Detached but very hard to start learning.

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

I know I have to concentrate on moving on.
I know I have to get some mojo back in my business game.
I know all this.
I have a lot of excuses at the end of the work day. I’m tired, I’m exhausted and dirty and soaked to the bone in sweat. I just want to sit on the porch with the dogs with a cold beer, so I do.
  I think I should sell the house and move. And it reminds me of a an old “New Yorker” cartoon with two poor people sitting outside a  mobile home and the dude saying “we should just pack up and move to a better place. (Paraphrasing).
It wasn’t even funny. It was reality. You can’t move away to escape what’s in my head.
  There is now easy off ramp after years of these relationships.
It does slowly get calmer but the sadness hole is deep.
  I know she is out there. Like the hurricane down south. I know she will re-emerge in a fury that will defy all logic although I am doing nothing but sitting with the dogs. Just know it’s coming.
   

[Goosey]

I know I have to concentrate on moving on.
I know I have to get some mojo back in my business game.
I know all this.
I have a lot of excuses at the end of the work day. I’m tired, I’m exhausted and dirty and soaked to the bone in sweat. I just want to sit on the porch with the dogs with a cold beer, so I do.
  I think I should sell the house and move. And it reminds me of a an old “New Yorker” cartoon with two poor people sitting outside a  mobile home and the dude saying “we should just pack up and move to a better place. (Paraphrasing).
It wasn’t even funny. It was reality. You can’t move away to escape what’s in my head.
  There is now easy off ramp after years of these relationships.
It does slowly get calmer but the sadness hole is deep.
  I know she is out there. Like the hurricane down south. I know she will re-emerge in a fury that will defy all logic although I am doing nothing but sitting with the dogs. Just know it’s coming.
   

[JNChell]

I’m jealous. Im a dog person. I don’t get dog action unless I go to my best friends house. Lizzy and Tilly are South African Boerbals. Big girls. Gunner is a rescue coon dog that got left in the woods. In my opinion, Gunner would take a limb. He’d also take your burger.

I get the end of the day. Tired and done. You’re right moving away will not outrun the memories.

Your story is interesting, but it’s hard to decipher. What’s in your head?

[Rev]

I know I have to concentrate on moving on.
I know I have to get some mojo back in my business game.
I know all this.
I have a lot of excuses at the end of the work day. I’m tired, I’m exhausted and dirty and soaked to the bone in sweat. I just want to sit on the porch with the dogs with a cold beer, so I do.
  I think I should sell the house and move. And it reminds me of a an old “New Yorker” cartoon with two poor people sitting outside a  mobile home and the dude saying “we should just pack up and move to a better place. (Paraphrasing).
It wasn’t even funny. It was reality. You can’t move away to escape what’s in my head.
  There is now easy off ramp after years of these relationships.
It does slowly get calmer but the sadness hole is deep.
  I know she is out there. Like the hurricane down south. I know she will re-emerge in a fury that will defy all logic although I am doing nothing but sitting with the dogs. Just know it’s coming.
   

Hey Bro,

You just keep doing what you need to do - and eventually the ruminations have less sting. This is a marathon and not a sprint... And sometimes you just walk and catch your breath - maybe even stop and bend over until the stitch leaves and then start up again.  But not matter, just keep moving until you hit that clearing and then you'll know it's time to process all this out. 

In the meantime...  yeah - this is can be hard. 

You got this.

Rev

[Goosey]

They girls as I call them haha.
The dogs are are both rescues. Both big.
A maremma (like a Great Pyrenees)
And the true gentle giant in the house a St. Banard
The girls have the life. It’s calm here now, they get plenty of care and attention and the air is on to keep them cool.
  The girls.
something to keep me focused.
Actually came back on the porch and Lucy is barking at me it’s bedtime.
   My wife took her dog. My (our) daughter and I worry about that dog.
  So I degress. This is hard stuff. Not the normal divorce stuff. This was insanity stuff.
   But ok I know that now. I won’t chase insanity anymore. I’ll be reasonable and fair if contacted but it’s doubtful I’ll get thrown fully upside down again. 
    She (wife) texted our daughter to look for a bed frame in the attic.
  No pleasantries just to look for it.
I feel my hackles rise.
But just told the kid i would look and changed the subject
Not worth the brain damage.
Ok lucy(st Barnard) is now barking in my face and knocked the phone away  haha. Time for bed!  God bless em. Good night.

