Could I be wrong about daughter's BPD?

[Pizzas123]

After trying to find an explanation for my daughters behavior the past few years, I recently came across information about BPD, and definately pegged her as a BPD.  The therapist I'm seeing confirms that this was probably what my daughter's problem is.

However, after reading many posts here from other parents, I wonder.  In many ways my DD seems atypical of a BPD. Many of the things parents are dealing with, we did not experience with our daughter.  For instance, she is now 30, and her behavior for the last 7 years has been terrible.  But as a teenager, she was no problem at all.  Happy, popular, hard working, no drugs or drinking, etc.  She has never been violent, or ever broken anything in anger, and she has never stolen anything from us.  Mouthy at times as a teenager, but just the typical stuff most people deal with.  No behavioral problems in any way.

Her problems started at about 24 years of age.  Yet  I keep reading here that as a child gets older, the problems seem to lessen.  Hers worsened.

My daughter developed an eating disorder when she started college, and that's when things started to go wrong, when her thinking seemed to be affected, although not to the extent it is now.  Despite the eating disorder, she was accepted at a top school, and graduated in 4 years with honors.  She immediately was hired by a company she had interned for. 

After this, she would change from job to job, at first very happy, then disenchanted.  She has never LOST a job, but she has quit many.  And this is when she started moving from relationship to relationship. At first they are the best thing to ever happen, and then about 6 months into it, they are horrible.  She always blames others for  her problems, and her impulsive decisions are always disasterous.  Once she met a guy from another country, and 3 months later quit her job, gave everything she owned away, and moved to his country.  One month later she was back.

She is manipulative, and lies.  She is accusatory, and sometimes verbally abusive. She is bulimic and a drug abuser, and promiscuous, although to what extent I'm not sure. She fits the profile in so many ways, and yet as I say she has never been violent, never broken anything in anger, and never stolen from us.  Could it be that her behavior is a result of the drugs she is taking that maybe mimics BPD?  Or does she just have a milder, more functioning form of this disease?  We actually rarely see her, since she lives in a different city, and totally supports herself, in fact makes very good money.  She alternates between praising us as the best parents anyone has ever had, to being horrible, unsupportive parents that she never wants to see again. Though she may not be a typical BPD, many of the posts from parents describing their BPD child could be written by me, it is so close to my daughter's personality.

What is your take on all this?  Any input would be much appreciated.  This site is such a godsend!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[lemon flower]

hi P,

according to your post your daughter definitely shows BPD-traits... .

to be diagnosed as BPD people should respond to at least 5 out of the 9 characteristics, not to all of them !

ofcourse only an experienced therapist can make a diagnosis, and often people suffer from several disorders, so it could be that she matches better with one of the "mixed" profiles... .

also I don't believe that BPD always comes out at a very young age, I think I read somewhere that it can also occur in (young) adulthood, and 23 is still young.

when people say that BPD disminuate with age, they mean a much older age, like when people are in their forties or fifties 

BPD is known to be very "heavy" for people in their twenties and thirties because they are still getting to know themselves and they have to built their own life at that age, since all this new responsibilities can be very stressfull, it is disbalancing them and that makes them do all those crazy things... .

[Pizzas123]

Thanks Triss.  I guess I keep hoping I might be wrong about her BPD.  I suppose not.  Latest adventure:  Left Husband of 6 months, cheated on him, then decided she made a mistake and desperately wanted husband back... . then got pregnant.  You see why I am hoping it might be drugs and not BPD.  I do believe she is off drugs, etc. now that she's pregnant, and she does seem nicer and calmer.  She does respond to more than 5 of the 9 traits, unfortunately.   I have read many people who have posted that their children showed much improvement as they hit 30... . I wish I were one of them!

[pessim-optimist]

I agree with triss that only a professional can give an official diagnosis.

At the same time - if your daughter fits the criteria, and you observe the behaviors typical for BPD, then you will most likely benefit from the tools and communication techniques on this site.

