My ex and I are talking again

[CryWolf]

I am staying busy though so I’m not prone to blowing her up and pressuring her. At least the past two days, I’ve got conversation out of her, which tells me she may be opening back up after that rocky conversation we had a couple nights ago.

This is the best tool to follow with any relationship. How are you staying busy? I know how bad you want to start a conversation, and feel the urgency to act and soothe your anxiety. But most of the time, giving someone room and space are works for the long term goal.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[whiteknight4152]

Yesterday I sent her a link on Facebook of an upcoming concert of an artist we both enjoy. She replied “sweeeeet”. I followed up with, we’ll have to try and see so and so as well!” After about an hour she replied, “why do you automatically think we are going to do all this shi*?

Caught off guard, I replied, “thought it’d be would be fun, but whatever.”

I checked last night, and she unfriended me on Facebook, not blocked. But kept me on everything else. Which doesn’t make any sense. I didn’t do anything to warrant that. I even sent her a picture through text last night I knew she’d enjoy and she hearted it. I have no idea why she would take me off Facebook though. It seems like I’m messing everything up so quickly, when that is not the outcome that I desire.

[once removed]

It seems like I’m messing everything up so quickly, when that is not the outcome that I desire.

before we can improve things, we have to identify those things that we are contributing that arent helping matters, or are making them worse.

youve identified those things. what do you think spurs you to keep doing them?

[whiteknight4152]

before we can improve things, we have to identify those things that we are contributing that arent helping matters, or are making them worse.

youve identified those things. what do you think spurs you to keep doing them?

Seeing her post and talk to other people that aren’t me. The flowers were delivered yesterday, she hasn’t said anything. I feel like I’m losing her. I have a feeling she’s talking to someone else... .she went from taking to me everyday all day on every platform, to not talking to me at all. I don’t know what to do... .I just want to win her back.

[once removed]

chasing and over pursuing are your worst enemy here.

things are reaching a breaking point whiteknight4152. she sounds deeply frustrated and resentful, at her wits end. you can respond to that with desperate moves and continue the path youve been on, and things will likely continue to go south until they reach their breaking point.

or you can switch gears and try another path. it will require a radically different approach and mindset, backing off big time, giving her a ton of space, and a real commitment to that path.

[whiteknight4152]

chasing and over pursuing are your worst enemy here.

things are reaching a breaking point whiteknight4152. she sounds deeply frustrated and resentful, at her wits end. you can respond to that with desperate moves and continue the path youve been on, and things will likely continue to go south until they reach their breaking point.

or you can switch gears and try another path. it will require a radically different approach and mindset, backing off big time, giving her a ton of space, and a real commitment to that path.

I want to switch gears. I want to be attractive, independent and confident towards her. I’m just afraid backing off big time, she’ll forget about me... .

[once removed]

I’m just afraid backing off big time, she’ll forget about me... .

the moves you are making (have been making) are pushing her to increasingly distance herself from you.

thats whats happening here and now.

a lot of guys do this. youre not the first. what they often fail to realize is that clingyness and neediness and desperation arent a strategy for winning someone back, they are a guaranteed strategy to push someone away.

a lot of things can happen with this strategy. at first its just off putting and unattractive. when it escalates, it feels (and becomes) disrespectful, smothering, desperate, even threatening. the natural response to that is to distance oneself. when it continues to escalate, and a person feels increasingly cornered, they will lash out, and often the next step is to completely cut off communication.

thats where youre headed. thats whats happening here and now.

members have been telling you this for a while, whiteknight. go back and read your old threads. at a certain point, something clicks, and we start to switch gears, or we continue doing what we have been doing. if youre going to continue that path, then really all we can do is be here to give you a hug when things come to their natural conclusion.

this is a key part of our article on what it takes to make it in these relationships:

Strength: It takes a great deal of strength and emotional stability to be in a BP relationship and not be emotionally injured by it.  A person in a weak emotional state, who feels wounded/abused, or depressed is likely to be consumed by the relationship, confused by the intense rages and idealization, and finding their self worth in decline.  If you chose this path, you've got to be very strong and very balanced.

im not encouraging you to leave the relationship, but its worth considering that it would be healthier and more respectful to both you and her to cut your losses and let her go than to continue chasing and over pursuing someone who is lashing out for space.

