It's a downward spiral

[Sheed]

Hi,

I believe i have a SO with BPD traits. I feel like the relationship is spiraling downwards. We are at a point where we are hurting each other both physical and emotional. I want it to stop. I feel like I am developing BPD as well being in this relationship. I am so lost and confused. She has threatened to leave our apartment but every time we end up back on the same spot. She claims that she has nowhere to go so she must leave her stuff at the apartment. She also proposed that she live with me for 3 months and after that she will get out for real. I am quite depressed and and just don't know what to do.

Best,

Sheed

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Rapt Reader]

Hello, Sheed & 

I'm really sorry for the troubles that have brought you here, but very happy you have found us 

There are so many members of this Board who have suffered the way you are suffering now (and have been), and who understand exactly what you have been dealing with. I'm a bit troubled about the physical and emotional hurting that is happening in your relationship... .Are you Okay? Are you safe? There are many links to the right-hand side of this page, and you will find them to be invaluable for you to read... .You can get a good handle on understanding your partner's behaviors, and learning the communication tools and techniques that can help you to stop making things worse, and even start to make them better. I'd recommend checking out every single one of those links, and especially this one: Safety First if the hurting doesn't stop... .

Can you tell us a bit more of your story? How long have you 2 been together? Are you married? Live together? Have any children? I'm so sorry for the push and pull, up and down features of your relationship, but you really will learn why your partner has those behaviors, and how to deal with them if you read what you can on this site, and let us know more about your situation... .We really want to help, Sheed 

[waverider]

First off you are not developing BPD, that is a life long disorder, but it is possible to to develop Post Traumatic Stress issues. More likely though you are just questioning your sense of self and your frustration levels are affecting your own ability to properly regulate your own emotions and are running on reactions

[Sheed]

Thank you all for your replies. It really is nice to know that i can talk to a group of people about our situation. We have been together for about 1yr and 3mos now and we are living together. The last violent episode was about 3 weeks ago where i was left with a bruise on my left eye... So far we have not been violent to each other but the verbal abuse is constant. I made a huge mistake of fighting fire with fire so this is why i think it got to a point of being physical to each other. This happens usually when she doesn't allow me to step outside the house and take a walk to take my self out of the escalating argument. She tells me that I always walk away from my problems and that i am a coward for stepping out and taking a walk. There was a time when i had to jump out of the window to get away, but now she uses this "jumping out of the window" thing as a tool to further attack my core. She would say something like, "you hate being with me so much that you jumped out of the window just to get away from me." You see, it is something like this that i do not know how to tackle or answer. She also constantly accuses me of cheating on her especially if i missed a call or forgot to text her or even if i get home from work 10 minutes late from my usual arrival.

When we are watching a movie, she constantly asks me if i am attracted to the girls in the movie, or if i find them attractive. And then goes on to ask something like, "So you think they're ugly?" and furthermore ":)o you swear that on your family?" If she asks me these questions once or twice, i can understand, but everyday? how do you answer those questions and make sure that you don't get frustrated from answering the same thing over and over again? I just resort to saying "NO" all the time because i don't want her to lash out on me... .I have tried saying "YES" once and she lashed out on me like there's no tomorrow.

There has been so many things going on so if you have any further questions, please just let me know and i will try my best to answer them.

Thanks!

[waverider]

There is a lot going on here. You are not going to deal with this head on or have a pat answer to stop this.

Once someone is in this level of aggression it is too late to do much. What you will learn here are several things.

First and foremost are boundaries to stop your exposure to extreme behavior. What is happening here with you having to climb out of the window is that you are leaving it too late to depart the scene. It is desperate reaction to get out of the firing line rather than proactive. Think of it as getting out of the car after it gone over the cliff rather than when its heading for it.

When it comes to leaving you need to think this out prior, work out now what you can do next time, where you can go. Somewhere useful and somewhere you can stay as long as possible. Just walking around the park muttering in frustration to yourself then coming back well before time and have the whole thing blow up again is not the best way of doing it. Be prepared.

Secondly you are getting sucked into JADE (justify, defend,argue,explain). This were you are trying to explain yourself when you shouldn't have too. you probably find the subject shifts until your excuses get weaker and a loophole is exposed or you get so frustrated you loose it and the finger can be pointed at you for loosing it.

