How to cope when you're not allowed to have a voice

[Wintersun]

I'm currently feeling very pained by the fact that my uBPD mother denies me the chance to have a voice. She constantly finds fault in my behavior. In her mind, I am always doing something hurtful, selfish, or inconsiderate (mostly to her but also to others - according to her). Being picked apart by her hurts but the denial of my voice is as or more hurtful. Denying my feelings makes me feel more worthless than the actual criticisms.

Any attempt to defend myself is usually met with the accusation that I am "twisting things around", that I'm too sensitive, that I'M the one responsible for any ensuing conflict. Or she will be offended that I am bothered by her behavior. I don't know how to deal with this. How have you dealt with this feeling? Letting her deny me a voice just to keep the peace feels like a sacrifice that a self-respecting person would not make. Then again, what is the point trying to defend yourself to an individual who is INCAPABLE of accepting any interpretation of events that conflicts with their own (which is usually highly irrational and fueled by emotion)? I'd really like to hear how other people cope with the feeling of their voice being squelched.

[WilliamItWasReallyNothing]

Wintersun,

This corresponds very closely to my experience, and I'm sorry to hear that you are going through this.

In the end my approach was to see a therapist, begin to separate from my parents, and eventually take a stand in which I instated a new regimen of much less contact. I had to do that by email in order to be "heard" as doing in person and being heard above the volcano of her anger would have been impossible.

Not seeing uBPDm very often has given me the time and space in which to start to develop a voice of my own with the support of my therapist, my fiancée, her family. It's funny, even a year ago I would never have contemplated talking therapy but it's been profoundly helpful. It's taken me some time to see that it isn't about me, and has never been about me, but simply represents her own odd perspective on life.

The great thing is that you seem really aware of how it's affecting you, and that you're denying your emotions. That in itself is really good. There's your voice! I wasn't able to articulate that awareness, even though I knew something was "wrong".

All the very best to you.

[jmanvo2015]

Hi Wintersun, It says that you're a newbie, so welcome   

I'm a newbie here too pretty much. It's been about two weeks, but I've benefited greatly already from the community.

I can sympathize and empathize so much with what you're saying about your mother denying your voice.     My mother has done the same.  I'm an only child and she's been such a dominant figure in my life that it's been difficult for me to establish fulfilling relationships with others.  I'm just now realizing that her BPD/NPD intended for that to happen.

I am not good at giving advice, but I am good at giving encouragement and support. You're not alone in this struggle with your mother.  She is very much like mine and I understand the pain this causes.

I am back home living with my mother and my stepfather and trying not to see it as the worst thing ever, but rather as an opportunity to be an objective observer of the abuse and behavior patterns and to learn healthy ways of coping.

I posted a few days ago about how my mother "baits" me into arguing with her and that prompted responses that helped me learn about High Conflict People and how they bait people into circular arguments that nobody can win.  Some people on the board gave me some really good suggestions. 

You might look up the following topics here in the search bar.

JADE ( don't Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain)

SET ( Support, Empathy, Truth)

Validating

These techniques have been helping me when my mom pulls me into an argument to criticize and belittle me and to rob me of my voice. Maybe they can help you too.

[Daliah]

I'm sorry you're going through this, Wintersun. (Beautiful username, by the way. )

I'm afraid this is a bit rambly and interprets 'you voice' a bit broadly, but for what it's worth:

What you're describing sounds awfully similar to what I went through with my uBPD/NPD mother. At best, what I said or did was wrong and needed to be corrected; at worst, it was seen as deliberately hurtful. Even things that a mentally healthy person would have seen as the favours they were ended up being interpreted as attempts to guilt trip or show her up.

Typical no-win situations: You did the job properly? She was sure you now expected praise for something the rest of the world does all the time. You made a tiny mistake? You're obviously dumb and can't be trusted and, anyway, you're just out to hurt and harm her, aren't you? You did the job exceptionally well? You're trying to guilt trip her, get special treatment and want to be told how smart/hard-working you are and have your ego stroked, don't you?

