Is he testing me?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hi all,

I recently started dating a man with bpd. The start of the relationship has been strained to say the least. Sometimes he wants to talk to me all day. The next day is radio silence or sporadic messages. This is fine as I’ve since read up about his condition and understand it a lot more than I did.
The thing is I think he might be testing me to see how much I care as I’ve told him I like him.
Test one was on Saturday night where he asked me to come over. We had a conversation where he said I was just saying it to see if you would. I did anyway as I wanted to see him so I obviously passed the test.
Test two was to see if I could spend time with him without us having sex (he seems to have an odd view that that was all I wanted) anyway I passed that as well as it was ladies time
Test 3, this is the one I’m confused about. He’s not messaged me all day today so I’ve left it, however I got worried and messaged now and he’s responded just saying he’s been busy which is why he hasn’t been in touch. I said to him I was just checking in to make sure you’re ok as I was worried. We had a little convo and I’ve left it.
Hes told me that some days he doesn’t want to talk so I was worried about messaging him but had to to make sure he was ok. What’s odd is that he seems pretty normal? Is he wanting me to chase to see if I care?
I’m really confused as to what to do as some day’s he wants to talk all day and then others he doesn’t. I understand that and I’m trying to learn as much as I can about the condition to help him but I don’t want to complain about the fact he’s not messaged as it triggers him I think.
I’ve never met anyone with bpd before I started seeing him and it’s early days so I’m trying to understand things a bit more before I know how to be on a daily basis with him.

[AllyMaine]

Hi all,

I recently started dating a man with bpd. The start of the relationship has been strained to say the least. Sometimes he wants to talk to me all day. The next day is radio silence or sporadic messages. This is fine as I’ve since read up about his condition and understand it a lot more than I did.
The thing is I think he might be testing me to see how much I care as I’ve told him I like him.
Test one was on Saturday night where he asked me to come over. We had a conversation where he said I was just saying it to see if you would. I did anyway as I wanted to see him so I obviously passed the test.
Test two was to see if I could spend time with him without us having sex (he seems to have an odd view that that was all I wanted) anyway I passed that as well as it was ladies time
Test 3, this is the one I’m confused about. He’s not messaged me all day today so I’ve left it, however I got worried and messaged now and he’s responded just saying he’s been busy which is why he hasn’t been in touch. I said to him I was just checking in to make sure you’re ok as I was worried. We had a little convo and I’ve left it.
Hes told me that some days he doesn’t want to talk so I was worried about messaging him but had to to make sure he was ok. What’s odd is that he seems pretty normal? Is he wanting me to chase to see if I care?
I’m really confused as to what to do as some day’s he wants to talk all day and then others he doesn’t. I understand that and I’m trying to learn as much as I can about the condition to help him but I don’t want to complain about the fact he’s not messaged as it triggers him I think.
I’ve never met anyone with bpd before I started seeing him and it’s early days so I’m trying to understand things a bit more before I know how to be on a daily basis with him.

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[jaded7]

Oh my gosh. I'm at the ending (I think, of a 2 year relationship with an undiagnosed, as far as I know, BPD gf and this 'testing' you describe just rang so many alarm bells for me.

-she lectured me and criticized me for months for being a 'child' for not keeping a Google calendar, for 'wasting' a summer because we didn't schedule things (I have no idea how the summer was wasted), for 'cancelling' events we had planned (that I never knew about, she never told me) how I'm not an adult for not keeping Google calendar. So, I set a time and we met for coffee to enter in the entire last summer times we'd be together- evenings, weekends. She immediately started cancelling, at the last minute, evenings we had calendared together, weekends we had calendared to spend together. When I finally was so frustrated that I got the courage to bring this up (after much denying that she did these things, much deflection and diverting and accusations) in her anger she said "I JUST WANTED TO SEE IF YOU"D DO IT!"

-harangued and lectured me many times for not making plans ahead of time "Last minute doesn't work for me, I have a busy life" and "If you can't plan ahead, I'll make other plans". And, for the last year made no plans with me and would text or call at the last minute to get lunch or go for a walk.

-all the messaging mixed messages you describe. Some times she texts all sorts of stuff and I always respond. Then I'll text her some days and she'll actually get 'mad' at me because "I don't respect the work she does" from home (she's never given me a schedule of the work she does, I have no idea when she is busy or not) or if I point out it's hurtful that she doesn't return communications for days she'll get very mad and tell me she's 'busy', or one weekend when she didn't respond for 2 days and I told her I was worried and hurt, she picked up the phone and told me "to work on this in therapy". 3 days before when I didn't text her one night like I usually do, she called early in the morning and was clearly concerned, the first thing she said was "go to bed early last night?"