[JNChell]

Those are very big breeds. I’m glad that you have them. I’m in an apartment. No dogs allowed. A well raised dog is something to behold.  Validate a dog properly, no leash required.

It’s not okay for messages to be passed between the kids. I’m not sure how to change that, but maybe tell your kiddo that she doesn’t have to be the messenger. Know what I mean? Take it off of their back.

[JNChell]

What’s on your mind? It is hard to start learning new things and different ways. What is it with you?

[Goosey]

What is in my head at this point?
Resignation to the situation.
 Waiting  on courts to dissolve marriage.
Figuring out if I can provide house for daughter and girls (dogs) in next faze.
    Sad. (Unless working haha.)
      Resigned.
        Moving on  (ok , just thinking) about trying to take care of my self a bit.
            Restraint.  Period.  No contact. Period.
  I haven’t taken the bait in months. It reduced to nothing. No chum for me to twirl around on.
                   And back to resignation.  
  Don’t know her at all.  
She told me that couple years back and she is right.
Total stranger.

[Beth2468]

Hi Goosey
I hope today is a better day for you.

Please be kind to yourself, of course you are tired, normal life is hard enough, without global pandemics. Doing all the right things in terms of recovering is also exhausting.

My T often says "ask yourself, what do I need?"  I decided that what I need this week, after forcing myself to eat, keeping busy, reaching out, living in the moment (doing all the right things) was do do absolutely nothing because I am exhausted.  So that is what I have done, it has been helpful but when I do nothing almost all my thoughts are of him. I'm calmer, but as you say, that sadness hole is deep.

You are right that you can't run from yourself, but would moving home be a positive step?

[Goosey]

I would like to keep the house. It’s a good location for my business. I busted my butt getting it to this point. There is a couple acres so the dogs have a good roaming area.
   I will try to negotiate a “buy out”. That is coming soon I assume. There is no way for me to have a sit down with my wife it would be out of control. So I’ll let the lawyer handle that part. 
   Today is better. Started tough. Had to deal with an business issue. But somehow it just all worked out agreeably for all parties. Amazing how calm people can accomplish things. .
  Wife did leave a voice message out of the blue. It was the usual sarcastic put downs on me. And I did... nothing. I have no inclination to defend myself against her attacks. She is mirroring me.   Had a long discussion with myself driving home from work. It was productive! I won’t fall into the trap of communicating with her.
   Life will go on. Up to me to join in at some point.
Have a nice evening. Storms blowing through but it cooled down so always an upside.

[FindingMe2011]

Don’t know her at all. 
She told me that couple years back and she is right.
Total stranger.

13 year marriage and I got the same truth. If I did, she knew I wouldnt have been there. She knew my core was good, and in some ways she was jealous of me and the children. I started therapy at the end of the r/s and I think she knew it was only a matter of time. I also remember telling her that I would figure this out. I did.

Wife did leave a voice message out of the blue. It was the usual sarcastic put downs on me. And I did... nothing. I have no inclination to defend myself against her attacks. She is mirroring me.

Not mirroring you, somebody  else...She is just trying to create conflict as the illness dictates. Looking for triangulation and the best response is no response. It leaves the conflict where it belongs, her head...


Life will go on. Up to me to join in at some point.

