I feel like its my duty to tell her about BPD

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I just joined, posted my story, and having been reading everyone else's story. And now, I'm absolutely convinced that my ex suffers from BPD.

I know you are suppose to completely disengage and I don't have any delusions about "fixing" her and having a happy Hollywood ending with her. I can see now how better off I am without her and I know that re-entering a relationship with her would do nothing but bring back that tornado.

But I have a genuine concern about my friend (of 13 years) and I am worried about her. I feel like I should tell her and explain to her the negative effects her actions has on people so she could take that info and get help or just deny it. Either way, I would feel better about completely disengaging if I at least did that.

Any advice? 

[AlwaysForgiving]

I just joined, posted my story, and having been reading everyone else's story. And now, I'm absolutely convinced that my ex suffers from BPD.

I know you are suppose to completely disengage and I don't have any delusions about "fixing" her and having a happy Hollywood ending with her. I can see now how better off I am without her and I know that re-entering a relationship with her would do nothing but bring back that tornado.

But I have a genuine concern about my friend (of 13 years) and I am worried about her. I feel like I should tell her and explain to her the negative effects her actions has on people so she could take that info and get help or just deny it. Either way, I would feel better about completely disengaging if I at least did that.

Any advice? 

[patientandclear]

Just bear in mind that the immediate reaction is likely to be very negative. BPD is a system of robust defenses that use denial and projection to ward off attribution of responsibility to the pwBPD. Those likely will be deployed to slap away what you're saying. And humans in general have a hard time hearing that something is wrong with them. They tend to resent the bearer of the message.

It's a helpful exercise to imagine it in reverse: she tells you she's done a lot of thinking and research and decided you have dependent personality disorder (or BPD for that matter) and that's why things were so messed up, and you really should get help; it's too late for this r/s but she's so magnanimous she wants you to heal so you can be happy with someone else in the future. That would piss me off and I bet it would piss you off.

If your interest is in being heard, not just saying it, you might want to take a look at Francisco (?) Amador's book I'm Not Sick before you take any steps like this. It explains how loved ones CAN play a role in helping someone mentally ill grapple with the impacts of their illness, but how thoughtful you need to be about communicating on the topic.

[qwaszx]

Hey, when me and my BPD friend where actually really close she always wanted me to fix her(and I means she liturally was like "well you can be my therapist"... . all I felt was doom)... but I tried anyways... . after about a year, I had looked through all mental health problems, and found the book "I hate u don't leave me"... . because of the amount of trust she had in me, the fact that she honestly really wanted help at that point, along with how u word it... . we were able to have that convo and it went really well... . 2years later she got her official dignoses "BPD and PTSD" ... has gone through DBT, and as far as I know is still in therapy, going to school, has her next new boyfriend(granted she's slipped back as far as that goes, cutting, the lies, they already recycled, etc) her life seems to be better ish:S all of that being said there is no programs anywhere in Canada for people with BPD, and most people aren't trained in how to help them... . so I don't know if anyone can actually fully help her get all the way... she's still the same as when I met her years earlyer, just more knowledgeable...

So yes, it's a sensitive topic and can be done, but timing and wording is a must...

She's a survivor, always has been, I'm just wondering what your reason for wanting to tell her is?

[AlwaysForgiving]

My main reason is I'm worried about the relationship she's currently in. She drove both me and her ex-husband to the point of insanity by leaving and coming back. And I can see the patterns of BPD in her new relationship too.

She texted me earlier the week and said she broke up with him because he's an alcoholic, but she got back in the relationship the very next day! If she ends up doing the same thing she did to me and her ex-husband, and this guy's an alcoholic like she says he is, I have a very bad feeling that this guy is going to absolutely snap and things are going to get really bad for her really quickly. This guy is going to end up hitting her or worse... .

