Therapeutic Separation

[Depression = 72% of members]

Therapeutic Separation - Restarting the Relationship

Sometimes the bad habits of the relationship are so ingrained on a day to day basis that recovering from within the current living situation is nearly impossible. Many couples hang in there hoping for the best and when it doesn't come, end up in a divorce that neither may have really wanted.

There is an alternative - therapeutic separation - members here have had varying levels of success and failure with this. The goal of this workshop is to talk about:

1) When does a therapeutic separation make sense

2) How it is best managed

3) What are the tricks and the traps

As an overview and to help start the discussions, I have briefly summarized Therapeutic Separation below:

Goal: To reinvigorate a broken relationship that has been damaged by stress, work, children or other distractions. Involves counseling and both parties seeking to improve the marriage. Also, can serve a way to experience that harsh reality of what a divorce would feel like before jumping directly to divorce. Distinct from a Trial Separation, where the goal is to test out separation, not to renew the relationship.

Term: Three months to one year, although more than six months may lead to increased distance in the relationship.

Structure: The terms of a therapeutic separation are highly flexible and are initiated by the therapist and agreed to by the couple.  The only required terms are that both parties are in solo counseling during the separation and that there is a set end where the couple agrees to come back together.  Therapeutic separation can begin with a period of NC (no contact) to allow both sides to have a break, heal and grow before starting interactions.  After the NC period, the remaining interactions are limited to “dates”, often weekly, where the couple can get together rediscover the positive aspects of their relationship.  Problem solving during dates is discouraged in order to prevent further harm.  The dates are usually followed by joint therapy sessions where communication and negotiation skills can be learned and any problems with the date may be addressed.

Living Arrangements: Couples may choose to have one member move out for the term of the separation, or rent an apartment and take turns switching who lives in the marital residence—especially if children are involved.  However, if the separation turns to a divorce proceeding, the person living in the house at that time will likely be allowed to remain there.

Custody: Custody is negotiated up front and can take any acceptable form.  

Finances: The goal of this type of separation is to come back together, so finances are often agreed to be handled as usual. This should be expressly agreed to however to make sure one spouse does not take this opportunity to clean out the bank accounts.  There are no legal obligations regarding disposal of assets during a therapeutic separation, so anything can happen.

Risks:
-The break caused by the separation may help one the parties disconnect and actually accelerate the end of the relationship.
-A pwBPD may see the separation as abandonment and sink deeper into their condition rather than improve, or act out in unpredictable ways.
-If the TS does not succeed and the couple heads to divorce, any terms agreed to in the separation could have an impact on the divorce settlement.  This could prove critical in custody and home possession issues.

References:
<a href="www.davismintun.com/2007/01/therapeutic-separation-for-couples.html" target="_blank">www.davismintun.com/2007/01/therapeutic-separation-for-couples.html[/url]
<a href="www.marriagemissions.com/to-stay-or-not-to-stay/" target="_blank">www.marriagemissions.com/to-stay-or-not-to-stay/[/url]

[Aurylian]

Therapeutic Separation - Restarting the Relationship

Sometimes the bad habits of the relationship are so ingrained on a day to day basis that recovering from within the current living situation is nearly impossible. Many couples hang in there hoping for the best and when it doesn't come, end up in a divorce that neither may have really wanted.

There is an alternative - therapeutic separation - members here have had varying levels of success and failure with this. The goal of this workshop is to talk about:

1) When does a therapeutic separation make sense

2) How it is best managed

3) What are the tricks and the traps

As an overview and to help start the discussions, I have briefly summarized Therapeutic Separation below:

Goal: To reinvigorate a broken relationship that has been damaged by stress, work, children or other distractions. Involves counseling and both parties seeking to improve the marriage. Also, can serve a way to experience that harsh reality of what a divorce would feel like before jumping directly to divorce. Distinct from a Trial Separation, where the goal is to test out separation, not to renew the relationship.

Term: Three months to one year, although more than six months may lead to increased distance in the relationship.