She knows this, it is not about the subject is about provoking you, so that you engage her, helping her vent and pass her dramas onto you. It is her coping method. Remember the problem is not the issue. The current issue is just a vehicle to transfer inner turmoil which may have no easy to identify source, give it a face and vent it out. The problem is poor emotional control. It is the process not the words or facts in front of you. By addressing the issue you fuel the process and miss the whole point.

There are a lot of tools in the form of validation and SET (support, empathy, truth) than can be used to oil the works and reduce your part in unnecessarily triggering her. Click on the Lessons to the right>>and read through them carefully. You will learn a lot about not making it worse than need be and also when to pull out of the firing line.

With the example of being grilled over the movie, the issue is you are feeling compelled to answer. You are answering in frustration. Neither answer is going to satisfy, and neither are you being honest or exerting yourself. The truth is you don't want to have to keep answering this question. Say the truth " I am attracted to you and that is all that matters to me, I can see that concerns you,  I am not going to keep answering that question so please stop asking it". If it continues, then stop watching the movie, either turn it off or leave. This is your truth and your boundary, you have also used SET.

Do this consistently dont keep trying different approaches, nothing works better than consistency even if it creates a backlash to start off with.

[Sheed]

thank you waverider. I have a very important question though and i hope you or the members can shed some light on this. The only family member that i have met from her, is her brother. I wanna reach out to him but i don't know if that is a good way to go.

Thanks!

[waverider]

thank you waverider. I have a very important question though and i hope you or the members can shed some light on this. The only family member that i have met from her, is her brother. I wanna reach out to him but i don't know if that is a good way to go.

Thanks!

Generally it does no good. If they could do anything they would have by now. Odds are they either don't believe it to be so, or that she's just a looser who needs to get her act together, or they are open to the reality but there is nothing they can do and they are glad its your problem not yours.

Generally though iit can lead you into endless wasted effort and frustration trying to "get help from someone who should also understand'.

It can also take you into unhealthy triangulation issues and your partner  (rightly) accusing you of bad mouthing/going behind her back/trouble making.

Keep in mind BPD is often a product of genetics and/or inappropriate upbringing. Hence family of origins do not readily accept it, as it can be seen as a direct criticism, whether it is true or not.

If you want support find it from a source that does not have an invested interest to deny it.

This is probably your primary source of support, with no chance of your confidence being betrayed.

[Sheed]

OK... .Got it. So, if i decide to break it off, i'd like some guidance. See we live together at our apartment. She feels wronged by me so if i tell her to pack her things up and leave, she really doesn't. She gives off this sense of entitlement that i can't make her leave. instead she will use delaying tactics so i can be lured back in. Her name is not on the lease nor is she paying for rent. Should i just pack up her things and put it outside, change the locks and all that? I do not have the option to move out of the apartment right now as my finances are tied up to something else. All the resources that i have read so far is that I should leave.

[waverider]

OK... .Got it. So, if i decide to break it off, i'd like some guidance. See we live together at our apartment. She feels wronged by me so if i tell her to pack her things up and leave, she really doesn't. She gives off this sense of entitlement that i can't make her leave. instead she will use delaying tactics so i can be lured back in. Her name is not on the lease nor is she paying for rent. Should i just pack up her things and put it outside, change the locks and all that? I do not have the option to move out of the apartment right now as my finances are tied up to something else. All the resources that i have read so far is that I should leave.

If comes to it does she have family to go to, and there are always storage facilities if she has much stuff.

I would try to get out of this one foot in, one foot out, status you seem to be in. Either try hard to make it work or split ASAP. Trying to get it to wok wont get anywhere unless you have some sort of commitment.

If you want more practical advise on the techniques of exiting a BPD relationship, then have a look at the Leaving Board where others will have been through this.

[Sheed]

Hello All!

My pwBPD had a disagreement a few days back. I cooked dinner and i served it up to her and she refused to eat because she said that i avoided the "discussion" that we had about an ex-coworker. I told her "i understand that you dont want to eat but you need to eat, so here is the food." She went on saying that i keep on lying to her especially about girls and continued on to swat away the food i had made and it splattered all over the floor. I told her "I am not cleaning that. I am going to take a break and i hope the floor is clean when i get back. If not i will be sleeping outside."

