Does a BPD / npd always have have someone else lined up?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Turkish this sounds right on to me.  My exBPDgf would note her guilt after having said days earlier that she would "never regret" anything that happened with me.  In a way both were true.  She was confusing guilt with shame. 

[BacknthSaddle]

Turkish this sounds right on to me.  My exBPDgf would note her guilt after having said days earlier that she would "never regret" anything that happened with me.  In a way both were true.  She was confusing guilt with shame. 

[Turkish]

Turkish this sounds right on to me.  My exBPDgf would note her guilt after having said days earlier that she would "never regret" anything that happened with me.  In a way both were true.  She was confusing guilt with shame. 

We have an article on this here. I read through it again and some things in there seem applicable.

BPD BEHAVIORS:Dissociation and Dysphoria

[Take2]

In a sense, she's sealed the dissociation. She publicly feels no shame, acts normal to me (I have to see her as a co-parent) as if nothing really happened. She has to. Otherwise, the full realization of what she did would be too much to bear emotionally.

My ex totally did this.  But he does with venom and hate against me.  He was caught cheating and lying but yet I wound up forgiving him to a certain extent even though I knew he was continuing to lie to me about her.  And clearly when he was finally ready to move on, the rages continued on and off like always but it was like he found whatever last excuse he could to put that last nail in the coffin.  He has last "scott free" because I am such a horrible person.  That last excuse?  Well, after he pushed me and glared at me at work, and then screamed at me that he was going to report ME to HR for accusing him of physical assault I was apparently STILL supposed to show him respect and I didn't because I sat next to his male boss at the company dinner. 

The many other horrible things he did he has long since forgotten (and by horrible, I mean HORRIBLE). 

In his mind, he is the good guy.  He is playing that good guy role again.  I hate it.  And I'm left reeling from the pain... .  

[Split black]

Mine... . ugh... .   When we met she was with her BF. I was with someone else but broke up shortly after. She was living with her BF and smearing him with what now I believe are lies. He was trying to get her to go to AA meetings and other meetings for drugs. When she was mirroring him she would go. I got her a place and paid for it etc etc. Not only didnt she ever totally cut the cord with him, she brought other guys into the picture because I guess she knew she couldnt use me for a place to live. I have a young son, and I never brought her to my house because my sons mother visits and I didnt want to confuse him. I didnt have sex with my ex. 

So after I was split black 4 times for not jumping thru all of her hoops and not responding fast enough to her emergencies ... . even pregnancies ( which I now dont believe )   I busted her with a new target, she promised never again... and a couple of weeks later I found out again and confronted her with proof. I was then blacker then black and there has been only one contact in which she accused me of being a minipualtive liar, terrible father, and a liar and I disgusted her.

Today... . after all the NC, a bit over a month ... . I self charmed and looked at her FB page. I can see pics and some things but we are not FB friends.  Shes back with her original BF of 3 or so years. Now this guy KNOWS all the times shes cheated, he was told by this other guy that HE was with her... . and mentioned me ( my name is not known)  AND he STILL took her back. Kissing on FB for the world to see... . that she is now back yet again with chump #1.  I actually feel badly for him. I dont know how she convinces everyone that shes going to change.

And she now has a JOB in a cosmetic place right NEXT TO MY GYM. I saw that on her stupid FB page as well. Awesome. How am I supposed to hit the gym and not walk two stores down and stick my head in. ugh.  Im a self charming loser.  But strangely... .    Im more angry then anything.

[Split black]

I meant to say another word in the above post but it comes out as charmed. Strange.