With her, I am 95% right about things I know are going to happen and they actually happen. I mostly want to tell her that if she feels the need to get out of the relationship, she needs to STAY OUT of the relationship and not to do what she did to me and her ex-husband, because I really don't know how hot-headed this guy is... . from what I can tell, he seems to be that way. 

[Arminius]

Give it caring, you are wasting your time, your life, and if she is this way, then nothing you can do will help.

Accept the loss, move on and love with normal people around you. It's an amazing feeling.

[talithacumi]

It's obvious that you still really care about this person, alwaysforgiving - and that's both really understandable AND admirable under the circumstances, but - hard as this is to hear - your relationship with her is over - as is any right/responsibility/need you may have felt you had to question, criticize, influence, accept, approve of, agree with, and otherwise invalidate the choices she makes/behaviors in which she chooses to engage.

You may be right: this guy may very well be bad news, and the relationship/life she's having with him may turn out to one of the worse she's ever experienced.

Two things.

First, consider the source of your information. It's your ex. You are perfectly aware she has BPD traits and therefore compulsively edits/manipulates the truth to get others to give her the attention, interest, sympathy, support, validation, acceptance, approval, and support she needs. Whatever she's told you about this guy, and the relationship/life she shares with him, has clearly triggered a very strong caretaking/rescuing/fixing response from you - which - whether consciously/intentionally or not - is exactly what she's learned, from experience, telling you certain things in certain ways will do. Her fear of either rejection/abandonment OR engulfment are invariably BOUND to get triggered from time to time by whoever her current boyfriend/partner/husband are - that person is just as invariably BOUND to get split/painted black when that happens - and she is just as invariably BOUND to look for someone ELSE to relieve the intense stress, anxiety, confusion, frustration, doubt, insecurity, panic, and fear she feels when that happens as well. You can either respond in the way you always have to her and BE that someone else for as long as it takes for her to get herself under control again ... . or you can remember that she's disordered, is mirroring you, manipulating the truth about her situation/feelings in order to get what she needs, give her credit for being smart/resourceful enough (despite being disordered or perhaps because of it!) to figure out how to deal with whatever problem she's having on her own, feel maybe but stop yourself from acting on whatever impulse you have to fix/rescue/take care of her, and just let her do that for herself - even if it means her getting yet someone ELSE to do that for her instead of you - because, really, who are you to sit in judgement on the what she does to take care of herself?

Second: consider the way the disorder works. Her primary mechanism for coping with the stress/anxiety she feels in relation to her constant fear of rejection/abandonment is being in a "committed" relationship with someone she sees/relates to as a caretaker/fixer/rescuer. Doesn't matter who, or what kind of person that is. Doesn't matter if they're good at it or totally suck. She's going to see her "partner" as that person and JADE like crazy, if necessary, so she can keep doing so for as long as she possibly can. She got triggered by something, showed up at your door, and essentially "cheated" on him by temporarily using you to fill that role for her again - then, once you'd serviced her - she went right back to him again because he - or, more importantly, the relationship he's interested in/willing to have with her - are the one/only thing she knows that makes it's possible for her to function given the kind of emotional disorder she has. Regardless of whether it's true or not, she perceives that relationship as being absolutely critical to her survival - and any attempt you make to alter/change/end it - however well and/or selflessly intended - are going to be viewed as the absolute/unquestionable threat they actually represent to her - and there is NOTHING you can do to change that: you did not cause this disorder; you cannot control it; the best you can do is accept it, and get out of its way.

It may sound harsh, but IF this is the mistake you're afraid it might be, then it's HER mistake and - much as you may wish it weren't, hers to MAKE as well.

It's really difficult to recognize when/where to set boundaries when it comes to people we love/care about. But in this case, your temptation/compulsion to feel responsible for her welfare/future, if not actually try to TAKE responsibility for those things AWAY from her doesn't sound like you see/value her as an individual nearly as much as your concern for her would tend to indicate. It sounds pretty inappropriate, presumptious, judgemental, and more than a little controlling actually so if you decide to go ahead and do it anyway, don't be surprised if she ends up reacting to it on that basis and NOT as the beneficent gesture of selfless help you'd clearly like her to see it as.

