How does parent choose GC/Scapegoat?

[Please help]

Back story, f was 21 m was 16 when they had me. F threw M down stairs to miscarry me. Drugs, prison, divorce after they married due to me. Both blamed me for their life's calamities.

  Their parents saw them as victims and me as cause of their child being a screw up. Sort of like the bad influence friend a child brings home.

I moved between homes as a kid. Both parents remarried had other kids. Those kids ( I'm 50) either overdosed, are full blown junkies or are in prison. I have no full siblings.

Both my parents trash talked me over the 20 plus years I was no contact. Making up awful lies about me. That hurt more than the abuse of being around them.

 M od'ed a few years back.

F is a dry drunk but smokes week daily. Heavy coke user as well back in the day.

F had a few kids he later gave up custody as he didnt want child support payments. He was reconnected with them when they aged out of foster care.

One lives with him (S 35) and D in her 30's is married.

F came back around several years ago. He asked my cousin how I dress. Cousin did not understand question. He clarified " does he look lke he has money"
A short time later F is at my work. Telling me he's sober and I caused him lots of grief but hes over it. I apologized knowing hes severely ill.

This is what I find odd. Shortly after he talked a few times. He immediately started in on I am a jerk for not knowing is younger kids and I am full of hate.

I explained they can call anytime. He wasnt in touch with them for 15 years. I wasnt in touch with him or his ex wife. How would I know them?

He also insulted me for trying to be a hero and bury my M. I said its none of his concern.

I always called him out for his past behavior which of course he denies.
I 'm delusional, need help, etc. His latest was I'm a drug addict.

His son and his ex wife live with him and do drugs all day. They stole his car, totaled it, hitting another car then took off. Police arrested him. He proved he was out of town.

Another child ripped him off for 8-10k cash.

I bailed him out of jail over 10 times but he had seething hated for me. He seems to genuinely like the other kids who caused him so much harm.

Screaming he cant talk to me as I'm crazy, full of hate. I suggested counseling but he thinks I'm trying to trap him.

He says I'm a liar, cheat and thief always trying to beat people , etc. I  hate him because he knows truth about me, etc

Everything about me is wrong and bad. Cant trust me. He used to always say it when I was a kid as well.

I'm not in contact and we had a recent blow up. He told me never to contact him again. I was asking why he insulted me the years I was no contact? His friends told me what he said. 

In your experience, since I am not fried on drugs like everyone else, does he find this threatening? My brain waves do not match his. Thats why addicts hate people not on drugs. Brains work differently.

He is very paranoid about me. Accusations about everything. He's like that with others who are functioning. So its not just me. There was something primal about his hatred for me. He said he's the smartest guy in every room.

 Does it sound like this guy wants to be high and around addicts all day ? This is his comfort zone and dealing with critical thought / answering for his past actions is uncomfortable?

I highly doubt he's high-functioning with his other kids. I suspect money and drugs are a large part of the relationship.

Your thoughts please

 

[Please help]

One more thing- when he knows I find things  about he and his children ( arrested , etc) he is very angry. I can hear it in his voice. I know he lies about how great his kids are.  I have always been able to easily break his narcissist facade. As a child, I listened to his stories but asked questions because they didn't make sense.

The few awful years I lived with him, he acted like he was a gangster on Miami Vice. When I asked why he lived in poverty, he flipped out. I ruined his life,etc.

Thanks

[Notwendy]

I don't know exactly- there is probably research on this.

Parents with PD's see their child as an extension of themselves. Knowing how pwBPD can "split" all white or all black, and project, it makes sense that the scapegoat child is the one they project the qualities they are most distressed about themselves onto the scapegoat child.

Birth order, gender, may possibly have something to do with who is scapegoat too. It isn't about the child but about the parent's feelings.

BPD mother has said that as a newborn, I ignored her. Newborns don't "ignore" on purpose- they sleep a lot and they can't talk. So this is a projection of her feelings that have nothing to do with the actual situation.

