I’m so fed up of turning the other cheek, is there a different option?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello everyone

I think this might be a long post, apologies, and I hope that I can make it reasonably coherent. Not sure where to start, but here goes... .

I feel that in my relationship with my mother, and probably in all my relationships actually, I have got into the habit of turning the other cheek. I have always been very good at making excuses for the behaviour of others: they didn’t mean it, didn’t know any better, it’s just the way that they are, I must have done/said something to make them behave that way, and so to maintain harmony I have always I suppose denied my own feelings. I have come to realise that yes, that makes them feel good, but what about me? Since being here and also through counselling I am learning to be kinder to myself and I am becoming a lot more self aware. I know where I’ve been going wrong, or at least I think I know.

My uBPD son, I’m pretty sure has BPD traits and may even have ptsd too following a very traumatic experience he had a few years ago. He has been NC with me over a year now and just prior to that he told me that he would never stay in my home again. He has always travelled and lived abroad since he finished university and he will soon be 36. Whenever he came back to UK he always stayed with us, but I understood his decision that he didn’t want to stay here again so I suggested he could stay with his grandma (my mother)

So after he went NC with me he started communicating more with my mother, unbeknown to me at that time. Now she knew what I was going through when he went NC with me, she knew how worried I was about him and how devastated I was, and one time last year she asked me if I’d heard from him. I said “No but I hope that he is happy”. She knew that he was happy and that he was ok but couldn’t find it in her heart to let me know that she was in touch with him.

I found out at the end of last year that he was phoning her about every six weeks (he lives in a different country), the reason she told me was because she heard me say something that irritated her and so she decided that she would ‘get her own back’ by letting me know. She promised us that she would let us know in the future when he phoned her, we just wanted to know that he was ok. Well, she’s never said a thing. I know that he could have quite feasibly told her to not discuss him with us, I wouldn’t have a problem with that, but I do have a problem with her not telling us when she speaks to him, especially as she promised that she would.

Ok, if you’re still with me:
Since her promise, and luckily for me, during my counselling sessions, she chose one day to bring me down a peg or two and at the same time get her own back for what she perceived was a slight to her. She has exhibited this type of behaviour numerous times and I have always turned the other cheek, but now, post counselling, I don’t see why I should continue turning the other cheek. So I have cut down my level of contact with her, but why do I feel bad about it? She is 90 years old, is fit and in good health, predicted to live to 100+. I know that the reduction in my contact with her won’t bother her in the slightest, she will probably think that I am being ‘funny’ (ignoring her). It really bothers me that I don’t have the relationship with her that I used to but the recent things that she has said to me along with her behaviour have upset me greatly. Now I am wondering whether I have set a boundary in place or I am just being mean to her, getting my own back just like she does.

[Feeling Better]

Hello everyone

I think this might be a long post, apologies, and I hope that I can make it reasonably coherent. Not sure where to start, but here goes... .

I feel that in my relationship with my mother, and probably in all my relationships actually, I have got into the habit of turning the other cheek. I have always been very good at making excuses for the behaviour of others: they didn’t mean it, didn’t know any better, it’s just the way that they are, I must have done/said something to make them behave that way, and so to maintain harmony I have always I suppose denied my own feelings. I have come to realise that yes, that makes them feel good, but what about me? Since being here and also through counselling I am learning to be kinder to myself and I am becoming a lot more self aware. I know where I’ve been going wrong, or at least I think I know.

My uBPD son, I’m pretty sure has BPD traits and may even have ptsd too following a very traumatic experience he had a few years ago. He has been NC with me over a year now and just prior to that he told me that he would never stay in my home again. He has always travelled and lived abroad since he finished university and he will soon be 36. Whenever he came back to UK he always stayed with us, but I understood his decision that he didn’t want to stay here again so I suggested he could stay with his grandma (my mother)

So after he went NC with me he started communicating more with my mother, unbeknown to me at that time. Now she knew what I was going through when he went NC with me, she knew how worried I was about him and how devastated I was, and one time last year she asked me if I’d heard from him. I said “No but I hope that he is happy”. She knew that he was happy and that he was ok but couldn’t find it in her heart to let me know that she was in touch with him.

I found out at the end of last year that he was phoning her about every six weeks (he lives in a different country), the reason she told me was because she heard me say something that irritated her and so she decided that she would ‘get her own back’ by letting me know. She promised us that she would let us know in the future when he phoned her, we just wanted to know that he was ok. Well, she’s never said a thing. I know that he could have quite feasibly told her to not discuss him with us, I wouldn’t have a problem with that, but I do have a problem with her not telling us when she speaks to him, especially as she promised that she would.