[AllyMaine]

It’s so confusing isn’t it? Sometimes if I message he says I’m bothering him and he doesn’t know what I want from him which is why I held off today. The reason I was worried is that we chat mainly on Snapchat and he usually posts on his story, but today nothing! I was concerned so messaged just to reassure him I’m here. He said he’s fine but he didn’t carry conversation on which means he doesn’t want to talk so I left it. I don’t know if he was busy or if he is pulling away as he feels we’re getting too close. I’ve not known him that long and maybe he doesn’t want to burden me, so I’m just trying to let him know I’m here for him.
I’m meant to be seeing him Wednesday so we’ll see what happens then!
The push / pull confuses me constantly and makes me second guess whether I’ve done something or not. Last night we were chatting and we said goodbye on good terms but it seems to be as soon as we’ve seen each other in person he’s distant for a while. I’m still trying to work out his triggers and learn as much as I can about his condition as I do really like him.

[jaded7]

Ally. All of this- and your feelings about it- are EXACTLY mine. I spent literally 2 years trying to figure out what I did 'wrong' if I did something 'wrong', what she wants, what she doesn't want. Telling me I'm a bad person for not responding right away, her not responding for days.

I will say I'm a bit worried for you. Your thinking- and your good heart, like mine- are exactly where I have been and it's super painful because you can never know what's next, what's up, and tests are always set for you that you don't know about and inevitably fail. You don't want upset him, you're trying to read his moods, trying to figure out the right thing to do. This has been my life and it's unbelievably tiring and hurtful when she turned on me for failing. Read my long, long thread if you dare.

[AllyMaine]

I don't know if I'm set up for this to be honest, it is early days so I feel sometimes like cutting my losses and running for the hills, but then I think that it isnt his fault.
It makes me feel like I'm being manipulated even though I know he's not doing it on purpose.
He's told me that he doesn't understand why I'm so persistent and that he's damaged and basically tried to warn me off him but I told him I'd make my own mind up about it.
He's been hurt in the past as he says he falls in love too easily so I'm trying to make this as stressfree as possible for him to see whether we can make a go of it. However I dont know how I'll feel months down the line if my emotional needs arent being met, which they obviously wont be.
When we'rw together he's the sweetest person ever and all he wants to do is cuddle and snuggle up together which I love, I just dont know what to do about the tests and the not messaging and the obvious arguments which will come eventually.
Jaded what was it like for you at the start? Has it ever got better? What do you mean your long thread? I cant see where that would be?

[once removed]

it sounds like youre feeling anxious about talking a great deal one day, not talking so much the next. do i have that right?

if so, i understand. inconsistency, especially in the early stages of a relationship has always made me really anxious.

you mentioned you got together recently. how long has it been?

[AllyMaine]

I dont think its so much the not talking but its the feeling like I've done something wrong. I was ok yesterday but then when I messaged and he said he was ok just busy it sort of threw me. That's why I dont know if he's testing me to see how I react.

Its been about a month, something like that. In that time we've argued or had a disagreement 3 times! I dont think he trusts women that much to be honest from what he's said so theres that as well.

I really dont know what to do or how to play it to be honest. My head tells me to cut my losses and leave it but my heart says no as I do really like him.

[jaded7]

Hi Ally, Let me try to refer to specific pieces here

I don't know if I'm set up for this to be honest, it is early days so I feel sometimes like cutting my losses and running for the hills, but then I think that it isnt his fault.
It makes me feel like I'm being manipulated even though I know he's not doing it on purpose. But it still feels the same.

that he's damaged and basically tried to warn me off him but I told him I'd make my own mind up about it..  This is a very big red flag

However I dont know how I'll feel months down the line if my emotional needs arent being met, which they obviously wont be. I have spent months and months having my emotional needs not met, asking for connection and inviting out to lunch, asking to go for walks, etc. all met with ignoring me (as in, literally ignoring texts, sometimes for day) or getting MAD at me for not respecting the work she does from home (in the beginning we spent 2 to three afternoons a week together, every week; she never tells me her schedule so I don't know if she is busy any day or not). BUT...I'm always there for her at a drop of the hat, always answer her calls and texts, will drive out to meet her or help her at a moment's notice (dropping my work). After a while this starts to feel really, really bad. AND last week she raged at me calling me all sorts of names...and said "I never show up for her"

When we'rw together he's the sweetest person ever and all he wants to do is cuddle and snuggle up together which I love, This was the start of our relationship, then almost exactly the time I decided to let myself, allow myself to fall love (she said "I love you" very early, I didn't; she was WAY into "us", had tons of time to text and call, did my family tree, made food for me, etc etc) she started with the criticism and the circular arguments filled with gaslighting and massive anger, name calling.