I have also read that the scapegoat is the "truth teller". Our family was focused on hiding BPD mother's behaviors and presenting her as a "normal" and good parent. I went along with this because we were expected to do so. However, I also knew by adolescence that there was something going on with my BPD mother and that the behaviors were not "normal" and so it was harder to "convince". My father acted more like a parent to me so I felt more bonded with him than with my mother.

I think it's a combination of these things. Maybe others have more ideas to share.

[zachira]

How does a parent choose Golden Child/Scapegoat? In my family, there are GC/Scapegoats on both sides, and on one side at least six generations. In my experience, the golden children have something that the family values which will make the family look good to the world outside the family. In my family, it is having an extremely high IQ. The scapegoats are chosen for not being able to maintain the desired image that the family wishes to sell to the world outside the family. Once a scapegoat is chosen, then their children often become scapegoats as well. In my family, the first born are often golden children as long as they have a high IQ and children close in age to the first born are often considered to be less than the first born. One thing I know for sure, is that the narcissistic people in the family need the scapegoats to be able to put themselves on a pedestal and to feel superior to others. The narcissistic people do not have the ability to regulate their emotions, have deep shame beneath the grandiose image they try to present most of the time, and need a scapegoat to blame for how badly they feel inside.
I am a family scapegoat. I have rich relationships with myself and others, that the golden children and their flying monkeys are not able to have. It often takes the scapegoats nearly a life time to figure out why they are scapegoats. The pain that comes with being a scapegoat is a lifelong sorrow. What do you think are the main reasons certain family members are chosen to be scapegoats or golden children?

[Notwendy]

In my family, I don't think actual IQ played a part in it. I think it was equivalent. However, the GC was perceived as being the "smart one".

Personality played a part. I think I was the more strong willed child with the GC being more passive and compliant and so more easily managed by BPD mother.

Although, BPD mother denied the favoritism, it was obvious, and even family friends noticed it. As a child it felt hurtful and I was jealous and wished BPD mother was more attentive to me. As an adult, I am grateful to not be the GC. I saw how it kept GC more enmeshed in the family disfunction.

Neither position is in the child's best interest but I think it was easier for me to establish independence from my parents.

[Please help]

I think we have have an ability to determine who is and who is not like us

 I do recall a strong disdain for healthy people. My F would rip others down who were often functional.

This may explain his incessant attacks on me

He could not handle being held accountable for his actions.

 I'm grateful I went NC for 20 and very LC for past 8 or so.

  One can never expect closure or a light to go off and have a good relationship.

There is a DNA pull to want our bio family.

This is why we suffer. Our nature tells us one thing and the reality is it's not possible.

[Notwendy]

 I do recall a strong disdain for healthy people. My F would rip others down who were often functional.

There is a DNA pull to want our bio family.

This is why we suffer. Our nature tells us one thing and the reality is it's not possible.

As a kid,  I wanted to be independent and do things for myself- but also- I had to do that. BPD mother isn't a caretaker type so we kids had to be able to fend for ourselves.

Practice influences our skills- so in general- my skills such as cooking, fixing things, the day to day tasks we do- are better than hers but I think it's partly because we had to do them and also she wanted others to do them for her.

Oddly- I did wonder if there was a sense of her seeing that I am functional that is a part of her treating me the way she does?

[zachira]

Notwendy,
I have often thought that your mother must be terribly jealous of you. You are probably everything she would like to be and can't because of her BPD. My aunt who had BPD traits was very jealous of her daughter. On one occasion she decided not to invite her daughter to a family party. Her excuse was her daughter talked too much.  My aunt never really learned to cook and seemed quite helpless in many areas of her life. Her other children were doing all the cooking and invited their sister to the family party. My aunt's daughter was extremely popular in the little town they both lived in, whereas my aunt did not have any friends.   

[Notwendy]

Zachira- it's possible you are correct but I think my mother considers herself to be superior.  BPD mother has her own set of skills. She was very pretty and popular.