You did a good deal at work. Have your daughter, dogs and some nice property, not so bad. Your surviving, get through the divorce and learn how to live. Be vigilant, understanding, patient, have a vision and watch it become true. I wish you well, Peace
 

[Goosey]

Today is one of those rumination days.
  Why? Why can’t I just move on. Why do I get into the “what if’s”.
Am I really as horrible as she made me out to be? How could I have spent two decades scrambling to keep up with the constant crisis she seemed to perpetuate and now wish I could try again? How can I think she even has these same thoughts when I know she has been with others and has no interest in our daughter or her family or old friends.
  What the hell is wrong with me!
  I just spend hours shaking my head in disbelief to it all. Discarded, everyone, not just me.
  I gotta get  my head out of my butt I have to survive and not going to do it feeling like this.
 Don’t want to talk to T about it anymore. I know what I’m feeling is depression. I’m just lost. I spend years actually afraid of her and now I’m afraid I can’t shake this “stuck” I am in.
Got to, have to.   And don’t think listening to country music driving around in the woods was the right tact haha. Ugh.
Anyway it could be worse. Just have to get my head screwed on straight or it will be worse.
  I’m envious of happy couples. I liked being married to her. Shot gun wedding and all I felt like I had a “duty” to shelter and protect... ok I am running in circles. I’ll go chop wood and talk to myself. “Man yells at clouds”.
Have a safe day everyone.

[Rev]

Today is one of those rumination days.
  Why? Why can’t I just move on. Why do I get into the “what if’s”.
Am I really as horrible as she made me out to be? How could I have spent two decades scrambling to keep up with the constant crisis she seemed to perpetuate and now wish I could try again? How can I think she even has these same thoughts when I know she has been with others and has no interest in our daughter or her family or old friends.
  What the hell is wrong with me!
  I just spend hours shaking my head in disbelief to it all. Discarded, everyone, not just me.
  I gotta get  my head out of my butt I have to survive and not going to do it feeling like this.
 Don’t want to talk to T about it anymore. I know what I’m feeling is depression. I’m just lost. I spend years actually afraid of her and now I’m afraid I can’t shake this “stuck” I am in.
Got to, have to.   And don’t think listening to country music driving around in the woods was the right tact haha. Ugh.
Anyway it could be worse. Just have to get my head screwed on straight or it will be worse.
  I’m envious of happy couples. I liked being married to her. Shot gun wedding and all I felt like I had a “duty” to shelter and protect... ok I am running in circles. I’ll go chop wood and talk to myself. “Man yells at clouds”.
Have a safe day everyone.

Yell at the clouds all you want. I have heard that they actually like it. (haha). Ssly. Just wanted you to know that someone has read this.

Be safe as well.

Rev

[ForeverDad]

I would like to keep the house...
I will try to negotiate a “buy out”. That is coming soon I assume. There is no way for me to have a sit down with my wife it would be out of control. So I’ll let the lawyer handle that part.

Three possible outcomes... Either she gets the house, you get the house, or neither can afford the split and it gets sold with proceeds split.

Likely the only way she could get the house is whether she could afford to maintain it post-divorce.  That's a financial calculation, generally such things are overseen by the professionals.  You also need to beware of Gifting her way too much alimony.

For you to get the house you would have to be able to pay her off what is due her (depends on what the marital split is).  She may demand that if she doesn't get the house, then you don't either.  That's emotional perception, court and lawyers will decide on what can or can't be done.

The financial split — assets vs debts — is somewhat straightforward.  Usually that's done toward the end of the divorce.  (Our custody issues for the minor children often are what takes the most time.)  One thing to beware is that the professionals will rush to get the final details wrapped up and can let a lot of things fall through the cracks.

Final thought... We here are typically very fair and thoughtful people, unlike our disordered ex-spouses.  You may imagine that court will credit you for all your fairness and niceness.  Sorry, court expects some level of conflict and so ignores a lot.  I read this a few years ago... The poorly behaving person seldom gets consequences and the well behaving person seldom gets credit.

Reality check... Courts generally will look out for women more than men overall, so it's okay to focus on what is to your (reasonably normal) benefit.  You don't have to protect her from herself.