[barbwire911]

@splitBlack

yeah mine got really angry when i confronted him. We had an argument and I told him we needed space to cool off and obviously he did not like that.  But during the space I found out he was gearing up a replacement (welll I heard of it) and so I phoned him and asked him (I was calm and did not yell as it had been a week of space after a hellish up and down 9 months) and he got all angry all of a sudden and yelled "you were never anything to me and we were never nothing." This after he had spoken to me the night before on the phone saying he loved me and asked me to lunch for the following day!  So I think they are more angry and act defensive as to admit they were cheating or lining up a replacement shows their weakness to be alone and how needy they are. Easier for them to project anger instead I suppose so they lash out.  But yeah since that line and then a hang up and nothing more. Silent treatment for 6 weeks. Me too... . I am split blacker than black and I did alot too for my ex. Not financially but I helped him move and was there for him in rough times emotionally. It is bizarre and so unpredictable to say the least.

[restoredsight]

Both break ups with my wife coincided with some sort of shingling and disassociation, at least when she was with me. From knowing her history, I don't think she usually sticks around long enough with others for them to see it. I don't know why I'm different in this respect.

When we got back together and discussed the break up she seemed to have real remorse over it, but simply could not recall parts of it. She asked me if I had thrown her across the room. She couldn't remember how she got from point A to point B. I do remember. I had found out she was cheating and went into our apartment to see her getting dressed to go out, and I had yelled at her, "How could you do this to me?" Her eyes glazed over and she backed up and fell into the bed. I leaned over her and I saw that she looked afraid, and I said, ":)on't you know I could never hurt you?"

This translated into a temporary restraining order where, in part, she said that I held her down and yelled at her for five minutes, along with threatening her life, and breaking her phone (which I did do, to my shame.)

In any case, she admitted to me that there was a hole there that she filled in, and that it was based on feelings.

She got engaged to a guy a couple of months later, and she told me that once she was riding in a car with him, looked over and fully expected him to be me and was extremely confused as to why he wasn't me for some time.

From time to time, she would tell me that most other people just didn't seem real at all.

[Turkish]

One dissociative episode happened a few months ago when she was still living with me but we were not a couple except in the kids' eyes. I was at her parents' house to pick up the kids and was hanging out because her sister came into town. uBPDx was going to the gym and we'd meet at home later. She hadn't physically seen her sis in a year, so she abandoned her, too, in a way. I get this text which says "Hi, Love, I'm here, where are you?" It was obviously to her boy toy. I can't find words to tell you how that felt... .

I got home later, met her there, and went to pick up her little brother from the airport. We exchanged several texts in the meantime. Then a few at the airport to say I was taking him to their moms house instead of ours, a change of plans. We have the same phone. You can see the conversation string obviously. I was confused. Dud she do that on purpose to hurt me? Some members here thought so.

A few days later, her boy toy called her phone as we were sitting down to dinner with our kids. I saw the name and confronted her. A conversation ensued which I won't recount here again. I told her about the text. She was crying (I wasn't yelling, it was just that the situation forced her to co font the reality of what was going on). She looked at me and said, " I didn't realize I sent you that." It wasn't a deer in the headlights look. She was normal, at least as normal was for her. She really didn't realize what she had done. Weird!

[talithacumi]

Short answer: no, it just seems that way by default.

Long answer is that this (personally experienced and all too frequently reported) aspect of BPD behavior has far more to do with compulsive self-soothing than it does with actually finding/lining up a suitable replacement.

BPD is characterized by a constant, pervasive, and intense fear of rejection/abandonment. This - far more than anything else - is what drives a pwBPD to bond with, and attach as quickly and deeply as possible to another person especially on a romantic level.

Being in a relationship, however, doesn't make that fear go away. It provides a very real, very specific, and very singular object for that fear to focus on, react to, and act out against... And that fear - in my experience - can be triggered by anything that so much as hints of rejection/abandonment - whether intended, inferred/implied, deduced, misinterpreted, merely perceived, intuited, anticipated, transferred, or even just projected.

Since rejection/abandonment hasn't actually occurred, mostly what pwBPD feel is stress/anxiety over the possibility of that happening. Like pretty much everyone, they tend to automatically and compulsively engage in a variety of learned behaviors that at least temporarily relieve the stress/anxiety they feel. They drink, take drugs, gamble, overspend, overeat, pick fights/rage, and misrepresent their circumstances to elicit the approval, admiration, support, and sympathy as well as hopefully the tangible sexual interest/attraction of others because being actively pursued is actually the only thing that doesn't make them feel like they're going to be rejected/abandoned.