It was quite breathtaking what she could find fault with, which was basically anything. When something like that is what you've grown up on (along with assorted other tactics, in many cases), it's a small wonder that you can come out the other end and still have a vague sense of which way is up. Posting here is already a small success on the way to finding and asserting your own voice!

For me, it's an ongoing process. Sometimes I read posts from people (this refers to various fora, though) who find out something is/was wrong, hear for the first time in their lives that it has a name and then go on to post about getting their lives back to normal within weeks... .it can feel discouraging because I've been at this for a decade and I'm still haven't reached my 'normal' as in, where I sense I could be without past abuse. I'm fairly certain I still lag far behind my potential.

It can feel worse because, outside of certain places like this one, dealing with the long-term effects of past parental abuse is often seen as having an expiration date, which is usually somewhere around the time you turn 30, at the latest, and sometimes as early as 18. So, even when I'm dealing with it by acknowledging its effects to myself and trying to counter them, I have to fight new negativity now because, at 35, I know I can't tell otherwise trustworthy people, even under the right circumstances, even if I'm close to them (with the exception of my SO). So by having to keep quiet about something that most definitely has long-lasting consequences, I sometimes feel my voice is squelched yet again.  I don't even want to think about where I would be without the internet, where places like this one exist.

Despite the long time I've now been NC with my parents, it is only recently that I have managed to become more assertive about whom and what I will and won't deal with and about being more true to myself, provided I have a choice (work, where toxic people can unfortunately abound, doesn't allow for that choice at times). The views that my mother had projected onto me had become that internalised - and I'm not even weak-willed!

For me, finding my own voice, or the courage to use it, is closely tied to following my own inclinations more with regard to work and interests - my mother rolled my thoughts/opinions, actions and aspirations/interests into a package deal to hate the hell out of and try to destroy, so it makes sense that they are connected, for me. Depending on your own situation, you may find a similar dynamic.

I can't really tell you how I managed to change things, other than perhaps that I hit rock-bottom. I only know that at one point (long post-NC!), I felt like I was disappearing, like I didn't exist as a person anymore, just as something that existed to fulfil various expectations and to function. I also developed autoimmune diseases that started acting up and, a little later, a variety of other conditions (often skin issues, such as very bad rashes) for which even a battery of medical tests couldn't find a root cause.

I felt justified in assuming a connection between my mental health and my physical condition, and since I would have been increasingly miserable in both ways if I had continued down that path, I only had the option to trust and externalise my own inner voice more if I wanted a life that was more than a miserable existence that was based on someone else's idea of what mattered.

Since I've started coming out of what I call survival mode about two years ago, I haven't had any more inexplicable physical conditions, so far.

It's certainly no fast process for me, and very much 'two steps forward, one step back', but the progress is there.

So, the only direct advice I feel qualified to give is: A) don't give up, no matter how slowly you're progressing. A babystep forward is still a step forward and: B) try to put distance between yourself and your mother in any way that you can - physically, mentally - anything is a good start. If you live with your mother, find things you enjoy that will take you out of the house and away from her when you would normally be there. If you don't live with her, be less available to talk and as aware as possible of her usual tactics when you do talk to her.

If you're financially dependent on her, she may leverage this dependency to maintain the status quo, unfortunately, so steadily working towards financial independence, as intimidating as this can be for someone with our background, is also usually a good idea.

[Wintersun]

Hi WilliamItWasReallyNothing,

Thanks very much for your reply. Your whole post was brought me comfort. I was especially struck by your words "It's taken me some time to see that it isn't about me, and has never been about me, but simply represents her own odd perspective on life." As I mentioned, my mom frequently denigrates me and completely shuts down any attempts to defend myself. On top of that, my mom is a dominant force in my extended family. As you can imagine, I am characterized very negatively when my mother recounts my behavior to other people. This means that her words and opinions often feel like they are morphing into the negative opinions of all those other family members (aunts, uncles, cousins, etc.). It is incredibly painful. Definitely feels like a battle I can't hope to win. I will remember your words though - it's not about me and never has been. Thank you for that.