Sorry if this sounds really harsh. I know you mean well. We all do. It's just that we're all so deep in the FOG, so distracted, so desperate/scared ourselves, so panicked, and so enmeshed in repeating the behaviors that characterized/made up the relationships we had with our exes - that we don't always see ourselves or those behaviors for what they really are - and just keep beating our heads against the same brick wall trying to figure out why it won't turn into a door.

This is hard stuff, alwaysforgiving. Set some boundaries. Focus on yourself, and stop worrying so much about her. It's not your job anymore.

[qwaszx]

I hear you  it's a really crappy situation to say the least... . and I understand how hard it is to sit back and watch as things start to escalate... my friend was just coming out an abusive relationship when we met... she also went into another abusive relationship while we lived together... I felt really trapped and I didn't know what to do... I didn't want to leave her in this relationship because I felt like she needed me more then ever when she was there... in the end he put her in the hospital... . I felt like I should have done more to stop it but I honestly did all that I could... I beat myself up to he point where I was so stressed I was puking... and I hold a lot of resentment towards her because she couldn't see the effects she had on me... it shouldn't have been my responsibility to do everything I could to get her out of it, it's her responsibility to take care of herself, just as it is your ex's

if she has BPD the more you tell her to get out of that relationship, the more she will fight you(it's her life, she might view it as you being controlling even though your trying to help and don't want to see her in pain) and want to stay, which makes everything worse for her... . if I learnt anything it was that next time as hard as it is I should have walked away. Closed my eyes so the attentions off her... . but that's thought makes me sick... no one deserves to be treated like nothing, and abused... . and I believe she did need my support... but I couldn't handle it.

I can't say what u should do, maybe it will help you ease your mind. And maybe it will help her... but above all else take care of you. When she feels she deserves better she will end it... it's really an internal battle for her and her self worth that she needs to face alone... .  I hope for both of u it doesn't turn out as it did for her... . but it was what she needed as painful as it was for everyone, she now has a really great guy she's with... so I'm hoping that will never happen again... .

[peiper]

I can tell you from my experience it will not do any good. The second time mine split and came back I told her that I had been talking to a therapist and he'd said she sounded borderline. I told her and she just ignored it. She either already had been told or didnt care.

[Blimblam]

I told mine and she said "yeah I think so, Its fine."

They know something is "wrong" with them.  If you try to go into borderline behaviors and depth about what borderline entails.  Expect to be abused and split black.

[Arminius]

To quote mine when it raised the issue: 'yeah, I might be a little bit bipolar' . Said, dismissively, the way one might say, 'yeah, I might be a little bit late'

[Narellan]

I toss this idea around too sometimes. If he comes to my door again maybe I can say " I understand what you're battling, there's help available if you want it"... . Then I think of his reaction and don't think ill bother.

My ex painted me as an alcoholic when we split. I'm not he was just painting me black with the first thing he could think of. His ex gf was a drug addict. I doubt that's true either.

Bottom line even if there's an element of truth when they split someone black everything's hugely exaggerated or lies are told.

Having said that, you can't control other people. You will just be seen as the jaded ex and you are putting yourself in a Triangulation you don't need to get into. You are not her rescuer.

Refocus on yourself and what you need and steer well clear of her and her life.

The fact that she's telling you things about her new relationship is dysfunctional. Even though you have the best intentions, at this stage we recommend no contact with our exBPD as they try to pull you into the fictional game again. Try NC for a while and give yourself time to heal. 

[AlwaysForgiving]

Thank you for all the responses! I have read every one of them and have decided not to say anything. I think and what until she contacts me again (which is a matter of time) and tell her about the overwhelming evidence that she may have BPD. I have absolutely nothing left to lose when it comes to her and there is no possibility of us having a relationship again so I don't care if she ends up hating or resenting me for telling her. It would be up to her what she wants to do with that information.

