He's back, ignoring his broken agreement

[LetItBe]

My uBPDbf recently broke an agreement we'd made, one that was important and is a very sensitive area for me.  I didn't hear a word from him for over 2 days, and just now, he texted me like we never skipped a beat!  NO mention of the broken agreement -- instead, "Hey, Baby... . ," with updates on plans we'd made with his family for Easter.  I'm soo angry!  GRRR!   

First of all, I don't believe texting is the ideal way to communicate about serious issues, and I am not going to ignore the broken agreement.  The only way I can continue with him is if he offers a HUGE, sincere apology with the efforts to back it up.  It seems with his recent communication, that is not his intention.

I'm not sure how I'll respond.  Have I mentioned I'm p!ssed?

Any similar experiences here?  And how did you respond?

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PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[benny2]

First of all, I have learned to not even make any agreements after several broken agreements in the past. Agreements seem to mean nothing to them, not sure why, maybe they feel it is a form of control, and they can't deal with that either. And yes, the silent treatment for sometimes severals days, or even weeks is common, and all of a sudden, hey baby hows it going.  I use to get infuriated with that, but now I just have no expectations and deal with the silent treatments as part of their disorder. Its hard, believe me, but the more you make of it, the worse the situation becomes. Don't get me wrong, your angry, let him know that you don't care for his behavior, just don't expect much, or any empathy in return because its just not there on their behalf.

[AllyCat7]

First of all, I have learned to not even make any agreements after several broken agreements in the past. Agreements seem to mean nothing to them, not sure why, maybe they feel it is a form of control, and they can't deal with that either. And yes, the silent treatment for sometimes severals days, or even weeks is common, and all of a sudden, hey baby hows it going.  I use to get infuriated with that, but now I just have no expectations and deal with the silent treatments as part of their disorder. Its hard, believe me, but the more you make of it, the worse the situation becomes. Don't get me wrong, your angry, let him know that you don't care for his behavior, just don't expect much, or any empathy in return because its just not there on their behalf.

Looks like we are all in the same boat . I can relate to your post so much NonGF and am struggling with the same thing right now. Mine has not reached out yet, but if/when he does I'm going to seem happy to hear from him, but if he doesn't bring up the broken agreement, I'm going to gently question him about it. Even if he doesn't answer or evades the question, at least me questioning him about it lets him know that I didn't like it. But I have to make sure to do it in a good mood. When I'm short with him, it just makes everything worse.

Also, Benny, when your guy would come back around with the "hey baby" after silent treatment, how would yo react/handle it?

[briefcase]

Sometimes we just need to let them feel the natural consequences of their own behaviors.  I'm not sure what your agreement with him was, but think about what the natural consequences of his breaking it might be - and let it happen.  Not in a vindictive way, more a let nature take its couse way.  If you kick a rock - your toe should hurt.  Maybe next time you won't kick a rock. 

[benny2]

well alleycat, I usually gradually fall right back into it. Staying away is something I guess I'm not ready for yet.

[whereisthezen]

Sometimes they do feel like they are in the wrong. Its ok to keep him there once you say ok I forgive you or we worked it out ( prematurely) if you're not ready, they wont feel any harm done. In their mind its fixed as soon as you help them pass it. So until you're satisfied dont move on. Just my experience.

[committed]

People with BPD very rarely say sorry or admit any wrongdoing. I think they would rather avoid having to deal with any of the emotions surrounding having to admit anything or show any empathy. They just can't handle it. My BF does the same thing, acts as if nothing ever happened... . but I've learned that if I watch closely he will make it up to me in other ways. I just don't have expectations that he will always do what he says or admit fault or be sorry about anything. Instead, I always have a backup plan to take care of things myself. For example, he's been in a real funk this week and has painted my daughter black. He is supposed to bring her to meet me after work so I can shop for an Easter dress for her. I think he will do it, but she and I know there's a possibility that something will very easily make him mad and he won't do it. So, I made sure she knew that if he didn't, I would drive home, pick her up and take her shopping. Always have a backup plan... .

[LetItBe]

Sometimes we just need to let them feel the natural consequences of their own behaviors.  I'm not sure what your agreement with him was, but think about what the natural consequences of his breaking it might be - and let it happen.  Not in a vindictive way, more a let nature take its couse way.  If you kick a rock - your toe should hurt.  Maybe next time you won't kick a rock. 

I like this.    I can see how I can apply this to my situation.

[LetItBe]

Sometimes they do feel like they are in the wrong. Its ok to keep him there once you say ok I forgive you or we worked it out ( prematurely) if you're not ready, they wont feel any harm done. In their mind its fixed as soon as you help them pass it. So until you're satisfied dont move on. Just my experience.

