Why not give up the fight?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I hate the subject of my thread, but I'm sure many have been there before.  I am absolutely burned out on this process and absolutely tired of all the journaling, recording, and frustration!  She has brainwashed the kids to hate me so much and they will defend her abusive behavior toward me and won't even consider the reality of her words.  They act exactly like her and it makes me very sad to see what the kids have become because of this ridiculous court system!  We are in a shared parenting situation and it is MISERABLE!  Her words and actions are incredibly abusive and I just don't want to live my life with her in it.  We are currently in court for custody and going through a psyche eval.  There is no way that anyone can see her to have custody but I travel half the month so they want us to do shared parenting unless the psyche eval. says differently.  The GAL supports me having custody despite my travel but wants the psyche eval. to confirm that this is the best thing for the kids.  As a man, if I were acting like her, they would have taken the kids away from a long time ago and I would be getting supervised visits.  I'm thinking, even if I get custody, her behavior will be even more abusive.  I'm tired of being abused, threatened, harassed, insulted by a crazy bi***!  This is no way to live a life!

[justaboutdone]

I hate the subject of my thread, but I'm sure many have been there before.  I am absolutely burned out on this process and absolutely tired of all the journaling, recording, and frustration!  She has brainwashed the kids to hate me so much and they will defend her abusive behavior toward me and won't even consider the reality of her words.  They act exactly like her and it makes me very sad to see what the kids have become because of this ridiculous court system!  We are in a shared parenting situation and it is MISERABLE!  Her words and actions are incredibly abusive and I just don't want to live my life with her in it.  We are currently in court for custody and going through a psyche eval.  There is no way that anyone can see her to have custody but I travel half the month so they want us to do shared parenting unless the psyche eval. says differently.  The GAL supports me having custody despite my travel but wants the psyche eval. to confirm that this is the best thing for the kids.  As a man, if I were acting like her, they would have taken the kids away from a long time ago and I would be getting supervised visits.  I'm thinking, even if I get custody, her behavior will be even more abusive.  I'm tired of being abused, threatened, harassed, insulted by a crazy bi***!  This is no way to live a life!

[Nope]

I hear you. It is exceptionally difficult to work with a disordered person and a court system that feels like it largely enables that  disordered person. It's time consuming and exhausting. My DH used to get so angry because day after day his ex would obstruct his access, lie, manipulate the kids, no care for the kids properly, and just generally make everything as difficult as humanly possible. And she would get away with all of it. My DH would say "and the courts do nothing... ." and I had to remind him that the courts could not do anything until our final court date. No matter how awful she is she will continue to be just that awful until you get your day in court. That's when all the journaling and documenting and collecting of evidence pays off.

It sounds to me from what you are saying is that there is this one last psych eval hurdle to clear before you really get your day in court. Others have said it is a marathon and not a sprint and they are right about that. I remember when my DH and I were gearing up to finally go to court and then we had to pull the filing because my DH had health issues and was about to have a long recovery process after surgery. I was so angry and exhausted. uBPDm kept the kids for an entire other year because of that. But in that year she really completely imploded and by the time we did actually go to court it was pretty impossible for the judge to leave the kids with her.

Does she still do everything she can to make every single thing as difficult as possible? Absolutely. But with the kids living with us full time and her access so limited her ability to cause problems is miniscule compared to what it was like when she had custody.

[ForeverDad]

Court are used to presuming the separation/divorce emotions and conflicts will fade once the parents get back to their daily lives.  For most families, that is what happens.  The parents who don't fit that pattern are the ones where acting-out PDs are involved.  That dysfunction unhealthily persists.  Sadly, it often takes years before the courts and associated professionals recognize how impactful that continuing entitlement and obstruction is.

I recall in my case that all the professionals, even my excellent custody evaluator, so calmly and matter-of-factly discussed my case like it wouldn't be all that difficult, virtually no big deal.  But it was, it was MY life that was deeply impacted, not to mention the children.

