Codependency

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

I didn't come from a dysfunctional home. My parents are happily married (still) My siblings are all successful people and I'm doing well with my career, etc. My family would do anything if I was in a jam to help me. So I feel guilty when I search for the reasons for my attraction to NPD/BPD partners like a moth to a flame, and my obvious codependent traits that are streamlined while dating them, lack of boundaries, neglect for myself, etc.

The only thing I can think of as far as a problem is this. And I would appreciate any feedback if anyone has knowledge or experience with this type of dynamic because anything you read about codependency is so rigid in it's examples of having a totally dysfunctional home life with addiction which I had none of either.

My parents always provided for us and I'm very very appreciative and love them so much so I feel like a brat even thinking this way but here it goes.

My family as I now see, doesn't really "feel" we "do"  And I've always been a sensitive person. That is, my dad is the most selfless, giving, honorable, stoic guys I know. Inevitably bad things happen in life to everyone. If someone has a problem and seeks help, there are two responses you get: One, is the logistics: What happened? Who/what/when/where/why.  And the response being: Try doing this, Try doing that, why don't you say this, why don't you try that.  But there is another aspect to problems or bad stuff happening. That's the human element. The questions like "Are you ok?" "How do you feel?" And the encouraging things that go along with that. I realize that my family is all logistics, never the human element. For example in the proverbial car accident where you'd call home, my family would answer that call and probably ask where the car is, is it drivable, was it your fault, did you call the police yet, etc. But they probably wouldn't ask "are you doing ok?" Are you freaked out? It's scary isn't it when that adrenaline kicks in." Or anything like that which would relate to the feelings part of situations.

I guess I didn't mind and it didn't matter much but I remember a few years ago in a previous relationship I was kind of alone in a new place for a job and was feeling like I was dealing with a loss of a relationship alone. I remember I had a long drive with my dad somewhere and I was really upset but you'd never know it by my face. I remember bringing it up casually and he blatantly ignored it. I remember the shame I felt and also anger for that. Followed by guilt. You see, I love my family and I know they did the best they could. That type of conversation isn't comfortable for everyone and that's just the way it is. But I later brought it up again and he simply said you know, I don't like commenting about stuff regarding relationships because its just something you have to figure out. 

Again, I'm the youngest, and I'm probably the most sensitive. But I realize that when a family member got sick, all of our conversations were about the logistics of the hospital, the care they needed, this or that but never did anyone ask each other are you ok? How do you feel? 

I remember as a kid when we moved to a new state, I was bullied pretty bad about my weight and I was miserable. I didn't want to move. I was away from all my friends, everyone in the new school made fun of me and I recall taking showers at night as a kid maybe 11 years old and I'd cry. I did this because I didn't want anyone to hear me. The times I did show "emotions" whatever the problem was, a pet dying or something, was met with more logistical approaches to try and solve it. There was never just a simple gesture of validating whatever that pain or sorrow was, or a follow up of asking me how I was feeling the next day.

I really think this was a common style a generation ago (think the dad from wonder years) But I'm beginning to think my care taking tendencies of rescuing these BPD/NPD people, wanting to please them, and being there until the bitter end are perhaps driven by something inside me trying to rectify and nurture in someone else what I feel I may have needed as a kid.

You see, I share my feelings very easily, and openly but to this day I only do so with people I really trust because when I do it in the open I get a sense of shame triggered in me. That I should suck it up, quit "b___ing" and move on. Nobody ever talked to me in such a mean way, but those feelings were triggered through silence.

Is it possible that this is the root of it all?

[anxiety5]

I didn't come from a dysfunctional home. My parents are happily married (still) My siblings are all successful people and I'm doing well with my career, etc. My family would do anything if I was in a jam to help me. So I feel guilty when I search for the reasons for my attraction to NPD/BPD partners like a moth to a flame, and my obvious codependent traits that are streamlined while dating them, lack of boundaries, neglect for myself, etc.

The only thing I can think of as far as a problem is this. And I would appreciate any feedback if anyone has knowledge or experience with this type of dynamic because anything you read about codependency is so rigid in it's examples of having a totally dysfunctional home life with addiction which I had none of either.