One thing to keep in mind is that you may not see all of the behaviors that members here describe. Also, there are different levels of severity of the disorder. Some people would not be diagnosed by a medical professional as having BPD, but have enough BPD traits to severely disrupt their lives and those of their loved ones... .

BPD is known to be very "heavy" for people in their twenties and thirties because they are still getting to know themselves and they have to built their own life at that age, since all this new responsibilities can be very stressfull, it is disbalancing them and that makes them do all those crazy things... .

Although we have many members with teenage kids who suffer from BPD, paradoxically the medical community is reluctant to diagnose people under 18 with BPD (hopefully that will change), because they are still developing... .

The typical age of onset is teens - young adulthood. But it is not uncommon to see the age of onset in early 30s... . That's what happened with my step-daughter, and we think it was triggered by the stress that her family was undergoing - transitioning from the military into the civilian life, relocating, trying to find a job etc., and all the insecurities that come with it.

Up until then, she seemed to be 'very difficult', but we did not suspect anything more. Then, when she started displaying bizarre behaviors and extreme reactions, even some short psychotic episodes, we concluded that something more serious was happening and found out about BPD... .

Then, when we looked into the past, we started seeing the slow formation of the disorder and some signs all the way back into her babyhood (they are often very sensitive).

As for her behaviors - she does not overtly self-harm, she does not steal or drink and doesn't do drugs. She might be considered 'high-functioning', however, I suspect that if her husband divorced her, she might become low-functioning very quickly, as she is not able to hold a job... .

[jellibeans]

Dear Pizzas123

Has your daughter ever seen a P or Therapist? She sounds very smart and high functioning but could there have been a trama in her life that she is not dealing with? Somethings there is a rape or some other event that can trigger pwBPD... . or sometimes there is no trama at all. Just want to add my 2 cents. I am sorry she is struggling so with her relationships... . hard not worry about our children even when they are grown.

[Pizzas123]

Yes, she saw a therapist for about 1 1/2 years when she first struggled with her eating disorders.  The concentration focused just on helping her overcome those issues. That was about eight years ago.  She just recently did start seeing someone again near where she lives.  So far only 3 appointments, so no huge sucess yet.  I figure it will take awhile for her to stop masking her true problems so the therapist can really see what's going on there.  So far she says the therapist thinks she just has extreme stress. 

I do wonder sometimes if there was some sort of trauma my daughter might have experienced that she hasn't shared with us, maybe in college or something.  I do see, as pessim-optimist said about her daughter, that all the way back to babyhood there was always something just a little off.  I always felt it in the back of my mind, but denied those nagging feelings and put them out of my thoughts.  Of course, it was not until a few years ago that these troubling behaviors really manifested themselves. 

I am going to review coping suggestions on this site right now, as my daughter just texted me that she's on her way here to spend the weekend.  Since her pregnancy, she's been doing that a lot more.  I feel my anxiety returning as I type... . Pray for me!

[pessim-optimist]

I am going to review coping suggestions on this site right now, as my daughter just texted me that she's on her way here to spend the weekend.  Since her pregnancy, she's been doing that a lot more.  I feel my anxiety returning as I type... . Pray for me!  

Thinking of you and wishing you a peaceful weekend (as peaceful as it can be under the circumstances). 

There is so much on this site, but the best ones for starters in your situation would probably be the workshops about Validation - tools and techniques, Validation - stop invalidating others, S.E.T. technique, and How do we become more empathetic to the pwBPD in our life?.

Those are really good starters to calm the pwBPD and let them know we listen and understand. Of course in the future you might need a lot of the other tools (boundary setting, how to not pick up an argument, how to stop circular arguments, how to take a time-out etc. when things are getting out of hand)... .

I can totally understand your anxiety building... . My heart would start pounding at the sound of the phone ringing, when we were having lot's of trouble with my SD, and she would call a lot... . Remember to breathe deeply, and do something that calms you down. 