In the hierarchy of family- she took center stage as the "queen".That was her spot. Other family members were merely drones to the queen bee. As far as Dad was concerned, she was the center of his attention. There was no competition.

I could connect with Dad in other ways. He was brainy- I liked academics, so we could discuss them. BPD mother is intelligent but in a different way. Her social maneuvering skills are sharp. She wins out in relationship dynamics. I just know to not get close to anyone in her circle. 

It's possible that BPD mother may feel some jealousy but her narcisism would not allow for that. I think she believes she is superior- not just to me but in general. It may be that seeing me being functional challenges that - which prompts her to be critical to reinforce her sense of superiority. To her, I'm someone who could be useful to her but at a servant level.

Interesting you mentioned the party because a while ago the neighbors had a birthday party for my mother. I was visiting and she didn't invite me to come along. I was confused- I knew these neighbors and liked them. I eventually asked one of them why I wasn't included and she said I was invited- so it was my mother who didn't invite me, not them.

[CC43]

This is an interesting question.  I tend to think that family scapegoats possess something that the abuser lacks.  Maybe it's intelligence, friends, status, good looks, talents, happiness, athleticism, freedom or a sparkling personality.  They are jealous, and they lash out and try to quash you, in order for them to feel a little less inferior.  If they try to cut you down with insults that make no sense--they tell you you're stupid, useless, a liar, ugly, no fun, too needy, too talkative, and you'll never get anywhere--those are typically projections of their thoughts about themselves.  They might try to cut you down with thinly veiled insults disguised as teasing--is your childhood nickname Sud (for Stupid Ugly and Dumb), when you are the opposite?  If you recognize the pattern, their insults won't hurt so much anymore.  In fact, you might start to feel a little sorry for them, because they are so unhappy and insecure.  Sometimes it might reverse the relationship--the child becomes the parent, and vice-versa.  The parent needs constant praise and reassurance, and the child over-functions to keep the household running while getting little in the way of support or positive attention.  If this doesn't damage you permanently, you probably emerge incredibly strong, self-sufficient and very perceptive of others.  You probably recognize this behavior in others outside the family, and you know how to handle them well.  You are probably popular and successful at your pursuits.  Even if the abuser is outwardly successful in some areas of life, it just isn't enough to make him satisfied, and he's plagued with jealousy and resentment, always feeling inferior.

[Notwendy]

CC4- this may explain why my BPD mother "keeps me in the dark" even though I am her POA. It seems every time something is set up for her, she undermines it- establishing her own control and power. I think there's some strange need to set people up to help her and then undermine them maybe to prove this to herself and them.

It's like some strange dynamic- disempower the POA.

She also lies and witholds information from me. This way she feels she is "one up" with me. She does this with others too, so it's not only me.

[CC43]

Notwendy,

Oh yes, I can see how someone who feels out of control, and with no agency, would relish foiling your work or plans, and scapegoating you.  She might feel powerless, and so her only recourse is to exert power over you, even if in exercising that power, she's not acting in her own best interests.  I've literally seen the equivalent in one of my parents, who would toss a prepared meal on the floor.  They didn't get what they wanted, and they protested they only way they knew how.  This might be seen as "spoiling" behavior.  They literally have to spoil things, to simultaneously put you down and demonstrate they are in control.

Alas, I don't have any conventional talents, but one thing I do possess is "executive function."  I can envision a goal (even an ambitious one), and I can plan out a course of action to achieve it.  I can work diligently towards the goal, overcoming obstacles, maintaining focus and sometimes making sacrifices.  I know what I want and I work to go get it.  If I have to learn something new, that isn't a deterrent.  So I'm really good at figuring things out, getting things done and solving problems.  I have grit and perseverance, which are traits that are generally sorely lacking with BPD and NPD.