My parents always provided for us and I'm very very appreciative and love them so much so I feel like a brat even thinking this way but here it goes.

My family as I now see, doesn't really "feel" we "do"  And I've always been a sensitive person. That is, my dad is the most selfless, giving, honorable, stoic guys I know. Inevitably bad things happen in life to everyone. If someone has a problem and seeks help, there are two responses you get: One, is the logistics: What happened? Who/what/when/where/why.  And the response being: Try doing this, Try doing that, why don't you say this, why don't you try that.  But there is another aspect to problems or bad stuff happening. That's the human element. The questions like "Are you ok?" "How do you feel?" And the encouraging things that go along with that. I realize that my family is all logistics, never the human element. For example in the proverbial car accident where you'd call home, my family would answer that call and probably ask where the car is, is it drivable, was it your fault, did you call the police yet, etc. But they probably wouldn't ask "are you doing ok?" Are you freaked out? It's scary isn't it when that adrenaline kicks in." Or anything like that which would relate to the feelings part of situations.

I guess I didn't mind and it didn't matter much but I remember a few years ago in a previous relationship I was kind of alone in a new place for a job and was feeling like I was dealing with a loss of a relationship alone. I remember I had a long drive with my dad somewhere and I was really upset but you'd never know it by my face. I remember bringing it up casually and he blatantly ignored it. I remember the shame I felt and also anger for that. Followed by guilt. You see, I love my family and I know they did the best they could. That type of conversation isn't comfortable for everyone and that's just the way it is. But I later brought it up again and he simply said you know, I don't like commenting about stuff regarding relationships because its just something you have to figure out. 

Again, I'm the youngest, and I'm probably the most sensitive. But I realize that when a family member got sick, all of our conversations were about the logistics of the hospital, the care they needed, this or that but never did anyone ask each other are you ok? How do you feel? 

I remember as a kid when we moved to a new state, I was bullied pretty bad about my weight and I was miserable. I didn't want to move. I was away from all my friends, everyone in the new school made fun of me and I recall taking showers at night as a kid maybe 11 years old and I'd cry. I did this because I didn't want anyone to hear me. The times I did show "emotions" whatever the problem was, a pet dying or something, was met with more logistical approaches to try and solve it. There was never just a simple gesture of validating whatever that pain or sorrow was, or a follow up of asking me how I was feeling the next day.

I really think this was a common style a generation ago (think the dad from wonder years) But I'm beginning to think my care taking tendencies of rescuing these BPD/NPD people, wanting to please them, and being there until the bitter end are perhaps driven by something inside me trying to rectify and nurture in someone else what I feel I may have needed as a kid.

You see, I share my feelings very easily, and openly but to this day I only do so with people I really trust because when I do it in the open I get a sense of shame triggered in me. That I should suck it up, quit "b___ing" and move on. Nobody ever talked to me in such a mean way, but those feelings were triggered through silence.

Is it possible that this is the root of it all?

[jhkbuzz]

Hi A5, that's a really thoughtful and insightful post. It sounds like you're really digging to get to the bottom of things; I'm in the middle of that process as well. I have a T, which has been invaluable for my healing.

Parts of your family history echo my own. My parents are still married (almost 60 years), they ran a business, my brother and I are successful, we were well taken care of as children, etc.  I have that same sense of loyalty as you; the feeling like, "wow, they did the best they could, no one is perfect, many people had it waaaay worse than me, there's a lot of good in them, too." My T pointed out to me that, as I prepare to dive into talking about the more difficult parts of my childhood, nothing is black and white - talking about the difficult parts doesn't mean I'm making them out to be "all bad." It's about my speaking the truth of the specific moments that were traumatizing for me; and talking about those moments doesn't mean I'm painting them "black" with broad strokes. They are just pockets of pain that need to be brought into the light of day so that I (my adult-self in the here-and-now) can deal with them and heal.