[BioAdoptMom3]

How do you think she would respond if you suggested she see a doctor?  It could be BPD as she definitely has some of the symptoms (our DD has never been violent or threatened others either).  It could also be something like bipolar.  Either one is very difficult to see your loved one go through.  You have my   and prayers!

[jellibeans]

pizza123

It is good you are reading the resources here. I found that really helped my situation with my dd16. Defusing conflict and not letting things escalate to out and out war... . the rage was unbearable. I do think pregnancy does have a great affect on most people and sometimes it is good and then sometimes it is bad. Certainly she needs your support now more than ever and is probably feeling a bit nervous about the whole thing which is prefectly normal. I hope things go well this weekend.


Supporting a Loved-one with Borderline Personality Disorder

Helping a loved one with BPD seek treatment

Helping our children deal with trauma

[Pizzas123]

Thanks, everyone.  I mentally armed myself with good suggestions and coping techniques found here and recommended by all of you, for this weekend with daughter.  So I was ready - but the typical firestorm never came.  My daughter arrived, in a very calm state.  Usually she walks in loud and angry about traffic, about her job, etc. and takes our peaceful home to one of tenseness and agitation... . I'm sure you are all familiar with that scenario. 

Anyway, she was calm and subdued all weekend.  Not one conflict or fight.  I can tell she is very depressed (she

layed in bed and watched TV a lot), but when I had observations or advice (and believe me I try to tread carefully), she accepted these with a good attitude and no argument. 

She has every reason to be depressed, as she is pregnant and her soon to be ex-husband does not want to be with her, although he has reluctantly agreed to be involved with his child, when it's born.  He is not supportive of her, and for good reason, which I won't go into now, but you all can imagine.

I think being off marijuana, cocaine, & adderol has had a very good effect on my daughter.  I do believe she has stopped the drug use, because of the pregnancy.  I told her , "You seem so calm and easy going, like you used to be.  I felt we lost you for so many years, and now we have our daughter back again!".  She just said "Thanks, Mom".  Usually she would be insulted and start getting nasty, from a comment like that.  Am I living in a fools paradise?  Is it just the calm before another storm?  Is there sometimes a normal calm between the adulation phase and the angry abusive phase?  I am trying not to get my hopes up that this is a turning point, as I realize one weekend does not negate years of misery with her!     Thanks for listening, it is so helpful!

[jellibeans]

Dear Pizza

I think that is very good news. Do you think in her currant state she might be willing to get help and talk to someone? This might be a good time to introduce the topic to her.

I am sure she is very sad over her marriage disolving and with the baby coming it must be extra hard on her. I have read posts about other dd having a complete turn around when pregnant and that could be they usually give up the drugs and drinking etc... . I think too it is the hormonal aspect of things that improves the mental help.

What are her plans for the future? I think it is good she was able to come home for the weekend and recoop but how is she going to manage going forward?

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[mom59]

My daughter who is now 34 was a very level headed teenager and we had no issues with her but when she was around 20 and started dating this crazy and I mean crazy guy is when my problems started. He convinced her to leave, move in with him and not talk to us. For seven years she did not talk to us despite my many attempts. The she came back when she was homeless and I started noticing the symptoms of BPD. I wasn't sure what was wrong until some of my nurse friends who work with pysch patients told me she sounded like a borderline. It has been a roller coaster ride with her and again she gets mad at me for not giving her money etc... so she has cut us off again. She is very violent when she loses control so I can only pray she will find help. She has physically hurt us and stole from us. Yet I know she does love us but she can't regulate her emotions. On top of it she abuses benzos which makes the problem worse. I go to bed every night sick over her but try to keep busy. Otherwise, I would be depressed knowing I can't help her until she wants help.

