First Post - Both parents with undiagnosed BPD

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello all - Just learned about this message board through “Walking on Eggshells”. I have been seeing a therapist for several years now, and in talking with them, though they were not comfortable providing a diagnosis, they suggested that both of my parental figures have BPD. How do you cope when both parents are aging, intensely dislike each other (they have not spoken in years and you cannot mention the other in the other’s presence - if that makes sense?), and you’re an only child and the primary caregiver? I’m working through this in therapy and through lots of reading and meditation, but thoughts are most welcome! Thank you for listening

[EnglishLavender]

Hello all - Just learned about this message board through “Walking on Eggshells”. I have been seeing a therapist for several years now, and in talking with them, though they were not comfortable providing a diagnosis, they suggested that both of my parental figures have BPD. How do you cope when both parents are aging, intensely dislike each other (they have not spoken in years and you cannot mention the other in the other’s presence - if that makes sense?), and you’re an only child and the primary caregiver? I’m working through this in therapy and through lots of reading and meditation, but thoughts are most welcome! Thank you for listening

[zachira]

You are wondering how to deal with your aging parents who likely have undiagnosed BPD. You have come to the right place as there are many members on this site who have an elderly parent with BPD. My mother with BPD died last summer and I have many relatives with BPD, both in my family of origin and extended family. As a primary caregiver, how much time do you spend with your parents, and how much time do you have to yourself? I am glad you have therapist who is helping you. I went to therapy for many years until my therapist moved out of town. Can you tell us a little more about the challenges you have with your parents and how we can be the most helpful?

[GaGrl]

There definitely are members here who are in the caretaker told with elderly parents. We can help and support you.

My mom, who is 94 and lives with us, is not diagnosed with BPD, nor would she be. But after being reared by a stepmother who was BPD/NPD, she has several BPD traits that can make our relationship difficult at times. I have really worked on boundaries, my patience, taking care of myself, and knowing when I need a break.

[EnglishLavender]

Hello - So sorry for the delay in responding. My father had a kidney transplant during this time of COVID, and I had to stay with him for 8 weeks as he went through recovery, as he has no one else that could assist him. My mother passed away 25 years ago, his siblings have their own serious issues they are navigating, and I am an only child.

That was one of the most challenging things I ever had to do. We did not get along the entire time I was staying with him, and I cried nearly every day. To try to get through it, I added more tele-therapy sessions and my psychiatrist increased my med dosage. It helped to curb the crying and panicking, but it did little to ease the sense of loneliness, helplessness, and frustration.

I am a quiet person. I refuse to raise my voice at anyone and choose to not make emotionally-driven decisions. However, while I was staying at my dad's house, I caught myself raising my voice when my dad was being verbally abusive to me and abruptly driving back to my house (2 hours away) just to escape for a while. I worked on this over and over again in therapy, but I still feel like I let myself down for reacting so emotionally. I just do not yell. I do not believe it benefits anyone, and I am a firm believer in kind, calm words and actions. I did not use insulting or accusatory language and did my best to focus on how I was feeling as a result of how he was behaving, but it did no good. I could never get my message across.

I understand that there is a lot of frustration for the patient when it comes to the medical recovery process. However, from my perspective, my dad's behavior continually bordered on childish. He refused to listen to reason (even when I tried to explain what the nurses and doctors told him, as I attended every appointment with him), he refused to contact his nurse or doctor whenever he had any questions - just outright refused. He said repeatedly that they should call him and he shouldn't need to do anything. The sense of entitlement is astounding. I explained the concept of being one's own advocate for healthcare, and he essentially refused that concept, and said that he isn't a doctor so he shouldn't need to do that. I was dumbfounded by his reasoning on everything.

His surgery was mid-June. I returned home as soon as he was cleared to drive again. I missed my husband and dog. I missed being in my safe space, where I wasn't scolded for leaving water droplets in and around the kitchen sink (among countless other things). Since I've been home, things have been just as challenging between me and my dad, and my therapy sessions are indeed continuing more frequently.