Ok, if you’re still with me:
Since her promise, and luckily for me, during my counselling sessions, she chose one day to bring me down a peg or two and at the same time get her own back for what she perceived was a slight to her. She has exhibited this type of behaviour numerous times and I have always turned the other cheek, but now, post counselling, I don’t see why I should continue turning the other cheek. So I have cut down my level of contact with her, but why do I feel bad about it? She is 90 years old, is fit and in good health, predicted to live to 100+. I know that the reduction in my contact with her won’t bother her in the slightest, she will probably think that I am being ‘funny’ (ignoring her). It really bothers me that I don’t have the relationship with her that I used to but the recent things that she has said to me along with her behaviour have upset me greatly. Now I am wondering whether I have set a boundary in place or I am just being mean to her, getting my own back just like she does.

[JNChell]

Hi, Feeling Better. I’d like to start by saying that I’m deeply sorry about your situation. I have a Son, and I couldn’t imagine not having him in my life. Mine is a toddler, but nonetheless. I’m also sorry about the situation with your Mother. I imagine that this is all causing you a great deal of stress, anger and upset. Especially not knowing if he is ok, or not. Heaven forbid, but if your Mother knew that he wasn’t, do you think that she would have the courtesy to let you know, and maybe even give some information?

Now I am wondering whether I have set a boundary in place or I am just being mean to her, getting my own back just like she does.

Do you feel that you have set this boundary out of self care/preservation, or that you have set it out of spite and anger? Maybe a little of both? Hang in there. 

[Feeling Better]

Thank you JNChell for your kind reply. I really don’t know whether my mother would let me know if anything happened to my son, I would like to think that she would but who knows? I have a daughter who is in touch with him also, I know that she would let me know although she doesn’t readily give information, I have to always ask her.

I set my boundary when I was feeling betrayed by my mother and extremely upset and I set it for my own well being. I felt that I couldn’t be around her at that time. Setting it has helped me to get myself back on a more even keel. I suppose that now that I am in a better place I am questioning that boundary. The thing is though that she has lost my trust. I wish that things were different but they aren’t and I have to deal with what I have got. I have lost the relationship I had with my son and I feel like I’m holding onto the relationship I have with my mother by a thread.

[JNChell]

I’m glad that you have your daughter to rely on for information when you see fit. That must be at least somewhat reassuring.

I could very well be wrong, but is it possible that there is some triangulation going on between your Son (victim), your Mother (rescuer) and you as the perpetrator? If so, perhaps the boundary you set is a quite healthy one. This is just an observation. I don’t want to make assumptions.

[Feeling Better]

Thanks JNChell, yes, it is very reassuring to me that I have my daughter to at least let me know how my son is.

Yes, I can see your triangle with me as the persecutor, my son as the victim and my mother as the rescuer, another triangle however would be me as the victim, my son as the persecutor and my mother again as rescuer. I stepped away from the triangle quite a while ago now and I’ve no wish to go back there.

[JNChell]

Oh boy!  I hope that you didn’t think that I was implying that you are the perpetrator. I was merely looking at it from the angle that your Mother and Son may be seeing things. That you were playing that role in their eyes. Not that you are. I’m so sorry if I miscommunicated that to you. I can definitely see the role reversal from your point of view, and I empathize with your feelings on it. I’ve been there.

[Harri]

Hi Feeling Better.  What a hurtful situation. 

I think it would be good to sort out what kind of relationship you want with your mother.  Realistically of course.  Do you want to have contact with her?  You don't trust her, rightfully so, so that needs to be taken into consideration.  You would also have to adjust your expectations about what she can contribute to the relationship, but that can be done.  You know that triangulation is an issue and to avoid it.  What else?

Lets talk about this.  See what you want.

[Feeling Better]

Hi JNChell

No, I didn’t think that you were implying that I was the persecutor at all, because in the eyes of my son I would be seen as persecutor so that he could play the victim to my mother, I understand that. The thing is though that the roles shift about, and when my son was communicating with me he became the persecutor, don’t forget, he is the one with the BPD traits, and I naturally became the victim. My mother was the rescuer to both of us, my son placed her in that role and likewise so did I. Once I realised that I was caught up in triangulation (thanks to parents on the S/D board) I was able to do something about it and I could see that I was the only one who could do something about it. As far as my mother goes, I don’t think she has BPD but she can exhibit some really nasty traits when she perceives that she’s been wronged, rightly or imaginary, and she then plots her revenge to get even and to teach me a lesson

No need to apologise, you didn’t miscommunicate at all, maybe I didn’t explain the other roles in the triangle very well. I appreciate your reply, thank you.

[Learning2Thrive]

Hi Feeling Better.  What a hurtful situation. 

I think it would be good to sort out what kind of relationship you want with your mother.  Realistically of course.  Do you want to have contact with her?  You don't trust her, rightfully so, so that needs to be taken into consideration.  You would also have to adjust your expectations about what she can contribute to the relationship, but that can be done.  You know that triangulation is an issue and to avoid it.  What else?

Lets talk about this.  See what you want.

Hi Feeling Better,

Harri has asked some great questions. If you make the focus about what you want—not what is socially expected or what you think is right—what does that look like?

Sending you gentle hugs and smiles,

L2T

[Feeling Better]

Hi Harri,

Thank you for your reply.