Structure: The terms of a therapeutic separation are highly flexible and are initiated by the therapist and agreed to by the couple.  The only required terms are that both parties are in solo counseling during the separation and that there is a set end where the couple agrees to come back together.  Therapeutic separation can begin with a period of NC (no contact) to allow both sides to have a break, heal and grow before starting interactions.  After the NC period, the remaining interactions are limited to “dates”, often weekly, where the couple can get together rediscover the positive aspects of their relationship.  Problem solving during dates is discouraged in order to prevent further harm.  The dates are usually followed by joint therapy sessions where communication and negotiation skills can be learned and any problems with the date may be addressed.

Living Arrangements: Couples may choose to have one member move out for the term of the separation, or rent an apartment and take turns switching who lives in the marital residence—especially if children are involved.  However, if the separation turns to a divorce proceeding, the person living in the house at that time will likely be allowed to remain there.

Custody: Custody is negotiated up front and can take any acceptable form.  

Finances: The goal of this type of separation is to come back together, so finances are often agreed to be handled as usual. This should be expressly agreed to however to make sure one spouse does not take this opportunity to clean out the bank accounts.  There are no legal obligations regarding disposal of assets during a therapeutic separation, so anything can happen.

Risks:
-The break caused by the separation may help one the parties disconnect and actually accelerate the end of the relationship.
-A pwBPD may see the separation as abandonment and sink deeper into their condition rather than improve, or act out in unpredictable ways.
-If the TS does not succeed and the couple heads to divorce, any terms agreed to in the separation could have an impact on the divorce settlement.  This could prove critical in custody and home possession issues.

References:
<a href="www.davismintun.com/2007/01/therapeutic-separation-for-couples.html" target="_blank">www.davismintun.com/2007/01/therapeutic-separation-for-couples.html[/url]
<a href="www.marriagemissions.com/to-stay-or-not-to-stay/" target="_blank">www.marriagemissions.com/to-stay-or-not-to-stay/[/url]

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Aurylian]

We have been batting this issue around recently and thought it would be nice to have a more in depth discussion. 

Just to clarify, a Therapeutic Separation is very structured with a purpose and is not intended to be just a "time out".  Time outs also have there purpose and can take the form of taking a day off or taking a solo vacation.  But, for those of us that are trying to Stay and need another tool, TS is an option.

[Annaleigh]

Thank you.  Hi!

[Aurylian]

“therapeutic separation.” . . . Everything about it is done for the purpose of ultimately restoring the marriage. While there may be a “time out” from one another, the “time out” is set up to strengthen weaknesses in the marriage so that you can come back together stronger than ever. Counsel should be sought, both individually and as a couple, to heal wounded areas. Books on communication and healthy conflict could be read and discussed to strengthen the relationship. Each party must take full responsibility for their failures in the marriage.

www.crosswalk.com/1386476/

I'm curious if any one has tried this where their pwBPD was not ready to take full responsibility.  Did it work out?

[Steph]

 To be TS, both parties have to do their part. Thats just the rules. In fact, one of the rules of TS is that if anyone stops doing their part, or dates, or whatever is not allowed, the deal is off... .


So, if one isnt willing to do what needs to be done, it isnt/cant be a TS, as Runnermom talks about.

   

[Aurylian]

So, if our BPD SO hasn't shown the ability to take ownership of their stuff, does that make TS impossible with them? 

Clearly if both parties are up for the work and improvement it can be good.  Can TS provide a low point or shock value enough to help the pwBPD see how serious things are?  Or is it just a futile attempt that will almost surely lead to non therapeutic separation or divorce?

In other words, if the pwBPD id not willing to work on the r/s stuff, should it not even be considered?

[Steph]

 Here is a possible scenario.

You two go to MC.

In a MC session, you announce to her that you feel that there are things in the marriage that will require separation to heal. You and the MC talk about what TS is, and what is involved.

Let her think about it, and then give her answer at the next session.


If she agrees, then she knows she needs therapy, and you have your own issues that you will work on.

Otherwise, without both of you working on your stuff, I dont see where a TS will work... part of what is required is therapy for each party AND MC... and to work hard on yourselves AND the marriage.

Maybe she is as confused as you are at this point.