It is day 3 now and she still hasn't cleaned the mess she made. instead she continues to say that it is my fault so i should clean it up. Yesterday, i went to my aunt's house to see some relatives. She constantly called and text me that she believes that i am not where i say i am. She continued on to text me this... "You really expect me to believe that you are going to see you relatives at 8pm dressed like that? Wow my intuition was right and you have hurt me beyond return. You're finally going to get what you want and I will move as soon as i can. Until then, there is no reason why i can't get a little revenge starting tonight at our apartment. I think i've let you get away with way too much and never did anything to defend myself except forgive you! ALWAYS! Buy now it's my turn to let you feel the hurt you've been making me feel. PS dont worry about the apartment, Im cleaning it as we speak. Just not for you.   So I hope whatever you're really doing tonight you make it worth it." I responded "OK"

Today, I come home for lunch and to drive her to work as she is supposed to but she was dressed up for a different reason. She looked spiffy. I asked her one time where she is off to but i got no response. I proceeded to exit the scene and go back to work.

So this is how it has been so far since her recent episode. I don't know where this will take me yet but i am doing this journey one day at a time.

-Sheed

[Sheed]

I am an emotional wreck right now. She came home drunk today and had another episode. She started attacking me but I didn't engage. She then proceeded to call someone to pick her up and someone did. I am so devestated right now. As I saw her get in the car I was engulfed with so much emotion that I shut down. Now I just feel numb. I need some help managing how I feel right now.

[Sheed]

Hi all!

It's been a while. I have just been dealing with a lot of added stress lately. I am about to get evicted from my place. My SO offered to help only to take it back. Now I am in a position where i wont have anywhere to live and faced with an eviction record.

She would seem cold and then later on loving, praise me and then devalue me. she says that i have done this to her and that she has never been like this before we met. Basically what i am saying is i don't know what to do right now. I am broke with no one to turn to because i have been isolated from my friends.

The thing that i am concerned about is that i am the one physically hurting myself. I don't know why i am doing this. I feel now that i am the one with the BPD and not her. I just need to know because if it is me, i want to get help.

Sheed

[formflier]

The thing that i am concerned about is that i am the one physically hurting myself. I don't know why i am doing this. I feel now that i am the one with the BPD and not her. I just need to know because if it is me, i want to get help.

Sheed

Sheed,

I think we should all stay away from labels... .you have clearly identified that you want to get help... .don't say for what... .go get help

I'll also let you know... that before we can really help you sort our your relationship... .or help your SO... .we need to help you.  You need to help you.  You need to let the system help you.

Being in a r/s with pwBPD traits is very confusing... .you can get ptsd like symptoms.  You can get many other symptoms.

I'm really glad you say you want to get help... .please do this.  Don't expect to tell your story once and got.  You need to build a support system.  bpdfamily can be part of that... .but you need an "in person" support system as well.

Where do you think you can go to get help? 

[EaglesJuju]

Hi Sheed,

I am sorry that you are going through such a tough time.     I understand how it feels when you are coping with many stressful things at once.  The best way to get through a pile of stress, is to handle one thing at a time.

As Formflier suggested, helping yourself should be the first and most important step.  Posting on here really helps. BPD family is a great support system.  We are here for you. 

Have you tried talking to your landlord about the eviction? 

[Sheed]

Hello All! Thank you for your posts. at the moment I have to wait until i get enough to enroll myself into therapy. I will try to talk to my landlord and see what my options are. Thanks for all your help and support.

[waverider]

Currently you have too much chaos going on in your head at once. This leaves you unable to focus on one thing at a time. This is probably were self harming comes into place. It kind of gives you something immediate and tangable to feel and focus on.

Self harming is not unique to BPD. many teenagers often go through it when the world seems against them and they dont have the life experience to organize their issues in order to work though them in a healthier way.

In order to tackle your issues, you first have to identify them. Prioritize them and allocate a cause and effect to them. Work out which are immediate and which can be put on teh back burner until you can better apply yourself.

It is normal to get stress/drama overload which can cause almost a mental paralysis. Accept this and dont panic. Work out the issue of keeping a roof over your head to start with and let all else slide. In particular RS issues are rarely as immediate as they seem. Especially when BPD is involved as this brings on a tendency to catastrophize eveything

[formflier]

Hello All! Thank you for your posts. at the moment I have to wait until i get enough to enroll myself into therapy. I will try to talk to my landlord and see what my options are. Thanks for all your help and support.