Do I think they always respond to that kind of interest/attraction? Absolutely.

Do I think they always act on it? Not at all. I think most of the time, they're able to relieve the stress/anxiety they feel simply by flirting with someone else and/or fantasizing about them. But if that's not enough, then, yes, I do think they'll end up having a one night stand, if not a full blown affair, in order to get the relief they're looking for.

Do I think they have affairs in order to procure a replacement in anticipation of their current relationship ending? Maybe if the current relationship isn't well established. But if it is, then I think they're intention - however subconscious, amorphous, and disordered as it may be - is simply to relieve the immediate and overwhelming stress/anxiety they feel about the possibility of being rejected/abandoned so it doesn't interfere with anyone's interest in/ability to have that relationship in the first place.

I think it tends to seem like that's what they're doing because when/if they get caught, the relationship often does end, and when it does, the person with whom they were cheating generally does become the replacement by default because they're there, they're available, they're interested, and they're clearly willing/able to assume that role.

They aren't monsters. They don't sit around figuring out how best to deceive, manipulate, exploit, use, betray, and hurt other people. They're just people consumed by a constant, pervasive, and seemingly irrational fear of being rejected/abandoned that causes them to engage in a wide range behaviors to relieve the stress/anxiety they feel that ultimately really only works to legitimize, reinforce, and intensify the underlying fear itself.

We were able to be with them because - at least to some extent - all of us were willing/able to ignore, deny, dismiss, rationalize, justify, excuse, forgive, and take responsibility/apologize/make amends for all of those behaviors as well as the effects they had on everyone/everything involved, including most significantly ourselves.

That's our part in the dance.

I played that part for over 12 years, and that's the part my ex-upwBPD - through my dilligence in this regard - ultimately came to believe, trust, and expect I would always play.

So, when I stopped - when I found I simply couldn't do it anymore - well - let's just say the feelings of shock, horror, and pain he's repeatedly expressed over my betrayal of him are not nearly as unfounded or disordered as I'm sure they appear to everyone but me.

Those are my current thoughts/opinions on the issue of whether or not all pwBPD always have a replacement waiting in the wings. Like everything else when it comes to this disorder, nothing - and I mean nothing - is ever as straightforward and simple as most of us would probably very much like it to be.

[dansure]

Since I think this is a very interesting thread I want to provide some more details on what I experienced.

My exBPD told me that she never really dated someone else before. She told me that her only "boyfriend" was a high-school romance where she would rarely see him and the biggest thing they would do is hold hands.

After we started dating I went on exchange to Asia for 3 month. She came to visit me and once I wanted to show a picture of us to some of my friends on her phone. When I scrolled all the way up in her album I found kissing pictures with some other guy. I got really angry because she obviously lied to me and we had a big fight. From this point on the relationship went down hill... . anyway after we broke up I found out that she was actually dating someone in the US before me (we study in Europe) and apparently that the guy from the pictures.

As I said before, we broke up several times during our 1 year relationship. She never wanted any pictures of us to be uploaded on Facebook and refused to upload pictures of us on her "Asian Facebook" as well. However, I don't think she was seeing anyone else during the period that we were together, since she really spent most of the time with me or studying. However, towards the end of the relationship we didn't see each other for a couple of weeks. I am pretty sure that she met someone during those weeks. We had one of our usual fights with her ending up breaking up with me as usual. But this time she was really different. She didn't pick up the phone when I tried to contact her and she became more bhity than usual. She also didn't show any attempts to get me back this time. I never thought about her seeing someone else already, since I just didn't think that she was this kind of girl (she always emphasized how she wasn't into dating at all before we met).