[Goosey]

Thank you for the reaffirming reality check.
Ya i am finally in the frame of mind that it’s gonna cost half the equity to keep the house.  I can piss and moan about all the secret credit cards and crap she did but in the end it’s just numbers. So one last 50 grand to “be gone” sounds logical at this point.
  She bleed all the other retirement and plans dry.
My fault I let her stampede my whole life and let that happen.
Oh well. At least it’s calm now. Priceless.

[JNChell]

You’re thinking right. You have to evaluate what is most important through all of this. I’m in the middle of this. My Son is the most important thing in my life. When I sit down and think about it with empathy and trying to understand, there is no question. No money or holdings could ever impede that. I’m fine with living poor if I’m able to see my child. The courts will decide that soon enough.

You’re a dog lover. My best friend has a couple South African Boerbels. Great dogs if raised properly.

[Goosey]

When I say “calm” I mean she isn’t here causing explosive situations. Of course there are still unresolved issues that are disturbing but no physical in your face intimidation.  
   Just have to say I feel sometimes this whole situation was planned (Incoherently) by her.
Something she blurted out after a staged medical emergency by her. “This isn’t going as I planned”. I’ll never forget that. And in the fog of it all I had that comment bouncing around for a year.
Like.”this is a game?).
Anyway. Ya compared to six months ago I’m in zen. Only money now I’m trying to keep emotion and fog out of my head. We shall see.

[JNChell]

That had to be unreal to hear! They always show themselves, but it’s not often that it happens at opportune times. Whether for ourselves or the courts. I can almost see disassociating from the comment she blurted out. That’s a lot to take in. I mean, a whole lot from one little comment that was probably yelled at you. You know, we built our lives, respectively on the commitment from our so called partners. Children are involved. A comment like that is hard to process and see it for what it is when rugrats are crawling around. Yet, standardized family law immediately blames the dad.

Emotion and FOG are hard things to deal with. The ex can’t feel, and God bless her for that, but her lack of emotions are now hurting a developing child.

[ForeverDad]

There is one financial source that is yours alone in just about every state as long as you don't merge or mingle it with martial funds - inheritance.  Keep any inheritance in separate, personal accounts.

[JNChell]

How’s it going for you today?

[Goosey]

I’m ok JNChell and hope you are also.
  I have come to the realization I’m gonna talk to myself for quite a while. I finally kicked myself in the butt and did all my business quotes and reach outs to get projects lined up. Of course I keep my personal turmoil in the down low I guess I’m just lucky people have been patient and still eager to get projects done.
 Work is the key. I absolutely know that I just have to keep focused. I feel useful and productive and appreciated when working.
  I feel dead the rest of the time.
   I do hear her in my head screaming at me what a loser and liar and unable and stupid and ... well you know the drill... during my rides between jobs.
    It’s amazing how that screws me up so bad. I know I’m not perfect (I’m the apologist even when not at fault) and I guess a part of me wants to argue with her (long gone except for a hand extended for money with the insults added for free) that I’m NOT all those things and YOU are a twisted lying cheat... ugh but I know that’s a dark hole of wasted ugly energy and I have to let this go.
   Anyway took the girls(dogs) for a ride through the pines, they love to hang out the windows and slobber all over the truck and come up between the bucket seats and flip my arm up for attention. I honestly would be a basket case with out two big dinner stealing trash can raiding shedding monsters.
   Anyway sorry for the run on sentence all is ok. One day this will get settled and I hope my mental state is better because I would really like to tell this woman what I feel. I was gaslighted for so long I did not know what way was up any more seriously.
  And after all the above I do hope she is ok and can keep herself sheltered and safe. (Why can’t I just forget her! I will never go back to the crazy! Lonely is better then crazy!)
So I’m ok haha. Hope we all are.

[ForeverDad]

"Let Go and Move On" ... easy to say but oh so hard to do.  Like so much else in life, recovery is a process, not an event.  Give it time and slowly you'll gain a better perspective.

[JNChell]

Hey, Goosey. Glad to hear that things are alright. The drive with your pups sounds nice. You’re going to be just fine. You have the drive for it. Keep pushing forward. 

