Should you disclose to someone that they are lying?

[Gigi213]

My adult daughter has untreated BPD. Her boyfriend broke up with her a year ago and they got back together because she said she was pregnant. They've been off and on for the past year. I saw some red flags the entire pregnancy (saying she was at ob/gyn appointments when she wasn't, etc.). Supposedly the baby has been in the NICU for over 2 months and she won't allow anyone to see him. Just found out that the baby pictures she has been showing are of someone else's baby that was premature and in the NICU that she found on another person's social media. She talks about this baby constantly. Saying the dad refuses to go see the baby in the hospital, the baby has an infection, the baby is in isolation so nobody can be with him, she will need a place to live when the baby leaves the hospital, that she's told the people at the hospital to tell anyone asking about him that he isn't there just to keep people away, etc. My question is, do I confront her and tell her I know about the pictures or just keep my mouth shut and let her continue to talk about this baby nonstop?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[CC43]

Hi Gigi,

The general advice on this site is to validate the valid but not the invalid.  If she's going to such lengths to perpetuate this fantasy, she might crave attention, money, a baby shower and/or a place to stay.  It sounds like she wants to showcase how terrible her ex is as well, to cement her role as victim in this delusion, and use it as a form of control.   Maybe you could focus on her feelings--how scary it must be to face all these changes and worries and uncertainties, and feel abandoned by the ex, and see where that goes, without pressing for factual details about the baby?  But since she's taken this so far, if you challenge her on the facts, she might become furious, because you'd be "invalidating" her version of events.

I don't really know, honestly.  What I experienced with my diagnosed stepdaughter was that she would test out stories of abuse and trauma to get attention and play the victim, but many of the stories had questionable fact patterns and timelines.  On a few of the stories, she conveniently omitted her role in starting an altercation--and accused others of assault, when she was the instigator.  I think that she eventually learned to keep details hazy, so that she couldn't be challenged on the facts or take any of the blame.  But I think the feelings behind the traumatic stories were genuine, even if the facts weren't.  So maybe focus on the feelings.

It's hard to say where this goes, because at some point the baby will need to materialize, or the story dies.  As I write this I'm wondering if she'll say the baby didn't make it, taking the fantasy to a whole other level.

[Gigi213]

She is already saying the baby isn’t doing well, is in isolation, which is why he can’t have visitors, he’s needed CPR, the  hospital keeps calling her in the middle of the night and she’s having to go see him when I know for a fact she hasn’t left her house. Sounds like she’s setting up the scenario the baby won’t make it. The photos she is using are of a premie in the NICU; she can’t keep using those photos much longer. He should be over two months old by now.
When the baby doesn’t make it, what do I do? Go to its memorial service, because I know there will be one. What do I say when friends and relatives keep asking me how the baby is doing? The ex’s mother has contacted me; I’m sure his parents are thinking this entire situation is as bizarre as I do. Do I keep ignoring her?

[CC43]

Hi Gigi,

This is really tricky as your daughter has become delusional. Maybe what you say to people who make inquiries is that you’re not really sure about the whole situation and that they should ask your daughter. Then you’re not perpetuating the fiction or contradicting your daughter.  You could state the truth—I haven’t seen the baby, have you? I bet they can read between the lines.

[Sancho]

Hi Gigi213
I agree that this is quite delusional - and perhaps you need to take some professional advice regarding what to do.

The fact that it has gone on for so long is a great concern. If it was something she instigated for a particular purpose eg keeping the boyfriend then I would think she would have 'wound up' the story by now. If dd has gone in so deep that this is reality to her, then I personally think it is something I would seek a medical opinion on. Perhaps even talking to your GP and see if you can be guided through this tricky situation.

Gosh . . so difficult!

[zachira]

Your daughter is seriously mentally ill and delusional. It may be possible to get the mental health authorities in your area to do an emergency home visit to evaluate your daughter for an emergency psychiatric hold in a mental health facility.

[Ourworld]

Dear Gigi213,

This is heartbreaking, I’m sure you realize that she needs help. Is there anyone you think she could talk with or you perhaps?
I don’t think you should go against her ‘delusion’, because she may in fact think it’s real. I fear for her own safety, and definitely believe that she needs to be in a safe situation where she can be properly assessed and treated.

The question is how to go about it. If possible, I think you or someone she would talk with should go to her, she’s calling out in pain. Talk with her about her feelings, and maybe help her to realize that there is not a baby, and calmly take her to get ice cream or something  and take her to a prearranged facility. This might be someplace you get referred to after meeting with a professional about the situation. You might be able to go to a hospital and meet with a case worker who can help.

She needs help, not punishment.

Wishing you the best and praying for you both.

[Ourworld]

Don’t tell her there is no baby, talk about things that help her to possibly realize it herself (hopefully).

[CC43]

Gigi,

If it's true your daughter has BPD, then my inclination is to think that her mental faculties aren't impaired to the extent that she actually believes she's had a baby--that she buys into her delusion--though she clearly wants to believe it, and for everyone else to believe it, too.  It seems to me that her problem is that she's a pathological liar, as implied by the title of your post.

I tend to agree with the others posting that trying to confront her outright about the lies might backfire, just serving to anger and destabilize her.  I've seen this issue with my diagnosed stepdaughter.  She will cling to her version of events--that she was traumatized and abused--like her life depends on it.  That's because she has to be the victim, and others are the enemy.  Admitting that SHE was the abuser and/or liar would be too painful for her to bear.  She'd rather change the details of the story or stop the conversation completely than to admit any wrongdoing.  Usually this meant cutting people out of her life.  Then she would become isolated and alienated, and her "exit" strategy had to be a suicide attempt--an extreme cry for help.  I think this was because of the intense shame and self-hatred she felt for her past behavior, made worse by the alienation.  But it was suicide attempts, not an admission of lying or any apology, that ultimately got her treatment.

I imagine that your daughter knows she's lying, but she's compelled to keep the delusion going, because she wanted her ex back, and she wanted the attention.  Maybe she thought she might be pregnant at the beginning, and she wanted to believe it so badly that she started with a lie that snowballed on her.  Admitting she did anything wrong would be too painful for her, so she had to keep the fiction going.  And now her "exit" is probably saying the baby died, having some sort of memorial, and maybe even a fundraiser.

Even so, this could be a prelude of an actual cry for help.  Only she can decide when she's ready to receive help.  If you challenge her lies, maybe she has a breakdown, while blaming you for provoking it.  Maybe she "confesses," but I tend to doubt that, given the lengths she's gone.

I don't know.  If you try to take stage an intervention or take her to a hospital, she could see you as the enemy.  That's what happened to my stepdaughter.  I think she has to feel ready to get help.  Maybe she faces a crisis herself with her housing situation.  If you don't let her move in with you, or pay her bills, thereby "enabling" a dysfunctional lifestyle, she might decide she's ready to change.  But if she's comfortable (others are paying for her upkeep, she's getting attention because she's a new mom, etc.), she probably has little reason to change or seek therapy.

There might be a way to coax her towards the truth, by being a compassionate listener.  But she'd need to trust you, and she'd need to be calm.  You might open a conversation asking about how she felt when she first thought she might be pregnant--the excitement, a chance to get back together with her ex, the joy of bringing a new life into the world.  And then you might gently state that losing those hopes and dreams would be devastating.  It would be understandable to cling to the idea of a being a mom and having a happy family.  That's a dream come true for many women.  You'd understand how awful it would feel to lose that dream, and how hard it would be to tell others about it.  Then maybe she confesses?