I tried to figure out what was going out and found out about BPD. On many sites it said that rebound relationships are extremely common... . so I was getting prepared that she might really see someone else. I tried to talk with her several times after her break up. She said things like "I rather find a new boyfriend" or "Maybe someday when I have a new boyfriend, we might see each other and can just greet each other as friends". I didn't give any meaning to this at first but then she said things like that over and over again. She also reactivated her account on Facebook and used very seductive profile pictures on her messengers. Finally, 2 month after we broke up I called her and asked her straight if she is seeing someone else.

Her response:

"Yes I do and it's not of your business! Leave me alone! THIS IS MY NEW LIFE"... .

this was the last time I contacted her. I was devastated but also shocked her predictable her behavior actually was.

That was also the point when I stopped to doubt whether she has BPD or nor. She told me that she met him just a couple of weeks ago, but I am sure she had him already lined up when we were still together.

It hurt, but it also helped me to get over her. She is a liar and for her boyfriends are like objects, which she throws away like a toy once she is done with it. I wonder if she denies that she was dating me and she did with her ex that she dated before me when she told me there wasn't anyone before me.

Anyway, it proved to me that she is not capable of true love. If you really love someone you can't just replace the person and have NO feelings and empathy left within a few weeks.

I always felt that something is wrong with her, but now I know for sure. She lives up to almost everything that I read about BPD. And I am happy that she disappeared from my life before we got married or got children together, because than I would have to deal with her for the rest of my life.

It will take time until I am completely over it, but I can at least hope for a healthy and normal relationship in my future with a normal girl, while she will probably repeat the same craziness with the new guy in the long run... . I don't think she will ever have a nice and long lasting relationship with anyone. She will probably have the same miserable marriage that her mum (which I am pretty sure has BPD as well) has with her dad... . and where she is from, getting a divorce is not as easy as here.

[Take2]

Talithacumi... . thank you for that post... .   it helps keep it in perspective.  I think everyone is different, just like every person with BPD is different so there are different aspects to each r/s or scenario.  As in, my ex truly has displayed some pretty horrifying monster-like characteristics but I actually think that may be overlapping npd or more likely aspd that may be in play.  But your post helps me remember what is actually going on with those with BPD and the why.  Thanks!

[Calm Waters]

my exBPDgf didnt tell me she was seeing someone else when we started. After a few weeks she told me she was dumping him for me ( he had asked her to marry him a few weeks earlier) he got the heave ho, at the time I was thrilled to be 'the one' then a few months later i got the same treatment and lookeing back I am pretty sure someone was being groomed to replace me when i finally got the push. How sad, I feel pity for them and thier victims

[HappyNihilist]

I don't know for sure in my situation, but my feeling is that my exBPDbf did have someone else lined up, most likely a younger woman, with whom I'm betting he cheated shortly before he left me. I have a bit of circumstantial evidence -- plus I know him.   

Here's what happened. I had a depressive episode and pulled back some from everyone. I do this for a few weeks almost every winter, and my friends and family all know. I warn them when it starts, . He was by far the least impacted, because I made an active effort to not shut him out. I was very open and upfront with what was going on, and I let him see me at my worst. My most emotional, crying, messed-up self. But I still did withdraw a little, just for psychic protection. I'm not the best partner during a depression, I realize this.

He immediately picked up on me withdrawing and went into cling overdrive. That was more than my already barely-held-together self could handle. I never really shut him out, he was always my priority even when I was at my worst, but I wasn't capable of giving him the attention he craved. He said that he was getting "very little" from me. Then he went on an overseas business trip for a month. I barely heard from him after the first week. The day he got back, he said he "wasn't leaving me" but he needed some space. I didn't hear from him for a week, and then it was, "I've been very unfair to you, I'll talk to you soon." Then on my birthday, without even acknowledging my birthday in any way, he texts me that he's trying to move overseas and can't guarantee he'll ever "be back for me."