Sheed... .I'm not a fan of waiting to get help.  I would suggest that instead of looking for a "final solution"... .(long term therapy) that you look at what you can do as a "first step" to get yourself some needed help.

Maybe that is a call to a local crisis line... .or a call to 211... .or 411... .basically a non-emergency information line where you can learn about and understand your options to get some immediate help.

What do you think you can do in your local community to "take that first step... "

[maxen]

hi Sheed. i'm really really sorry you're facing this situation. the behaviors you describe are characteristic of BPD and there were two things you said in particular which i also experienced in spades:

she doesn't allow me to step outside the house and take a walk to take my self out of the escalating argument.

... .

It is day 3 now and she still hasn't cleaned the mess she made.

so it may help you, that we know exactly what you're experiencing.

you're in a relentlessly abusive situation and i'd second what formflier said - take the first step. the mere act of doing something in your own interests is therapeutic, whatever it is. please keep us updated!

[Sheed]

Hello All!

I am putting all my efforts in keeping a roof over my head. It's gonna be difficult but I will find a way. I already have part of the money so i just need to buy more time from the landlord. As for my SO, she is acting like everything is fine and dandy as i try to find a way to get things together. She had also admitted to hanging out with someone that likes her and that something is going on between them. I am really trying to keep my cool though. After what i did, "self harming" the other night i realized that i cannot do anything to improve myself if i do this kind of stuff. Once i fix myself i can then deal with the SO situation.

Thanks to all of your support and help.

P.S. i did call the hotlines but they offered little to no help. They were just telling me stuff that i already know. This board though is helping me a lot.

Cheers!

Sheed

[EaglesJuju]

Hi Sheed,

I am glad you are taking each problem one step at a time. 

Once i fix myself i can then deal with the SO situation.

  This is a wonderful start for you.  Focusing on yourself first is very important. Sometimes you can get so wrapped up in the relationship of your pwBPD, you tend to forget about yourself.  You are important too!

I think it is great that you are ignoring the behaviors of your SO. If it gets too much for you to keep your cool, leave the house for a bit. Temporarily removing yourself from a situation is really helpful.

I am glad this board is helping. Keep posting.  We are here for you.   

 

[formflier]

 

 

I'll join Eagles in giving you a thumbs up.

Sorry the help lines weren't that much help.  Might be worth another try or two... .be persistent.  Remind them of what you know... and let them know you still need help.

Did you ask about free counseling services?  Did you inform them about your self harm?

Tasker 2:  Start describing your support system.  Hint... we are going to push you to build one.

BPD family is a good part of that... .but it is not meant to be THE support system.  Just part of a bigger picture.

Do you have a family doctor... .or some kind of GP that you can go to?  A pastor or any kind of religious affiliation? 

[Sheed]

Hello People!

OK. So my SO can somehow manage to shift all the blame on me. It is infuriating. How do you handle it when they start

to shift the blame on you when clearly they are at fault? I know why they don't want to be wrong because to them they

feel that they are a bad person and that because they did something bad they might be cast as undesirable by the people

that love or care for them the most. It really is like dealing with an adolecent. It is very frustrating.

Sheed!

P.S. I am double spacing to make it a bit easier on the eyes.  

[Sheed]

 

I'll join Eagles in giving you a thumbs up.

Sorry the help lines weren't that much help.  Might be worth another try or two... .be persistent.  Remind them of what you know... and let them know you still need help.

Did you ask about free counseling services?  Did you inform them about your self harm?

Tasker 2:  Start describing your support system.  Hint... we are going to push you to build one.

BPD family is a good part of that... .but it is not meant to be THE support system.  Just part of a bigger picture.

Do you have a family doctor... .or some kind of GP that you can go to?  A pastor or any kind of religious affiliation? 

Hi FormFlier!

Thanks for the reply. It is a bit difficult since my direct family is in my homeland and they are not always in reach.

Same thing with my long time friends. That is why getting a T would be great for me so i have someone i can talk to.

and i know that the T will understand. I call my family every now and then though. I miss them greatly.

-Sheed

[formflier]

Goal is to not shift it directly back to them... .

You want to "deflect" the shift... and use as little energy as possible to do it. 

DO NOT "react"... .be curious... .be inquisitive... .be careful to not sound "smart ass"

Possible words...

"I'm sorry you feel that way... ."  Listen for emotions to validate. 