Daliah and jmanvo2015 -- thank you both so much for your replies. I'll respond to you both separately soon.

[Wintersun]

Hi jmanvo2015. Thank you for your kind words and support. It really helps.  love It is a very hard, painful thing we're going through but we're not alone. I'm glad to meet you, jmanvo2015.  Empathy

[Wintersun]

Hi Daliah. Thanks for your reply! Boy, do I ever feel you when you say "At best, what I said or did was wrong and needed to be corrected; at worst, it was seen as deliberately hurtful. Even things that a mentally healthy person would have seen as the favours they were ended up being interpreted as attempts to guilt trip or show her up." The constant accusations of being deliberately hurtful are so hard to take and are especially painful. Once I scrimped for weeks to take my mother on a beautiful cruise (she was going through a rough time and I thought she could use the vacation). She interpreted the gesture as implying she was weak and in need of coddling. It was tough.

I'm very glad to hear that you've found a greater equilibrium in your life. It does encourage me to keep at it and not give up. Thank you, Daliah.

[trees]

It can feel worse because, outside of certain places like this one, dealing with the long-term effects of past parental abuse is often seen as having an expiration date, which is usually somewhere around the time you turn 30, at the latest, and sometimes as early as 18. So, even when I'm dealing with it by acknowledging its effects to myself and trying to counter them, I have to fight new negativity now because, at 35, I know I can't tell otherwise trustworthy people, even under the right circumstances, even if I'm close to them (with the exception of my SO). So by having to keep quiet about something that most definitely has long-lasting consequences, I sometimes feel my voice is squelched yet again.  I don't even want to think about where I would be without the internet, where places like this one exist.

I had NO idea that occurred.

Why on earth would people think that? People come to grips with what happened in their past at different points in their life; I can't imagine why someone would fault someone for seeking out healing at any time for any reason. My mind is just boggled at that kind of thinking. I'm really sorry that you faced that invalidation again.

[Daliah]

Thanks for your reply, Wintersun. That must have been a terrible experience - scrimping for weeks when you're struggling yourself, only to be attacked for doing her a favour of such dimensions!

About keeping at it, it has really helped me to realise that, in my case at least, the journey is the destination.

I wish you the best in becoming financially independent again. I often find that work is a minefield, too, and a sizeable minority of co-workers and bosses also aren't operating on the basis of good mental health, which can sometimes feel like I'm reliving an updated version of past events. But, as unpleasant as it is, it is easier for me to deal with it coming from work than from my parents. The impact is less severe. It's bad enough that it happens at all, but if I have to choose between the two, I'll take it from work, go home and get at least some time to recover than none at all.

But even finding a job you can live on is tough enough at the moment, I know that. I'm more than ready to leave my current job and place of work myself, but I can't find anything better that pays at least the same (which isn't much to start with). I wish you the best of luck in becoming financially self-sufficient again.

Thank you for your kind words, trees. I'm surprised you're surprised, but at least that means that invalidation isn't univeral. I hear boatloads of 'Your parents were only responsible for what happened to you until you turned 18, anything after that is on you!'. It's not necessarily in direct response to me, because I have learned to keep quiet when I'm not up to taking it (which is most of the time). I think many people who have either lived more charmed lives or are in denial can't quite imagine/grasp the effects that childhood abuse has and don't differentiate between 'my parent made me do something / did something to me' and 'the cumulative effect of two decades of abuse led me to think/act a certain way [that doesn't harm others], and I'm finding it hard to change my reality', and they don't recognise that recovery is a process and not a one-time thing of discarding dysfunctional patterns and replacing them with better ones, like a mental spring cleaning that you do and are then done with.