My guess? My withdrawal triggered his fears, and he sought out alcohol and sex to self-soothe. Then he probably felt guilt and shame, bringing on more self-soothing. I do think he was trying, in his way, not to hurt me any more than he already had -- he told me, even at the end, that I was a genuine and good person -- and I'm grateful that he did. I'm sure he decided to run to the new woman because she's obviously available and wants him. I don't think he went into this trying to screw over my life.

talithacumi:

They aren't monsters. They don't sit around figuring out how best to deceive, manipulate, exploit, use, betray, and hurt other people. They're just people consumed by a constant, pervasive, and seemingly irrational fear of being rejected/abandoned that causes them to engage in a wide range behaviors to relieve the stress/anxiety they feel that ultimately really only works to legitimize, reinforce, and intensify the underlying fear itself.

This.

[goldylamont]

They don't sit around figuring out how best to deceive, manipulate, exploit, use, betray, and hurt other people.

... . Like everything else when it comes to this disorder, nothing - and I mean nothing - is ever as straightforward and simple as most of us would probably very much like it to be.

i will agree that it's not simple. still there's plenty of pattern that each of us may recognize. i think you make a lot of valid points here. i came back to this post though, as this statement i realize is what is triggering me:

They don't sit around figuring out how best to deceive, manipulate, exploit, use, betray, and hurt other people.

for me this statement feels a little too generalized... . in my case it's simply not true (also for many others). the fact that you were with someone for 12 years and come out of the r/s knowing that this person never purposefully tried to deceive, manipulate, exploit, use, betray or hurt you (or other people) is great. this is truly awesome talithacumi.

i hope you can understand that these comments feel a bit invalidating to my experience. because i just knew, you know, i knew my ex was doing/planning lots of things to try to hurt me. i've shared stories before but for brevity i will just say that i have ample proof to convince me of this.

it's hard to explain to someone who's never been through this aspect of the emotional abuse. but the trickiest and most devastating part of being with someone who is purposefully cruel is that you never know really if you can trust yourself, or if you're just acting paranoid. i was fortunate enough to gain some awareness in time to sidestep a lot of BS--but i was only able to do this because i became aware of who i was dealing with. if i had been so cavalier to think that this person was above trying to hurt me on purpose i would have experienced much, much more pain. knowing how she operated is what kept me from staying in contact with this person, or buying into her cheap 'friendship' offers. she is able to continue fooling more people simply because none of them would suspect that someone would act like this.

in a way i feel my personal stake now in participating on the boards is to try and pass some of this knowledge on that i feel helped me. and also it's just an outlet for me. much of the knowledge i gained was how to trust my gut to clarify when i was being manipulated and deceived. and i want others in this tricky situation to know they aren't alone and there are ways to navigate it.  trust me, it feels good to be able to gain this kind of perspective, but i wouldn't wish the situation on anyone

[Take2]

While everyone is different and there are probably many BPD folks who don't intentionally try to hurt those around them... . but in my experience, it's close to what Goldy wrote... .

My ex flat out told me about past things he'd done to people to get back at them for hurting him (keying a car, slashing tires -to a stranger... . !  sleeping with someone to get back at an ex GF because he wrongly thought she cheated on him.)  I know from the many many threats he has saidto me and some he's follow through on that yes he absolutely planned ways to hurt me.  To destroy me. His words.  His attempts.

Not physically but honestly, I realize that my ex is quite a dangerous man... .   I don't rule it out.  Even as we are split up and not talking, I still don't rule it out.  Not very comforting... .

[Cardinals in Flight]

My X most definitely came after my Achilles heel! Also heard her speak of retaliation towards others.  The silent treatment was used most often as I had stated early on (prior to knowing about BPD) that it was more hurtful to me than anything physical.

Just think? I love this person 

CiF

[expos]

ex-wife (she was my girlfriend back then) had a guy lined up the first time I dumped her.  I still had feelings for her, but I was getting weird vibes and asked for some time a part.  Three days later she is making out with some dude at a bar.