[whiteknight4152]

the moves you are making (have been making) are pushing her to increasingly distance herself from you.

thats whats happening here and now.

a lot of guys do this. youre not the first. what they often fail to realize is that clingyness and neediness and desperation arent a strategy for winning someone back, they are a guaranteed strategy to push someone away.

a lot of things can happen with this strategy. at first its just off putting and unattractive. when it escalates, it feels (and becomes) disrespectful, smothering, desperate, even threatening. the natural response to that is to distance oneself. when it continues to escalate, and a person feels increasingly cornered, they will lash out, and often the next step is to completely cut off communication.

thats where youre headed. thats whats happening here and now.

members have been telling you this for a while, whiteknight. go back and read your old threads. at a certain point, something clicks, and we start to switch gears, or we continue doing what we have been doing. if youre going to continue that path, then really all we can do is be here to give you a hug when things come to their natural conclusion.

this is a key part of our article on what it takes to make it in these relationships:
im not encouraging you to leave the relationship, but its worth considering that it would be healthier and more respectful to both you and her to cut your losses and let her go than to continue chasing and over pursuing someone who is lashing out for space.

I’ve thought about it long and hard. I am not giving up. She’s the one. I’ll stay strong. I sent her a few pics of crystals I bought today and she replied “that’s beautiful” but other than that, I haven’t responded.
I’m just so confused why she hasn’t brought up the Facebook thing? She still hasn’t added me back, but still has me on everything else. I was talking to her friend last night and told her and she said”hm? Idk just give her a bit. I know you have.”

[whiteknight4152]

I haven’t heard from her in a few days. Still nothing new on the plant o had delivered to her. I’m trying  I stay focused with work while I’m away from her. I’ll be home next Wednesday, hopefully things can resolve when I’m able to see her. I haven’t made any contact to her in two days. Hopefully she sees me respecting her boundaries and reaches out Soon

[once removed]

its good to give her space.

i think this is a much bigger picture thing than just not talking to her for a few days.

Hopefully she sees me respecting her boundaries and reaches out Soon

when she learns, through repeated words and actions (or lack of actions) that you respect her boundaries, and sees a long term change in approach i think you will better connect.

if she reaches out, and you over pursue, it will tell her its best not to reach out.

[whiteknight4152]

its good to give her space.

i think this is a much bigger picture thing than just not talking to her for a few days.

when she learns, through repeated words and actions (or lack of actions) that you respect her boundaries, and sees a long term change in approach i think you will better connect.

if she reaches out, and you over pursue, it will tell her its best not to reach out.

Update... .so yesterday I talked to her best friend on the phone for a good while. She has also been cut out by her. As well as others. Her friend asked her if she needed her to come help at work on Tuesday, and she said no she was going to “meet this guy on Tuesday”... .
She has since unfollowed me on Instagram. When I noticed, I went to our messages and accidentally sent a heart emoji that is in the Instagram Dm’s, and she immediately took me off her account. I talked to her friend and she said she didn’t know anything about this “guy” or if it’s anything serious since she won’t talk to her. We both agreed that the best thing for our relationship is to not talk to her until I get home and can sit down with her, if she lets me. Apparently, she has been tearing everyone up. She made her sister cry when she came to visit because she was tearing her up about why she didn’t like her boyfriend. We genuinely think that she thinks she’s doing good by being so mean and harsh to people. We agreed that she doesn’t see cause and effects, she just sees reactions and runs with those. We’ve all tried to help her, but she doesn’t want to help herself. She told me I’m the best partner my girlfriend ever had, and she may not think she deserves it, or that something will fault because of her past. It’s all about trust and control. If anyone should be concerned about trust, it should be ME. And I forgave her. She messaged me while I was talking to her friend on the phone last night “your shoes are in. I’m not sure how to get them to you” I said, “may I call you”. She said “sure” so I called, I said hey, she said hey. And I said what’re you up to, and she said work. I said okay well I don’t want to interrupt you at work, and she’s like what do you need. And I said nothing I just haven’t talked to you hardly since i left, she said ok well I’ll call you later. And hung up. I texted her later on “call?” Because I knew I wouldn’t be able to hear her later that night if she called because I’m working so I wanted to make sure to talk to her before she fell asleep. She didn’t answer. So I just texted her “check out the moon before bed if you get the chance. Sweet dreams.” And she read it this morning. I can’t fix this 900 miles away from her. It can’t be done over the phone. It’s also not going to fix or heal, because it’s almost like she likes being miserable. She says she wants to be alone, but then goes on a date with a guy while I’m gone.  She can’t say no to others. Her friend says I know how mean she is to you. And how much you treat her like a queen anyways. But she doesn’t know how to react to good, because she’s only ever been used for her looks or money and exposed to bad relationships. But at some point, she’ll have to realize that you must trust and be vulnerable to grow. That’s just like saying I got sunburnt yesterday, I’m never going outside again. I asked her friend why she would’ve said “I’m not sure how to get them to you (limited edition shoes). She said, she probably knows you’ll think about it. And that’s why she did it. She probably is doing all of this to get a reaction out of you so she has a reason to let you go. Because right not, she has no reason for cutting any of us out or treating us bad. I showed her messages between us and she’s like everything you’re saying is so sweet, not pressuring, not smothering, but she wraps it to make you out to be the bad guy. I told her that she told me that I make her angry and give her anxiety from what I did in the past, and her friend was like you didn’t do anyThing though? She told me everything and you haven’t done anything except not stop loving her. Please, if any of you out there read this, I need help. Advice. I will not give up on this woman. She is my equal and is the love of my life. I know I have the opportunity to walk, everyone is telling me to do so. I will not. I will take care of her and love her to my last breath. If there is anything I can do to make this situation right, to get it through to her, that she needs help, that she can trust me, that she can open up and love me again, please let me know. Thank you.