Oh, Narellan... . you mentioned how it was dysfunctional that she told me about her relationship. Well, that was nothing! She used to tell details about her relationship before this one like I was one of her girlfriends or something... . like she wanted me to give her advice about how to fix that relationship!

[trappedinlove]

It's obvious that you still really care about this person, alwaysforgiving - and that's both really understandable AND admirable under the circumstances, but - hard as this is to hear - your relationship with her is over - as is any right/responsibility/need you may have felt you had to question, criticize, influence, accept, approve of, agree with, and otherwise invalidate the choices she makes/behaviors in which she chooses to engage.

Very true.

It's really difficult to recognize when/where to set boundaries when it comes to people we love/care about. But in this case, your temptation/compulsion to feel responsible for her welfare/future, if not actually try to TAKE responsibility for those things AWAY from her doesn't sound like you see/value her as an individual nearly as much as your concern for her would tend to indicate. It sounds pretty inappropriate, presumptious, judgemental, and more than a little controlling actually so if you decide to go ahead and do it anyway, don't be surprised if she ends up reacting to it on that basis and NOT as the beneficent gesture of selfless help you'd clearly like her to see it as.

Sorry if this sounds really harsh. I know you mean well. We all do. It's just that we're all so deep in the FOG, so distracted, so desperate/scared ourselves, so panicked, and so enmeshed in repeating the behaviors that characterized/made up the relationships we had with our exes - that we don't always see ourselves or those behaviors for what they really are - and just keep beating our heads against the same brick wall trying to figure out why it won't turn into a door.

This is hard stuff, alwaysforgiving. Set some boundaries. Focus on yourself, and stop worrying so much about her. It's not your job anymore.

I was in a similar situation with my uBPDxso. There were 3-4 occasions where I felt she's endangering both herself and her son, to both I felt (and still feel) strongly attached to. This happened before we went NC and I reacted negatively to both relationships and that was a mistake in hindsight.  It was a lose-lose situation because on one hand I did not want to abandon her because I cared so much and I didn't want to hurt her, but OTOH I couldn't fully support her in her decisions and just let her make her mistakes and learn from them as any adult person would do.  She expected total unconditional support from me as a friend and soul mate and I was scared to my pants about her, so anxious to the level of panic - pounding heartbeats, trembling voice, losing sleep over her, etc. as if she was my teenage daughter.

To my defence  I do have a teenage daughter who's diagnosed with BPD traits that went through a very tough period and really put herself in danger a couple years earlier and that left a mark on me.  So I suspect a lot of it was projection.

The bottom line is that I strongly agree with that once you broke up it is inappropriate to intervene.  Unless it is a life threatening situation.

It is certainly not your duty to tell her about BPD.

[Changingman]

Personally I would avoid telling anyone they have BPD, by it's dark nature it will suck you in if you show any connection. Remember at it's base it is a numbing depression, emptiness, self hatred, paranoia, rage, chaos. These gifts can be yours, if you want them.

If insulted they will accuse you of the same.

If they are hiding you may find they start a smear campaign against you: Police, partners, friends and your family being used to abuse you.

Worst of all... .

If they are interested in your attention you may end up in a relationship (replacement) with them. Fascinated by your perspective, suck you into their black hole at 3am in the morning, then involve you in the torture/Triangulation of their 'boyfriend'.

Personally I now avoid these Cluster B people at all cost. They are either your problem or NOT. I make sure they don't know I avoid them.

Lose whatever 'bond' you have with her, no one will thank you.

This is vanity, not care.


Good Luck

[enlighten me]

I could happily go NC with my ex apart from 1 major issue. We have a son together. I have already seen the same traits in her daughter 9 and if there is anything that I can do to prevent my 13 month old boy from developing it then I have to try don't I?

I am still unsure of the best way to approach this though.