The first go-arounds my lawyer thought a GAL would be a waste of money, then we did get a GAL when I was back seeking custody.  The GAL wanted to do more incremental improvements, granting me sole legal custody but keeping equal parenting time schedule so Ex could have child support and hopefully behave better.  You can guess what happened, Ex's entitlement remained the same.  Next time in court the GAL did see the problem more clearly and supported me getting majority time but the court ordered it only during the school year, summers remained equal time.  Finally, now with son approaching his teen years, I had a workable order.  What made the difference?  Was it son being older?  me with majority time?  her without child support?  her getting castigated (finally) in the latest order?  a combination?

My commendation to you, justaboutdone, is that you have stood up for yourself and your children for so long.  It has made a real difference.  If you had rolled over years ago imagine how much worse it would have been for you as a sidelined father and for the children even more stuck than they are now.  Here you are now, perhaps on the verge of finally getting in depth review of the parenting situation.  Hopefully this custody evaluation report will improve things going forward with the worst behind you.

Since it seems you do have the favorable attention of the GAL and hopefully the CE, I would recommend that you focus on ensuring the professionals (GAL, Custody Evaluator, court, etc) don't just improve your current order but also give deep thought on how to handle long term Ex's sense of entitlement, control, obstruction and especially alienation of the children.  The reality is that if her obstructive behaviors aren't addressed there's high risk you'll continue returning to court.  Do the professionals see that as one of the hurdles to address?

For example, are the children in meaningful counseling?  Do they take advantage of the services available at school such as the school counselor?  Is it practical for you and the children to participate in an intensive period of reintegrate your relationships?  Richard Warshak has a program Family Bridges.  Sanemom reports her DH and SD just participated in a similar program/retreat in their local area and it did help.

[livednlearned]

It's rough, I think many here have felt the way you feel.

I am no longer in the degree of exhaustion and frustration you're in. I do remember it. I felt the same way. Mine was bad enough that the judge issued a (useless) gatekeeping order, intended to prevent my (former trial lawyer) ex from filing frivolous motions.

She has brainwashed the kids to hate me so much and they will defend her abusive behavior toward me and won't even consider the reality of her words. 

This is actually separate from what's going on with court, although obviously related. Court is the battle for their physical selves, and there is a separate battle for their hearts and minds.

How old are your kids?

[ForeverDad]

She has brainwashed the kids to hate me so much and they will defend her abusive behavior toward me and won't even consider the reality of her words.  They act exactly like her and it makes me very sad to see what the kids have become because of this ridiculous court system!

As I recall the twins should be in elementary school, grade 2 or maybe 3.  It is totally unnatural for children of that age to reject a parent, perhaps barring abuse.  So the possibility of alienation ought to be high on the list of the professionals to investigate and handle.

That they act just like her are probably the fleas (behaviors and responses) they've picked up from exposure to her example and indoctrination.  So their current actions certainly do not mean they're Borderline or have other acting out PDs.  Given proper guidance and resources — and time — there's hope for them to counterbalance their mother's negative, invalidating and overwhelming behaviors.

They're still young, they can't think in the depths of thought and insight as an adult or even an older youth can.  Yet, with you providing validation of proper perspectives and mindsets, they can, over time, gradually grasp the logic and positives of what you instruct them. It won't be easy, but hopefully the legal system will provide the tools (counseling, etc) and orders (firmly establishing your parenting boundaries) to assist you even though it didn't before.  One challenge you will have is to help train the children to ponder situations and scenarios, formulate their own conclusions and to stick to them.  Their mother is training them to echo her biased version of reality, in other words, being like leaves blown about by the wind, her ever-changing wind.  She wants minions, she's more concerned about her self and her control rather than their long term welfare.  They''l be adults in a dozen years, you want to do your best now in their formative years so they'll be confident and caring adults, not emotionally crippled.

As lousy as the court system is, it is still better than dealing directly with the Ex without any legal support.  When speaking with the professionals, focus on what the system can do going forward, for the children and also you as parent, and not so much on their past failures and lapses.  You don't want to appear stuck in the past or a complainer, be the parent proposing solutions and strategies.