Do you think she will attend MC?


Steph

[Steph]

Therapeutic Separation for Couples

By Margy Davis-Mintun, LCSW, ACSW

When a marriage/live in relationship feels broken and the zest of the early years seems lost, before jumping to the solution of divorce, why not consider a less drastic yet jarring experience, a therapeutic separation. This type of separation is designed between clients and therapist to increase the possibility of reinvigorating and rediscovering the essence that has been covered by stress, work, children and life’s distractions.

Good candidates for a therapeutic separation are couples who can remember that in the past they experienced pleasure, joy and companionship with each other, and through the years distance has prevailed and loneliness has become the more frequent companion.

What a therapeutic separation is designed to accomplish is to create enough distance, physically, by living apart to really allow the opportunity to feel the absence of the partner. During this time of living apart the thrust is to repair the marriage, rather than move toward divorce. We know that 70% of second marriages end in divorce, a higher number than first marriages. We also know that many relationships can repair provided a concerted and focused effort is directed toward that end so long as both want the relationship to continue. Furthermore, we know that past feelings of connection can be rediscovered provided the purpose/opportunity is designed for such.

In a therapeutic separation, the couple agrees to the terms of the separation, with the guidance and counsel of the therapist. Both are engaged in ongoing therapy and there may be occasion for individual work as well. In these separations, dating becomes the means of contact with each other, and contact is reduced to a minimal level so that each can gain a glimpse of what it would be like to live without the partner and experience the most positive aspect of being together. There are mutual rules established around the terms of the separation, these include and are not limited to such choices as monogamy, dating others, privacy, finance, how to deal with work, family and friends, and if relevant the care of children. The time frame is 3-6 months, anything longer tends to increase the possibility of moving too far apart to come back together, and anything shorter tends to be too quick to actually fully benefit from the time apart...

This separation discourages problem solving (regarding the couple) outside the therapeutic relationship in order to prevent further harm and repeated failure of repair.

The goal is to rediscover the positive aspects of the relationship, to build safety within the context of the couple and to provide space for the individual as well as the couple. In the therapy process, problem solving differences, communication and negotiation skills are enhanced, so that the couple can practice newly learned skills. Assumptions are reevaluated and beliefs are examined. When there are breakdowns in the relationship outside the therapy session, those are discussed and reviewed in the protective environment of the psychotherapy session. The goal is to recreate the positive underlying theme in the couple so that assumptions, if made allow for the benefit of the doubt rather than falling to negative interpretations.

With the support of therapy, and the commitment of couples to find ways to stay together in a more meaningful and rewarding relationship, therapeutic separations have been successful in preventing divorce and in creating stronger, more loving, and healthier partnerships. The key in deciding to try this as an alternative to divorce, is that both partners in the relationship want to remain together, are willing to work toward this end and commit to the process of creating a more satisfying and stronger connection with each other rather than “jumping” into divorce

[Jen48]

This is what I want to try with my H. because even though I am leaning toward divorce and really do not see the future being any different than the past. I believe in taking one last step to see if our marriage is salvageable - -if I will be able to forgive him and trust that he will stick with therapy... .see if he just tries to manipulate me and the therapist -- and if so, I'm done.

[Jen48]

So, if our BPD SO hasn't shown the ability to take ownership of their stuff, does that make TS impossible with them? 

Clearly if both parties are up for the work and improvement it can be good.  Can TS provide a low point or shock value enough to help the pwBPD see how serious things are?  Or is it just a futile attempt that will almost surely lead to non therapeutic separation or divorce?

In other words, if the pwBPD id not willing to work on the r/s stuff, should it not even be considered?

This is my concern, too! If BPDh is not willing, it is not going to work - but I do plan on at least showing up for the first appointment and see where it takes us.

[Aurylian]

And if you are at the point where you have nothing to lose . . . then you have nothing to lose.

It is certainly worth a shot.

[Jen48]

And if you are at the point where you have nothing to lose . . . then you have nothing to lose.

It is certainly worth a shot.

And I feel it is more for my benefit than for his... .even if he doesn't grasp it, I have had a chance to have my say, and he will see that I am firm in my decision to heal and not be dragged back down by his behavior and manipulation.