I visited my parents recently (hadn't seen them in 8 years), and it was a very interesting experience. One of the things I've talked about with my T is how often my mother raged, and how I was always trying to strategize how I could make her happy so she wouldn't be mad. (Interestingly, my ex was a waif and didn't rage). What I had forgotten until I went to visit was how anxious she is as well. My ex was very anxious in the first several years of our r/s, and I thought I knew how to "soothe" her since I had lots of practice with my mom, and also watched my dad do it a lot as well.  There's the caretaking. When things "flipped" in my r/s around the 4th year and my ex became very passive/aggressively angry, I thought I knew how to deal with that, too. The truth is that I dealt with my ex with the same strategies that I used with my mom. None of it worked. But it was all very familiar.

But I'm beginning to think my care taking tendencies of rescuing these BPD/NPD people, wanting to please them, and being there until the bitter end are perhaps driven by something inside me trying to rectify and nurture in someone else what I feel I may have needed as a kid.

There is very likely a grain of truth in that ^. In the end, I think I was trying to give my mom AND my ex what I needed for myself; compassion, love, understanding. There's this feeling that "if I give it, I'll eventually get it in return." But we're giving it to partners who my the very nature of their mental health struggles are not able to give it in return. But we keep trying, eh? Just like when we were kids.

There's something "familiar" in the BPD/NPD r/s's that you're finding yourself in - something you're repeating from the past. Perhaps it's the choice of emotionally invalidating partners that echo your childhood experience?

[Skip]

I don't know that the prerequisite for co-dependency is a dysfunctional family or addiction.  You may want to read this: https://bpdfamily.com/content/codependency-codependent-relationships

My family as I now see, doesn't really "feel" we "do"  And I've always been a sensitive person. That is, my dad is the most selfless, giving, honorable, stoic guys I know.

This may very well be where it starts... .you earn love in an environment like this.  Codependency is a lot about trying to earn love.

[lbjnltx]

Hi anxiety5,

It seems you were raised in an invalidating environment... .unknowingly your parents didn't discuss (validate) your feelings.  They are problem solvers... .make the feelings go away (and not addressing them) by making the problem go away.  There is a mismatch between parent and child and this sets up the dynamic for an invalidating environment.

I am aware of this because this is what happened in my home with my child who went on to be diagnosed at 12 with emerging BPD.  She is sensitive and I am not, she is emotionally driven and I am logically driven. Thankfully we got her diagnoses early in her life and I learned what she needed here on this site, put the skills and knowledge into practice and got her the help she needed.

As I learned about validation one of the key components is first learning to validating myself. Are you able to validate yourself and acknowledge your feelings, accept them as right for you and self soothe?

I'm not very knowledgeable about co-dependency so maybe others can explain how the need for validation missed as a child relates to co-dependency later in life.

lbjnltx

[anxiety5]

Hi anxiety5,

It seems you were raised in an invalidating environment... .unknowingly your parents didn't discuss (validate) your feelings.  They are problem solvers... .make the feelings go away (and not addressing them) by making the problem go away.  There is a mismatch between parent and child and this sets up the dynamic for an invalidating environment.

I am aware of this because this is what happened in my home with my child who went on to be diagnosed at 12 with emerging BPD.  She is sensitive and I am not, she is emotionally driven and I am logically driven. Thankfully we got her diagnoses early in her life and I learned what she needed here on this site, put the skills and knowledge into practice and got her the help she needed.

As I learned about validation one of the key components is first learning to validating myself. Are you able to validate yourself and acknowledge your feelings, accept them as right for you and self soothe?

I'm not very knowledgeable about co-dependency so maybe others can explain how the need for validation missed as a child relates to co-dependency later in life.

lbjnltx

Thank you for your response. I'm glad you are approaching that problem early, sounds like it's a great start to fully rectifying it. That's a true gift, by acknowledging differences and doing what's best for someone in your life you care about.

I've always been someone who can discuss how I feel about things. Where I'm not a typical codependent is, I'm assertive and when she would act or behave in ways that were unacceptable I had no problem standing up for myself, pushing back and pointing out that she was being contradictory, hypocritical or just nasty.

My problem is, I wouldn't quit. I wouldn't walk away. I kept trying to make it work. I kept thinking it could work. I paid attention to words over actions. I believed her. I ignored my instincts and intuition for a long time until I was already badly hurt and was able to assert some boundaries or even understand what boundaries were.

