Can a pwBPD go back to idealizing you after she has been devaluing you?

[BorderlineMagnet]

Me and my high-functioning ex pwBPD had a very strong bond, and friendship. I was not her dysfunctional norm. But at the end even though she was saying she loved me still, just needed time to think, I could tell I was being devalued. She even said it was not fair to me to be on the backburner of her life. Now that were apart, and she's idealizing the new normal dysfunctional guy she's found, and also doing the intense thing with him that she did not do to me, do you think it's possible for her to be back to idealizing me at some point? Or am I going to be devalued for good?

[HarmKrakow]

Me and my high-functioning ex pwBPD had a very strong bond, and friendship. I was not her dysfunctional norm. But at the end even though she was saying she loved me still, just needed time to think, I could tell I was being devalued. She even said it was not fair to me to be on the backburner of her life. Now that were apart, and she's idealizing the new normal dysfunctional guy she's found, and also doing the intense thing with him that she did not do to me, do you think it's possible for her to be back to idealizing me at some point? Or am I going to be devalued for good?

From a factual kind of point yes. Based on reality they can, this might happen the moment you push them away, chose for yourself, get a strong sophisticated life which will show her that she is completely not needed. Get in shape, date others, completely forget about her emotionally, and *shebang* there she might be again. It has the highest % chance of them idealizing you again

From my point of view and my line of reasoning, you should not ask the question could she idealize me again but how can I make sure my hapiness, my life and my needs are not dependent on her.

[Mightyhammers]

Before me and the ex got together, and indeed before we met, she would ‘end’ things by saying stuff like ‘you aren’t the man I first thought you were’ ( she came back to me 6 months later ), ‘you obviously don’t care that much for me’ ( back 3 months later ) ‘I don’t need this stress’( back 2 months later ) – now I have been told ‘you wont see or hear from me again’, will she come back at some point? Well from what has previously happened I would think yes, even though this time is a little different as we have actually had a physical relationship together.

Just try and concentrate on yourself and not hang on by your phone waiting for her to get back to you – easier said than done I know. I also decided over the weekend to make my FB profile private, after checking into every place imaginable as I know shes been checking it out, so she’s been seeing that Ive been out and about and enjoying myself without her, but now she’ll just have to guess, sorry Im digressing. In answer to your original question I think yes it does happen, just invest time in yourself and get out as much as possible is the best medicine

[hithere]

Yes, often in the push/pull dynamic when they pull they will idealize you again.  I found the idealization on pulls got shorter and shorter each time.  As boundaries were crossed when fighting and the idealization would only last hours or days.

[mitchell16]

yes mine did. Just about every pull cycle. I was the greatest again, I was the best, she loved me more then anybody else in her past. Blah, blah, blah. She owuld even go as far to say she was sorry and it was all her fault and how she now seen her mistakes and she relized what she had once I was gone.

But each time that phase was shorter and shorter. During our first year together she broke up with me about 6 times. each time I cmae back it was pure heaven. Since dec 26, to about 5 weeks ago she broke up with me 4 times. She started back idolizing me but with 2 weeks or so I was back to being lower then bottom of the ocean. So, yes they can but it cant and wont last.

I think this time its done, from both of our point of view. Me, Im tired of it, I will not keep aloowing myself to be abused. From hers, I had set up a boundry of her getting therapy teh last time she recycled me. I said before we go further we need therapy or no point. she agreed. but after one session she said she wasnt doing it anymore. That was it. From what I know about BPD this is the norm. The will start it but very rarley finish it.

[hithere]

I had set up a boundry of her getting therapy teh last time she recycled me. I said before we go further we need therapy or no point. she agreed. but after one session she said she wasnt doing it anymore.

My experience exactly!

[BorderlineMagnet]

Thank you all for your advice on this One of my ex's w/BPD I was with for 5 years, your typical low-functioning nightmare, took about a month to call me after I made her leave for good. To this day she still is trying to get me back but I will have no part of it. My current ex w/BPD is very high-functioning, and we really had an amazing 10 month fwb/friendship/relationship with literally no fighting. I think I was just too much what she wanted. Her fear of abandonment and her fear I wouldn't except her kids caused her to stray back to the type of loser she's used to. My fear is since I confronted them both (told him that she was still with me when they were together) will get in the way of her seeing me for who I really was to her again. I could hear the shame in her voice the last time we talked on the phone, and almost a sob of regret when I revealed I wanted to spend my life with her, so I don't know if these things will matter at some point.

