well, this is new

[Depression = 72% of members]

She wanted him to prove himself to her, turning things into a test like pwBPD often do, and he wanted to prove himself. She brought up such an important, life-changing, relationship-cementing issue, pointed at the calendar with a "This could happen next week, are you in?", and then went on a two week trip instead. Putting the weight of committed intimacy on him while she runs from it. Leaving Max feeling, and dealing with... .What? How are you doing, Max? How's the "peace and quiet"? It's probably a relief in many ways. Hopefully you're using it as a time to relax, recharge, and regroup yourself for what's next.  Because another question is: Where is this going to go when she returns? From what you've described, it doesn't sound like the best situation to bring a kid into. She may not even really want one, just another time of muddying up the waters/acting out. She may also be feeling, "I want to be the baby. I'm the baby here."

[myself]

She wanted him to prove himself to her, turning things into a test like pwBPD often do, and he wanted to prove himself. She brought up such an important, life-changing, relationship-cementing issue, pointed at the calendar with a "This could happen next week, are you in?", and then went on a two week trip instead. Putting the weight of committed intimacy on him while she runs from it. Leaving Max feeling, and dealing with... .What? How are you doing, Max? How's the "peace and quiet"? It's probably a relief in many ways. Hopefully you're using it as a time to relax, recharge, and regroup yourself for what's next.  Because another question is: Where is this going to go when she returns? From what you've described, it doesn't sound like the best situation to bring a kid into. She may not even really want one, just another time of muddying up the waters/acting out. She may also be feeling, "I want to be the baby. I'm the baby here."

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

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[Mutt]

There has been some "taking of sides" and callouts in this thread. We have removed two posts.

The topic centers on "she came in and told me she is going to go on a vacation by herself, or else she would wind up back in the hospital."

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[Grey Kitty]

Wow, Max, this is some serious stuff. I hope you get plenty of good time to yourself during this vacation!

Do you expect to hear from her frequently (or constantly?) while she's on vacation?

[Skip]

Soo.  I see this as good.  Good to have the peace and quiet.  Good for her to do something on her own.  

I just find it strange that me telling her I was ready to have a child (a half truth - I feel like my end is ready) is what set her off.

Is this a good "read" on the situation?

I haven't read the history here, but this seems far more complicated than a "statement" and a "reaction".

Most women do a lot of prep before taking a two week vacation - so they questions about whether this was a plan and or backup plan probably need exploration.

The crying in the car on the way to the airport is not a typical sign of someone going on a get-away.  There is some painful feelings there - exploring what this about is probably worth doing.

Is she overwhelmed and getting space - a good thing?

Is she doing something careless and impulsive?

Why?

[maxsterling]

I certainly welcome the input here.  It is valuable.

My feelings are this was a game either way.  And I willingly participated.  Was it wrong to be untruthful?  Yes.  Do I regret it?  A little.  It was manipulation on my end.  And her trying to manipulate me is no excuse for doing the same in return. 

But I have gotten to a point where I am just so tired of this game, and I felt I needed to say something different - just take a different action.  Basically, I felt like she was trying to manipulate me.  Avoiding the question doesn't work.  Saying "No" and enforcing a boundary gives her what she wants.  it's more honest, but it is still playing her game.  I've been down that road dozens of times.  She wants me to say "no" so she has a reason to blame her life on me, and for months afterwards I hear about it.  So I tried option #3.  At this point in the r/s, I don't feel like I have much to lose.  I've tried so many approaches to help her see she is in charge of her own destiny so that she will quit blaming me.  I used to JADE.  Obviously, that doesn't work.  I've tried the boundaries - she still persists.  It feels like the r/s is doomed anyway unless something changes.

I'm slowly decompressing and enjoying the peace and quiet.  She sends me text messages a few times a day, and is for the most part in good spirits. 

[maxsterling]

In reply to skip -

She's a runner.  That's one of her ways of coping when she feels overwhelmed.  It's not always a bad coping skill - we all need time alone.  I think it is good for her to recognize it and take action.

