When the lies are blatant but you just daren't confront?

[Depression = 72% of members]

This is something which keeps going round my mind and won't go away.

I suppose that's when you realise just how controlled you really are?

When someone has you so hooked, controlled and manipulated that you just daren't scream at them

"stop effing lying!"

The frustration is just unbearable.

Contradictions are lies as well, because after all, if you say you like something/did something one day, but the next week you say you can't stand something/never did that before... . one of those is a lie!

Those contradictions are probably the first hint that something doesn't add up with a person. I saw those hints, but ignored them thinking he wanted to impress me.

What I found a lot, and usually during periods of distance/low contact etc, was that I would receive excuses for that absence, not unusual for BPD but in my case every now and then I would receive an excuse which I'd had before.

It would be a far fetched excuse very  unbelievable or at least highly unlikely, but most definitely one which I'd had before... . word for word,exactly!

I also had pictures sent to me with captions such as 'hey look at this someone made for me'... . an identical picture of an identical thing 'someone just gave him'... . clearly NOT, this was something hand made and unique, so therefore not likely to be duplicated, and if it was, not likely to be given to the same person twice?

He obviously kept the photo... . but totally forgot he had already sent it to me a few months before.

He has (not been in touch) because he 'lost his phone' and found it in the exact same place three days later... . four times in six months!

Obviously forgot he already used that one!

I  lost count of how many times this happened, and I suppose what I'm wondering is,,whilst I know that they lie pathologically, and to be a good liar you have to have a good memory?

I can't understand how anyone can actually KEEP using the same lines without realising that WE pick up on it.

Are they SO deeply enmeshed with themselves that they are oblivious to OUR perceptions?

Or is it really like the little child who got away with being naughty so easily that they (like that one, and choose to use it again)?

There were so many times I wanted to scream "OH FOR FFFFKS SAKE, how thick do you think I am?"

And some people say its not games they play, it's defence mechanisms?

Not from where I was sitting. It felt really obvious to me that he was enjoying duping me!

It felt to me that he enjoyed being cruel, and I can't describe how much that hurt.

[Peterpan]

This is something which keeps going round my mind and won't go away.

I suppose that's when you realise just how controlled you really are?

When someone has you so hooked, controlled and manipulated that you just daren't scream at them

"stop effing lying!"

The frustration is just unbearable.

Contradictions are lies as well, because after all, if you say you like something/did something one day, but the next week you say you can't stand something/never did that before... . one of those is a lie!

Those contradictions are probably the first hint that something doesn't add up with a person. I saw those hints, but ignored them thinking he wanted to impress me.

What I found a lot, and usually during periods of distance/low contact etc, was that I would receive excuses for that absence, not unusual for BPD but in my case every now and then I would receive an excuse which I'd had before.

It would be a far fetched excuse very  unbelievable or at least highly unlikely, but most definitely one which I'd had before... . word for word,exactly!

I also had pictures sent to me with captions such as 'hey look at this someone made for me'... . an identical picture of an identical thing 'someone just gave him'... . clearly NOT, this was something hand made and unique, so therefore not likely to be duplicated, and if it was, not likely to be given to the same person twice?

He obviously kept the photo... . but totally forgot he had already sent it to me a few months before.

He has (not been in touch) because he 'lost his phone' and found it in the exact same place three days later... . four times in six months!

Obviously forgot he already used that one!

I  lost count of how many times this happened, and I suppose what I'm wondering is,,whilst I know that they lie pathologically, and to be a good liar you have to have a good memory?

I can't understand how anyone can actually KEEP using the same lines without realising that WE pick up on it.

Are they SO deeply enmeshed with themselves that they are oblivious to OUR perceptions?

Or is it really like the little child who got away with being naughty so easily that they (like that one, and choose to use it again)?

There were so many times I wanted to scream "OH FOR FFFFKS SAKE, how thick do you think I am?"

And some people say its not games they play, it's defence mechanisms?

Not from where I was sitting. It felt really obvious to me that he was enjoying duping me!

It felt to me that he enjoyed being cruel, and I can't describe how much that hurt.

[em754]

Unfortunately I think we all let their lies slip through because it is easier than the alternative. I find it easier to avoid the confrontation as I have enough problems with her as it is, and I know what the truth is most times anyway.

[elessar]

Hi peterpan,

I know what you are going through. been going through the same thing for last couple of days (as I have been for years). I don't know what to say except, I feel if someone understands what we are going through it might make us feel more sane.

