Complicated step-family

[Depression = 72% of members]

Happy almost-New Year! I'm not sure of how to word a smooth intro here, so I guess I'll just start typing and hope it makes sense.  My daughter's grandmother lives with BPD, and has recently smashed a serious boundary. I now have to figure out what to do next, and I'm hoping I can get some empathetic insight and advice. Some quick background. I grew up in a religious cult. My dad died when I was a teen, and my mom moved us away. I started college at 19, completely sheltered, terrified of everything, and far, far younger than my years. My second year I met and fell madly in love with ':)'. He was in a mutually toxic relationship (and you can probably already see where this is going), but put the moves on me constantly. I was flattered, frightened, and ashamed, and told no one. I told him no more times than I can count, even once in writing, but he persisted until I finally stopped saying no. I ended up pregnant, jobless, just out of college, with no car, no savings, no work history. He spent months promising to break up with hs girlfriend and legitimize our relationship, until he ended the game via the worst phone call of my life. This is where his parents come in. He told them I was pregnant, and these two women who had met me twice, dropped their lives to make sure I was okay. They drove hours to be with me for doctor's appointments; made sure I had everything I needed for the upcoming baby; fielded endless fear and pain and shame; and were all the emotional support I needed when my own family didn't know how to help. I was in such an incredibly dark place that I likely owe them my life. After my daughter was born, they invited me to visit them (they lived out-of-state). I found a job while there which sparked a career and ultimately turned a visit into a permanent move. This was all nearly seven years ago. This whole time they have been incredibly loving and supportive in every way they could, while their son has been completely out of contact with me the entire time. I should specify here - the lack of contact is at my insistence. Once I became pregnant, D. turned emotionally abusive. I cut him off when the baby was about two months old, because I couldn't bear the pain any more. It doesn't make me happy, it never did, but it was the difference between life and death. His parents have always understood and supported that decision. We've cried about it together. I could go on ENDLESSLY about how many times they have been the support I needed, and how grateful I am. I call them my step-in-laws, because they stepped in when D. stepped out.
However, L., D,'s bio mom, has BPD. One of the manifestations has been her lashing out at me whenever I try to make myself less dependent on them. For example, she was upset that I got an apartment and moved out of the spare room in their rental. She screamed at me more than once; tried to buy a piano and put it in my new apartment without my consent; brought her rescue dogs over and let them urinate and defecate all over the carpet on a daily basis, and when I tried to ask her to stop that, she accused me of being a horrible person who was going to ruin my daughter's life through my obsessive cleanliness (this sounds like satire when typed out, but I assure you it's not). Anyways, there have been blowups like this on a semi-regular basis, but her wife, M., always played mediator. L. has never apologised for anything she has said or done during her blowups. The one time I asked for an apology, she screamed 'screw you' in my face. The one time I tried to apologise for upsetting her, she (verbally) attacked me so mercilessly I've never attempted to smooth over ruffled feath'ers again. When blowups happen, M. will make nice, and we all try to pretend nothing ever happened. There have been so many times I've needed to say 'L., no, I won't do this,' or 'You can't behave that way around my daughter,' but I have had absolutely no backup, and I'm not strong enough to take her on alone. She is MEAN when upset.
Almost two years ago I met a wonderful, wonderful man. We moved in together this spring. He has strong feelings about emotionally abusive people, having cut off ties with his own abusive father. After comforting me multiple times while I've been in tears over the latest incident, he HATES L. and M. and cannot fathom why I don't share that feeling. He gets very upset if I have anything to do with them, and so, I've very nearly ghosted them. I have no idea how to say 'I love you anyway, but my new partner, who cannot understand what we've been through, absolutely hates you, and I understand why he feels that way.'
Anyway, this summer, I found out that L. had asked D. to buy dance clothes for my daughter, and had told her who they were from. When I confronted them, L. refused to see me. M. at first denied it, then finally admitted that yes, both those things had really happened, but it had absolutely nothing to do with me OR my daughter, and I had no business interfering in L. and D.'s relationship.  I responded by setting boundaries - no presents from D (which had not ever been a question for the past six years); no overnight Camp Grandma stays and no more out-of-state vacations without me. They still get her at least twice a week, and no in-state, daytime fun was curtailed.  M. called me cruel and threw in my face everything they had done for me in the past.
Well, for six months, L. has refused to see or speak to me. Then, when we all went out to dinner after my daughter's latest recital, she blew up on me when my partner left the room to pay the bill. Accusing me of hating her, reiterating all she'd done for me, accusing me of things I never said, stating that the only thing she'd done was make one slip of the tongue. M. dragged her away as she spat over her shoulder that I am throwing them aside now that I am with my partner, and that I can only ever think about myself. I haven't spoken to either of them since, because I don't know what to say.
I don't hate them. But the dance clothes thing was a huge violation, and their refusal to admit it is an even bigger problem for me. Something needs to happen; the air needs to be cleared. But I don't know what to do.