You ask what kind of relationship I want with my mother, and the honest truth is that right now I just don’t know. I do know that it won’t be the same kind of relationship that I had with her previously because I am not prepared to compromise myself or my feelings any longer, but I would still like to have some sort of relationship with her. I need to get rid of the feelings of guilt that I have since I reduced my contact with her. I feel sad too. Sad for her that she doesn’t realise what damage she has done to our relationship. And sad that I have reduced contact with her. I think I probably have already, to a degree, started to readjust my expectations as to what she can or will contribute to the relationship. I feel that I also need to take into account her age, I don’t want to abandon her at this stage of her life. I also could never do to her what my son has done to me, although I might feel like it at times. I think in order to have any kind of relationship with her I need some good, healthy boundaries.

[Feeling Better]

Hi Learning2Thrive

Thank you for your reply

If I make the focus about what I want, I want to have a relationship with my mother, but it has to be a different relationship. I gave too much of myself, always looking for her approval, wanting to please her and take care of her, always being protective of her. I’m not prepared to do all of that anymore. I want a relationship with her that doesn’t make me feel bad about myself or worried and anxious that I might have said or done something for her to feel she has to chastise (my T’s word) me. I guess it all comes down to good healthy boundaries again.

[Harri]

Hi again FeelingBetter.  I am sorry it took a bit for me to get back to you.  I got caught up in some personal stuff.  Anyway, how are you?  I've been thinking about your situation and right now, I'd say that it is okay if you don't know what kind of relationship you want with her.  You just realized some pretty important and painful stuff about not being able to trust her and that she can be pretty mean... .and knowing that turning the other cheek no longer works for you.  As painful as all of that is, it is good too.  in with all the pain there is freedom there too. 

I am not particularly religious so I forget where the turn the other cheek part comes in and the context in which it was said, but I do know that it does not mean to accept abuse.  My T is still trying to get me to understand that while I want to accept people as they are that I can do that but still keep them at arms length.  She thinks there are some people I should keep a few blocks away from me too! haha 

So take some time to just sit with the new realizations and maybe work on figuring out where the guilt is coming from.  I think sometimes, for us here on this board, our guilt meter is set too low and we feel guilt for things that have caused no true harm. 

Have you ever read the article we have here called Emotional Blackmail: Fear, Obligation and Guilt?  I am not sure if this applies to your relationship with your mother but you may find it useful.

I the meantime, I hope you keep posting so we can help.

Take care.

[Feeling Better]

Hi Harri

Thank you so much for your reply, I’ve not been around that much of late, been dealing with emotions arising from my uBPD son’s birthday so it has been a bit of a difficult time for me.

I reflected on my relationship with my mother and decided to take my own advice (which I have previously offered to others). So, my advice to me is to do what feels right for me and to do what I know I can live with, no regrets and no wishing I’d done things differently when I’m further down the line. That way I hope it makes what I choose to do, about me and not about her.

So take some time to just sit with the new realizations and maybe work on figuring out where the guilt is coming from.  I think sometimes, for us here on this board, our guilt meter is set too low and we feel guilt for things that have caused no true harm. 

I think the guilt most probably comes from childhood conditioning, I discussed this with my T. It’s hard to shake off, I have to keep reminding myself that I am not to blame for other people’s actions, it’s not my fault and I shouldn’t be feeling guilty about doing something to protect myself when I have been hurt.

Have you ever read the article we have here called Emotional Blackmail: Fear, Obligation and Guilt?  I am not sure if this applies to your relationship with your mother but you may find it useful.

I the meantime, I hope you keep posting so we can help.

Yes, I have read this article and I have read it twice more from your link, so thank you so much for that. I am not sure if it applies to my relationship with my mother either.

So, just to update:
Last weekend I went away with my mother and a friend of mine who she knows. I drove us, about a two hour car journey which turned into three hours due to heavy traffic and a van catching fire in front of us, the smoke from which reduced the visibility to zero which was quite frightening. The weekend was enjoyable. I was due to drive back Sunday and Saturday night I hardly slept. Nor did my mother which is unusual for her. I told her that I needed my sleep as I was worried about driving back and didn’t want to have an accident due to tiredness. So on Sunday, driving back around lunchtime I said that I was feeling alert and would prefer to drive straight back without a stop if possible but I would stop if either of them wanted me to. My friend kept checking whether my mother wanted to stop. She said she was ok. Almost back and my mother said “You didn’t have an accident “ I replied jokingly “Did you think I would have?” She responded badly and I told her I’d been joking. Then she unleashed some more words, my friend told her she had the wrong end of the stick, and that I had wanted to just get back, realised she wasn’t getting anywhere so gave up. I sat there quietly driving and listening to my mother say:
“She always gets her own way” pause
“It’s her behaviour” pause
“It’s true what they say, you always hurt the one you love” big pause
“I’m sorry FB’s friend I didn’t intend this to happen”
A couple more mutterings under her breath before I dropped her at her door. To be fair she did apologise for once, but what the heck was all that about?

Sorry it was long but I just needed to get it out of my system x