I'm just now learning to self sooth. And I'm also learning that I don't need anyone's approval to feel how I feel about things. That was actually the last argument which led me to break things off with her. I pointed out to her that she was invalidating my feelings and that rather than talk to me about the way I felt about our relationship she was shunning me and getting angry for no reason.

As a kid and maybe to this day, I always feel a sense of shame if I share too much information about something. But yet, I feel so much better when I do. And everything I ever talked about, I just wanted someone to tell me it was ok to feel that way. I was always met with what I needed to do, etc rather than feeling like someone just heard me or could see that I wasn't necessarily asking for help. 

What's incredible is despite needing this, i realize for a long time I was doing that very thing to my partner which kind of enabled and encouraged that NPD behavior.  I'm able to sooth myself now, especially around bully type people in adult hood the ones you can't get away from like managers, etc. I just imagine a wall around me and I choose to let in what I let in, but only after I filter it. I don't let it penetrate me. I don't need their approval to feel however I feel about something. I need to be true to myself, not to anyone else. Some will accept me, others may not but I guess through that process a realignment will happen that naturally leads me to be around the people I need to be around and away from others who aren't good for me.

I don't think I'm co-dependent in any situation other than a relationship, and it's triggered not necessarily there from day one. When I was cheated on it triggered it in me. I took that personally as an indication that I was rejected, flawed and not wanted. I internalized her actions rather than keeping them focused on her. I should not internalize the behaviors of someone else. They are not a reflection of my self worth, they are a window into their own character, not mine.

I'm learning. But I guess the question is, does it ever stop? How do you know when you have it figured out enough

[jhkbuzz]

... .My problem is, I wouldn't quit. I wouldn't walk away. I kept trying to make it work. I kept thinking it could work. I paid attention to words over actions. I believed her. I ignored my instincts and intuition for a long time until I was already badly hurt and was able to assert some boundaries or even understand what boundaries were... .

... .I don't think I'm co-dependent in any situation other than a relationship, and it's triggered not necessarily there from day one. When I was cheated on it triggered it in me. I took that personally as an indication that I was rejected, flawed and not wanted. I internalized her actions rather than keeping them focused on her.

Wow, that ^. That is my story, too.

[Suzn]

I remember I had a long drive with my dad somewhere and I was really upset but you'd never know it by my face. I remember bringing it up casually and he blatantly ignored it.

Did you feel heard?

My problem is, I wouldn't quit. I wouldn't walk away. I kept trying to make it work. I kept thinking it could work.

How about here? Would it be fair to say these actions would be someone who wants to be heard?

I'm learning. But I guess the question is, does it ever stop? How do you know when you have it figured out enough

Codependency is learned and you can work on identifying what triggers these tendencies in you and work to develop alternative coping methods. The longer you work at it the easier it gets to recognize when you are leaning too far into someone else. We begin to see the line between where we end and someone else begins.

My mother always had another reason for having uncomfortable feelings too. It was "you are tired or you're hungry" not hearing that I needed comfort or guidance to work through the emotions I was feeling. I believed her and as an adult I didn't have a clue how to identify emotions to respond appropriately, instead I always looked for another reason behind being uncomfortable. Being sad or angry for any amount of time was wrong and I should just get over it. Whatever "it" was.

Today I realize that grieving is an important step to recovery and sometimes it takes a bit of time. As a child I looked for comfort in someone (my mother) who wasn't capable of giving it. As an adult, I did the same with many partners.

 

[Kelly123]

I am SO glad I stumbled upon your post. I could have written that myself word for word. I absolutely think you're right in your theory and you are definitely not alone. I was brought up well, I had a huge social circle I have a career by all means nothing in particular has seemed to fit as to why I am attracted to these broken people/my BPD partner. I've always known I've been overly empathetic and sensitive I consider it a strength however there was always a component of me that always isolated me from my family. My mum and brothers are so extremely "practical" they are problem solvers and not empathetic at all. My mum never hugs me and feels awkward when she does. When I go to her for motherly advice I am always met with practical black and white answers nothing sympathetic no shoulder to cry on. I began to realise in myself that I crave to be the solution for this for other people and I naturally attract the ones with a broken wing. It gives me a sense of fulfilment that I don't get from my own family. You are not alone in this and you are not crazy for being a "straight" background person that attracts that kind of person...