I had thought of speaking with her brother who lived with us and witnessed how she was but this could be seen as me flinging mud.

I just don't know. The fact that she has alluded to her temper not being right says that she is aware of what she does.

[Feralnerd]

Thank you for all the responses! I have read every one of them and have decided not to say anything. I think and what until she contacts me again (which is a matter of time) and tell her about the overwhelming evidence that she may have BPD.

Hi AlwaysForgiving! I'm glad to hear you're not reaching out to tell her while you're painted black. I tried to tell my ex while I was on the outs, and believe me, there's always something to lose. If you care enough about her to want to tell her, then she still has enough of a hold on your heart to hurt you.

As for waiting until she contacts you - I would caution that coming from an ex, this will probably trigger every defense mechanism in her arsenal. You're the wrong person to tell her. "You might want to talk to a therapist about BPD" can sound a whole lot like a vindictive "you're crazy" or "you're unlovable" to them. Even if you've waited until you're in her good graces again, telling her that is going to feel like an attack on her most vulnerable places. I wouldn't be surprised if you're split right then and there.

For therapy to do her any good at all, she has to be personally committed to getting help. That will only happen when SHE comes to the realization that she has a problem and SHE decides it is worth fixing. That just can't be handed to her. It's a process of realization she will come to when she has decided she's had enough of her own $#!%.

[bruised]

If you care enough about her to want to tell her, then she still has enough of a hold on your heart to hurt you.

That's a very good point!

[willbegood]

I told mine she had BPD. It was in one ear out the other and she turned it around and told me I was the crazy one. From  what I've seen, if they sense you care in the slightest bit they will try to hurt you if they feel hurt. Then naturally paint you black.

[Mutt]

Hi AlwaysForgiving! I'm glad to hear you're not reaching out to tell her while you're painted black. I tried to tell my ex while I was on the outs, and believe me, there's always something to lose. If you care enough about her to want to tell her, then she still has enough of a hold on your heart to hurt you.

As for waiting until she contacts you - I would caution that coming from an ex, this will probably trigger every defense mechanism in her arsenal. You're the wrong person to tell her. "You might want to talk to a therapist about BPD" can sound a whole lot like a vindictive "you're crazy" or "you're unlovable" to them. Even if you've waited until you're in her good graces again, telling her that is going to feel like an attack on her most vulnerable places. I wouldn't be surprised if you're split right then and there.

For therapy to do her any good at all, she has to be personally committed to getting help. That will only happen when SHE comes to the realization that she has a problem and SHE decides it is worth fixing. That just can't be handed to her. It's a process of realization she will come to when she has decided she's had enough of her own $#!%.

They have to have the inclination or self awareness that there is something that is off or wrong and want to do this for themselves and commit to it, no one else can do that for them. We need to detach ourselves from the pwBPD and radically accept that this the way that they are. The pain inflicted is not intentional but we are met with a series of defense mechanisms that protects their core abandonment wounds and they are re-living and that core pain in the here and now through their attachment. Our love is not above this disorder and will not cure it or make it go away.

[Lights843]

I too lost my best friend of over 14 years. Like Mutt said, they have the inclination to know something is off. It's going on three years without her in my life and I know she is still damaged but she is only damaged in my mind. Until she admits there is something wrong in her mind, she will continue her path of destruction with lack of accountability. If you reach out to her in any way she will paint you black and thus the reason we are all here. We are making sense of all of this through the experiences of what others on this forum have gone through. There is some wise advice in this thread and it's why I come here - for a reminder of why I need to never reach out and try to help. I'll put my efforts towards a woman that can appreciate me.

[Arminius]

There is some wise advice in this thread and it's why I come here - for a reminder of why I need to never reach out and try to help. I'll put my efforts towards a woman that can appreciate me.

That's what I'm doing. And it feels wonderful. Just beware, as I am, that you don't confuse normal with amazing. Normal seems amazing after these creatures.