Although abuse isn't hard to find if you look for it, it seems most people still grew up fairly healthily. Which is great, of course! But it does often seem to lead to a certain inability to even imagine abuse as something more than exaggerated, wimpy whining because your parents were a bit strict from time to time, and they don't grasp the extent of the consequences. In the early days after going NC, I made a few attempts to find a therapist. One of the three therapists I had first sessions with even told me straight-up that he doesn't engage in the practice of blaming parents and said we had to focus on me. Well, yes, focus on me - I'm the one seeking help! But don't act like my problems arose in a vacuum! These days I would report him to his professional association, but back then it was just the final straw, and I stopped looking because it did more harm than good. The first two therapists I tried were one person I just felt uncomfortable with, but nothing was really wrong, and another one who didn't quite spell it out that parents were off-limits, but I got that feeling there, too. And I didn't exactly go in saying 'poor me, my parents did this and that to me and now I'm forever broken', but tried to explain how I thought and felt and what I thought the reasons were and that I wanted to change. In between some sobbing, I'm afraid. But I can't quite believe that the sobbing made them think it was an act. Don't they see that every day? Because they certainly seemed to stock plenty of paper tissues in their offices! Or perhaps it is a fad of looking at each problem in isolation, as if it had nothing to do with anything. I've noticed that with medical issues sometimes, so perhaps it happens in psychology/the mental health field as well.

But anyway, yes, any grace period you may get for dealing with childhood abuse, if you get it, decidedly ends at age 30, in my experience.  But I'm very glad to hear this view isn't the only one out there.

[Harri]

Hi Wintersun, it is good to see you here! 

I remember you said it is only the last several years that your mother started acting out towards you and I imagine that must make this even more difficult and painful.  For me there was a certain type of stability in my mothers lifelong instability.  This is all new to you.   

How are you with imagery?  I wonder if using some imagery when you are with your mother will help you to shield yourself from her venom and remind you that she is projecting her own pain, fears and hurts and as such, she is not actually seeing you when she is so vile and harsh.  We can talk about different strategies if you want to try it.

As for not having a voice, I think you have heard me spout off about that before and how important it is to see and hear ourselves standing up for us.  It is not about getting your mom to hear you, she can't.  It is about you speaking up for you and saying No.  Obviously, you need to pick your battles and all that, but I think it is far more important for you to see and hear yourself standing up for you.  You are enough Wintersun.  You are amazing, and talented and wise and smart and loving and you are capable.  You are worth speaking up for you Wintersun.  Please stop giving your mother the value of your voice... .she is not worth it and she does not deserve it.  but you do.  The point, the value of speaking up and defending you is You.  Stop denying yourself the right to have a voice and stop looking to your mother for understanding and validation.  She is incapable of giving you that. 

I am characterized very negatively when my mother recounts my behavior to other people. This means that her words and opinions often feel like they are morphing into the negative opinions of all those other family members (aunts, uncles, cousins, etc.). It is incredibly painful. Definitely feels like a battle I can't hope to win.

Have you ever said anything to your mother about her talking trash about you to your extended family?  Who is telling you about this or is she saying bad things in front of you?  Wintersun, if you define winning as getting her to hear you, allowing you to speak, and her to stop being a malicious gossip, then you are right, this is a battle you can not win.  But (!) this is only a no win situation because you are basing the win on her.  Her reactions.  Her actions.  Her words.  Put the focus on you.  Place the importance on you.  Put the focus of what is of value on you.  Give yourself permission to go bat ___ crazy on her or to just shake your head gently, say no and walk away.  Do whatever works, but you need to redefine what winning looks like.  She is ill and winning can not be defined the same way as it would be if she were not ill.

Put yourself first.  It will feel strange and uncomfortable and it is going to feel like the wrong choice.  Do it anyway.  On your terms.   

[lucyhoneychurch]

   Wintersun   

The maelstrom of pain that inundates our hearts when we have lived all of our lives with this upheaval and abuse can seem insurmountable.  If you have breath in your body, you have hope. You can find and create change. One of the most breakthrough moments I had many years ago was somehow grasping that just because my mother said it, didn't make it so. Whatever angle she was taking suddenly, whether I was being ungrateful or too sensitive or full of myself (all the things you might correct a small child about, not your grown daughter mother of three), I could never keep up the whiplash pace of what I'd done wrong NOW... .