When we are trying to justify their behavior because of their illness, we say their lying is their defense mechanism. when they have made us extremely angry, we no longer feel like defending their illness and say they just lie deliberately and purposefully. maybe the answer is both. depending on my level of anger i have been on all three sides of it. .

but it is the lying and contradiction that i hate the most. because then it feels like they are insulting our intelligence. like, cmon... . I know what you said or what you did, stop lying to me. that is happening to me right now for a topic and i was telling a friend, maybe she does believe her lies. i was thinking, she starts out by telling the truth. but the truth shames her so then she makes up other reasons for her behavior (which stops the buck at me) and then starts believing her made up story. then she no longer is ashamed and if i dare to get angry, I am being bad because her behavior was because of something I did/didn't do etc.

[rollercoaster24]

Hi all,

Yeeeeepppp, been there, done that. So many lies, and so many times I just let them go, but each one hurt more each time, my heart was building up layer upon layer of scar tissue!

Ironically, my exBP spent all his time obsessed that I was lying to him, playing a game and cheating!

In the beginnings of our relationship, I owned up to every little thing/criticism/insecurity that would cause him to doubt my faithfulness, I eliminated every single item from my life, in order for him to feel more secure. Even started only seeing female friends etc, it made no difference, BP merely found new ideas to punish me with. The man at the shop, my boss, work associates.

For my part? I was always 98% honest, (basically all the important stuff).

Any white lies I ever told at the beginning? (once I realised his condition) were necessary to protect other people's privacy and safety, as well as my own.

Through my therapist, I was relieved of the guilt at having to omit the truth occasionally to my partner, once I realised what I was dealing with in terms of his mental health.

I still kept doing everything I could to address his trust issues, but none of it made any difference, and you know what? BP just carried on doing whatever he liked when he liked, and justifying it the whole time.

For a while there, I brought into his lies, but it came to the point where I couldn't stand it anymore, and I spoke up, there may have been two weeks where he did not travel to his favourite beach city and 'sleep in his car' overnight.

There were lots of other things I let go, but I was never able to trust him, because each time he ruined any trust I might have been trying to build in him.

I have no doubt that he had been continuing to see other women throughout our entire relationship, and likely has moved back or on in the last three weeks, to those other targets.

A few days ago, I did some snooping, (I know, still obsessed!) and found that on the same day he had read an email I sent after he assaulted me and dumped me on the 10/6/13, he was looking at a spam email for Viagra!

I am not sure what was going through his mind that day, and I shouldn't have snooped, because it only made me feel worse. But I knew that he never needed Viagra when he was with me, so maybe he has had someone younger, and feels he might have to keep up? Who knows?

I do remember him being obsessed about his own 'equipment', always talking about how it wasn't always working the same as it used to, joking about being impotent, jokingly asking me if I thought he was, and I was always loving and supportive towards his 'equipment'. I certainly never felt that he needed any assistance in that sense, and for the most part, he didn't either.

I did feel like he wanted me to 'worship' it though, (not that I had any trouble, sigh... . )

[Ishenuts]

In my case, with my uNPDexH, my gut told me he was lying, but very rarely did I have indisputable "proof". The few times I did have proof, before the marriage, when confronted he was contrite, and soo sorry, and I ended up marrying him anyway. What did that tell him? He could get away with it! This all happened during the honeymoon stage. My T tells me I should forgive myself for being so gullible. But I never never trusted him! I hung in there because we had 2 small children and I gave up a once in a lifetime job to be a stay at home mom. I felt trapped. His lies were never blatant, just not logical. I think it will be hard to trust again, and I'll listen to my gut from now on.

[Peterpan]

Rollercoaster, your story is very similar to mine!

Mine in the beginning had troble in that deptartment, always okay right up to hte actual act,and then,,bam! he would lose it.

I too was very understanding, put it down to nerves, guilt, you name it... . after a while the word VIAGRA came into his vocabulary too... . he would hint at needing a few hours with me (never happened) and on occasion I would have a gut feeling that he'd had 'some help',I just knew, and broached it carefully.

He just kept saying,it's not you,it's me... . .I knew it wasn't me, but couldn't grasp what the hell was wrong!

I put that together with all the other clues of someone else, and then had obsessive thoughts of... . I'ts just the thrill of the chase? he wants the thrill, but not the deed?

If I hadn't caught him out with another woman... . I would have been totally understanding, patient, for someone I loved so deeply?

The lies from him were silly ones though which hurt like short stabs.

Can't talk now, just bumped into so and so (she lives miles away!)?,not once but a few times over  a span of a few months?

And always, always an illness or potential illness which he had brought up before... . over the span of a few months?

I saw very clear patterns and these identical excuses would pop up every three or four months,he would totally forget that he used them before, but I was always left, like you, not being able to question them,OR prove them,he would have just lied again with another explanation?

I have to say that it was/is an extreme case of at least Narcissism, for a whole year I was pulled at as a distant caretaker, he used my weaknesses to a fine art, knew I wouldn't question him,even though I'm sure he knows I knew he was lying to me.