I take her back and she commits to me and we are married.  Three years later she has her replacement, a co-worker, lined up before we are officially divorced.  What the heck.  

Yep, they can't spend a single second to reflect, grow, or try to change.  They are that miserable.  I feel cursed to have fallen in love with this person!

[blissful_camper]

My experience was similar to Goldy's. 

I could see that my ex had awareness about how he was hurting others.  He not only admitted to it, but he continued on that path rather than taking action to not hurt others.  It was deliberate, and he clearly got off on it when he felt he had won.  He seemed to take pleasure in targeting others for abuse, recruiting others to abuse for him by proxy.  He wanted to take people down, all the way down ruining lives, and destroying others. This was his form of entertainment.  It was appalling. 

There were hurtful things that he directed at me and I know now those actions were conscious and deliberate.  I went from walking on eggshells, to staying a step ahead of him anticipating his bad behavior so I could get out of his way. 

Frankly, he seemed to have a sadist streak. 

[Turkish]

My experience was similar to Goldy's. 

I could see that my ex had awareness about how he was hurting others.  He not only admitted to it, but he continued on that path rather than taking action to not hurt others.  It was deliberate, and he clearly got off on it when he felt he had won.  He seemed to take pleasure in targeting others for abuse, recruiting others to abuse for him by proxy.  He wanted to take people down, all the way down ruining lives, and destroying others. This was his form of entertainment.  It was appalling. 

There were hurtful things that he directed at me and I know now those actions were conscious and deliberate.  I went from walking on eggshells, to staying a step ahead of him anticipating his bad behavior so I could get out of his way. 

Frankly, he seemed to have a sadist streak. 

I'll split the difference on mine. She once told me, after I queried why she got so mean to everybody when triggered, "I want everyone else to feel my pain!" I could cite "poor executive control" which is typical for a BPD, and there is some truth to not controlling her emotions. But I also noticed over the years that the worst of it was reserved for her family, me and sometimes our little children--- the ones who couldn't leave her. So she could control it, she just "let go" so to speak, and refused to.

[goldylamont]

post-breakup i had a convo with my ex and we were talking about horoscopes/signs. i'm not too into this... . but in any case her horoscope said her sign (scorpio) tended to be jealous and manipulative at times. we were laughing about it and she totally denied being jealous at all, despite me telling her she was the most jealous woman i had been with. but when i said manipulative, oddly enough she basically said "yeah, that's me. i can be pretty manipulative at times... . " wow. see, we did agree on some things,  .

i Don't think everything she did was to purposefully hurt others. even really painful things she said/did to me at times i feel i was simply collateral damage. nevertheless, there's other things she did that were used as a tool to punish.

i feel some want to minimize purposeful behaviors of pwBPD since they feel this is unnecessary demonizing. i think this is worthy of reflection as demonizing can wear us down. still, we need to be able to balance and see the situation for what it is/was.

i accept all the pain inflicted, whether purposeful or not, as things that happened that i need to process and work through. knowing that certain things were done with a sadistic twist to them does make it more challenging to release my attachment to these memories, yet i do feel confident that i can do it.

i can kind of laugh at some of this stuff now because i have proper space. my ex wasn't only a monster--but she damn well can be monstrous  . and no my ex was not all evil. i would have never been with or fell in love with someone who was all evil... . but there were times where she was pretty damn evil and so i'm working with my vocabulary and thoughts to make sure i can detach from the memories that seem so 'evil' to me. i accept this part as my responsibility as readily as i do any knowledge of her behaviors.

[HappyNihilist]

i feel some want to minimize purposeful behaviors of pwBPD since they feel this is unnecessary demonizing. i think this is worthy of reflection as demonizing can wear us down. still, we need to be able to balance and see the situation for what it is/was.

i accept all the pain inflicted, whether purposeful or not, as things that happened that i need to process and work through. knowing that certain things were done with a sadistic twist to them does make it more challenging to release my attachment to these memories, yet i do feel confident that i can do it.