This makes sense.  What do you mean by "don't move on?"  What would that look like for you?

I'm still not sure of my boundaries with this situation (can't be in a r/s, can't be in a r/s unless we go to couples' therapy, or ?).  While I'm sorting it out, I'm thinking of just telling him I need to take some time for myself, and I'll be in touch next week, which will mean not attending Easter at his parents' house like we'd planned.  I just can't go and put on a false smile like everything is fine.  It's not.  I need to spend some quality time with myself, looking at my needs and priorities.

[Seashells]

Hi there, I haven't posted in sometime, but when I read this it compelled me to do so.

I just went through a r/s ending blow up over a very similar situation.  We had an agreement very important to me in continuing the relationship based upon the past history.  And one I knew was going to be hard for him.  In the two weeks leading up to it I started to feel the difficulties begin.  Distancing picking fights, etc.  To the point where my upwBPD traits re-negged on it and blamed me and the r/s difficulties for backing out of it. 

Calmly told him the night before that if we were not going to follow through I didn't feel I could continue the relationship, but would try to remain a friend.  He didn't want to talk, didn't want anything. Blamed me for being so horrible to do this to him and end the r/s.  I didn't hear from him for two days until after the event had passed and suddenly he wanted to act as though nothing had happened. Then I started hearing from him as we had this other event a few days later,  I told him I couldn't attend with him and he could find someone else to go.  Well, he kept arguing and asked me 5 more times over 2 days if I was going with him.  I kept saying no.    I agreed to meet him to talk.   

From past experience I figured if I let it blow over, so would he and it would just repeat and break my boundaries more.  It was one of those things that my self esteem couldn't tolerate without taking a huge blow.

When we met, he kept insisting on just hugging and making up his way, with no apology, tried to deflect all conversation, etc and just expected me to be fine and go along as though nothing happened.  I've never ever seen him try to be so dominating previous to this.  Completely and totally unfair and rewriting the history of the previous week so that the "facts" fit his feelings. Being dismissing and acting in a completely controlling manner. 

Again any attempt at conversation was angrily thwarted or deflected. 

In the end, this other next event two days later had also been planned well before hand.  I couldn't feel good about going with him if we hadn't worked through what had happened.  So, there was a two day push/pull.  In the end I just couldn't let it go. His controlling behavior stoked my resentment even more.

My repeated attempts/ insistence on talking made him angry and he ended up furious, blew up and ended up saying forget it and he wouldn't go a few hours before this event.  (I admit I was slightly hoping for it as I was so hurt and angry and trying not to blow up at him.  ).  He ended up telling me to never bother him again.  I wasn't willing to fight it or beg him not to do it, nor beg him to go to the event with me. 

I'm now painted black and heading to the leaving board.  The next day I got a flurry of horrible insulting texts and I told him not to contact me with insults.   His normal pattern is to do this and then be horribly sorry and beg to recycle in a few days or a week or two at most.  I'm not sure he will this time, and I'm not sure I care to see or speak to him at this point either. 

So, this may be advice on how not to handle it if you want the relationship to continue.  I just couldn't put myself aside this time.  It may not have been an effective way to deal with it as far as the relationship continuing or avoiding stress, but I was so frustrated and hurt, I just didn't care.

[LetItBe]

So, this may be advice on how not to handle it if you want the relationship to continue.  I just couldn't put myself aside this time.  It may not have been an effective way to deal with it as far as the relationship continuing or avoiding stress, but I was so frustrated and hurt, I just didn't care.

Thank you, Seashells.  Sorry you've been going through such a tough time.   

Our situations do sound very similar, down the the detail about having an upcoming event we were planning to attend together.  Who knows how he'll explain my absence?  Not "my stuff" to worry about... . I have to focus on myself right now. 

Like you, I just can't continue to put myself aside.  My self-respect has become more important than preserving this r/s.  If he can't make a real effort to remember and respect our agreements, I'll be joining you on the Leaving Board.  I am not some toy to be put on a shelf when he's tired of playing with it.  He has some BIG issues that would take YEARS of targeted therapy to address, according to my T who does DBT, and whatever therapy/treatment he's been receiving for the last 10 years is clearly NOT working to help him be in a healthy, intimate r/s.

Part of the "natural consequences" of his behavior is that he's pushed me away, so, I'm away.

[patientandclear]

My T said the same thing about my uBPDexbf, who seems to have gone into the deep freeze since I wrote very gentle things about how we would lose something in our r/s if he decided randomly to move to another city ... .

She said "if that caused this reaction, I would stake my entire professional career on him having issues that would require years of therapy to address such that he could function in a relationship."