That's the part for me which is so hard to come to terms with even now. Like a spiteful, cruel, child poking fun at me, actually dangling me on a string because in his words (he knows I love him so much) and knows he can get away with it.

It's not just a mental illness to me,it's sick and cruel!

I know now after reading some of the 'stop being a caretaker to BPD' that I have issues too, I have been allowing it to happen, I am about to arrange therapy for myself.

I can't keep obsessing over something which will never happen, and I need to take care of me now.

I know it's going to hurt me,but nothing could ever hurt me like he has,,I shall move on with MY life.

[laelle]

At first I tried to confront the lies, but I got rage, blamed and ignored for my troubles.  They can twist a bald face lie into the honest truth in moments.

It was simply easier to ignore and wish for the best.  It was more for my own self preservation than for him.  The stress, fear and anxiety it caused to stand up to him wasnt worth it.  I wasnt stupid, I just overlooked it.

Truth?  Oh, that little unimportant thing? 

[numbr3]

I lived for 22 yrs with his rages and projections that I was lying and hiding things.  In the end I did get this much... .

"I don't lie to you anymore." = a lie

"I haven't lied to you in a long time." = a lie

"You're a pathological liar" = projection

That confirms enough for me, I didn't get details on what exactly he lied about, an apology or that he would change.  I can guess anyway, it was probably worse than I imagined and it definately was ongoing.  I opted out of the relationship before it destroyed me anymore.

[danley]

Sometimes even the small lies add up. Blatant lies are hard to deal with. Small lies even rub me the wrong way now with my ex. I know we all tell soft lies to not offend people but with my ex I notice now I get annoyed. He wanted to show me pics on his phone. An hour later I see him texting and he tells me he forgot he didn't put the pics on his phone. I know this is a lie. He probably didn't want me to see his text messages coming thru while he showed me the pics. I didn't react, I just said OK. But really? I'd think it be more stand up if he would just say the truth.

Blatant lies from my ex never went over well. It was rare that he would lie while we were together. It was kinda strange how he was overly honest. But in the relationship I always state the truth of any matter. If it was something i felt was blatant Id point it out and he usually gets flustered and ends up deflecting on another topic.

[Littleopener]

Sorry to drag this up, but it felt relevant.

I asked him about something he had posted on twitter. His response?

"I don't have twitter".

When two days ago he was conversing with me on it. Why blatantly lie when he knows I know he has twitter? Makes no sense.

So i didn't dare call him up on this, I just walked on egg shells, said it was "my mistake" to avoid conflict.

Gah.

[Learning_curve74]

Gaslighting:

Gaslighting is a form of mental abuse in which false information is presented with the intent of making a victim doubt his or her own memory, perception and sanity. Instances may range simply from the denial by an abuser that previous abusive incidents ever occurred, up to the staging of bizarre events by the abuser with the intention of disorienting the victim.

The term "gaslighting" comes from the play Gas Light and its film adaptations. The term is now also used in clinical and research literature.

[Notthesame64]

I know it's going to hurt me,but nothing could ever hurt me like he has,,I shall move on with MY life.

Good for you peterpan,  I understood every word!

[Siamese Rescue]

Thank you just for the title of your thread. As usual, I visit this site and am reminded of the correct choices I should be making about my exBPDbf. Every word of the original post reasonates with me, and all the follow up posts so adequately describe my experience with this man.

[Bananas]

I feel for everyone on this thread!

I am detaching but we have a few mutual friends and many mutual coworkers and I learn about a new lie just about everyday.  No need to confront now, just sit back and watch the trainwreck.   

[Aussie0zborn]

We know this scenario all too well.  We think we're helping the situation by not confronting them to avoid an ugly argument but in the end we do ourselves harm and we have to do so much work to get over it.

I like the trainwreck comment. In my case I'm sitting back and waiting.  I would love to have a front row seat but that's not going to happen. I got a small sample of it in court today when she yelled and her lawyer had to shoosh her up. It might take a while but Im in no hurry.

[Zack]

I found the lies to be one of the worse traits. I've tried to figure out why my uBPDex lied... . sometimes it was to hide the fact she was with another man, other times it was for simpathy, to get a reaction... . other times I just don't know why.

My ex fiancee once spun a lie for 3 days. She phoned to say her teenage son was in hospital having an operation. She described the operation, the journey to hospital in the ambulance, described the conversation she had with the doctors... . etc... . etc. It was all a lie. I checked her sons FB, there was nothing wrong with him, he was at home with his GF. A continual lie for 3 days solid... . gosh. During the 3 days she even accused me of not believing her... . madness!

[sadinnc98]

I avoided confrontation because it either led to: circular arguments, him turning things around on me and somehow I ended up apologizing, he would shut down and break up, etc... that kind of stuff. More drama than it was worth.