Yikes...uBPD mom about to lose home?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hi everyone,

For some background, my mom is uBPD and I have been essentially NC with her for the past 3 or so years.  When my parents separated approximately 10 years ago, she moved into my grandmother's home with her, and has stayed ever since.  At first it was just to "get on her feet" but eventually she morphed it into her needing to care for my aging grandmother.  Because my mom lives there, I don't often see my grandmother, which has been sad but necessary.  My grandmother is in her late 80's and has signs of dementia (I am not certain if it has been officially diagnosed).  I do believe she needs help with some things, like reminding her to eat and take her medicine, but she is mostly functional with daily living activities.  I have heard some stories here and there of the house being very dirty, and my mom verbally abusing my grandmother when angry, but I don't have proof of any of this.  My aunts are who told me these stories and I left it to them to deal with (mistake, since they didn't do anything about it... .).  

I got a call on my cell phone last week, looking for either my mom or grandma in regards to "the home on X street" - the street they live on.  I found the call odd, since I am not really tied to either of them at this point.  So I googled their address and found that the home is up for public auction at the end of the month due to foreclosure!  After doing some more digging and talking with other family members, it turns out that my mom took out a mortgage on the home (in both her name and my grandmother's) several years ago.  She has told some family that she took it out in her name only in order to take on the balance of the remainder of my grandma's mortgage, and she has told others that it was a second mortgage for home improvements.  I'm not sure what the real story is, but both of their names are on this mortgage in default.  When I found this info, I called one of my aunts (my mom's sister) and told her what I had found, and she called my mom directly.  My mom told her that what was online was "wrong" and that she just had sent them a check and everything was fine.  She told a story about how my grandmother was getting the mail and not paying the correct balance, so there were past due bills that she was not aware of, but she had cleared it all up and no one should worry.  My mom is notoriously terrible with money.  She's had cars repossessed (once after telling me about a month beforehand, unsolicited, that she was paying more than she owed on the loan each month in order to pay it off early), and my dad was constantly bailing her out of credit card debt when I was younger.  She also makes up stories, so I have no faith at all that she actually paid the debt and the auction isn't happening.

I have told several family members (my mom's sisters and my brother) about what I found in an effort to get the ball rolling on plans that we'll likely need to make in the event that my grandmother finds herself homeless in the coming months.  What I have unfortunately been met with is family who are treating my mom like a child and tiptoeing around her in an effort to "not make her mad."   My brother is upset with me for telling other family members, because I'm "making mom look like a piece of %&#*."  No one seems concerned about my grandmother, only about how my mom feels, which is beyond frustrating!  They don't want to upset her because then they know she will shut down and stop talking to them, but she's not giving them actual information anyway so what's the point in pretending she hasn't totally screwed up here?  They also seem to want to give my mom the benefit of the doubt about her claims to have paid them.  But, the auction is still listed online - nothing has changed.  It sounds like if the house does go to auction, my aunts are interested in purchasing the home and kicking my mom out, but I think that once push comes to shove it won't really happen.  And, they'd have to win the auction, and with the home "priced" significantly lower than what it could be worth, I think it will have a lot of interested parties.  

I also filed a report with APS (adult protective services) to make sure that my mom doesn't try to do something sneaky like get guardianship over my grandma now that she probably knows that her time in the home is limited, and also to make sure something is in place when the house inevitably gets auctioned.  I don't think my mom would have any issue with living in a car with my grandmother and telling no one and acting like everything was fine - this hopefully helps ensure that won't happen.  I got a call from an investigator the next morning who said they had opened a case based on the information I provided and had already attempted to contact them at the home, but no one was there.  She said she'd keep trying.  

I'm not sure I have any definite question to ask you all and may just be venting here - but is there anything else you all would do in this situation?  I want to cover all possible bases to ensure my grandmother is safe and cared for.  I feel like I'm the only family member not entirely engulfed in the FOG right now!

Thanks for reading my ramblings

[CollectedChaos]

Hi everyone,

For some background, my mom is uBPD and I have been essentially NC with her for the past 3 or so years.  When my parents separated approximately 10 years ago, she moved into my grandmother's home with her, and has stayed ever since.  At first it was just to "get on her feet" but eventually she morphed it into her needing to care for my aging grandmother.  Because my mom lives there, I don't often see my grandmother, which has been sad but necessary.  My grandmother is in her late 80's and has signs of dementia (I am not certain if it has been officially diagnosed).  I do believe she needs help with some things, like reminding her to eat and take her medicine, but she is mostly functional with daily living activities.  I have heard some stories here and there of the house being very dirty, and my mom verbally abusing my grandmother when angry, but I don't have proof of any of this.  My aunts are who told me these stories and I left it to them to deal with (mistake, since they didn't do anything about it... .).  