For an example of how he has been since I've been home: He went to a local pharmacy to receive a high-dose flu shot (he did not call first). They explained that they did not have it ready and available in stock. So, he texts me, using rude language and tones, and said that I need to find a pharmacy in his town that has that particular flu shot available and that he isn't going to do it. Please keep in mind that he has a cell phone and good internet access and a computer at his house. I was working, so I do a quick Google search in his area for places that offer this flu shot, and I provide him with my suggestions. He was irate, said he expected me to call around, not just Google it, and he wasn't going to go to those places. So, when I was off work, I called around until I found another local pharmacy that had the shot in stock. I told him, and he only thanked me once he had been there, verified that they had it, and received the shot. Again, the entitlement is astounding. This behavior is a daily occurrence.

He continually needs reassurance and "plays games" and "tests" me to prove my dedication to him. It is utterly exhausting. No matter what I say or do, I am always wrong and I am not allowed to be correct on any matters. I am constantly torn. He has driven literally everyone else from his life and I am all he has left. My husband has been telling me for years that I need to cut him out of my life. I can't do that.

Has anyone else had experience with someone who just emotionally badgers continuously? I am tired.

[EnglishLavender]

Edit: The other parent to which I referred in my initial post is my maternal aunt, with whom I lived from the time that my mother passed away until I went away to college (my mother knew that her cancer diagnosis was terminal, so she arranged for my aunt to have primary custody when she passed. She and my father had been divorced since before I was born). My dad was there every day and supported my educational endeavors, but I did not live with him.

[GaGrl]

What kind of elder caregiving does your dad receive? If none, are there services you could help arrange?

[EnglishLavender]

My dad currently has no elder caregiving. He is 67, and still quite independent. He drives, owns and takes care of his own home, etc.

[GaGrl]

My dad currently has no elder caregiving. He is 67, and still quite independent. He drives, owns and takes care of his own home, etc.

 In that case, it might benefit you most to do some personal work on boundaries. Your dad is having you do too much, and he is infringing on your personal and work time for things that are not urgent.

What boundaries have you had in place that have worked for ypu ?

[EnglishLavender]

I have basically no boundaries. I struggle with feelings of guilt, so I have had trouble with boundaries. This is also something I have been working on in therapy, but I am still not comfortable with setting boundaries. It’s a never ending guilt-centered thought cycle for me. My dad has no one else. I have tried before, but he accuses me of not wanting anything to do with him and always says, “ I would never DREAM of [doing that or saying that] to my parents.” So it makes me feel awful.

[Methuen]

I could never get my message across.

Right, and you never will, so it's best to accept that you can't change him, but you can change how you react to his unreasonable demands.  Are you familiar with "don't JADE" with a BPD?
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=139972.20
JADEing invalidates a pwBPD, and just escalates a conflict.  On the other hand, JADEing is a pretty typical form of communication amongst emotionally healthy people.

So, he texts me, using rude language and tones, and said that I need to find a pharmacy in his town that has that particular flu shot available and that he isn't going to do it.

Right.  So a thing I had to learn, was that I didn't have to drop what I was doing and run to tend to my uBPD's mom's demands.  I've worked on that over the last year, and I am doing so much better now.  I just tell her when I will be available, and that's when I get things done for her.  Surprisingly, she has adjusted.

