When a child lashes out, a lot of people will not hold them accountable for their actions, Does that same idea apply to BPD?
remembering that they are a child isnt necessarily a refusal to hold children accountable. most people believe in disciplining children. children are children and its appropriate for a guardian or authority (teacher, principal, etc) to discipline a child, pwBPD are adults. that inherently means that they are responsible for their behavior and actions, as the law will testify if one breaks it. remembering that they are mentally ill isnt necessarily a refusal to hold them responsible.
When they do things to hurt you, is it because they are literally "fighting for survival" as some board members suggest, or are they just truly selfish? Instead of a personality disorder, could some of these people just be immature instead?
at the end of the day we are all fighting for survival. for some of us, our idea of fighting for survival is more socially acceptable, for good reason. self centeredness (not necessarily selfishness) is a hallmark of personality disorders, as well as emotional immaturity. you dont have to be personality disordered to be immature. one of my closest and best friends is one of the most emotionally immature guys ive ever met, has narcissistic traits, but i would bet a large amount of money he would not qualify for a diagnosis. your premise is a good one: immaturity is really the bigger issue than a diagnosis.
Using my ex as an example, she is exceptionally logical about anything that doesn't affect her emotionally. Outside of my relationship with her, she is perfectly normal. If they were going through such an ordeal emotionally, how can they function (or even excel at life)?
you sort of hit the nail on the head when you said "logical about anything that doesnt affect her emotionally"
. BPD is triggered by intimacy. some people refer to BPD as an "invisible" disorder. thats a generalization as dysfunction is far more obvious in some people than it is in others. i asked the same thing of my ex. why did she treat me so differently (in a negative way) than other people? why did i have a feeling no one knew what it was really like between us behind closed doors? even more confusing when my ex expressed self awareness. it makes much more sense when you consider that BPD is triggered by intimacy.
how can they function (or even excel at life)?
in a similar way that many, many addicts do.
Even if the emotional part of their brain cannot comprehend what they are doing, why can't the logical side of the brain simply identify the most common denominator? Is there a complete disconnect? Why does this disorder not influence many when it comes to day to day life, and not just relationships?
sometimes it does. i saw my ex flip out at people, some of her closest and furthest friends described her as "crazy". logic and mental illness dont frequently meet in the middle. accepting that your belief system is "wrong" or inhibiting you, or, in fact, hurting other people, is an awful tough pill to swallow, for anyone. identifying oneself as the most common denominator is to go against the belief system of a person with BPD. that doesnt mean its impossible. many people with BPD do have such thoughts in a fleeting sense, and some of them seek help and remain committed to it.
You wouldn't accuse a selfish, or even an egocentric person with a personality disorder... .so why do we? Instead of them being damaged, could that just be how they are? At what point is an individual mentally disordered?
you raise some good points. on one hand, we shared strong bonds with our partners, so we know them well, but are of course, naturally biased in many ways. the vast majority of our exes are undiagnosed. and the vast majority of them would not meet the criteria for a formal diagnosis. that doesnt mean the vast majority dont have traits. on the other hand sometimes we cling to a diagnosis because it excuses us from holding ourselves accountable. an individual is mentally disordered when they meet enough criteria for a diagnosis. only a professional can decide that.
When they decide to shower you in fake apologies, a part of them know they are doing something wrong. I'm not saying they process emotions like nons, but it makes absolutely no sense how they feel like they need to apologize (to get you to talk to them) yet not connect that to the fact that they are doing something wrong.
theres no evidence that i know of that people with BPD dont generally know right from wrong. it might be easier to see it as the disorder facilitating a sense of wrong=right, where pain is overwhelming and feelings are facts, and distorted thoughts and belief systems override logic or "right". there is also the impulsive nature to consider. most of those apologies you refer to are sincere at the time, but the attitude is simply not sustainable. it may also be learned behavior. people "apologize" without apologizing all the time - learned behavior.
On top of seeing a lot of people saying that they are fighting for survival and they have to do what they do. I also see a lot of people shifting blame over to the non. What if codependents cannot control themselves either? Why does the destructive BPD get a pass, while the possible codependent non gets blamed?
like i said, at the end of the day, we are all kinda fighting for survival, and some of us have more socially acceptable and successful ways of approaching it. at this point its not really about us vs them, our relationships are over. the codependent shouldnt be "blamed", but it goes back to your point about seeing yourself as the common denominator. as we are detaching, we are the only ones we can change, and, presumably, with the goal of healthier relationships in the future.
Personally do not think I am codependent. I believe most of the reasons I still have her on my mind is because of a trauma bond over anything else. I went into my relationship and I had no idea what to expect, as most relationships I have witnessed have not been ideal. I feel if she wasn't my first official relationship, I would not have put up with her with even the few months we were together. Of course some of the actions I did post breakup were mistakes, but as far as the relationship goes I don't see how I can be blamed for trying. But I still do not understand why a non should be held accountable, while a pwBPD is not.
one size doesnt fit all. i dont consider myself a codependent though i can certainly relate to codependent behaviors, and i can say my relationship dipped into codependency. it has really helped me to shift parts of my belief system about relationships and gain a better understanding of what constitutes a healthy relationship. if this was your first serious relationship, far be it for anyone to blame you for getting involved in a complex and complicated relationship, but ill bet you that it would do you a lot of good to clearly define your values, boundaries, belief system(s), and what you want in a future partner.
great questions Schermarhorn