I got a call on my cell phone last week, looking for either my mom or grandma in regards to "the home on X street" - the street they live on.  I found the call odd, since I am not really tied to either of them at this point.  So I googled their address and found that the home is up for public auction at the end of the month due to foreclosure!  After doing some more digging and talking with other family members, it turns out that my mom took out a mortgage on the home (in both her name and my grandmother's) several years ago.  She has told some family that she took it out in her name only in order to take on the balance of the remainder of my grandma's mortgage, and she has told others that it was a second mortgage for home improvements.  I'm not sure what the real story is, but both of their names are on this mortgage in default.  When I found this info, I called one of my aunts (my mom's sister) and told her what I had found, and she called my mom directly.  My mom told her that what was online was "wrong" and that she just had sent them a check and everything was fine.  She told a story about how my grandmother was getting the mail and not paying the correct balance, so there were past due bills that she was not aware of, but she had cleared it all up and no one should worry.  My mom is notoriously terrible with money.  She's had cars repossessed (once after telling me about a month beforehand, unsolicited, that she was paying more than she owed on the loan each month in order to pay it off early), and my dad was constantly bailing her out of credit card debt when I was younger.  She also makes up stories, so I have no faith at all that she actually paid the debt and the auction isn't happening.

I have told several family members (my mom's sisters and my brother) about what I found in an effort to get the ball rolling on plans that we'll likely need to make in the event that my grandmother finds herself homeless in the coming months.  What I have unfortunately been met with is family who are treating my mom like a child and tiptoeing around her in an effort to "not make her mad."   My brother is upset with me for telling other family members, because I'm "making mom look like a piece of %&#*."  No one seems concerned about my grandmother, only about how my mom feels, which is beyond frustrating!  They don't want to upset her because then they know she will shut down and stop talking to them, but she's not giving them actual information anyway so what's the point in pretending she hasn't totally screwed up here?  They also seem to want to give my mom the benefit of the doubt about her claims to have paid them.  But, the auction is still listed online - nothing has changed.  It sounds like if the house does go to auction, my aunts are interested in purchasing the home and kicking my mom out, but I think that once push comes to shove it won't really happen.  And, they'd have to win the auction, and with the home "priced" significantly lower than what it could be worth, I think it will have a lot of interested parties.  

I also filed a report with APS (adult protective services) to make sure that my mom doesn't try to do something sneaky like get guardianship over my grandma now that she probably knows that her time in the home is limited, and also to make sure something is in place when the house inevitably gets auctioned.  I don't think my mom would have any issue with living in a car with my grandmother and telling no one and acting like everything was fine - this hopefully helps ensure that won't happen.  I got a call from an investigator the next morning who said they had opened a case based on the information I provided and had already attempted to contact them at the home, but no one was there.  She said she'd keep trying.  

I'm not sure I have any definite question to ask you all and may just be venting here - but is there anything else you all would do in this situation?  I want to cover all possible bases to ensure my grandmother is safe and cared for.  I feel like I'm the only family member not entirely engulfed in the FOG right now!

Thanks for reading my ramblings

[hellebore1]

Oh my gosh.  I'm going to stay tuned in this thread - this sounds like exactly the kind of thing my BPD half brother got great at, creating a problem for another person and then pulling our whole (very large) family into the FOG.

For starters, I would try to avoid involving your other family as much as possible.  FOG is MUCH harder to deal with when it's on the part of multiple other people, who are calling each other to reinforce each other's narratives. You don't say whether you're married or with a family of your own, but you're going to need some support to deal with this.  I would recommend going into therapy as soon as you can - long story short so that the other family members can't surround you with FOG and try to make you feel crazy or like a bad person for trying to take care of your grandma.  Try not to think too badly of people who believe your mom's distortions - remember that BPD people can sound very convincing to those who don't know them well.  

Unfortunately there's probably not much proactive you can do until the house sells.  At that point things will become a "crisis" (I use quote marks because it wouldn't be a crisis if people would listen to you now, but sadly that likely will not happen.)  :)o you have one particular family member not as involved in Mom's distortions who might listen?  In addition to APS I wonder if you might look into resources in your area for older people.  Is moving your grandmother in with you an option?  Some states have programs that help pay for care workers.

[CollectedChaos]

Thanks for your reply hellebore1   I'm so sorry that you've dealt with similar situations with your family, and thank you for the positive support. 

I am married, but no kids yet - he and his family have been a tremendous support to me over the years so I am solid there, thankfully!  I have also been in therapy for a couple of years now (next appt is tomorrow - first one since learning this news), so I'll definitely be talking about it there too.