[once removed]

Please, if any of you out there read this, I need help. Advice.

lets try this:

reread this thread in entirety. take a look at the advice and observations members have given you.

can you summarize the advice youve gotten through out this process?

[whiteknight4152]

Give her space and time to grieve and heal. Don’t pressure. Don’t pressure harder when she shuts me out. I just don’t understand anymore. I’m at a loss here on what to do. Feels like I’m losing her 900 miles away. I just want things to heal with us.

[whiteknight4152]

I wrote this. Wanted to send it to her and then not pursue anymore till I get the chance to see her when I’m home.

Sometimes in life we come across the wrong people. However, once in a while the right ones come along and will never leave. I will always celebrate your brightest days, and comfort you in your darkest nights. Every night has a day. All scars can be healed. I’ll boost your dreams, challenge you, and will always believe in you. Take a breath and concentrate where you are today. Recognize your flaws, but choose to love yourself anyways. At times, you may only see your thorns, but you are undoubtedly a rose. Do not settle for stars when you deserve the galaxy. Remember, all good things take time.

[once removed]

I’m at a loss here on what to do.

so this is the advice youve received as you see it:

Give her space and time to grieve and heal. Don’t pressure. Don’t pressure harder when she shuts me out.

and your plan is to write her a heavy love letter and then try to get her to see you?

do you see where that approach is at odds with the advice?

[whiteknight4152]

so this is the advice youve received as you see it:

and your plan is to write her a heavy love letter and then try to get her to see you?

do you see where that approach is at odds with the advice?

Yes... .but I feel like if I don’t keep in contact she’ll go to someone else. Which, looks like she already did when I left for Wyoming. I get back Wednesday, hopefully she lets me see her. I still am racking my brain why she said “Your shoes came in. Im not sure how to get them to you”

Why would she say this? She obviously knows I’m going to be back soon(she doesn’t know when cause she hasn’t spoken to me). Did she say that just to make me think and play mind games? That’s what her best friend said would be the only explanation for her saying that. Her sister also messaged me and we asked how each other were. I said honestly things have been hard between me and her since I left for work. But I’ll be back Wednesday. And she said,  It's probably not what you want to hear, but I don't know if it's very fair to you to wait for my sister. It's easy for her to move forward and not really linger with someone”.

[once removed]

Yes... .but I feel like if I don’t keep in contact she’ll go to someone else.

and how do you think she will react to more pressure and chasing?

whiteknight, she really wants to be left alone. i think her sister is trying to get that across. can you see how youre disrespecting that? put yourself in her shoes and ask yourself how you might react if someone you wanted distance from kept pushing.

[whiteknight4152]

and how do you think she will react to more pressure and chasing?

whiteknight, she really wants to be left alone. i think her sister is trying to get that across. can you see how youre disrespecting that? put yourself in her shoes and ask yourself how you might react if someone you wanted distance from kept pushing.