[Neverknow]

My BPD w and I are kind of doing this now.  She moved out suddenly, with my blessing, about seven weeks ago.  Since then, she has been living at her mother's, about 150 miles away.  I have visited twice and she is coming this weekend for a visit, but we have decided that we want to keep things this way indefinitely.

Somehow, when we stay apart like this, things work.  She likes it, and I like it.  I enjoy talking to her on the phone, and I enjoy seeing her for a few day every couple of weeks. 

Therapeutic Separation seems like as good a way to describe what we are doing as anything.  I don't really care about getting a divorce, I just can't take all of the BPD sht anymore.  I do see some of it, still-object constancy-for example.  If we don't talk for a day or two, she almost seems to forget about me (not so bad, really).   And, she will go off on an everything is my fault rant every once in a while.  But, since all I have to do is hang up the phone and I am by myself, it is not so hard to deal with.

I don't really know where this is going to end, but I am just kind of riding it out to see.

[truthbeknown]

what if you are just in the beginning of a relationship/dating?  i have been with a woman for 6 months and things are getting very alarming to me.  I read about ADHD and have a hard time distinguishing whether she has this or a form of BPD.  She is very clingy to the point of picking fights with me and then when i refuse to stay over at her place because i'm upset she begs me too.  It feels overwhelming and from what i read on the ADHD site, people who have this can be OVER-focused on something and it scares them etc. and they just won't let go of it. She definately fits this and i'm not sure about BPD.  She is a VERY caring woman and has a good heart.  She just seems troubled emotionally and when i pulled back the interaction with my kids this drove her crazy.  She won't let go of how i am "cutting her off" when i simply followed a therapists advise about establishing boundaries.  She does not like the boundaries.  She asked me if i would like this if the situation is reversed and truthfully i probably wouldn't.  However, i don't make crazy behavior like she does though.   So i want to have a separation but not sure about pulling the plug yet.  any advise?  btw, we do not live together.

[Neverknow]

I have to admit, that I keep thinking things will get better one day, when everything in my head tells me I am crazy to entertain that thought.

But, at least now, with her living away from me, any further damage is on hold, while I get things sorted out.

She is coming up this weekend, and I am not really that excited about it any  more.  It will be a good test, though. A test of my resolve to set meaningful and real boundaries, and to stick to them.

[LoveNotWar]

My BPDh and I are trying a TS and it's good. I was looking for a way to keep myself safe and still support him, he raged daily and became physically abusive. It got VERY bad.

I moved out of the marital residence and have a small apartment I call "The Sanctuary". I took a 6 month lease.

This wouldn't work if he hadn't agreed to go into treatment but he is seeing a T who is helping guide him (and myself) through the TS. She initiated a period of NC except for text and email. When she and my h thought he was ready she told him he could meet for brief periods so we had burgers last weekend. He's still BPD but because I had a period of healing I was able to work the tools and we actually had a normal lunch out in public.

I am also seeing a T and our next step will be a MC together but he was so dysregulated almost 24/7 that my T recommended he work alone before we see a MC and when he finally went to treatment his T concurred.

TS might not work for everyone but I believe it is tailor made for us. As long as he is in treatment I will support him. During  this separation I am working hard to learn and use the tools and I am also understanding how my behavior made a tough situation worse. I didn't set boundaries which reinforced his rages and I fell into a depression so I wasn't good for him OR myself!

I now have hope. I know he will always be BPD but I believe I can practice the tools until they become second nature and do my part towards making a life together.

[MeSoBlu]

LoveNotWar: Good Luck to you, please keep posting on how it is going. My uBPDh left 7 months ago. He finally went and saw a T, I finally also sought one out and learned my H may have BPD. I read everything I could, did NC and will not contact him unless it concerns our children. It has taken a long time, but the skills that I learned seem to help. He has been acting like the man I married for about 7 weeks now, however, he stopped contact yesterday after weeks of daily texts, emails and phone conversation initiated by him. This has alerted me to the fact he is cycling in his head again. I don't know where this will lead to. Unless we can go to counseling together, I think his illness will destroy us, because we can't do this without a 3rd party. I am glad you have a T who is assisting you. Good Luck again!