[Goosey]

Working nights. Sleeping all day.
Sad. I’m just extremely sad and depressed about the whole mess.
  Maybe I should be angry and happy she is gone but I’m not. I know I did all I could but did I really? I know she has moved on because she has thrown it it my face. I know if I ever talk to her again she will say she hates me. I know I shouldn’t be treated so badly with the mental and physical abuse but I still miss her. I know I have now financially ruined and I’m sure when (if ever!) the divorce gets to the financial stage I have more stress coming. I know it’s over and I am just crushed. 22 years with a difficult woman and I know there where so many signs that things were not normal but she was my wife damnit so I just dealt with it best I could. I know she is probably in trouble financially and god knows what else and I tears at me. Why couldn’t she or her shrink let me in so I knew what to do! Why did I have to finally read “walking on eggshells” to see this destructive pattern she was living with. Why do they push you away when it’s the thing they fear most. Why why why why.
  Just want to sleep and not wake up.

[Rev]

Working nights. Sleeping all day.
Sad. I’m just extremely sad and depressed about the whole mess.
  Maybe I should be angry and happy she is gone but I’m not. I know I did all I could but did I really? I know she has moved on because she has thrown it it my face. I know if I ever talk to her again she will say she hates me. I know I shouldn’t be treated so badly with the mental and physical abuse but I still miss her. I know I have now financially ruined and I’m sure when (if ever!) the divorce gets to the financial stage I have more stress coming. I know it’s over and I am just crushed. 22 years with a difficult woman and I know there where so many signs that things were not normal but she was my wife damnit so I just dealt with it best I could. I know she is probably in trouble financially and god knows what else and I tears at me. Why couldn’t she or her shrink let me in so I knew what to do! Why did I have to finally read “walking on eggshells” to see this destructive pattern she was living with. Why do they push you away when it’s the thing they fear most. Why why why why.
  Just want to sleep and not wake up.

I could have easily written this...  I found the knowledge I gained hard to stomach at first too. It made me look at myself in ways of blame and shame.  I too asked, and still do ask...  WHY?

Keep asking.  Eventually, you'll get bored of yourself - or at least I became board.  It still hurts, some days more than others.  But much less now. 

Hang in there.

Rev

[JNChell]

Goosey, I promise you that it will get better. Time and self learning make a big difference. These feelings are acute because people like you and I were raised to feel things in this manner, and our exes were raised to deal things out just the same to our raising. A perfect disaster.

You’re holding on to a feeling. I get it. I did it longer than I should’ve. I hate to break it to you, but your ex isn’t able to feel the way you feel.


I totally get wanting to go to sleep and not wake up. You know, this stuff eats at the pit of our stomachs. The anxiety is insane. They feel nothing. How do we relate or even negotiate with someone like that? We don’t.

The members here, along with myself would appreciate a daily message from you. Is that reasonable?

[Goosey]

Yes that’s reasonable CNChell. (I know that was weeks ago you posted) (and thank you for your post)
I kinda just slid  away from posting.
  It’s a shame I’m too old (way) to enlist in the damn army. I really do need a boot on my head and an new indoctrination.
  Hope your well. I’m ok with the dogs.  I try not to say much anymore or really see anyone. I’m messed up with this all.
She is right I am f’ed up. And I let her do it to me.
  Empty nest don’t help. But blessing at same time, kid is happy and in love. Hope she makes it she can be angry about it so much.
  It’s stupid and boring and I’m sure I think about it 200 percent more then anyone involved.
  Just can’t shake it.
  Honestly.  I’ll say it.
I can’t get over the hate and accusations. I just want to defend myself instead of seeing what I am arguing with.
 I know I’m being stupid I just don’t want being hated by anyone and to feel that way about someone who destroyed me in every way is sad.
  I know what I have wrong in my head. I am a male and it’s hard to admit. Won’t even type it.
  Again sorry. I’m fine.
And mind you there is very limited email contact about bills and then nothing.
 Just she called me couple days ago and in 14 seconds just set me in a hole.
 Tomorrow is another day!  
Bless her energy to hate so much.