You are likely right that there isn't much to be done until the house sells, and from there it'll be chaos for a while.  My grandmother could move in with us, but I don't believe it would be a good long-term solution.  We're in a condo that is on the second level of the building, so she'd have to walk up/down a full flight of steps to get in or out.  She has some balance issues, so this could prove to be too difficult to navigate for long.  But it could work out if we needed something temporary.  My other hope with the APS case was that they could help give a clear picture of her finances as of now (no idea if my mom has been spending my grandmother's money as well as getting her to sign on this loan?), and give us options for housing, etc. 

My aunts know my mom has some "issues" but seem to feel bad for her and therefore feed into her distortions more frequently than they should.  I think my brother will see the light on this eventually, but it'll likely take him some time - I think once the auction is days away and is still clearly going to happen he'll realize that my mom was lying, and his tune will change.  I try not to take it personally when they side with her and her craziness, but it's very frustrating! 

Thank you again

[Harri]

Hi Collected Chaos.  I am so sorry to hear of the current situation with your mother and g-ma.  I do not have a whole lot of practical input for this I'm sorry to say.  One thing though is that you may want to contact Elder Services in addition to APS to find out what resources may be available to your grandmother. 

I try not to take it personally when they side with her and her craziness, but it's very frustrating! 

  This part of your post especially caught my eye.  I have a question related to things I have been thinking about as I read and post on the board and want to ask your thoughts.  Do you think it is that they are taking their side or are they going back to the roles they had with your mother all of their lives and it is ingrained behavior just like we exhibited for so long before we were aware of the disordered behavior and all that entails?

The change in perspective, if it applies to your situation, changes nothing except to maybe lessen the frustration so you can focus your energy elsewhere.  Again, I am not sure if it applies and I am mostly interested in hearing your thoughts on this.  If this does not apply, please disregard.  I know you are already dealing with a lot and do not want to add to the stress.

 

[Turkish]

CC,

You did the right thing by calling APS. Elder financial abuse is a crime.  Maybe it isn't too the level of criminality in this case by the letter of the law,  but from what you said,  they are likely losing their (well, your grandmother's) home due to your mother's inability a manage finances. APS in my case went to my mom's bank to access her records to determine of I was stealing from her.  Hopefully APS puts on the effort to dig into her finances more. 

It's pathetic that some in your family are afraid of your mother rather than advocating for your grandma,  who is in reality the vulnerable one 

[hellebore1]

 

My aunts know my mom has some "issues" but seem to feel bad for her and therefore feed into her distortions more frequently than they should.  I think my brother will see the light on this eventually, but it'll likely take him some time - I think once the auction is days away and is still clearly going to happen he'll realize that my mom was lying, and his tune will change.  I try not to take it personally when they side with her and her craziness, but it's very frustrating!

One thing to keep in mind: siblings of BPD (I am one) are often groomed to look the other way and swallow their own feelings in order to make parents' life with BPD children easier.  In my own case I'm angry with my mother because nobody who survived what I did wouldn't be, but I'm also understanding of what caused the dynamic... .it's not anybody's fault per se that my half sibling has a severe case of BPD, and that it wasn't fun for anyone least of all himself to live with.

Glad to hear you have your brother, a supportive group of inlaws, and a therapist.  Still staying tuned.  

[Woolspinner2000]

Hi Collected Chaos,

Thank you for sharing your situation with us. It's helpful to connect with others who know what the traits of a BPD are like and aren't surprised by them. It sounds ominous, and I'm glad you took the steps to protect your grandmother. 

Keep us informed!

 
Wools

[CollectedChaos]

Thank you all so much for your replies!  I really appreciate the support and viewpoints.  As of Monday, my aunts were able to confirm with the bank that they did receive a payment for the correct amount needed to reinstate the loan, but it hadn't posted yet.  Considering that it appears it was "paid" over the Memorial Day holiday (a week and a half ago now), I'm surprised that it has yet to clear the bank, which leads me to believe it'll get declined due to insufficient funds.  Still TBD, but that's my guess.  I can see my mom sending a bad check, or making a payment knowing she didn't have the funds, knowing it would buy her another week of it looking as though she was doing the right thing.  Only time will tell at this point. 

Do you think it is that they are taking their side or are they going back to the roles they had with your mother all of their lives and it is ingrained behavior just like we exhibited for so long before we were aware of the disordered behavior and all that entails?

Oh, for sure, Harri.  This is the behavior I've seen my whole life, so I know it's just how they operate (and heck, it's how I used to operate too!).  That's why I try not to take it personally - I know they have created that coping strategy over many, many years and aren't likely to change anytime soon.  I realize they aren't truly "siding" with her in terms of logic.  I just sometimes wish I could get them to see the problem behaviors as clearly as I'm able to see them now! 

Turkish, I'm glad to hear that APS was able to pull financial records in your situation - that was my hope in filing the report, but I wasn't 100% sure of what exactly they were able to do/see.  I imagine it varies a bit by state but hopefully they all have the same general authorities.  Unfortunately, I got a call from APS on Monday afternoon stating that because my grandma is out of the state right now (she's visiting my aunt until mid-June), they can't hold the case open that long and have to close it out.  They suggested calling and filing a new report once she's back in my state, which I will do.