If you are anything like me, you might also have a talent for executive functioning.  If your mom sees that, she might be jealous of your life and many achievements, and she subconsciously wants to foil and spoil your efforts, lest you outshine her.  She might even try to sabotage you!  While this might not be normal, it does happen sometimes.  Does she try to "put you in your place" and knock you down?  Does she disrupt a friendly gathering you are hosting?  Does she tell others stories about you that could be considered disparagement?  Does she criticize you unjustly?  You might be dealing with a spoiler!

[Notwendy]

Notwendy,

If you are anything like me, you might also have a talent for executive functioning. 

Does she try to "put you in your place" and knock you down?  Does she disrupt a friendly gathering you are hosting?  Does she tell others stories about you that could be considered disparagement?  Does she criticize you unjustly?  You might be dealing with a spoiler!

Oh my goodness. While my mother seems to have difficulty with executive functioning, she seems to have exceptional ability to manipulate - so maybe it's selective executive functioning? I think I have good executive functioning but also, it could be due to having to figure out things for myself.

Yes to all the spoilers! I tried to host a get together for her and she almost didn't attend her own party. She also tells stories about me- the times I misbehaved as a kid, or her version of that- as if what kid doesn't ever misbehave? I didn't do anything terrible- just typical kid behavior.

[Please help]

My bio F is instrumental in helping his kids with life, custody issues, and other misc things.

I believe PD people enjoy those who need and don't challenge narrative.

I suspect almost all of us hate the brains and backbone to confront our PD parents and of course did not need them for much at all.


I'm thinking that may play a huge factor why we get demonized and they play loving parent to other siblings.

Many of us are also the oldest and may have seen PD parent is bad spots when they were younger.

Am I getting close ?

[Notwendy]

I believe PD people enjoy those who need and don't challenge narrative.

I suspect almost all of us have the brains and backbone to confront our PD parents and of course did not need them for much at all.


I'm thinking that may play a huge factor why we get demonized and they play loving parent to other siblings.

Many of us are also the oldest and may have seen PD parent is bad spots when they were younger.

Am I getting close ?

Yes. However, my BPD mother doesn't like the helping part- her need is for people to do things for her. However, I think this makes her feel less capable and she wants to be in control.

So whoever helps her has to also be submissive. She will be critical of what they do for her and be humiliating. She needs to dominate and control the "helping" person.

They say the scapegoat child is the truth teller. We weren't allowed to say anything about BPD mother but I could also see that her behaviors weren't "normal" parent behaviors.

Being the oldest may be about seeing it first. When all the children are small- the parent is the only example they have of parenting. They don't experience anything else. By the teen years, the oldest child goes to friends' houses, sees their parents, sees other adults and has a comparison, while younger siblings don't do this yet.

[Please help]

F wife tossed me out at 17/18. F didn't care. A year later , they were getting divorced and I let him stay with me, gave him money, got him out of jail 10 x plus.

He gave up parental rights to his kids from that marriage only to reconnect when they aged out of foster care

 He now gives them money , plays grandpa to them.

It does hurt as he says I'm a hole for abandoning them.

How was I supposed to stay in touch with them?

He came into my life looking for help, realized none was coming do started smear campaign again?

They steal his car, total it. He gets charged for hit and run, steal his money, rob his house. Yet, he hates me and will defend them to death.

Thanks for letting me vent

[Please help]

A possible slight breakthrough in my healing process ( possibly).

My F came back around after 20 years ( discussed in prior posts).

He quickly started with accusations.

I just realized he is doing the same MO as the few years I lived with him.

He tells me I'm full of hate, explains why I'm full of hate, I'm delusional,crazy,etc.

 He can't talk to me as all I do is start " making stuff up".

I'm totally insane in his opinion.

I ask for a 3rd person to meditate at his choosing.

He tells me he's " not falling into my trap".

I asked how we can break this cycle and move the conversation forward.

He tells me I'm too full of hate.

Just like when I knew him. I was no good, couldn't be trusted etc
If I'm correct, all he's done is hate and gaslight me.