[justaboutdone]

My DH used to get so angry because day after day his ex would obstruct his access, lie, manipulate the kids, no care for the kids properly, and just generally make everything as difficult as humanly possible.

Does she still do everything she can to make every single thing as difficult as possible? Absolutely. But with the kids living with us full time and her access so limited her ability to cause problems is miniscule compared to what it was like when she had custody.

Never in my life have I met someone as angry as her.  Nothing even close!  It is ALL the time.  She does everything you mentioned above and it is exhausting.  That is my only hope is to have the kids full time and limit her time.  I just cannot see any kind of 50/50 split time working at all.  Thank you for your post.

[justaboutdone]

Since it seems you do have the favorable attention of the GAL and hopefully the CE, I would recommend that you focus on ensuring the professionals (GAL, Custody Evaluator, court, etc) don't just improve your current order but also give deep thought on how to handle long term Ex's sense of entitlement, control, obstruction and especially alienation of the children.  The reality is that if her obstructive behaviors aren't addressed there's high risk you'll continue returning to court.  Do the professionals see that as one of the hurdles to address?

For example, are the children in meaningful counseling?  Do they take advantage of the services available at school such as the school counselor? 

Thank you for the post as always!  Correct, they are in 3rd grade.  The GAL and my lawyer both agree that she will keep bringing this back to court.  They are confident that even if I do get custody, then she will bring this back to court.  They don't know how to deal with her.  That has been repeatedly stated by the GAL.  They also feel that even if I have custody, that we will continue to have the same problems because she will still be involved.   The only light that the GAL can see in mom is the very strong attachment that my daughter has to her.  I would agree with that!  I can't count the number of times my daughter yelled at me because of the way I am treating mom.  I told the GAL that I don't know if it is a healthy attachment or unhealthy.  Shortly afterward in our discussion is when the GAL came to the conclusion to request a psyche evaluation.

[justaboutdone]

She has brainwashed the kids to hate me so much and they will defend her abusive behavior toward me and won't even consider the reality of her words.  They act exactly like her and it makes me very sad to see what the kids have become because of this ridiculous court system!

Their mother is training them to echo her biased version of reality, in other words, being like leaves blown about by the wind, her ever-changing wind.  She wants minions, she's more concerned about her self and her control rather than their long term welfare.  They''l be adults in a dozen years, you want to do your best now in their formative years so they'll be confident and caring adults, not emotionally crippled.

As lousy as the court system is, it is still better than dealing directly with the Ex without any legal support.  When speaking with the professionals, focus on what the system can do going forward, for the children and also you as parent, and not so much on their past failures and lapses.  You don't want to appear stuck in the past or a complainer, be the parent proposing solutions and strategies.

All excellent advice, thank you!  You nailed it about the minions and more concerned about herself and her control.  I appreciate everyone's advice and it helps a lot to get the support from people who have been there.  But I am exhausted!  As I have told my lawyer, therapist, GAL is that if you were in my shoes and you witnessed her behavior, you would say she is crazy and would be fighting just as hard as I am to seek custody. They agree with that thought but I my journaling and evidence still don't even hold a candle to her actual behavior.

[HopefulDad]

Kids become adults.  As adults they will rewind their childhood and revisit it through the lense of adulthood.  Sure, that lense may be cloudy from the parental alienation they were subjected to, but they will also look at objective actions on your part.  Was dad there for me?  Did dad even try to be there for me?  If you create a void in their life by not being present, they will fill that void with the worst intentions on your part thanks to the PA they were subjected to.

Don't be remembered as the dad who quit on his kids.

[catclaw]

I feel you. I'm at the same point right now. Since BPDm's latest weird ideas and all of a sudden mobilizing all of her forces to prevent SS from getting a therapy that involves me and her new bf while we can't do anything to protect SS and offer him the help he desperately needs, I'm just freaking exhausted. I lost weight, I don't sleep well and I feel helpless all through the day. DH is about the same mess right now. SS has panic attacks, hardly ever sleeps thorugh a whole night and cries often without any apparent reason.

