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Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits. Practicing lawyer, Senior Family Mediator, and former Licensed Clinical Social Worker with twelve years’ experience and an expert on navigating the Family Court process.
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Author Topic: This is ripping my guts out  (Read 1007 times)
formflier
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« Reply #30 on: October 20, 2016, 12:03:19 PM »

While Jesus is a role model, there are different facets to Jesus.

Correct!  And to be clear... .my message on this is as follows:  Jesus doesn't force anyone to follow him.  He communicates clearly and people have a choice.  He respects that choice.

So... .once you have clearly laid out your love for your wife, a pathway to a marriage that you two can thrive it... .you are done.

It's up to you to listen and respect the answer.

I've pushed hard for clarity before.  I'm convinced you stepped up to that.  You were both in counseling.  She walked away (my understanding).

I AM a bit curious about what she means by "working on herself".  Any fruit coming from that?

For instance:  My wife refuses more MC right now.  Only wants to work with her "mentor".  I don't agree with this.

However, changes are obvious.  Changes are positive.  Perhaps I will reconsider my opinion as time passes.

My wife has made a choice.  I respect it... .

FF
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Notwendy
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« Reply #31 on: October 20, 2016, 12:35:57 PM »

I guess I didn't mean it in terms of following. People have a choice to what to believe or not- and I respect their right to choose.

I meant the role model- of what is a good person. I think how people determine their own ethics can vary. Jesus is both an example of self sacrifice, and a person who could stand up to others. Self sacrifice can also err into co-dependency- giving up all that you are for the sake of another.

I personally don't believe we are created to do that. I think we each have a unique value and so have the right to defend that value. A relationship with a disordered person can diminish how we see ourselves.

There are marriages where one partner is financially dependent on the other. If there is a divorce, I imagine the courts decide how to deal with that- and they consider the individual circumstances when they do.

I doubt most marriages are exactly 50/50. However, if ByFaith's wife chose to marry someone only as a means to support her and her son, and By Faith married assuming this would be a marriage, then the basis of this marriage isn't on a mutual agreement.

By taking his ethics with him, I believe that if he divorced, he would do this ethically, and if he stayed he would also act ethically. I don't think any of us is obligated to be a martyr in a relationship, however, people are free to make that choice as well.
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ForeverDad
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #32 on: October 20, 2016, 01:48:10 PM »

I meant the role model - of what is a good person. I think how people determine their own ethics can vary. Jesus is both an example of self sacrifice, and a person who could stand up to others. Self sacrifice can also err into co-dependency - giving up all that you are for the sake of another.

I sometimes make the comparison, You can rightly make sacrifices in a relationship but don't sacrifice yourself.  Can you see the difference as I do?

However, if ByFaith's wife chose to marry someone only as a means to support her and her son, and By Faith married assuming this would be a marriage, then the basis of this marriage isn't on a mutual agreement.

By taking his ethics with him, I believe that if he divorced, he would do this ethically, and if he stayed he would also act ethically. I don't think any of us is obligated to be a martyr in a relationship, however, people are free to make that choice as well.

Divorce attorneys have a reputation as being sharks and borderline unethical.  Frankly, most aren't but there can be a fine line between proactive versus aggressive.  We here don't know what her lawyer is like, but fact is her lawyer's obligation is to her alone, not you and not the two of you together.  He/she may be better than that but you can't count on it.  Therefore you, for your part, should have a capable family law attorney who will advise you on the optimal strategies and solutions, including warning you when you're letting your emotions get in the way and sabotaging yourself.  You lawyer won't be a 'meanie' but primarily keeping your interests to the fore and helping you avoid bad decisions that you could regret down the road once you pulled your head out of wherever.

Example 1, if you did proceed to divorce and you wanted to be "the Nice Guy" and gift her what she demanded, say, perhaps 60%, and then later after she'd run through the money and come back guilting you for more and you call your lawyer and ask why you even gifted her that much, he'll tell you, "I advised you against that much but your emotions were louder than my advice."

Example 2, if you did proceed to divorce and you wanted to be "the Nice Guy" but also listened to your lawyers practical advice and gifted her what was appropriate and not what she demanded, say, perhaps 10% (or whatever) and then later after she'd run through the money and come back guilting you for more and you call your lawyer he tell you, "I advised you to gift enough to satisfy the court and a normal outcome.  If you want to give her some more, then that gift would be optional and up to you.  You've been out of the relationship for a while and probably not buried so deep in the past emotions... .it's your choice to gift a little more if that's what you want."

Do you see the difference between examples 1 and 2?  In the first, you're guilted in the moment and regret later being obligated to gift so much, perhaps even overextending yourself.  In the second, You were reasonable and fair but not overly so and later on you could look back and decide whether or not to gift a little more... .  not guilted, not obligated, but freely giving within your financial and emotional comfort zone.  If you so decided.
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formflier
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« Reply #33 on: October 20, 2016, 03:22:37 PM »

You can rightly make sacrifices in a relationship but don't sacrifice yourself.  

Very well said!   Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)



I do think that Byfaith should ask the attorney if there is an angle to "annul" the marriage based on "fraud" or based on "nonperformance".  Basically the years where she would not be intimate while Byfaith still provided a roof over her head and other support.

Also ask if there is an angle to push the settlement lower because of this, if annulment is not allowed.

Get the legal advice first, develop strategy before serving her or doing anything else. 

Recommendation is to not discuss divorce until you have decided a course.

FF
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empath
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« Reply #34 on: October 20, 2016, 03:43:36 PM »

Usually an annulment requires the person who is seeking it to act immediately on the situation that presents itself - sometimes there is a timeframe in which a person has to act.

Byfaith, what kind of IRL support system do you have? How do they think about your situation?
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ForeverDad
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #35 on: October 24, 2016, 10:31:18 AM »

Get the legal advice first, develop strategy before serving her or doing anything else. 

Recommendation is to not discuss divorce until you have decided a course.

Share or not to share... .which is done when?

  • If your goal is to improve the marriage — and that goal is not unrealistic — then sharing is crucial, a marriage with both sharing appropriate matters becomes built upon mutual trust.
  • If your decision is that the marriage is irretrievably failing or has failed, then you must limit what you share.  You have a right to confidentiality and privacy, especially when it comes to unwinding an unhealthy or dysfunctional marriage.  Just as when in court, you should not be forced to divulge your confidential information.  You do not have to submit yourself to interrogations, pressuring or guilting.  Divulging certain information or strategies can Enable a disordered spouse to sabotage you.  Sadly, this is a mindset you'll have to learn, divorce is best handled without the emotional overload.  With a disordered spouse, the emotional pressuring, guilting and obligating can be thrust upon us as a tremendous weight if we don't deflect that burden.
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