I know a lot of people her talk about moving on, and I really respect that. I did with the previous ex. But this girl is special to me, and I believe she told me she had BPD as a subtle warning, a kind of "if I hurt you I'm sorry, I don't mean it". If she hadn't had told me I probably would have never known. So I'm hoping that after her idealizing/intense/whirlwind thing she is doing with this guy (which she did not do to me, we took our time forming a bond before even dating) she will try and get in touch with me. It's been a month since I saw her yesterday, and 3 weeks today since we had that last talk on the phone. I hate the feeling of waiting, and I have been living extremely healthy. Working out 5 days a week, and eating very well. But I'm so afraid that she and her kids will get hurt by this man this is obviously just with her for sex.

[paperlung]

My ex did, but each time it would happen, the whole push/pull thing would last longer.

The first time it happened, we had been dating for maybe 4-5 months at that point. One evening I get a call from her telling me it's over. I was flabbergasted. We never argued, got along great, and I did nothing that I can recall to trigger this. She just told, "I don't feel the same way I used to about you anymore. The spark is gone. We can't relate. We're too different." I was crying and I was confused. Not even 12 hours later, she calls me back to apologize and say that she was just being her stupid, depressed self. We were back together and she was in love with me, again.

The second time happened I think a month or two after that. She began working as a cam model online around this time and spent the night talking to one her "customers". Well, the next day she sends me a text to say it's over. Again, I was very shocked and confused. She told me she had been talking to this guy and it made her realize that we shouldn't be together because, like before, the spark was gone, she felt like she couldn't relate to me, didn't have enough common interests, ect. This time, however, I didn't shed a tear because I felt that I'd be hearing from her again soon with another apologize. She did just that the next day.

I'll post the next two, more extreme happenings later as I'm using my phone.

[BorderlineMagnet]

Paperlung,

I've read your story and I feel for you so much. My previous ex w/BPD is exactly like yours. I just found out today her parents are cutting ties with her for good now, and she's only 28. It is so depressing. And I know she will try and get me to help, but I am going to have to turn my back on her now too. I can''t watch her waste away any further.

The most recent ex pwBPD is the one I'm stuck on now. She was never mean to me in anyway, other than her infidelity and leaving. I really do hope she reconnects because I still love her so much, and I don't want to see her get hurt or her children to have to grow up in the midst of constant dysfunction with trashy men, who are only using their mom for sex. I would be her pillar, and help her raise her kids to the best of my ability and give them the best life possible. It's not my responsibility, but I choose to want this. With her being high-functioning though, I am afraid she will not fall into the traditional push/pull routine. She did fall into the intense/whirlwind scenario with her new guy, which makes me think she might burn out on him soon. But I am respecting her NC wishes for now. If I don't hear from her by near the end of May (her birthday) I thought I might send her a birthday email, telling her that she is still special to me, there's no hard feelings, and I hope we can start all over someday. I believe everything she said about me being different from the guys she's been with before, so I cling to hope that I will be the one she returns to.

[paperlung]

Paperlung,

I've read your story and I feel for you so much. My previous ex w/BPD is exactly like yours. I just found out today her parents are cutting ties with her for good now, and she's only 28. It is so depressing. And I know she will try and get me to help, but I am going to have to turn my back on her now too. I can''t watch her waste away any further.

The most recent ex pwBPD is the one I'm stuck on now. She was never mean to me in anyway, other than her infidelity and leaving. I really do hope she reconnects because I still love her so much, and I don't want to see her get hurt or her children to have to grow up in the midst of constant dysfunction with trashy men, who are only using their mom for sex. I would be her pillar, and help her raise her kids to the best of my ability and give them the best life possible. It's not my responsibility, but I choose to want this. With her being high-functioning though, I am afraid she will not fall into the traditional push/pull routine. She did fall into the intense/whirlwind scenario with her new guy, which makes me think she might burn out on him soon. But I am respecting her NC wishes for now. If I don't hear from her by near the end of May (her birthday) I thought I might send her a birthday email, telling her that she is still special to me, there's no hard feelings, and I hope we can start all over someday. I believe everything she said about me being different from the guys she's been with before, so I cling to hope that I will be the one she returns to.

This last part reminded me of Belief #6

6) Clinging to the words that were said

We often cling to the positive words and promises that were voiced and ignore or minimalize the negative actions.