Yes... .her sister, friends and family see how well I am to her and how much she takes advantage of my love for her and how it’s not fair to me to keep going through it while she’s in a whirlwind. I never meant to disrespect her... but I guess I am unconsciously. You think distance and space is the best scenario for me for the long game? I get home Wednesday, what do I do then? So we have multiple Pinterest boards together, our cooking, our love board, tattoo boards, and her clothes boards. Yesterday I sent her best friend a pic she would like, and she’s like “what the heck hold on” and sent me a screenshot of her sending the same pic to my gf earlier that day, a happy coincidence. I also saved it to my mental health and healing board of ours. Last night at like 2:50, I got a notification she left that board. Just that board. I asked her friend and she’s like “maybe she’s doing little things you’ll notice to say about?” And I said I could totally see, “What sucks is, she could look at that and make a connection between it in her head and shut us both out for it” since I save it to our board, and her friend sent it to her.

[once removed]

“What sucks is, she could look at that and make a connection between it in her head and shut us both out for it”

shes not just saying "give me space". shes screaming it.

youre saying "if i cant get to you ill go to your friends and family and post to you indirectly"

it isnt respectful. its violating her space, big time. as a result, shes blocking you and cutting off every avenue. this isnt going to end well whiteknight. ive seen members wind up with restraining orders for less.

time to switch gears?

[whiteknight4152]

shes not just saying "give me space". shes screaming it.

youre saying "if i cant get to you ill go to your friends and family and post to you indirectly"

it isnt respectful. its violating her space, big time. as a result, shes blocking you and cutting off every avenue. this isnt going to end well whiteknight. ive seen members wind up with restraining orders for less.

time to switch gears?

But me posting the picture in our board and her friend sending it to her was just a happy coincidence. Yes it’s time to switch gears.
What do I do once I get home?

[once removed]

What do I do once I get home?

You do nothing. Give her space. Call an old friend, go out, play pool, shoot hoops, whatever youre into, and you have a good time.

[whiteknight4152]

But don’t we need to hash everything out, and why she went ghost after I left town? Why she took me off of social media when I was giving her space?

[Tomacini]

First of all i know what you are going through, it’s nothing short of hell. The anxiety, the worst case scenarios,... .its all going through your head like a maniac.

I can also relate to your story. My ex and I are also back in contact after she broke up with this other guy. She was emotionally more involved with me so during her relationship with that guy she sought contact with me again, I waited it out and sure enough that relationship ended.

First few weeks she was all over me, then the distancing started again and I can also become pushy and uncertain at times and that’s ok we all have our limits. But everytime I do it, I back off afterwards. Like last Monday, I was too needy and she suggested to take a couple weeks break. I’ve been anxious in the mean time but I leave her be.

I see a pattern with you though: you say you are going to back off and then you make contact. Your words and actions are not aligned.
Have you talked about this with your therapist?
Like Onceremoved said: this is not going to end well.

Just back off, let her come to you. You don’t have to hash anything out. She’s pulling away in every possible way (Facebook, IG, Pinterest) and you take it as a sign that she wants to provoke a reaction?

[whiteknight4152]

First of all i know what you are going through, it’s nothing short of hell. The anxiety, the worst case scenarios,... .its all going through your head like a maniac.

I can also relate to your story. My ex and I are also back in contact after she broke up with this other guy. She was emotionally more involved with me so during her relationship with that guy she sought contact with me again, I waited it out and sure enough that relationship ended.

First few weeks she was all over me, then the distancing started again and I can also become pushy and uncertain at times and that’s ok we all have our limits. But everytime I do it, I back off afterwards. Like last Monday, I was too needy and she suggested to take a couple weeks break. I’ve been anxious in the mean time but I leave her be.

I see a pattern with you though: you say you are going to back off and then you make contact. Your words and actions are not aligned.
Have you talked about this with your therapist?
Like Onceremoved said: this is not going to end well.

Just back off, let her come to you. You don’t have to hash anything out. She’s pulling away in every possible way (Facebook, IG, Pinterest) and you take it as a sign that she wants to provoke a reaction?

But pull away from what warrant? We were fine until I left, then she decided to give me the cold shoulder? I got a text this morning, “you still haven’t told me where I can drop off all your things or whatever” I want to give her that space. But why does she do this thing where she gives me no context or rhyme or reason out of the blue why she’s doing this

[Tomacini]

Don’t try to find logic where there isn’t any.
She has a disorder, you don’t. You react from your point of view which is caring, explaining things, making sure the other feels good... .this is not her frame. Does she do this on purpose? No, she is not a bad person, she has a disorder. It’s the disorder talking, it’s a DISorder, it doesn’t make any sense.