Our problems in short:
1. We've worked forward to SS getting help since he lives with us which is 2 years. Everybody seemed to be in the boat and we filled all kinds of forms and kept BPDm informed about the procedure. When in the latest (medical) evaluation she read that I and her new bf would be involved into the therapy, she suddenly made all kinds of appointments (after 2 years of not giving a single F** and played the victim - with the effect that suddenly the problem is not SS' biography or his development or even how he suffers, but the problem is DH NOT TALKING PROPERLY TO BPDM IN A WAY THAT PLEASES HER! So, no, all the effort was in vain because BPDm said "no" without giving further reasoning. The ball is in our field again, DH and BPDm are advised to go to freaking COUPLE COUNSELING (following BPDm's wish). Guess who's to pay for it.

2. We have documentation over documentation. We have a file that is about 200 pages thick - phone protocols, E-mails, printed text messages, letters from lawyers, judges, CPS, everything. Guess what? As soon as BPDm is in the room, we "need to let the past rest and look forward". Great. It's not like SS has moved 8 times in 6 years before getting to live with us, was put in foster care for no apparent reason (with out even notifying DH) and all of this may or may not have had an impact on SS. This is not even a possibility to be considered. I feel like no one will ever be going to read it.

3. We will need a good lawyer. We will need a very good lawyer who is trained in dealing with pwBPD. Since we don't receive any child support and work full time to cover our and SS' expenses, we are not quite sure how to handle all of this financially. Neither of us can work more hours because SS needs one of us at home.

We are planning on getting a lawyer and demand an evaluation of BPDm's ability to parent. But since being in court will have such a heavy impact on SS' loyalty conflict and his mental well-being, we want him in therapy first, which is not possible because of BPDm.

I don't know. I 100% feel like giving up, but I just can't because it isn't the right thing to do.

[ForeverDad]

My lawyer always told me that courts love counseling.  I hope that's true with your court too.  If dad wants counseling for the children and mom doesn't, I can't imagine court not ordering counseling.  Dad should of course think ahead and know that mom will try to sabotage any ordered counseling.  She'll want to take over counseling and squeeze out dad.  She'll want to choose the counselor.  She'll make so many claims about dad that counselor could be overwhelmed thinking, "Surely if there's this much smoke, there must be a fire in there somewhere."

So dad will have to make sure certain things happen... .That court orders counseling for children promptly without waiting for the rest of the case to proceed to wherever it goes.  Dad should offer up a short list of excellent counselors so ex must choose from among that list and not pick her own gullible counselor.  Court order should state that dad is involved in counseling at least as much as mother to avoid him being shut out.  Mom cannot 'fire' the counselor without dad's consent or return to court for adjudication.

[Duck_Borders]

I feel the same way every day... .  I have 100% temporary custody because after all of her BS accusations and misbehaviours my uBPDx showed up to court high on Xanax.  I spent the last 2 years quietly waiting for my day in court and when it finally came, she did all the work for me.  She was high (obviously not a good start), she wouldn't stop talking (the G.M. literally read her her miranda rights), and she waived around and forced her lawyer to present affidavits that everyone knew were BS because the facts said otherwise.  I didn't even need a lawyer, uBPDx did all the work for me.

Now even with 100% custody, she attacks and accuses me every day.  She makes everything difficult and miserable.  She just showed up to her weekly 1 hour supervised visitation a half hour late and somehow it was my fault.  We have an order to record calls, so I record every call, and keep a spreadsheet documenting everything.  It's a huge amount of work, but it's starting to pay off big time.  Now I have stats to present (example:  Mom insults Dad on her FaceTime calls with 2S on 43% of calls).  Everyone is so tired of her, even the GAL has blocked her number... . 

If you're at the beginning of this, I would say either get ready for 3 years of misery with this pathetic excuse for a court system or the alternative... .   (I personally thought many times about changing my name and/or moving to a new country to evade the feminazi child support enforcement agencies), problem is if you run, they will find you.  And then you're really ducked.

Listen to ForeverDad... .this guy knows his ish.