"Can you help me understand... I'm a bit unclear on what has happened here... ."  Keep listening... .keep validating the emotions... .don't agree or disagree. 

Most likely their goal is not agreement or disagreement... .there is "emotional upset" inside... .they are dysfunctionally dealing with that... .trying to stick you with it.

When they say you "made" them do xyz... ."help me understand your choices in this situation... ."  They are fans of "this is the "only" thing that would work... .

As long as talk isn't abusive... .or "too abusive"... .keep looking and listening for emotions to validate... .and information you can think through.  Your goal is not to "fix"... .its to gather information about their thought processes and emotions.

If it get's abusive ... "I'll be back in 10 minutes... .hopefully we can talk properly about this then... "  Don't accuse them of abuse... .don't debate it... .just leave.  Whatever timeframe you say... .make sure you meet it... and come back.

[maxen]

How do you handle it when they start to shift the blame on you when clearly they are at fault?

the first thing you do, is you know without doubt within yourself that you're not at fault. the tendency to JADE* arises because a little demon inside gets into your mind and tells you that she might, even in some small degree, be right. so hold always in your mind that you are not to blame, that she isn't right, and she won't be right, no matter how many people she tells.

*JADE is an acronym for Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain. do not do any of these things in response to her accusations. we have a resource on this: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=205038.0.

When faced with untrue accusations it feels natural to want to defend yourself. To explain yourself. After all, no one wants to hear lies and distortions of the truth.

The problem is that JADE rarely works. It often makes things worse. She won't believe you because as soon as you start justify/attacking/defending/explaining yourself her own defense mechanisms kick in and she can't process what you say. You see, she can't accept being wrong. Her version of what happened is her truth. Her feelings are her facts. She hears your JADE as blame and criticism, and to her blame and criticism feels unbearably painful. She blocks out painful information by attacking and shifting the blame onto you instead.

this is very good advice, but the key is knowing within yourself where you stand.

(cross-posted with formflier)

[formflier]

 

Reading maxen's post reminds me of another point.

Once you know within yourself that it isn't your fault... .and you really know.  Then you know it isn't really about you... .so DON'T TAKE IT PERSONALLY.

This was earth-shattering for me to learn and implement.  If it isn't about you... .then there is less tendency to want to JADE... and you are more sincere when you say... ."i'm sorry you feel that way... "

[waverider]

Dont get sucked into trying to bounce blame back either. As long as you know you are not to blame, that is enough. Dont waste your effort trying to convince them they.

Know your own reality, don't then try to sell it.

[Sheed]

Hello People!

I am glad to post that I was able to take care of the living situation. Thanks for all your support and advise. Soo much help. I will keep you posted on the SO situation.

Best,

sheed

[formflier]

 

Can you let us in on the solution to your living situation.

Remember... .it's not just for us... .it's for everyone else that reads.

Good to see details of how things got solved.

What do you think next step is for SO situation?

How are you doing reading the lessons?

[Sheed]

Can you let us in on the solution to your living situation.

Remember... .it's not just for us... .it's for everyone else that reads.

Good to see details of how things got solved.

What do you think next step is for SO situation?

How are you doing reading the lessons?

OK... For the living situation, I stopped relying on my SO's word. I focused on myself and what i need to do

to keep the apartment. I looked at myself and realized that I made it this far by myself so there is no reason for me

to give up and that I can do this. I talked to my landlord about how much money i have that night and that i will give

them all of it, although it wont cover everything and work on a payment plan for the rest of the outstanding balance

while continuing to stay in the premises. I was so happy that they agreed and that they understand that i might be in

some difficult times right now. I have always been a good tenant until recently so they are giving me the benefit of

the doubt.

As far as the SO is concerned, I haven't really done anything just yet. I am taking a break and enjoying my

accomplishment thus far. I will post updates about the r/s.

I have been reading up on the lessons a lot. learning how and when to engage and disengage. I know this has been

said so many times but learning how to validate is very essential in dealing with the hyper emotional being. Everyone,

I can't stress this out more, validate, validate, validate and when it seems that your hitting a dead end, disengage.

When i disengage, i tell her that i will take a walk for (enter number of minutes) and then i come back. When i am

back if she is acting better i do not bring anything up. I wait for her to say something because truth is my SO has

always something to say but i try not to get caught up and J.A.D.E.