To be fair to my ex, he did leave before he completely lost control of himself, so I think I was spared a lot of cruelty that might have happened had the r/s lasted. I don't excuse or minimize his or any pwBPD's behaviors. We all choose our actions and words, and must bear that responsibility. I just think it comes from less a place of conscious manipulation and is more their version of a survival instinct: strike first, and usually very painfully, before anyone else can hurt them.

That being said, there were certainly things that he did and said in the r/s that I know were meant to be cruel and hurtful. But I will never believe that he went into this r/s with the plan to get me hooked, build up a fantasy, and then hurt and abandon me. For one, that would require more self-awareness and future planning that I think he or most pwBPD are capable of. He probably did think this was the r/s that would work, in the beginning. But once the idealization wore off... . well, then very few punches were pulled.

[Take2]

My experience was similar to Goldy's. 

I could see that my ex had awareness about how he was hurting others.  He not only admitted to it, but he continued on that path rather than taking action to not hurt others.  It was deliberate, and he clearly got off on it when he felt he had won.  He seemed to take pleasure in targeting others for abuse, recruiting others to abuse for him by proxy.  He wanted to take people down, all the way down ruining lives, and destroying others. This was his form of entertainment.  It was appalling. 

There were hurtful things that he directed at me and I know now those actions were conscious and deliberate.  I went from walking on eggshells, to staying a step ahead of him anticipating his bad behavior so I could get out of his way. 

Frankly, he seemed to have a sadist streak. 

Your ex sounds like he may also have some antisocial personality traits... . As does mine... .   and probably some NPDthrown in for good measure. ... . haha

[Split black]

i Don't think everything she did was to purposefully hurt others. even really painful things she said/did to me at times i feel i was simply collateral damage. nevertheless, there's other things she did that were used as a tool to punish.



i accept all the pain inflicted, whether purposeful or not, as things that happened that i need to process and work through. knowing that certain things were done with a sadistic twist to them does make it more challenging to release my attachment to these memories, yet i do feel confident that i can do it.

The things she did were done with no regard for me or anyone else except to satisfy whatever impulses and stories she was living in at that moment. Or what she convinced herself she wanted. She simply does not care.  For example... . shes back with her original ex of 3-4 years. This same guy that she cheated on with me, that she told me she cheated on many times before. She said she didnt feel guilt because he cheated on her once ( who knows)  But for that entire year, even after begging me to help her get a place so ( I would have a relaxing peaceful place to go to where we could be together when I was free) was just a manipulation to get her own place and invite anyone over she wanted to on my dime. One time she said to me that she and I had more sex then she and her ex ever had. He knows of her cheating, he has rejected her and wouldn't allow her to move back in... but there he is again. One time we were in the apt, and I discovered she walked on to her deck in the snow to text him or FB him while he was on vacation somewhere. I walked out. She called me begging, crying, hysterical... . screaming you win, you win, you win, please come back ... . I didnt text him, I was flirting it was all a lie you know how I need to flirt... .  Of course I came back and rocked her back and forth in my arms till she fell asleep... .    Then I discovered another... and found evidence of others... . lies, cheating, more lies... .   and then to top it off... .  Im banished and evil and horrible father and I disgust her ... .  never to see or hear from her again.  I guess thats a good thing. But it still does feel brutal.

[Take2]

One of the most frustrating things for me is how much I forgave and then wound up banished as well... .   things like him having started dating and sleeping with someone else... . him threatening me at work constantly and scaring the crap out of me... .   him yelling at me on the phone how disrespectful I was to ask him to come sit with me at my dad's bedside the night he died - yelling as he was on his way to a date with someone he'd just met online... .   WOW what on earth is wrong with me... .   it's absurd how much of a doormat I allowed myself to become... . but that I took a hit and another and another and another and changed myself and my life for him... . and wound up the discarded fool... .    while he's of course with another girl... . or maybe he's not if he wasn't lying last week... .    it's ridiculous... .