:'(

[Seashells]

I am not some toy to be put on a shelf when he's tired of playing with it.

Thanks for the kind words Non, and I'm sorry you're going through this as well.  I'm sorry all of us are.   

Talk about taking the words out of my mouth?  I can't tell you how many times I've said this in the above quote. I hope you are more successful than I feel I've been at maintaining calm and not playing into the drama.

How are you feeling now?  Have you given more thought as to how you want to handle it?


P&C I've read many of your posts and have received great comfort from them in stressful times.  TY

I can also relate to what you said about trying to gently nudge, when I felt the distancing start a couple weeks back I tried that as well.  And as many of us often experience, the unpredictability of response we're going to get can be anxiety inducing and confusing.  I did not get a good one and the dread started because I felt I knew what was coming. 

I often do that, as in anticipating what's coming.  I often wonder how much I unintentionally play into the dynamic simply because of that anticipation based upon past experience with him, and I have felt so helpless in the past when trying to avoid it to no avail.

I'm feeling sad and almost a little guilty today, I'm starting to think he was so dysregulated when I met him in person to talk, I think he might of been disassociating.  He also embarrassed himself in front of some mutual friends while lashing out at me in front of them.  Which will drive him further into isolation and make it take longer for him to get back to balance.  It all just makes me sad. 

I was trying to break a cycle of going in circles because I knew I just couldn't continue on this way.   He just wanted assurances that we could take a break or breather for a bit (this happens too often for me).  I didn't want to continue the cycle (put me on a shelf) at this point.  There is an ex wife in this dynamic and the history of triangulating isn't good. 

And sorry Non, don't want to take over the thread with my stuff.

[LetItBe]

I'm feeling sad and almost a little guilty today, I'm starting to think he was so dysregulated when I met him in person to talk, I think he might of been disassociating.  He also embarrassed himself in front of some mutual friends while lashing out at me in front of them.  Which will drive him further into isolation and make it take longer for him to get back to balance.  It all just makes me sad. 

I was trying to break a cycle of going in circles because I knew I just couldn't continue on this way.   He just wanted assurances that we could take a break or breather for a bit (this happens too often for me).  I didn't want to continue the cycle (put me on a shelf) at this point.  There is an ex wife in this dynamic and the history of triangulating isn't good. 

Thanks, again, Seashells.  I'm feeling sad today, too.  And stuck.  I just can't bring myself to respond to his message he sent yesterday.  I don't know what else to say to him right now.

There is a possibility that he dissociated after the dysregulation he experienced a couple of nights before, following my question if he had something on his mind.  This disease just SUCKS.

I feel stronger when I focus on myself.  When I focus on him and his issues, I enter the FOG, and I start missing him. 

As laelle said somewhere on the boards, they love triangulation and would triangulate you with a video game if they could.

What are you going to do?  Just ride this wave until it settles?  Are you NC?

[Seashells]

I can so relate to that "stuck" feeling in trying to figure out the best way to handle things without making them worse.   Mmmm Hmmmm 

We are NC at this time.  I've considered sending a neutral email to avoid leaving it so negatively between us. I also felt it might be easier to face the other friends if he knows I'm being neutral, as I'm concerned about his well being at this point. 

I need to be on the Leaving Board, but I don't want to be on the Leaving Board.  And what I want is not practical at this point.   So in a sense I'm stuck too. 

And I couldn't agree more and I also am better off when I can focus on myself.  It's really hard for me to do at times, I was much better at it before, but have worn down over time. 

It never occurred to me that this part of the wheel was FOG as well.   

[patientandclear]

As laelle said somewhere on the boards, they love triangulation and would triangulate you with a video game if they could.

I am currently being triangulated with another country, possibly with another continent!

Oh you guys.  I find it so disconcerting and so hard to feel sure of myself and my own choices and actions when they are not resulting in any good outcome!  When all the choices feel bad, it helps to keep me spinning, because it seems like there must be some approach that would work better than this crappy one.

It sucks to care so much for someone who also cares for you and yet feels under constant threat from you.

[arabella]

I find it so disconcerting and so hard to feel sure of myself and my own choices and actions when they are not resulting in any good outcome!  When all the choices feel bad, it helps to keep me spinning, because it seems like there must be some approach that would work better than this crappy one.

It sucks to care so much for someone who also cares for you and yet feels under constant threat from you.

Can I join this group? Seriously, we should all hang out together and eat ice cream and ponder the mysteries of the universe and the evil that is BPD.