Look, I’m in the same boat as you right now. I have 4 years of experience with a BPD girl and only now and after over 1 year of intensive therapy i’m able to cope with it most of the time. Sometimes not, sometimes i act needy but that’s ok. At least i’m not blowing up her phone or sending her 50 text messages like i used to.
She’s acting distant now, that’s ok. Remember, BPD is all about fear of abandonment AND engulfment. Right now she is engulfed and withdrawing. We as nons are also engulfed from time to time but it is nothing compared to someone with BPD. Engulfment for them ignites old wounds of abuse and control because abuse is the ultimate form of engulfment, you have no control at all. And at this very moment, she associates you with abuse because you are smothering her.

The best way to react to her text? Just tell her where she can drop off your stuff and leave it at that.
If you want ANY chance with this woman, please leave her alone until the engulfment wears off.

[once removed]

The best way to react to her text? Just tell her where she can drop off your stuff and leave it at that.
If you want ANY chance with this woman, please leave her alone until the engulfment wears off.

i would second this advice from Tomacini. along with leaving her alone, this will begin to signal that you accept and respect her need for space and arent going to chase her or make the exchange of belongings difficult.

[whiteknight4152]

i would second this advice from Tomacini. along with leaving her alone, this will begin to signal that you accept and respect her need for space and arent going to chase her or make the exchange of belongings difficult.

As much as it hurts I said, “I’ll let you know when I’m home. You may choose where you want to meet me” she responded “K”

[Tomacini]

It hurts because of the distance you feel which feels as a rejection. But this is what she craves: distance. Try to not take it personal, that’s what my BPD always says to me, easier said than done of course.

Think about this for a while: if you want to continue with this woman, how will you align your need for intimacy with her need for distance? She will always need distance from time to time. We all do but pwBPD are more drastic in demanding and taking it and will lash out if you don’t give it to them.
So this is key: can you live with that? Please be brutally honest with yourself, it takes a strong character to see them distance themselves from you to the point where they completely disappear. They crave it for they feel engulfed.

[whiteknight4152]

It hurts because of the distance you feel which feels as a rejection. But this is what she craves: distance. Try to not take it personal, that’s what my BPD always says to me, easier said than done of course.

Think about this for a while: if you want to continue with this woman, how will you align your need for intimacy with her need for distance? She will always need distance from time to time. We all do but pwBPD are more drastic in demanding and taking it and will lash out if you don’t give it to them.
So this is key: can you live with that? Please be brutally honest with yourself, it takes a strong character to see them distance themselves from you to the point where they completely disappear. They crave it for they feel engulfed.

How do I know that it isn’t rejection? I gave her distance all the time in our relationship and it wasn’t like this. As soon as I left, she dropped me. Her friend told me she went and had lunch with another guy. I’ll giv her all the distance she wants. I can’t keepnitntogther right now because I don’t know for certain if it is distance or rejection. I’m not going to sit here and act like I am strong in this moment, because I’m not. I am 900 miles away from her and she is cutting me off without rhyme or reason. I just broke down in front of my mother, who is telling me she is sick and tired of her doing this to me and tired of the BS. I can be strong enough for it. But she waited till I was gone to do it, after I bent over backwards more than anyone in her life has for her, and this is what I get? I hope this was the best decision for my relationship with her, because to me, those texts make me feel like it’s over for good. But you all have more experience with this, so I trust your judgement. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. Her friend also told me she is bipolar depressive.

[Tomacini]

It’s ok if you’re not strong enough at the moment, we’re not perfect and we all have our limits of what we can take.

In a sense you are right: it’s a form of rejection but it’s only because she needs it. She rejects you to accomplish the distance you won’t give her. I say this based on all your previous posts that showed that you have a hard time giving her space. My BPD once told me that she rejected me because she was hurting and the only way to deal with the hurt was hurting someone else (me). It’s not logical, it’s the disorder.

So you say you give her space but at the same time you keep sending her texts. Do you see that discrepancy?

My advice for now if you want it: leave her, let her come to you. Trust me I know how hard this is but it is the only solution. If you can’t deal with that, speak about it with your therapist. Practice on alleviating that anxiety within you which stems from your own childhood trauma as your therapist will also tell you.