“But she said she would love me forever”

Many wonderful and expressive things may have been said during the course of the relationship, but people suffering with BPD traits are dreamers, they can be fickle, and they over-express emotions like young children – often with little thought for long term implications.

You must let go of the words. It may break your heart to do so. But the fact is, the actions - all of them - are the truth.

[BorderlineMagnet]

I knew not to believe the words of my previous ex pwBPD, because they were meaningless. The current one was much different. An extremely high-functiong invisible type. And I really am different than the other guys she's been with. She has had a string of deadbeat, white trash, abusive men. And I've confirmed this w/ friends of hers. I even met her ex husband and... .   yikes. Also I wondered why her mother was so excited when she met me. I think it's because she knew how different I was. Stable, job, in school, my own apt., puppy owner, ambitious, I have goals. Towards the end I could tell she was remorseful that she was hurting me by being inconsistent. She said as much, and the higher-functioning ones do have longer moments of clarity. The big thing I noticed is that even though we had this confrontation on the phone that her new guy made her have ( I think she was avoiding me because she didn't wanna hear me hurt, or couldn't handle it herself) as that neither of u were mean. She was flustered, mad, but I also heard shame. And an emotional response when I told her how much she meant to me and what my plans are. With this girl it was all about abandonment issues. She was so afraid that I wouldn't want a family some day, that I would just up and leave her and her kids. She directly told me this. She didn't cut me off right away when she started seeing him because I believe she wanted to keep me on the sex back burner, since we had really started being friends based on good sex. I know I might be clinging to hope for nothing, but being higher-functioning I hope she gets that moment of clarity and sees me as the safe place she saw me before. As that different guy who was so sweet to her. She never did the worship thing, so there weren't any real crazy infatuation statements to cling to. It was like a regular relationship, which is why this caught me so off guard. But a borderline is a borderline, and they can't help who they are and what they do eventually.

[paperlung]

Let's say she did realize she made a mistake and asks you to take her back. Wouldn't you at all be worried in the back of your mind about possibly being devalued and dumped again? Because that could very well happen. I know I had my guard up pretty high the last time she recycled me.

[BorderlineMagnet]

I would be very hesitant. She means the world to me, but I don't think I would ever want to see her if it happened again. The thing I would have to have for us to move forward would be she would have to agree to go to counseling with me. That would be a step in the right direction for gaining some of my trust back. The thing is now I would be very aware of her BPD. I actually, honestly forgot she told me she was BPD because of how good things were between us. She was nothing like my ex before her. She never said one mean or cruel thing to me, and seemed genuinely sorry for the times that she was inconsistent and I felt hurt. I would really have to calm her abandonment fears by telling her what I plan for the future, and showing her how much I want to be a friend to her kids. But yes, the doubt will always be there. It was crazy, today I thought I saw her at a restaurant I was eating at, and I began to shake. I avoided looking at her table the entire time till the end, where I had to make sure. It wasn't her. Facially this girl could be a twin sister, but I could tell it wasn't her. I felt so dumb afterwards. She really has a hold on my heart.

[mitchell16]

BorderlineMag, Its not easy as a matter of fact it had been one of the hardest things I have ever done. Going NC and when she threw out a line a few weeks ago. It was tough not to bite. She was great at wording the email so it was almost impossible to not respond. It was a mixture of being sorry, professing her love to me and also blaming. So it triggered in me the desire to express the same for her and also defend myself from the blame. But I didnt. After countless recycles in two years I have heard it all. Her blaming me, she excepting some responsiblity, how she was lost without me, how she couldnt make it without me, How I was the "one", to lets get married, she had a dream bout me and was worried, she found god, again, all her problems was because of hormones and needing surgery. But, once I was recycled. It was always the same thing again. All the promises were forgotten, all the words said, where taken back, absolutely no follow through on her behalf. Just empty words. In my eyes this women was everything, nothing I would do for or hadnt done. Including giving up my self respect, turning my back on friends, sacrficing all my own needs and it still wasnt enough. You could probabley be recycled and If so I hope for you that it turns out better then all mine. But read the boards and everyone stories, just about all the same. Some diffrences but the core of everything is the same. some will cheat, most will lie, manuplate, leave you when you need them the most, will paint you black in a heartbeat. I was told from people on these boards and I wished I had listen. I would be way past the pain and being enjoying my life. But I listened alright, I listened to her and she convinced me to take her back everytime, except this time.

[nylonsquid]

Yes.