He's still doing it.

He wants to feel like big man so his family of hopeless junkies is better than me. Gives him validation.

I don't really know or have any relationship with him. However, one does feel that " DNa pull" towards parents and siblings.

Please share insights


Am I close?

[Tangled mangled]

A possible slight breakthrough in my healing process ( possibly).

My F came back around after 20 years ( discussed in prior posts).

He quickly started with accusations.

I just realized he is doing the same MO as the few years I lived with him.

He tells me I'm full of hate, explains why I'm full of hate, I'm delusional,crazy,etc.

 He can't talk to me as all I do is start " making stuff up".

I'm totally insane in his opinion.

I ask for a 3rd person to meditate at his choosing.

He tells me he's " not falling into my trap".

I asked how we can break this cycle and move the conversation forward.

He tells me I'm too full of hate.

Just like when I knew him. I was no good, couldn't be trusted etc
If I'm correct, all he's done is hate and gaslight me.

He's still doing it.

He wants to feel like big man so his family of hopeless junkies is better than me. Gives him validation.

I don't really know or have any relationship with him. However, one does feel that " DNa pull" towards parents and siblings.

Please share insights


Am I close?

I was scapegoated due to a birth defect. I didn’t turn out perfect enough for my mum, but later on gears shifted and I was scapegoated because they felt I was behaving like I was superior to them. From a young age I tried to do right things, like not cheating at exams , taking drugs, drinking, or being promiscuous.
In hindsight, I was actually better than they were because amongst my siblings these  vices were common.

DNA Pull: I’ve successfully gone NC for almost 4 years- I live abroad and don’t see them. I speak with one or two siblings but I’m not very close to them at all. As for my parents, I don’t see any reason to reconcile or reconnect with them. I’ve made friends or created family with other relatives who are beyond my parents control.
So , no there’s no dna pull for me. I’m at peace

[Notwendy]

I don't know about a DNA pull but it seems from reading about children who were adopted wanting to find their biological parents- I think there's a sense of wanting to know our background, who we came from. The wanting a relationship with a parent- babies are born with an affinity towards the parent for their survival. A child will love even an abusive parent.

As adults, we can choose to not have contact with a parent- and not feel a pull-as Tangled mangled has, but I think it's a process- different for each person. Maybe that decision is quicker or less emotional for some people than for others.

I can relate to the trying to be well behaved, to achieve in school, to somehow attain the approval of a parent and yet that approval seeming evasive. I think this contributes to "people pleasing" behavior as an adult and that is something we can work on.

For me, this wanting approval was stronger with my father than my BPD mother. I don't think we ever bonded in what one thinks of as a mother- child bond. I don't think she bonds much with anyone. Since going NC with my mother would have to include my father, it wasn't something I would be able to do. I can relate to that kind of DNA pull with my father.

However, his relationships with people (besides my mother) were influenced by my BPD mother. For Please help- it's notable that it was your step mother who threw you out and then your father came up with false accusations. There's no way to know what your step mother has said to him.

I think it feels hurtful to be falsely accused. I wonder if your feeling of a DNA pull is actually a wish for validation, a wish to be "seen" for who you are, not  projections or fabrications. I realized at some point that BPD mother sees me through her projections. I can't change that. It's how she processes relationships. I have done a lot of good things for her but somehow she finds something about them that she claims is hurtful to her, even if there was no intent and they aren't hurtful. Because my parents were a pair, her perception influenced my father.

Seeing it this way, I don't have a DNA pull with my mother. I would want a relationship with her, if it were possible, but I have tried so many times and not succeeded that I don't think it is. For me, that was a process- a result of trying, and seeing that my efforts didn't work.

[Please help]

I have been giving this question some thought.

 My grandmother's on both sides were clearly bpd. They each were separated from bio M's during formative years and later married alcoholics.

They were much closer to their PD children than to the normal ones

There was a tendency to look down a bit on the normal ones