Jaded what was it like for you at the start? Has it ever got better? What do you mean your long thread? I cant see where that would be? No, it hasn't gotten better, it's gotten worse. The last 6 months she hasn't been to my place once, we haven't had sex since August (and that was the first time since April), and 99% of our interactions have been on the phone, my listening to her tell me what a narcissist jerk her ex-husband is. Never asked about me, my life, etc. Read the thread I started here about a week ago and you will be shocked. I'll try to link to it.

In that time we've argued or had a disagreement 3 times! I dont think he trusts women that much to be honest from what he's said so theres that as well. Did the arguments catch you completely by surprise? Were they circular? Were you constantly saying "but I didn't say that..." , or "that's not what I meant", or "but you said...".? And, mine REALLY distrust men, doesn't like them at all.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=342384.0

[jaded7]

Ally, the link I put in there should be to the first part of the thread I started. There's a second thread with the same name in this same forum.

Read through it to see the hell I've been through. Notice the red flags in the very first post, from the first couple months of our relationship. I didn't understand these things, and I felt bad for her.

[AllyMaine]

Jaded the arguments were out of the blue, the first one was that he said i was being too needy because I dared to message him first! He actually apologised for that one. Second one was me making an off the cuff remark about sex which he took offence to, he just went distant with that one so I said sorry even though I'd not meant any offence. Third one was before I knew he had bpd, he wasn't responding to my messages so I sent him a message basically saying if you want to leave it that's fine but don't message me and then when I reply act like you don't wanna talk. That escalated into an argument but I left it and he messaged me and I ended up seeing him at the weekend.
We chatted all day Sunday after I'd left his and since then nothing, I messaged him Monday just to check he was ok and he responded he was but other than that I've not heard anything. I've not done anything, not that I know of anyway so at a bit of a loss as to why. I suppose all I can do is leave him alone and see what happens? God knows, I am at a loss as to what to do because I do really like him but I feel like if I carry this on I'm going to get hurt even more.

[jaded7]

Jaded the arguments were out of the blue, the first one was that he said i was being too needy because I dared to message him first! He actually apologised for that one. Second one was me making an off the cuff remark about sex which he took offence to, he just went distant with that one so I said sorry even though I'd not meant any offence. Third one was before I knew he had bpd, he wasn't responding to my messages so I sent him a message basically saying if you want to leave it that's fine but don't message me and then when I reply act like you don't wanna talk. That escalated into an argument but I left it and he messaged me and I ended up seeing him at the weekend.
We chatted all day Sunday after I'd left his and since then nothing, I messaged him Monday just to check he was ok and he responded he was but other than that I've not heard anything. I've not done anything, not that I know of anyway so at a bit of a loss as to why. I suppose all I can do is leave him alone and see what happens? God knows, I am at a loss as to what to do because I do really like him but I feel like if I carry this on I'm going to get hurt even more.

Guess what I've been called multiple times Ally? TOO NEEDY Guess who ALSO told me when we first started dating "I love taking care of you". Guess who also yelled, I mean yelled, at me multiple times "I have a child! I don't need another child! I don't want to have to take care of you and be your mother!" AND, true story, once when we first were dating I was having a down day (I almost never have those, this was the only one) and she said come on over I'll make lunch. I got there, gave her a big hug. Sat at the table as she was cooking. Then, full of love watching her, I said "honey, can I have another hug?" She turned her head, looked at me and said "NO. Too needy".

How about apologizing for things you know you didn't do or me? DITTO I've told her many, many times I don't know where she gets this from...it's like a story in her head that exists independent of what actually happened, what my actual motives were, what my intent is. "It doesn't matter what your intent was, its the effect" I'm not kidding here, on the 17th of December she stopped returning calls texts because she was MAD at me for asking her out to lunch. Because somehow I was supposed to know her schedule that day (she never shares it, it varies day to day, we've gone out to lunch many, many times).

This messaging/communicating ON/OFF, mad or not?, push/pull expecting mind-reading is my EXACT experience over the last 8 months. When you love someone it's debilitating and painful because you can't figure it out.

[jaded7]

Just to add Ally. See how painful this is and you are just getting to know him? It's really weird to hear someone in the very first stages of a relationship describe EXACTLY what's going on in mine of 2 years. She didn't show all these behaviors at first.