[LoveNotWar]

MeSoBlu: I feel so fortunate that he is in treatment and has agreed to this TS. After he became violent I was leaving with or without his cooperation. I really wanted to support him and make our r/s better but I made up my mind that I wouldn't stay with him if he didn't get treatment. So I agree, without the T, and eventually MC, there would be no hope for us either.

But I am also realistic, I know he's BPD and I will need to learn and use the tools. Just like your h he will cycle and it will be up to me to modify my behavior, stay calm and not take it personally.

I am planning on reading about radical acceptance and seeing if I can wrap my mind around that. 

[MeSoBlu]

LoveNotWAr: So here is a recent event that I want to share... .learn about yourself and learn those skills... .I think that is what is helping us out!  Anyway, he asked to visit the other night, he had a small smile on his face but ya know that "something just isn't right feeling"... .well he was oozing frustration and I sensed myself internally doing the defensive posturing thing in my body... .Weird how I can now recognize how I am internally preparing to have to defend myself.  Anyway, because of what I learned about BPD and my incorrect reactions to it.  I told myself, whatever he is feeling, it is NOT about ME... .I hadn't seen nor spoken to him in over 24 hours... .so I knew it... .then I started the deep breathing to calm myself from my learned defensive posture... .it worked... .so I internally was able to come off the defense in my mind and body.  This enabled me to ask him how he was doing, how are you feeling, I sense some frustration. So I also learned, when h is quiet... .let it go and be ok with it.  After about 10 minutes I asked if we would like to go to the store with me as I had to pick up juice.  OMG... .so we are driving and then he says, ya know, I am really frustrated with work.  Can you say... .Thank God... .he has never noticed or ever acknowledged his frustration with other folks, it always was me... .so I took some more calming breaths, validated his frustrations and then asked him, so how will you handle this?

It seems like a lot of hard work, but once you start to understand how they think, it makes it not so bad, if you are willing to change a bit yourself to accommodate how they interpret/misinterpret things.

I have tried to imagine what his mind is like, the closet thing I have found is watching the movie "What dreams may come". The darkness and denial of the female lead... .I can't live like that but I can change how I speak with him, kinda joining him on his level in a way so that communication eventually does get through and things get better.  Fingers crossed and prayers said, I don’t know how long this will last, bit right now, he is starting to try and communicate with me. 

Try learning and practicing the skills, what I did to acknowledge me, was place myself mentally in a not so good past situation while I had time to reflect and I could actually sense my pulse racing, stomach churning and the “here we go again” cycle. I wrote down every physical reaction I felt and started to acknowledge them in myself and breath through each one to calm myself. Thus when he oozed his frustration and I felt my reaction when we met up, I could again, acknowledge it wasn’t me, calm myself and not be a partner in aiding his cycling!

[rollercoaster24]

Hi all

I met my uBP partner early 2010, friends first, then we became involved. In the early friendship stage, he was crashing at my house temporarily, in search of employment supposedly.

After we became involved, the search for employment seemed to stop, as he tried to enmesh himself further into my life. I knew something was not right with him from the early days of our being involved, however I did not really know what I was dealing with, until some time in 2012, when I went to my own doctor, (stressed and unwell and looking to go on antidepressants myself!).

She asked what was going on in my personal life, and I broke down, after she asked me to explain some recent incidents with my partner, (outings together etc) she then told me that he meets the criteria for Borderline Personality Disorder, she told me to look it up, and see what I found.

I did, and coming here, made everything fall into place for me immediately, like a light bulb had gone on in the darkness.

After two years of him staying at my home, off and on, (usually every week he would start raging out of control over some aspect of life with me), and all the horrific events that involved, he ended his stay instigating physical conflict with other members of my family boarding here also.

The physical violence never ceased, he just found new targets to project his rage onto, and if it wasn't someone else, then it was back to me again. At times, I did fear for my life, and that of others around me, due to real events, and the never ending threats of violence.