[AnxiousCucumber]

Happy almost-New Year! I'm not sure of how to word a smooth intro here, so I guess I'll just start typing and hope it makes sense.  My daughter's grandmother lives with BPD, and has recently smashed a serious boundary. I now have to figure out what to do next, and I'm hoping I can get some empathetic insight and advice. Some quick background. I grew up in a religious cult. My dad died when I was a teen, and my mom moved us away. I started college at 19, completely sheltered, terrified of everything, and far, far younger than my years. My second year I met and fell madly in love with ':)'. He was in a mutually toxic relationship (and you can probably already see where this is going), but put the moves on me constantly. I was flattered, frightened, and ashamed, and told no one. I told him no more times than I can count, even once in writing, but he persisted until I finally stopped saying no. I ended up pregnant, jobless, just out of college, with no car, no savings, no work history. He spent months promising to break up with hs girlfriend and legitimize our relationship, until he ended the game via the worst phone call of my life. This is where his parents come in. He told them I was pregnant, and these two women who had met me twice, dropped their lives to make sure I was okay. They drove hours to be with me for doctor's appointments; made sure I had everything I needed for the upcoming baby; fielded endless fear and pain and shame; and were all the emotional support I needed when my own family didn't know how to help. I was in such an incredibly dark place that I likely owe them my life. After my daughter was born, they invited me to visit them (they lived out-of-state). I found a job while there which sparked a career and ultimately turned a visit into a permanent move. This was all nearly seven years ago. This whole time they have been incredibly loving and supportive in every way they could, while their son has been completely out of contact with me the entire time. I should specify here - the lack of contact is at my insistence. Once I became pregnant, D. turned emotionally abusive. I cut him off when the baby was about two months old, because I couldn't bear the pain any more. It doesn't make me happy, it never did, but it was the difference between life and death. His parents have always understood and supported that decision. We've cried about it together. I could go on ENDLESSLY about how many times they have been the support I needed, and how grateful I am. I call them my step-in-laws, because they stepped in when D. stepped out.
However, L., D,'s bio mom, has BPD. One of the manifestations has been her lashing out at me whenever I try to make myself less dependent on them. For example, she was upset that I got an apartment and moved out of the spare room in their rental. She screamed at me more than once; tried to buy a piano and put it in my new apartment without my consent; brought her rescue dogs over and let them urinate and defecate all over the carpet on a daily basis, and when I tried to ask her to stop that, she accused me of being a horrible person who was going to ruin my daughter's life through my obsessive cleanliness (this sounds like satire when typed out, but I assure you it's not). Anyways, there have been blowups like this on a semi-regular basis, but her wife, M., always played mediator. L. has never apologised for anything she has said or done during her blowups. The one time I asked for an apology, she screamed 'screw you' in my face. The one time I tried to apologise for upsetting her, she (verbally) attacked me so mercilessly I've never attempted to smooth over ruffled feath'ers again. When blowups happen, M. will make nice, and we all try to pretend nothing ever happened. There have been so many times I've needed to say 'L., no, I won't do this,' or 'You can't behave that way around my daughter,' but I have had absolutely no backup, and I'm not strong enough to take her on alone. She is MEAN when upset.
Almost two years ago I met a wonderful, wonderful man. We moved in together this spring. He has strong feelings about emotionally abusive people, having cut off ties with his own abusive father. After comforting me multiple times while I've been in tears over the latest incident, he HATES L. and M. and cannot fathom why I don't share that feeling. He gets very upset if I have anything to do with them, and so, I've very nearly ghosted them. I have no idea how to say 'I love you anyway, but my new partner, who cannot understand what we've been through, absolutely hates you, and I understand why he feels that way.'
Anyway, this summer, I found out that L. had asked D. to buy dance clothes for my daughter, and had told her who they were from. When I confronted them, L. refused to see me. M. at first denied it, then finally admitted that yes, both those things had really happened, but it had absolutely nothing to do with me OR my daughter, and I had no business interfering in L. and D.'s relationship.  I responded by setting boundaries - no presents from D (which had not ever been a question for the past six years); no overnight Camp Grandma stays and no more out-of-state vacations without me. They still get her at least twice a week, and no in-state, daytime fun was curtailed.  M. called me cruel and threw in my face everything they had done for me in the past.
Well, for six months, L. has refused to see or speak to me. Then, when we all went out to dinner after my daughter's latest recital, she blew up on me when my partner left the room to pay the bill. Accusing me of hating her, reiterating all she'd done for me, accusing me of things I never said, stating that the only thing she'd done was make one slip of the tongue. M. dragged her away as she spat over her shoulder that I am throwing them aside now that I am with my partner, and that I can only ever think about myself. I haven't spoken to either of them since, because I don't know what to say.
I don't hate them. But the dance clothes thing was a huge violation, and their refusal to admit it is an even bigger problem for me. Something needs to happen; the air needs to be cleared. But I don't know what to do.