I too am an only child (58), and a year ago, my 84 year old mother fell under her plum tree on the grass (she lives independently in her house), and fractured 4 bones in her pelvis and sacrum.  I cared for and tended to her daily for 6-8 weeks.  The harder I tried to support, help, make her comfortable, run her errands, pay the bills, take her to appts, the more abusive she became.  One day on the way to her doctor's appt, she screamed at me (while I was driving) all her pain was my fault.  By the end of that 6-8 weeks, she was healing, but I was broken.  From my experience, the harder you try, the more abusive they become.  I had to learn boundaries.  I ended up arranging home care and community care for my mom, because I wasn't able to do it anymore.  Surprisingly for me, she suddenly became "better", and cancelled all the arrangements I had made, and healed and somehow managed on her own.  They are adults.  They are surprisingly able, yet surprisingly gifted at making us feel responsible for their feelings (happiness, anger etc), and for having their "needs" met.  Another thing I had to learn was to let my mom feel her own feelings, and differentiate from her.  You mention that your dad's demands are a daily occurrence and you are tired.  He's not going to change EnglishLavender, so what can you do to get back some control of your own life?  

I'm feeling for you, I really am, because I know what's it's like to care for an aging BPD parent.  I too am an only child.  This site has lots of helpful tools for us, that really do work.  It can get better.

[PearlsBefore]

By the end of that 6-8 weeks, she was healing, but I was broken.  From my experience, the harder you try, the more abusive they become.  I had to learn boundaries.  I ended up arranging home care and community care for my mom, because I wasn't able to do it anymore.  Surprisingly for me, she suddenly became "better"...

It does seem to be a common underlying theme in much of the literature on BPD, that they will not only attack the person who is doing the most to help them - but the viciousness of the attack will correlate to how much help is being offered.

One of the dBPDs in my life explained it (while what we term "lucid" without the official meaning) that her faulty logic while in a "BPD fit" is that looking back on the assistance I offer, means she must need help and be unfit...so to prove to herself that she is healthy, she lashes out - often physically violently, to drive off anyone helping her just to "prove she can".

So on a completely related topic, fellow caretakers of BPD...who among us gets enough hours of sleep in a night? ;)

[Methuen]

One of the dBPDs in my life explained it (while what we term "lucid" without the official meaning) that her faulty logic while in a "BPD fit" is that looking back on the assistance I offer, means she must need help and be unfit...so to prove to herself that she is healthy, she lashes out - often physically violently, to drive off anyone helping her just to "prove she can".

Huh.  That makes a lot of sense with BPD.  I can honestly say now, after the fact, that I have some gratitude for my moms abuse (which broke me) while I was giving her all that support, because it became crstal clear to me that something was wrong, and it led to me finding a new T, this site, and a year of personal growth that has let me take back agency for my life.

who among us gets enough hours of sleep in a night? ;)

Not me while all that was going on.  I actually sleep much better now, believe it or not.

[Methuen]

So PearlsBefore, I am still thinking about this:

One of the dBPDs in my life explained it (while what we term "lucid" without the official meaning) that her faulty logic while in a "BPD fit" is that looking back on the assistance I offer, means she must need help and be unfit...so to prove to herself that she is healthy, she lashes out - often physically violently, to drive off anyone helping her just to "prove she can".

Wow.  Just, wow.  Thanks for sharing that.  Firstly, it explains the distorted thinking.  Secondly, the dBPD in your life told you this! Are they recovered?  DBT? Just, wow.  This really struck a chord deep within me.

It does seem to be a common underlying theme in much of the literature on BPD, that they will not only attack the person who is doing the most to help them - but the viciousness of the attack will correlate to how much help is being offered.

This perfectly describes my experience.  I quote it here to draw attention to it, for EnglishLavender who like many of us, have tried so hard and with care to support our BPD loved one, only to be hurt.  I'm not saying don't support them, because we wouldn't be true to ourselves if we did that since we are caring people, I'm just suggesting that there are proven strategies (on this website) for interacting, communicating, and managing a relationship with our BPD SO, so that we can also look after ourselves.

[zachira]

I find that people with BPD and/or NPD get very insecure when they see that their targets are developing healthier boundaries with them and that the targets are no longer fooled by the facades. Thus the healthier the targets get, the more enraged the people with BPD and/or NPD become, thus the targets have to increase their distance and set even healthier boundaries, a never ending cycle, unless no contact is established, which often is not possible.