BP expected me to take his side over my family, and just allow him to carry on as normal, but I held firm, and said No, that he could no longer stay here, because he just wasn't willing to address his need for change.

He was offered the chance to sit down and resolve his differences with my daughter and son in law to be, but he refused several times, dismissing them as nothing but 'idiots and ****kids'.

So, they felt as did I, that he had his chance to stay here, and preserve his relationship status with me, and he chose not to and to move out.

He went back to his elderly parents (residing in their outdoor shed), to stay permanently.

That was February 2012, and he vowed it was over, and he would never return to this ***** and ****** again.

Several days later, he rang up, and wanted to recycle, and I was again charmed into submission. This cycle continued off and on for the past 15 months, (weekly breakups, violent behaviours and manners, verbal abuse and his major dysregulating)

Initially, I was travelling to stay with him overnight several times per week, but 9/10 he would be raging, dysregulating, violent, verbally abusive, and really nasty company. I would often be tired, stressed, and not coping well with his abusive behaviours and the only choice I had was simply to either drive off somewhere, or walk, (if it was during the day) or drive home again if it was late at night.

I admit it was my lack of ability to put the necessary boundaries in place as to his rages, that made it worse, I just found that a lot of the time, validating him just seemed to give him license to act out more.

Most of his rages were all about projecting, so I stopped validating so much and just detached. Most of the time though, I was the sponge, soaking up his crap for hours on end.

Sleep deprivation has always been his favourite form of punishment to me.

It was pretty difficult to decide what to do, as in a LD, you are not seeing as much of your partner anyway, and the sense of abandonment for them, is even higher, (hence the rages being present).

You want to be a supportive partner, but when you are, that just seems to make it worse. I was often torn inside about what to do, and also frustrated and hurt myself. Putting all the effort in to spend quality time together, and all you get is more demands that you are not doing or giving enough to them. It was exactly the same when he lived here, nothing was ever enough, non-stop accusations, twisted perceptions, maddening every day life, and the eternal excuses for him to act like a complete jerk to me. It was always my fault that he abused me, (according to him) or some aspect of my life, (usually friends or family) that he used as justifications.

The same stands true today, only now his parents have been the major target for his projections for the past 8 months or more. Last year, his parents placed a 72 hour restraining order on him after he threatened his elderly Father with a wrench. $40 cash was passed onto him via the police, from his parents, for money to live on for those 3 days he was to vacate their property. As far as I know, he was sleeping in his car, in his nearby favourite city, the one he has disappeared overnight to weekly since I met him.

There had been many more upsetting incidents at his parents, and that police incident is not the first, there have been several similar over the years that he had relied on them to provide him with accommodation.

His Father has wanted to have him committed several times, but the Mother has always stood in the way, almost seems that since the Father was exactly the same in his younger days, she wants revenge, or believes her son is justified in his rage against his Father, for abuse suffered as a child.

The Mother is now at her wits end though, and her health is suffering more, so she now stands firm against her son abusing his Father, (she has been telling BP son frequently to leave her home but still allows him to stay there, so the whole situation there is pretty dysfunctional really).

BP has also taken to verbally abusing his Mother more in the past 6 months, she now gets labelled with the same gutter type words once only reserved for myself and his Father. The C word precisely.

I have only seen BP once in person, since the 10/6 this year, when he assaulted me, smashed my new phone, threatened my life, and damaged my property, and I had to call for police intervention (from a neighbours) at 3 am to be able to retrieve my car and property to leave.

Several days later, he rang asking to help pay for a new phone, but since I needed one before that, I had to sort that out myself urgently.

When he found out I already had my new phone, he then launched into a denigration of his entire experience with me, (Groundhog day). This went on for hours, with hang ups, and more verbal abuse, until finally I left my phone off the hook for the rest of the day.

The next day, he rang more humble and apologetic, and extended invitations to come visit anytime, this carried on, over several more days, and daily chats on the phone several times like normal. Until the Sunday 16/6 when he established I wasn't making a concrete plan to visit him again any time soon.