[Pizzas123]

How will she manage with a baby?  That question haunts me every day.  She has a good job, but it is very demanding and she has to be ready to travel at any given moment, so how this will work with a baby I just don't know.  She lives in an extremely expensive area, and pays almost $1,400.00 a month for a tiny studio apartment in an old, grungy apartment building.  She has no extra money at the end of the month, so how will she pay for childcare?  And that's just the money part of this connumdrum. 

Her BPD is a huge component also, of course, although she is so much calmer now to the point that it is unbelievable... I wonder how long that will last.  She is seeing a therapist, and has had 3 appointments, but this doctor travels frequently, and DDs next appointment is not until the middle of next month.  At least she is willing to see someone, finally.

She knows she really needs us right now, but we are hesitant to help her financially, as we have so much in the past, since we've learned that much of that money went to drugs and partying.  UGH!  What a nightmare.  This poor baby, I am so scared for him or her.

Thank you so much for your input, everyone.  I'm just taking it day by day.   

[jellibeans]

I am sure these are all questions she has thought of herself Pizza... . the baby has had a positive impact on her and she is seeking help... . although you can tell how long this calm with last try to enjoy it while you can... . this is a happy time too

[lemon flower]

I'm just taking it day by day.   

glad to hear that 

this pregnancy could be an eye-opener for her and if she worries I'm sure you'll be there to advice her!

maybe that can be the moment you can discuss post-natal aid from a social assistant or some kind of nanny and if that works out she might consider a more permanent form of assistance for her and the child... .

[Pizzas123]

My daughter actually makes too much money to qualify for any kind of aid. I checked into it and she just doesn't qualify.  All childcare will be on her, and it is EXPENSIVE! How will she manage is anyone's guess at this point.

Well, the good thing is that this pregnancy, so far, has had a calming effect on her BPD. I hope it holds... . this is like being on a rollercoaster, and I don't like roller coasters... .   I like the nice slow Merry-Go-Round!  I didn't sign up for this crazy life!

[pessim-optimist]

How far along is she? The good news is - after January, she will be eligible for a tax credit and so some of the expenses might even out a bit... .

I know - we did not sign up for this and yet are along for the ride. 

[Pizzas123]

She is 4 months along... .

[mama62]

Hi,

I don't think you are wrong.I am new here myself so don't know what value my words have but all I can say is that my daughter who has recently been diagnosed with BPD has similar traits to the ones you describe in your daughter.

My daughter was really a very quiet mousy little girl.Although as a teenager she suffered from depression.Well that was what was diagnosed.She was on antidepressants for a number of years.She was also cutting herself at that time.All the time this was going on she was well behaved and polite.She was not into alcohol or drugs or anything of the sort.She did well at school and college.She is still doing quite well with further studies but there has been a change in her behaviour in the past 2 years.She is 26 years old now.She has been drinking very heavily in the last 2 years.As she is living away from me I have no other knowledge about her lifestyle now as she has become very secretive.She lies all the time.

She is very reckless and takes all sorts of risks.

I hope that everything with your daughter turns out all right.

[Pizzas123]

Thank you, mama62 and everyone.  My daughter has been coming home now most weekends... . she is almost at the 5 month mark in her pregnancy.  She is looking for a new place to live that will have room for the baby, and is closer to work.  No sucess so far.  Very worrisome.  I still have no idea how she will work this out.  My husband still swears it will fall in our lap, like it always does, with her.  But the one thing - I don't know if it's stopping the drinking and drugs, or if it's hormones - but she is a much calmer, nicer person.  Barely any fights, and although she is still resistant for the most part to advice, she doesn't go off when I do offer it, like she normally does.  I worry about her returning to the bulimia, drugs and drinking after the baby is born... . she made some statement yesterday that marijuana is accepted and legal now, so it's not a big deal.  UGH!  At least she has given it up during her pregnancy.

Thanks to all of you for your kind words of advice.  I am trying to practice forcing positive thoughts, but in the back of my mind, the realistic side of me is bracing myself for the next catastropy!