[tenderhearted]

Great post, anxiety. I always enjoy your writing and insights.

I can relate... .I am considered the sensitive one in my family, and this is generally stated pejoratively by the rest of my family members. I've always felt ashamed of my sensitivity, until recently my T explained that it was a good way to be in the world, but must figure out a way to nurture and protect the quality, instead of wishing it were gone.

Your post has got me thinking. Thanks for sharing.

[anxiety5]

I remember I had a long drive with my dad somewhere and I was really upset but you'd never know it by my face. I remember bringing it up casually and he blatantly ignored it.

Did you feel heard?

My problem is, I wouldn't quit. I wouldn't walk away. I kept trying to make it work. I kept thinking it could work.

How about here? Would it be fair to say these actions would be someone who wants to be heard?

I'm learning. But I guess the question is, does it ever stop? How do you know when you have it figured out enough

Codependency is learned and you can work on identifying what triggers these tendencies in you and work to develop alternative coping methods. The longer you work at it the easier it gets to recognize when you are leaning too far into someone else. We begin to see the line between where we end and someone else begins.

My mother always had another reason for having uncomfortable feelings too. It was "you are tired or you're hungry" not hearing that I needed comfort or guidance to work through the emotions I was feeling. I believed her and as an adult I didn't have a clue how to identify emotions to respond appropriately, instead I always looked for another reason behind being uncomfortable. Being sad or angry for any amount of time was wrong and I should just get over it. Whatever "it" was.

Today I realize that grieving is an important step to recovery and sometimes it takes a bit of time. As a child I looked for comfort in someone (my mother) who wasn't capable of giving it. As an adult, I did the same with many partners.

 

Yes I wanted to be heard. Here is the weird thing, when people I know well, good friends are going through tough times, I seem to be the one a lot of them turn to. Everyone is busy in life and things get crazy, I'm aware of when someone really cares or is pretending to hear you out so they can get off the phone. I've always genuinely offered my time to friends going through something hard. And I don't try to talk them out of feeling how they feel. I don't try to solve their problem and I don't try to tell them to stay busy, etc.  I hear them out, I put myself in their shoes, and I relate. I connect the dots from their perspective so I can walk a moment or two in their shoes and try my best to understand what it feels like to be them in this moment of crisis. From there all I try to do is lend an ear, and simply remind them of their good qualities. Their strength, and perhaps a time or two when we had gone through something in our past and how everything will be ok. 

I didn't feel heard. My dad has never been the type to reply to me bringing up that relationship with something like, "what happened" and if he did I couldn't picture him ever saying encouraging things or stuff to try and remind me of my good qualities. I almost lost my dad this past year. I'm not angry with him. My dad had a childhood which I could not imagine living through. He fought in a war. I have never heard him complain before. I have learned to ACCEPT the fact that he simply can't offer me this type of validation. He was completely and devoted to his family growing up. And I genuinely know with certainty that he did the best he could. You see, blaming him does not solve anything.

My dad is a caretaker type to a fault. I learned this dynamic from him. He did everything for those around him. But my mom treated my dad really good. She loves him to death.

I think my unfortunate mixture was this: I learned to give to a fault, to follow this mode of operating I describe above. It works for my dad because that man would never tolerate my mom running around or belittling him, demanding things or beating him down. He would leave in 2 seconds.  So while I followed the model I saw as a kid for this selflessness, I went through some tough years of bullying etc as a kid and while that may not be a big deal (even I would have never thought about it again) It really messed with my self worth, and the way I thought about myself as well as destroyed my boundaries. I just wanted people to like me, to have friends at that age. At any cost. And for them to stop.

So I think the unfortunate combination that happened to me is being a selfless giving type of person mixed with inner feelings of not feeling worthwhile and poor self respect, lack of boundaries as well as conditioning to take a lot of disrespectful behaviors.  So unlike my dad where that model works because he does it for people who respect and love him, I ended up doing it for the wrong reasons with the wrong people and lost a lot of myself trying to win them over to somehow validate my self worth.