[hellebore1]

I can see my mom sending a bad check, or making a payment knowing she didn't have the funds, knowing it would buy her another week of it looking as though she was doing the right thing.  Only time will tell at this point. 

I was thinking about you while doing gardening earlier today.  Have spent a long time having issues with my uBPD half sib and enabling mother... .somehow it never occurred to me sufficiently that people somehow survive with BPD parents.  Can't imagine how hard that would be.

Again, in my experience it's pretty hard to convince groups of people of anything because of mutually reinforcing FOG.  Have been able to get some of my (very large) family members to budge vis a vis a couple of things but it's taken a long time, like a decade.  Stick to your guns, though - what choice do you have?  It's hard to put the genie back in the bottle once you've seen what's really going on.

Hugs to you. 

[CollectedChaos]

Thank you, hellebore1   

It's hard to put the genie back in the bottle once you've seen what's really going on.

So, so true!  And I agree that it's incredibly difficult to convince others in the FOG since they all feed off of each other.  I'm sorry that you've also had to deal with that in your own family - regardless of who in the family is BPD, it's never easy! 

[Turkish]

What's going on with this now? What did your aunts find out?

[CollectedChaos]

Hi Turkish!  Thanks for checking in.

For a little background, my mom also has a boyfriend living at the house with them.  I guess after my aunts started calling the house about this, he found out about the house being in foreclosure from them (didn't know until then) and paid what was required to get the loan back to good standing.  He also set up automatic payments from his account going forward.  I've confirmed that the house is no longer scheduled for auction, so it seems that this story is true.  However, knowing my mom, if the house was about to go under, she likely has a lot of other credit cards/loans out there she hasn't paid on either, so it's only a matter of time before he finds out there are more things she needs him to "save her" with.  I don't see someone not married to her with no kids sticking around forever if this is the new norm (my dad did that through their whole 20+ year marriage, says he did it to stay together for my brother and I).  So I imagine that he'll be gone eventually and we'll have to worry about the house again.

I've been going back and forth about putting in another report to APS (my initial case was closed because my grandma was visiting my aunt out of state - she got back a couple of days ago so I can re-submit now), and I'm pretty conflicted about it.  While I have some suspicions that my mom is likely using my grandma's $ for her own benefit (my feeling is that if she had money to pull from, either her own or my grandmas, she would have done that long before going into foreclosure and having to confess this whole thing to her bf), I don't have proof, and now that the house is theoretically safe I feel as though my family will see another report as me trying to get back at my mom and not to benefit my grandma.  I think I will ultimately call them again - the guilt of standing by when something terrible may be happening is worse than my family being pissed off at me, in the end.

[Harri]

I don't have proof, and now that the house is theoretically safe I feel as though my family will see another report as me trying to get back at my mom and not to benefit my grandma.  I think I will ultimately call them again - the guilt of standing by when something terrible may be happening is worse than my family being pissed off at me, in the end.

What a tough situation!  I am glad the immediate crisis is over but agree that it will probably become an issue again at some point. 

Have you made the decision to call or are you still weighing the pros and cons?

[CollectedChaos]

Hi Harri!  I am still weighing, but I think I will call this week.  I was over at my dad's this weekend, which means I have to drive past my mom's house, and noticed that she has what appears to be a new car - definitely rang some alarm bells.  I imagine her credit is pretty shot at this point, as well as my grandma's because of the almost foreclosure... .so my guess is that it's more likely under the boyfriend's credit than either of them, but I don't know for sure and am not sure I want to risk it being under my grandma and my mom losing that too.

[Harri]

  Hi CollectedChaos!

I was just wondering how things are going with you?  have you been able to still cope well with the family situation?  Any changes?

Just poking you to check on you. 

[CollectedChaos]

Hi Harri!

It's funny you should post on this over the weekend (sorry for not responding sooner - I try to avoid the internet on weekends!), I actually called on Friday afternoon and had a new case opened.  I haven't heard anything yet but anticipate that I will sometime in the next couple of days.  It feels like a relief!  I'm a little sad that it took me this long to step entirely out of the FOG and realize that if my family is mad at me about this, then that is their issue.  But, I suppose better late than never. 

Thanks for checking in on me 

[Learning2Thrive]

I'm a little sad that it took me this long to step entirely out of the FOG and realize that if my family is mad at me about this, then that is their issue.  But, I suppose better late than never.

I understand this feeling, but you are so right. It’s better late than never. It really does take time and usually the willingness to address some difficult truths for the fog to clear.

  L2T

[Harri]

Well, I am glad I posted then!  FOG is so hard to deal with but you did it. 

Do keep us posted.