And then either someone said it or logic just kicked in - simply because the thought ugly as it was crossed her brain and came out of her mouth did not make it true.

Logic told me I had many friends who enjoyed my company, my help when they were facing tough times, they were there for me when I had my own issues and gave my love and compassion. I was not this impossible awful odd problematic person. My children were reflecting lives where they were encouraged, held responsible but age appropriately, allowed to laugh, make mistakes, etc.

Logic played a huge part in - would I take this kind of attitude or ugliness off of any other human being at this stage of my life? No, heck no.

What you wrote or someone else wrote in responses above totally touched a nerve with me - the shelf life, the expiration date, of when you think out loud about your upbringing and someone basically says, "What that's still a problem for you?" well, yes... .it's like we were dipped in permanent ink and it stained our thoughts and possibilities and potential. The beauty of that analogy is that the TRUTH is like an annihilating current of lightning or bleach or ultraviolet that totally and completely can cast out the stains. But it takes time.

Just this very week, 18 months after my mother's passing, and in light of all these stories in the States about football players abusing at home, etc, a friend posted one of those memes on FB about domestic abuse etc, a friend I know and love deeply... .and my comment under it was, "Women and mothers can be abusers too." My friend commented underneath, something she has been doing pretty much nonstop since uBPD'd mother died, "Yes well ding dong the witch is dead remember?"

So I can't comment that if there is to be honest discussion about domestic violence, keep in mind women can do it too? That the cost can sometimes be lifelong scars, suicide of children or mates, etc?

I love this friend. But I have gotten very bold with saying, ":)on't correct me, don't placate me anymore with that 'witch is dead' stuff, I'm only too aware of that." She has a mother that we all would give our eye teeth to know and love as our own. She is on the outside looking in. She will never understand the depth of this misery that we CAN override and survive but is there nonetheless.

You have a voice. I'm hearing it even as you ask how do you have a voice - because you are on this board, learning what the rest of us have tried or done or what's worked - because you are learning it's really what's inside of you that is going to make the difference, not what comes out of her.

May I also comment on the idea that opinions or feelings other than her own are squelched - oh yes indeed. If you go to a pastor or you go to a doctor or you go to a teacher, and you say certain things, based on their expertise or professional capacity, they are going to really only say certain things back to you. Your mother's absolute and total inability to see outside herself, to see you as a separate soul and person and not an extension of herself - she is programmed by her disordered thinking to say these broken cruel things. Put yourself in her shoes (this helps you, if you will be patient with me for a sec), and see how with her world view that everyone is out to get her, that no one understands, that she cannot trust people, no one cares, etc - the things she says are the logical outcome of a paranoid mentality. It's not that she won't say anything kinder or gentler, it's that she CANNOT.

Repeat - not that she won't, but that she can't. Think of a paraplegic - you'd never expect someone to get up and walk who's suffered spinal injury. They can't. Not that they won't.

This is logic. This was maybe some of the most pertinent, profound stuff that I finally grasped inside of me. I had to face it with my children's father as well, dx'd antisocial personality disordered... .not that he won't (I spent years trying to explain and beg and demand help, understanding etc), he CANNOT.

If you grasp this inside of you like a delicate little tether to your life outside of this sorrow, it will keep pulling you through to light and calm. I promise.

See how this dovetails in with everyone else's thoughts about "it's not you, it's her and her stuff?"

We are stamped with our mother's issues, who wouldn't be? But if we can tear away the veil and see how much they are layers of pain projecting onto us because we were simply so available, for so long - we can move away, we can "get it" and try to detach and think in the moment and radically accept we didn't break 'em we can't fix 'em. I wish you strength and courage and the ability to see yourself as a beautiful soul worthy of good things.