I was in need of reassurance that he would be nice to me the whole time I was there, and an assurance that he would not abuse me again. This reassurance was not forth coming, so I decided against going.

This set him off again, and he slammed the phone down in my ear, claiming he only had several things to think about, 'being able to eat,  having somewhere to live, and getting a job'.

I simply wasn't allowed to place any expectations on how he treated me on him right now!

For the first time ever, he extended his NC to 2 whole weeks, and I again, gave up on the relationship being repaired ever.

Initially I sent 2 emails, and tried calling, all attempts were ignored, so I ceased trying and began to grieve.

By the 3/7 he rang back, and I was shocked.

His reasons? "its complicated' (I took it that he had been sleeping with someone else). And he knew I was under stress with my previous employers, and taking over a contract with my new business on the 1/7.

Since then, there have been many more verbally abusive incidents, instigated breakups, ultimatums, threats, labelling us as not having been in a relationship for the past 15 months since I 'kicked him out' in favour of ***** son in law and daughter.

He has said some extremely hurtful and confusing stuff, and is now making out that I cannot stay at his parents with him, because not only do they not want him there, they don't really want me going there either.

He says that because of the way his parents treat him, he is extremely unhappy, and cannot be good company when I come to visit, because of this.

I know he is hinting at me providing somewhere else for him to live, (getting a place together) so we can finally have a relationship that is about 'us' and not everyone else. He says we have never had any privacy, and hardly ever had the chance to be alone together. That is not true, we had plenty of privacy, but he destroyed any time we had together, with his rages, and dysregulating.

So, we are in a separation, but I would hardly call it therapeutic, as I am the only one in therapy, and also about to go on to antidepressants, which I hope will help me come to terms with the inevitable ending I see for us.

I feel hesitant about giving up the security I have had here for so long, to set up another home for himself and I, because I need to see that he is serious about contributing towards that himself.

I am not going to be resented because I have a job, eat, and am better off than he is right now. I also am hesitant to allow his illness to undo all the good I have built for myself, because he can so easily ruin all that in the blink of an eye, like he had tried to do in the past.

The public humiliations I suffered at his hands at my workplace, is not something I am willing to go through again, now that the contract there is mine and the onus is on me so much more to be professional in my habits.

I just could not afford to lose this, seriously.

But I am in internal conflict about what to do about this relationship, he just won't seem to let me go, yet I really don't know what to do about things.

If I did set up a place for us to stay, the cost would be on me again, and the stress, so I would only enter into that, if there was an option for me to get out after a few months.

There is the temptation to prove it to him once and for all.

A place of our own, with nobody bothering us, and little stress of our own. Then lets see how he behaves!

At least then, I can hand it to him on a plate, and say, well, this is what you said you wanted, and now what?

[momtara]

Problem is, BPD issues are usually a bit more complicated than just losing the early heat of the relationship... . and if children are involved... . I wonder if anyone has done this successfully w/kids.  Just curious.  Not a bad idea, if it works for your situation.

[hurthusband]

What do you do in this situation is your

a. broke... I let things get to this point before doing anything.  My wife has no job and we have 2 kids.  She basically refuses to get a job too.  Just cleans part time and complains about it all the time. 

b. wife will not move out without kids

c. wife will not allow me to move in with anyone i know... family nor friends.  she blames family for alot of our problems and she things i will conspire with them against her

d. wife hates the place where we live and claims its a main contributer to all this so hard to leave her there.

e. wife says she has nowhere to move

basically, wife wants me to move into a motel, but come back when she wants me to.  Meanwhile my sole income is being gobled up.  Health insurance doesnt cover much therapy so we have med bills of like $2k a month, and her spending is out of control still.  (our debt went from 0 to $25k in last year on credit cards) $250 last week on clothing for a trip that she taking in two weeks to Europe.  Yes, her parents got her a tour with them in Europe for her graduation, but I had to pay for airfare and watch kids.  Never consulting on any of it neither on whether my work would would be okay or anything

[momtara]

"c. wife will not allow me to move in with anyone i know... "

Extremely controlling, but that's BPD for you.