Do you find that when you point out that this is confusing or painful that he then turns it around on you and your failings as a human being? Denies your experience. Can't hear your emotional experience? Gets angry if you suggest what he's done is painful?

Did you read through my thread on here. You'll be shocked.

[AllyMaine]

We've not actually got to the stage of talking about it yet as I didnt want to argue when I saw him. he's never ever said a cross word to me when I'm with him, its just over messages.
This time it will result in an argument though as he hasn't opened any of my messages from yesterday that I sent. I'm leaving it now as I cannot be bothered to even ask what I'm meant to have done wrong. I'm going to wait until he contacts me, which I'm sure he will and then I will have to say my piece. He either wants this to work or he doesnt but I can't live like this. Its one month in and I feel like I'm going mad already. The longer this continues the worse it will be unless its nipped in the bud now.
I need to set clear boundaries of what I will and wont tolerate and being left with no contact or ignored when I've not done anything wrong isnt one of them.
I understand he has bpd but it takes 2 minutes to message someone to just check in, or am I expecting too much?
Yes I did read your post, its making me quite concerned if I'm honest as if it gets two years down the line what will it be like then for me to leave.

[jaded7]

Boundaries are important, and since you've read my post/thread you will know how painful this can be over the long term. Everything you've experienced in the first couple of months I've experienced, and more, over 2 years.

I did set a boundary a couple of times and she literally blew right through it. Once I told her, after some lengthy verbal abuse episode (circular 'arguments', gaslighting, name calling, yelling, pointing a finger in my face, pacing around the room, etc) I texted her that I'm not ready to talk right now after she got in touch with me and I'll contact her later in the week- within 5 seconds she sent a text saying if "I hadn't done______ this never would have happened". See that? My fault, blowing through a boundary I set, accusing.

[AllyMaine]

Well he’s still not messaged or opened my message to him so I’m trying to forget about him as I think that will probably be for the best. I can’t hang around like this in limbo waiting for him to pick me up when he feels like it and drop me when we get close!
I am understanding to a point but this is just being silly now. The thing is I don’t understand why  he hasn’t blocked me or deleted me off his social media. Probably cos he’ll want to pick me back up at a time when it suits him. I can’t see this being the last I hear from him because as soon as he thinks there’s a chance I’ll leave he’ll want me back won’t he? Is this what it was like for you jaded?

[jaded7]

I have no idea if he will come back, but people on this board say that boundary setting is a good thing. I know what you mean about not even looking at a message- it just sits there unread, as if they are trying to send you a signal. It looks and feels like controlling behavior, and I can tell you that my gf is super-controlling and she's done that exact same thing to me for days- just letting a message sit there unread when you know she has all kinds of free time. AND, at the same time, after she attacked me for an hour and then stormed out in a huff- she sent a "talk tomorrow" text the next day, I took one day to gather myself (and I saw it in notifications so I didn't have to open it) she sent me a long, vicious email about how punishing and cruel I am.

It's so exasperating.

[AllyMaine]

well he has until the end of this weekend and if he hasn't contacted me to explain or try and resolve this I am deleting him and sending a message to explain why. It has been a week since we spoke now and I've had enough. I cant just wait in limbo for him to decide what he wants. Its upsetting me to be honest so I'd rather make a clean break and then I'm not checking all the time to see if he's read my messages.

[jaded7]

I say good for you Ally. Just imagine if this was all happening after you've fallen in love and met his family and spent holidays with them. My guess is that the behavior would get even worse.

If you read my thread, you'll know that my gf quit communicating with me on Tuesday the 17th of December, ignoring 3 texts and a phone call. Didn't communicate more than 'busy" or "around people all the time" (lies) once on Thursday night and once on Friday night, then after a show we had tickets together to for months (where she was really mean, snapping at me and ignoring me during intermission, literally walking away from me and leaving me standing alone) no response to at text that night, two more days go by and she's left town for Christmas. She then sends a "tired. going to take some time to recalibrate" text on Christmas Eve and I don't hear from her until the 30th.

This, from a gf of 2 years.