I think she had been thinking about this for awhile.  So it wasn't completely impulsive.

This is more than a "statement" and a "reaction".  I think she has some deeper feelings about the marriage and relationship in general, especially some internal shame.  I'm sure past relationship failures are a factor here, too.  I got a vibe when she was she was buying her ticket that her attitude was that she may never come back.  But it didn't take long for that attitude to shift.

[Verbena]

Max, is she vacationing completely by herself?  I know pwBPD rarely can tolerate being alone so I was wondering.  Do you anticipate that she will stay gone the entire two weeks?  I really hope she does because you need at least that much time to get your strength up for what happens next.  You deserve this time to yourself. 

[maxsterling]

She went to go visit her best friend.

[Verbena]

Is this the woman who was swapping prescriptions with her the night before the wedding and the one she suggested join the two of you in a three-way? 

[maxsterling]

Is this the woman who was swapping prescriptions with her the night before the wedding and the one she suggested join the two of you in a three-way? 

That's the one.  Interestingly, she says the friend has lost a bunch of weight and seems to be taking more pain meds and is in more pain now.  She never suggested a "three way", but suggested I marry both of them, later said it was a joke, but also said that if I was to cheat on her with her friend, she would not be jealous. 

[Grey Kitty]

Max, let me give you something to try on regarding the half truth about having a baby... .another take on the options here:

1. You are ready to be a father—you want this, and are ready. at least this is what I think you said.

2. Your wife doesnt appear healthy and stable enough to be a good mother.  Plus she has abused you verbally and physically, and blames you for calling the police rather than taking responsibility for her actions. She could change after having a baby, but there is no reason to believe it will be for the better.

3. Your answer to having a baby with her requires both #1 and #2 to be yes for an honest yes.

The answer: I am ready was true enough.

You have good reason to expect a full blown raging dysregulation if you say "no" of say "you aren't ready" instead.

Do you think your relationship could survive a consistent "no" on your part?

If not, consider whether you want to serve the OOP, or at least break up before you say "no".

[maxsterling]

GK - I don't know if the r/s could survive with a consistent "no" to that question.  Any way to answer that question feels like a trap. 

And regarding #1 and #2 - yes, #1 is true, and #2 is also true. 

My bigger questions - "do I want this r/s to continue?" Even bigger than that, "Is it possible to continue this r/s?"

Depending on the answer to those questions, it may make the answer to the baby question irrelevant.

My feeling right now is to use this time to take care of myself.  Spending too much time pondering those questions right now is self-destruction. 

[KateCat]

My feeling right now is to use this time to take care of myself. 

Hear! Hear!

Your primary care physician has seen you recently, hasn't he, as the result of some newly-emerging health issues you've had? What might he say if asked by you or your wife if you were "ready to have a baby" right now?

Is it possible that the physicians attending both Mr. and Mrs. Sterling might be in agreement that neither party is ready to have a baby at this time? I'm kind of remembering back to a theme that a number of valued contributors to your posts--including a board advisor--have repeated: that of the necessity for professional guidance in this very very difficult situation that is your marriage.

Really glad you've got some time to yourself. That both of you have some time to yourselves. Things are changing now.

[Grey Kitty]

GK - I don't know if the r/s could survive with a consistent "no" to that question.  Any way to answer that question feels like a trap. 

That the question is a trap she keeps throwing at you is a big issue.

Which goes back to your other questions.

Meanwhile... .take good care of you. The peace of having her out of the house will help.

[formflier]

 

Max,

When you feel ready... .can you update us on the status of your wife "complying" with her P... .T... ."mental health team"... .I would add in her GP and OB as well.

Last I remember... .it seems a good team has been assembled and she was starting to work with them.

FF

[MaybeSo]

GK - I don't know if the r/s could survive with a consistent "no" to that question.  Any way to answer that question feels like a trap.

it's possible, and probably a necessity for personal mental health... .to want the relationship to survive while being prepared for it and willing for it to NOT survive. both.  at the same time.  things don't feel like traps if one is willing to absorb and/ or be open to all possibilities.