I'm on my second major break-up-and-run-away cycle of agreement-busting and can't-we-just-pretend-this-is-okay?  And everything seems wrong. I keep thinking back to the last time and what 'worked' (maybe this will be interesting to someone else?) Basically, I withdrew/detached and let him run his course. I was still nice and responded to contact because I wanted that for myself - not that I needed the contact per se, but I needed to be able to feel good about myself. I needed to feel like I was a good person and that I'd done all I could even if he hadn't. I figured if it all fell apart in the end anyway, at least I'd be happy with myself. And, you know, que sera sera. 

[LetItBe]

I find it so disconcerting and so hard to feel sure of myself and my own choices and actions when they are not resulting in any good outcome!  When all the choices feel bad, it helps to keep me spinning, because it seems like there must be some approach that would work better than this crappy one.

It sucks to care so much for someone who also cares for you and yet feels under constant threat from you.

Can I join this group? Seriously, we should all hang out together and eat ice cream and ponder the mysteries of the universe and the evil that is BPD.

I'm on my second major break-up-and-run-away cycle of agreement-busting and can't-we-just-pretend-this-is-okay?  And everything seems wrong. I keep thinking back to the last time and what 'worked' (maybe this will be interesting to someone else?) Basically, I withdrew/detached and let him run his course. I was still nice and responded to contact because I wanted that for myself - not that I needed the contact per se, but I needed to be able to feel good about myself. I needed to feel like I was a good person and that I'd done all I could even if he hadn't. I figured if it all fell apart in the end anyway, at least I'd be happy with myself. And, you know, que sera sera.  

Arabella, I'd love to hang out with you and P&C and eat ice cream!  

I texted him Thurs. that I felt angry and hurt, I loved him (holding up my end of an agreement he requested when I need space), and I needed some quality time with myself.  I haven't responded to his texts from Thurs. night & Fri. morning (first good morning text in a long time... .   he seems to like me more when I'm pulling back... .   I would have REALLY appreciated that about 4 days earlier).  In those texts, he indicated he didn't know why I'd be upset and that he was there if I wanted to talk.  The thing is, whatever I say seems to fall right out of his memory sieve, so I end up feeling better when he's listening, then a whole lot worse when he acts like he never heard me.  :)efinitely re-enacting the "call/response" I used to get from my mother... .    

I know a LTR won't work with someone who I can't trust.  Feeling safe is SO important.  I just can't bring myself to make that final statement to him right now.  I have ideas about what to say, yet I am speechless and spinning.  All of the likely outcomes seem painful.  I suppose I need step away from the myopic lens I'm looking through and look at the long-term outcomes of my decisions right now.

[arabella]

In those texts, he indicated he didn't know why I'd be upset and that he was there if I wanted to talk.  The thing is, whatever I say seems to fall right out of his memory sieve, so I end up feeling better when he's listening, then a whole lot worse when he acts like he never heard me.

This isn't a long term solution for anything, but could you email an explanation to him? I think if it were me I would want to move forward knowing that the other person was at least aware of the problem.

As for trust... .   That's really hard. It's something that you own and can give or take away whenever you please - but it is always within your control. I think a lot depends on how you view trust as well. I trust my BPDH with a lot of things, in fact I would say that I generally do trust him... .   but I don't trust him to either do or not do specific things. And I don't trust very much at all when he is dissociating (I guess I only trust one of his personalities?) so that alters things as well. For me, trust is not a blanket and it is not all encompassing. I have altered my expectations and levels of trust in order to meet the reality of my relationships with different people, not just my H. So then, is the issue about trust? Expectations? Minimum levels of getting your needs met? I think it's important to define the issues before you can make a decision that you'll be happy with. Good luck!

[LetItBe]

The hard truth that I'm looking at is that I can't trust him to follow through on things he says he's going to do, regardless of the reason (i.e., dissociation, rebelling, resentment, mental illness, etc.). 

[patientandclear]

The hard truth that I'm looking at is that I can't trust him to follow through on things he says he's going to do, regardless of the reason (i.e., dissociation, rebelling, resentment, mental illness, etc.). 

Yep.  I think your choices are to radically accept that he will in fact pull back after you've been close, without following any agreement or structure about how to communicate during those pull-backs (because he is pulling back because his feelings are bad, which makes it hard for him to carry the best interests of the r/s foremost in his mind at those moments), but also knowing he will almost certainly be back ... .   or to decide you cannot live that way.

I don't see how explaining to him why you are upset is going to advance anything.  There is no way he cannot know, if he wants to figure it out.  You have been very plain & very clear about your minimum needs.  Having to explain & re-explain how he has not come through in ways he has promised to come through ... .   that doesn't seem like it is going to heal what needs healing for you.  Explaining to him also takes away your chance to learn from him what happened & what things looked like from his perspective.