Here is my biggest question of all. I have a ton of awareness of all these things now. I see it, I get it and I have done 10+ sessions with a counselor to work on identification of core values, to understand that WE SET THE EXPECTATIONS FOR HOW OTHERS TREAT US, to understand boundaries and deal breakers. And most important, to learn that there is nothing heroic about never quitting, when you are being emotionally beaten down. That's not stoic, it's suicide.

So I get all these things, but WHEN IS IT DONE? I always hear about "doing the work" When is the work done? How do you know you are ok? How do you know when you have rid yourself of these things? Or is it simply awareness. Something I certainly didn't have but do now.

[anxiety5]

Great post, anxiety. I always enjoy your writing and insights.

I can relate... .I am considered the sensitive one in my family, and this is generally stated pejoratively by the rest of my family members. I've always felt ashamed of my sensitivity, until recently my T explained that it was a good way to be in the world, but must figure out a way to nurture and protect the quality, instead of wishing it were gone.

Your post has got me thinking. Thanks for sharing.

Thank you for your kind words. You know what's interesting about myself, is this. I may feel this shame for as you said being sensitive. But I also know deep down that what I possess is a GOOD thing, not a bad thing. I'm able to admit fault. I don't posture. If I cut someone off in traffic and they pull up with their fist raised, and I was at fault, I wave and say hey man I'm sorry. It's so funny to watch someone go from furrowed brows and fist shaking to instantaneous "hey that's ok, no problem" . You know what I mean. I guess so few people today do this, it's kind of funny the reaction you get. On top of that, if I ever get in arguments because I'm grumpy, or hungry, or just having a bad day, I always go back to the person and let them know I'm sorry, I was having a crappy day and sorry for not putting that aside when I was hanging out with them.

Meanwhile my siblings will have misunderstandings and ignore each other for months. If I have a misunderstanding I'll call someone and ask for a minute of their time and hash it out and for the right reasons, to resolve it not to "win" the argument.

I don't have any kids yet but I'm looking forward to it. Those hard talks aren't hard for me. I look forward to using the intuition I've been blessed with to see my childs face and know he had a rough day and to talk to him and let him know he/she is gonna be ok.

I guess sometimes the good in us, may bring us grief, but the key is aligning with good people so we can be ourselves without being exploited. I look forward to that one day. I'm not dealing with these type of people anymore or ever again.

[jhkbuzz]

Here is my biggest question of all. I have a ton of awareness of all these things now. I see it, I get it and I have done 10+ sessions with a counselor to work on identification of core values, to understand that WE SET THE EXPECTATIONS FOR HOW OTHERS TREAT US, to understand boundaries and deal breakers. And most important, to learn that there is nothing heroic about never quitting, when you are being emotionally beaten down. That's not stoic, it's suicide.

So I get all these things, but WHEN IS IT DONE? I always hear about "doing the work" When is the work done? How do you know you are ok? How do you know when you have rid yourself of these things? Or is it simply awareness. Something I certainly didn't have but do now.

I've asked myself this question a lot, and I'm not completely sure of the answer, but I'm getting closer. I've been seeing a T for about a year, and it feels like the "serious" work is just beginning.

My T talks about me "connecting my head and my heart."  It's not enough to have an intellectual understanding - there are some aspects of myself and my upbringing that I've understood for years, but it hasn't really changed anything about my r/s's in a pragmatic sense. What I said in my earlier post: that there are "pockets of pain that need to be brought into the light of day so that I (my adult-self in the here-and-now) can deal with them and heal" is important. It may be painful and messy and unpleasant, but necessary - I can't intellectualize my pain away, I have to deal with it AND with the childhood assumptions I made about myself and the world as a result of that pain. It's some of those assumptions that kept me stuck in an unhealthy r/s, I think.

My T also told me that some of my healing would happen without my being able to verbalize what has changed or healed. I'm experiencing some of that right now - things are shifting and clicking on a level that is beyond my ability to explain.

I think part of the answer to your question about being "done" is also getting to know yourself well enough to understand you triggers - for caretaking, for boundary busting - and recognizing when you start to head in that direction. My T says it's about learning to trust myself.