Well, for a therapeutic sep, both people have their eyes on the same goals.  Your wife sets up impossible, controlling situations, as people with BPD often do.  I guess this wouldn't work for you if she's not thinking rationally.  Hmmm, we'll have to keep thinking... .

[LoveLove]

Hello everyone!

I am in the same boat it seems... . my boyfriend decided to get help/therapy about 4 weeks ago and per his therapist, there has been a no contact rule installed. Thus, we have not had any contact for 3 weeks now (the 1st week - he was trying very hard to hold on to us and didn't want to stop talking to me). Yet, he felt that if he went against what the therapist told him (not to contact me), then therapy wouldn't work for him. And I appreciate the fact that he's getting the help that he needs.

It's just hard not being able to talk to him... . and according to the therapist, his "treatment" will take 12 weeks... .

I'm wondering if he'll return after that... . ? Since I don't know what the therapist is telling him/and what he is telling the therapist and what sort of help he is receiving... . any thoughts?

[momtara]

Well, this is rough because he could have a skewed view of what happened, and you're not there to correct it.  If he really feels he's missing out by not being with you, he will do his best to make things right and come back.  :)espite the similarities among cases, every person really is different and has diff circumstances.  Maybe you can use this time to figure out what you want too.  Is it worth it to go back to him, or do you have to walk on eggshells too much?

BPD's also tend to lie about what their therapists said.  They say "my therapist said" in order to validate their own feelings.  But this may not be the case with your guy, if he truly misses you.  I guess you'll have to see.  12 weeks straight with absolutely no contact sounds harsh though. 

[LoveLove]

Momtara -

Yes 12 weeks of intense treatment. 2 or more days per week, with 2 hour sessions each time. And apparently the sessions lesson after the 12 weeks... .

And I doubt he'll give in and contact me within the 12 weeks (he has 8 more weeks left to go), but I'm no longer waiting like I was.

He said he was doing this (therapy) in order to get on a "better path" with me, but who knows. I have heard that most do say "my therapist said... . " because they themselves can't admit that that's what they want or how they feel.

My SO had a problem telling me if something was bothering him or if he was freaking out... . he said he couldn't say "no" to me because he saw how happy I was... . so hence why we are where we are and he's in therapy... . but right now, definitely focusing on myself and I guess I'll see what happens... . thank you for the support!

[bruceli]

Hello everyone!

I am in the same boat it seems... . my boyfriend decided to get help/therapy about 4 weeks ago and per his therapist, there has been a no contact rule installed. Thus, we have not had any contact for 3 weeks now (the 1st week - he was trying very hard to hold on to us and didn't want to stop talking to me). Yet, he felt that if he went against what the therapist told him (not to contact me), then therapy wouldn't work for him. And I appreciate the fact that he's getting the help that he needs.

It's just hard not being able to talk to him... . and according to the therapist, his "treatment" will take 12 weeks... .

I'm wondering if he'll return after that... . ? Since I don't know what the therapist is telling him/and what he is telling the therapist and what sort of help he is receiving... . any thoughts?

Right along side you right now and was wondering this myself.

[hurthusband]

I totally think its a good idea.  Problem is when you are married with home and kids.  I have not figured out how to work that where kids are not confused by the whole thing, and how you even afford to have two seperate spots if the wife is essentially a house mom.  Especially when her own family thinks that its my job to just do whatever it takes to please her and if she tries to kill herself or others, o well, not their problem.  that is my problem now

[Skip]

The key is structure, therapist oversight and commitment.

[unicorn2014]

 Reading this first page, this is the first thing that struck me.

pwBPD may see the separation as abandonment and sink deeper into their condition rather than improve, or act out in unpredictable ways.

My pwBPD has not been treated for his BPD only his PTSD.

I understand a TS is a reset.

I also understand its for marriages/live in relationships.

I see there a lot of links on this first page which I will read.

I think for me this points back to the question why am I staying?

At any rate I will read the links and then the 2nd page and post more.

To be honest, I think for me taking off my ring, telling the truth about why he's not here, not allowing him to come see me until he files for divorce is a good start.

I also have other tools to work on my relationship in both my recovery and my church.

Thank you for your direction.