[once removed]

I understand he has bpd but it takes 2 minutes to message someone to just check in, or am I expecting too much?

you might be expecting too much. ive been on both sides of this.

its not clear to me how long youve been together...you mention that you got together recently.

in the beginning of most relationships, conversation is easy, you want to talk all the time, and you do so effortlessly.

but eventually, when you settle in, people tend to want to assert a little bit of independence, break it up a little bit, have some space.

men, especially, dont like to feel too obligated.

as i said, ive been on both sides of this. with my ubpdex, she preferred to talk constantly, and far more than i usually wanted to...even late into the relationship. and if i didnt respond fast enough for her, shed get either upset or angry. it was a huge drain, and it only made me want more space.

on the other hand, ive dated a few girls that tended to initiate the conversation, so when they didnt, i wondered if theyd lost interest, and id push for more, and get anxious about it. and that tended to push them away.

this is a lot of fighting that the two of you are doing, in the relatively early stages of the relationship, that makes the relationship more of a chore and obligation for both of you than a budding relationship can really stand.

and its come to a breaking point.

the question is whether you are serious about giving up on this relationship or not. you may not be sure - thats okay.

whether you are serious or not, i would not make grand gestures of deleting him and sending him a message detailing why.

its just rehashing the fighting the two of you are doing, except escalating it even further. and if he doesnt acknowledge it, thats likely to hurt your feelings.

if you want to be done, just be done.

if you want to save this, i think you need a pretty different approach.

[Intrigued04]

It’s so confusing isn’t it? Sometimes if I message he says I’m bothering him and he doesn’t know what I want from him which is why I held off today. The reason I was worried is that we chat mainly on Snapchat and he usually posts on his story, but today nothing! I was concerned so messaged just to reassure him I’m here. He said he’s fine but he didn’t carry conversation on which means he doesn’t want to talk so I left it. I don’t know if he was busy or if he is pulling away as he feels we’re getting too close. I’ve not known him that long and maybe he doesn’t want to burden me, so I’m just trying to let him know I’m here for him.
I’m meant to be seeing him Wednesday so we’ll see what happens then!
The push / pull confuses me constantly and makes me second guess whether I’ve done something or not. Last night we were chatting and we said goodbye on good terms but it seems to be as soon as we’ve seen each other in person he’s distant for a while. I’m still trying to work out his triggers and learn as much as I can about his condition as I do really like him.

This thread hits home for me. My male friend of 10yrs is a pro at the push pull dynamic! It took me years of emotional drainage and overthinking to realize he meets BPD criteria to a T, along with avoidant attachment behaviors. After every fun and positive encounter we have, and still have, he avoids or distances from me for a few days, then things are cool. I feel it's the fear of intimacy & closeness that makes him feel suffocated, even though I'm partially avoidant myself and very independent. The current issue I'm having is how often I'm being blocked/unblocked for what may be his fear of emotions towards me & needing a way to shut it down and regroup. My struggle is trying to find a way to be there as a friend without taking his behaviors personally, which is hard when you feel anything you do can trigger them. From all my research it seems this is common the longer you know them, and the closer you are to them because their abandonment fears become more pronounce. Maybe I'm wrong?  It does help to mirror their emotions back to them because they do lack self awareness and often react all on feelings, not facts. Read about the SET technique. It is helpful! Thank you for posting!

[AllyMaine]

Well I deleted him, he read the message, didn't respond and after him adding me back and me deleting him he then blocked me. He then unblocked me and I sent him another message just to see if he wanted to talk and he blocked me again. This was Saturday and I'm still blocked.
Maybe I shouldn't have overreacted and pushed too much because now I have no way of contacting him. I don't know if this is for good and I've been split black or whether he'll come back but I'm leaving it alone now. Even if I didn't want this to end he's done what he had to and stopped me from contacting him so I suppose I now have to deal with this. Will he come back? I have no idea, however the stress that this has put me under is too much, even though I do really like him I cant cope with this push/pull battle so its probably best that he's blocked me.
If he contacts me again I'm sure I'll cross that bridge when I come to it but for now I'm going to try and forget about him and focus on myself.

[jaded7]

I can really sense the frustration and even pain Ally.

It's real, I feel them too. I, for one, think you did a good job. I don't know if you have a therapist, but I've been working with mine a lot and it's helping me to come to terms with things, to think that I'm not a bad person.

[AllyMaine]

Thanks for the advice, its really appreciated. he still hasnt been in touch.
I dont think I'm that far down the line that I need to speak to someone about it, we were only together about a month and most of that was hardly speaking. I'm sure I'll be ok.
I'm still blocked so I'm getting on with my life, I'm not making any more grand gestures, I've told him how I feel and he has a way to contact me if he feels the need otherwise this is the end.
I know this is for the best, however it does hurt me that I wont see him again, but I cant enter a relationship with someone when its hurting in the first month. I need to think of myself.
If he does contact me I really need to assess whether this is worth the hassle really as I know from all the research I've done means he wont ever change without help and no matter how much I like him I cant have this every time I dare to contact him.