[Suzn]

My dad is a caretaker type to a fault. I learned this dynamic from him. He did everything for those around him. You see, blaming him does not solve anything.

This isn't about blaming, it's about understanding. You know what was there, what was missing?  

I went through some tough years of bullying etc as a kid and while that may not be a big deal (even I would have never thought about it again)

If this took away your self worth then it is a very big deal. Your inner child needs to be heard here and only you can work through that hurt with him.

So I get all these things, but WHEN IS IT DONE? I always hear about "doing the work" When is the work done? How do you know you are ok? How do you know when you have rid yourself of these things?  

When you are comfortably living this below. \/

identification of core values, to understand that WE SET THE EXPECTATIONS FOR HOW OTHERS TREAT US, to understand boundaries and deal breakers. And most important, to learn that there is nothing heroic about never quitting, when you are being emotionally beaten down.  

Those that have identified what "the work" really means likely work on themselves for the rest of their lives more or less. It gets easier the longer you practice what you wrote above.

I am not better than anyone. My goal is to be a better me today than I was yesterday.  

[anxiety5]

My dad is a caretaker type to a fault. I learned this dynamic from him. He did everything for those around him. You see, blaming him does not solve anything.

This isn't about blaming, it's about understanding. You know what was there, what was missing? 

I went through some tough years of bullying etc as a kid and while that may not be a big deal (even I would have never thought about it again)

If this took away your self worth then it is a very big deal. Your inner child needs to be heard here and only you can work through that hurt with her.

So I get all these things, but WHEN IS IT DONE? I always hear about "doing the work" When is the work done? How do you know you are ok? How do you know when you have rid yourself of these things? 

When you are comfortably living this below. \/

identification of core values, to understand that WE SET THE EXPECTATIONS FOR HOW OTHERS TREAT US, to understand boundaries and deal breakers. And most important, to learn that there is nothing heroic about never quitting, when you are being emotionally beaten down. 

Those that have identified what "the work" really means likely work on themselves for the rest of their lives more or less. It gets easier the longer you practice what you wrote above.

I am not better than anyone. My goal is to be a better me today than I was yesterday. 

Thanks for your response.  All of the things I've learned, make me realize how really really really uncomfortable any talk of "feelings" are with my family. They DON'T do it. It's weakness. It's vulnerability, whatever it is, you just don't do it. It gives the perception that you can't handle your own business. This is so absurdly flawed and I see that clear as day. The thing is, I KNOW that their way is not right. But I just don't try to change them into something they can't be. I simply have awareness, know that I will not repeat that dynamic with my own kids, and I've let go of that FALSE sense of shame for talking about the way I feel. Everyone is different. I'm not like them. And I don't want to be. I still love them. (At least I can say it verbally) .

Is this a sign of healing? My ex had STRONG NPD traits. I would classify her as more NPD than BPD. She was a text book on the subject. If you had the DSM in front of you, our interactions and fall outs were like a checklist of symptoms. It was kind of eery. That being said, I have this awareness now about narcissism. And sadly, ITS EVERYWHERE. But in time's past, I guess I used to project the way I thought onto the dynamics of other people, so when they would do something so hurtful or just undermining, I would try to figure out why they did that, etc and try to make the relationship work. Now, I see it for what it is. It scares the crap out of me and I instantly retreat away from that person. I share less of my personal thoughts with that person, and I just sort of avoid them when I can. There are a couple friends I've known for years I guess you could identify with these type of traits, and for whatever reason, I just don't feel like talking to them much anymore. I'm not mad at them, I just kind of see it for what it is and I don't really have any desire to maintain relationships with people like that.  So I talk to them very little anymore. 

I also was talking to a girl briefly post breakup with my ex, very recently and she told me about her past. She said she had been divorced, but he was a jerk. She said she's only loved 1 person and she isn't sure she loved that person. She told me she is difficult to deal with sometimes but needs a man who is strong enough for her.  She told me she's a "strong" personality.

In times past I may have seen this as a challenge because she was simultaneously wanting to know all about me. When she told me the above, I instantly retreated. Stopped responding to her and told her point blank that I don't know if we are a good fit and I wish her the best.

Good things?