[Turkish]

Even if you hadn't grown up in a cult,  what you describe is complicated to say the least. Given the cult background and D, it's understandable keeping the r/s with your daughters grandmothers.

First,  I'd say that communicating how your beau feels about them wouldn't help.  Second, how you feel about them is none of his business.  However, given your relationship with all of them,  it's understandable that he's frustrated.

Here's the thing: it's not your job to "rescue" any of them except your daughter.  How is she dealing with this?

[Kwamina]

Hi AnxiousCucumber

Welcome to our online community  You've had a difficult history growing up in a cult, losing your dad and then in essence losing the father of your child. Her grandparents have played a crucial role in your life in helping you get through a difficult period, unfortunately the BPD of one of them is making it hard to have a (pleasant) relationship with them now.

Second, how you feel about them is none of his business.  However, given your relationship with all of them,  it's understandable that he's frustrated.

I totally agree with what Turkish says here.

He has strong feelings about emotionally abusive people, having cut off ties with his own abusive father. After comforting me multiple times while I've been in tears over the latest incident, he HATES L. and M. and cannot fathom why I don't share that feeling. He gets very upset if I have anything to do with them, and so, I've very nearly ghosted them. I have no idea how to say 'I love you anyway, but my new partner, who cannot understand what we've been through, absolutely hates you, and I understand why he feels that way.'

Your boyfriend is entitled to his feelings and so are you. You are two separate people and even if he does not understand why you feel a certain way, this does not make your feelings any less valid than his. Going NC is a highly personal decision. He undoubtedly had reasons he deemed very valid for cutting ties with his own abusive father, which I can understand since being subjected to abuse is very unpleasant. Yet every person and every situation is different. Regardless of how you move forward with the grandparents, I think the crucial thing will be for you to have solid boundaries and also be able and willing to enforce/defend those boundaries. Do you generally feel comfortable setting and enforcing/defending boundaries with people?

I don't hate them. But the dance clothes thing was a huge violation, and their refusal to admit it is an even bigger problem for me. Something needs to happen; the air needs to be cleared. But I don't know what to do.

What might help here are two structured forms of communication described on this site:

S.E.T. (Support, Empathy, Truth)

D.E.A.R.M.A.N. (Describe, Express, Assert, Reinforce, Stay Mindful, Appaer Confident, Negotiate)

Have you perhaps heard of these techniques before? They can help you speak your truth and assert yourself in a manner that reduces the likelihood of (further) conflict while maximizing the likelihood of getting through to the other person.

Take care

The Board Parrot

[AnxiousCucumber]

Thanks for the reminder that my daughter's well-being is my priority. My initial reactions to things tend to be framed in the light of 'what is least likely to set L off?'

And no, thanks to my upbringing in the cult, I have absolutely no practice in boundary-setting or conflict management skills. My beau is helping immensely, because he is the first person I've ever had in my life with whom I know I will be well-received if I bring up a touchy subject.

There is a conversation pending with both L and M. At the moment, I've planned it out something like this: 1. Reassure them that I don't hate them, and have not at all forgotten everything they've done for me. However... .
2. Involving D in my daughter's life without my knowledge or consent is absolutely not okay, and their unwillingness to acknowledge this makes the problem even worse.
I'm really not sure what will happen after that. My experience with L indicates that she would rather burn down the world than apologise.

At some point, I feel that L does need to apologise to my daughter for upsetting her and turning her happy evening into a very unhappy one.

Also, I worry that they will bring up how little time I spend with them now, compared to before Beau and I got together. Do I tell a partial truth, and say that learning to live together, while wonderful, is taking all my time and energy right now (because it is - this is a first for us both), and I'm sorry they've felt ignored? I agree that saying 'Yo, my new man hates you' is wildly unhelpful, but I cannot lie, and half-truths make me very uncomfortable.

[Kwamina]

Hi AnxiousCucumber

It's been a while, how are things now?

Were you able to have that conversation with L and M?

The Board Parrot