I don't think you can ever be devalued for good. But the words you speak sound like mine. I loved her with every ounce of me but really, that on its own is a trigger for her. I think her loving you is as true as her not loving you. What she says to you as being special is what she is saying to the next guy. Why would you believe her feelings when she loved you and not when she runs to the next guy? Don't worry about that guy hurting her, you should be worried about him being hurt like you. Why wouldn't you believe her when she tells him he is special? You are choosing to believe what you want to. Both (loving and not loving) are true and I can see you are rationalizing to get back to her wanting you (the love to be needed). Which prompts another question: Why do you love to be needed?

[wanttoknowmore]

Nylon,

I agree with your explanation. I ,also believe that her love was real and now,her hate is equally real. Its about the timing... . at that time, she genuinely

loved me... . she was doing everything which one does when in deep love with someone... .   now, at this point .she is angry and hateful.

Its hard for me to hate her because I think she is unable to love me anymore.

Her mind has totally changed. She is not doing it to hurt me on purpose.

As laelle, mentioned somewhere, we are collateral damage ... . yes.indeed we are.

[BorderlineMagnet]

I guess my experience with my current ex pwBPD is a little different. I experienced no hate from her. Again, she is very high-functioning, so much to the point I actually forgot she told me she had BPD when we made it official. She kept coming back to the fear of abandonment if I didn't want a family someday. Sometimes borderlines blatantly tell you their fear or trigger. If I had experienced the hate, I might feel differently. But the night I had found out about her guy and messaged him, all I got from her was that I was childish for doing that. Which in itself was her projecting on to me, because I told her it was more childish not to tell me she found someone else when I had given her many opportunities when she was being inconsistent. What I got then instead was that she was confused, she needed time, and regret for how she had been so flakey. And the guy she's with? Maybe he is being told some similar things, but I doubt it's exactly the same. He is her normal pattern: white trash, bar guy that has been recently arrested. No school, no apparent ambitions outside of tattoo chicks and big boobs. And she's also doing the whirlwind thing with him that she did not do with me. We took our time, became friends first (even though sex was involved), dated, and slowly declared our love. I know she has low self-esteem, and probably an empty sense of self she validates with sex. I choose to stay in love with her. I choose to forgive her actions because they were not meant to hurt. And I could care less about that guy getting hurt because he's not in it for the long run, just for sex. It's painfully obvious. And I feel the words of kindness about how I felt about her, rather than cursing her out for what she did, will make an impact on her at some point. It did that night when I heard her sob and say goodbye in such a sad way. I have respected her no contact wishes and at this point I just pray that her higher-functioning half will remember how much love we did share, how supportive I was, and how much I told her at the end that a family is what I truly desire. So that is why I hope she can at some point get over devaluing me, if she ever really did, and reach out. One member described what she may be feeling as intense "core shame" for me catching her with her usual lowlife. If that is true, then maybe she can overcome her shame, and maybe it will be me that needs to reach out at some point and say "Hey, I think I understand why you did what you did, and I hope you can understand why I did what I did. You're still very special to me and I would love to start over someday. If you ever need anything don't hesitate to get a hold of me". It's been 3 weeks yesterday since we had that last talk on the phone, so it's just to soon to send that feeler out. I even had a dream about her last night, that she was a police officer and she protected me. But even in the dream when I asked her to hang out, I had doubts that she would. Is my dream a harbinger for her maybe coming back? I don't know. But I would have my doubts honestly. I would have to go to counseling with her to gain some trust back. It looks like I got the type of job I have been looking for today, since they are just waiting on background and drug test to come back. Living positive, clean, and staying healthy is starting to pay off. That's why I hope that dream is also a sign of good things to come, and another chance at this girl I love so much, who only hurt me out of fear she would be hurt first. I miss her dearly as even a friend, which we were great friends.

[nylonsquid]

Nylon,

I ,also believe that her love was real and now,her hate is equally real. Its about the timing... . at that time, she genuinely

loved me... . she was doing everything which one does when in deep love with someone... .   now, at this point .she is angry and hateful.

Its hard for me to hate her because I think she is unable to love me anymore.

Her mind has totally changed. She is not doing it to hurt me on purpose.

As laelle, mentioned somewhere, we are collateral damage ... . yes.indeed we are.

Yea... . its what I also said about my exgf. By the end she was scared of me like I was going to beat her asking me to not touch her and claiming I had sex with her as if she's a whore. She also thinks I abused her. Surely that is misperception right? I can say she did not do this on purpose to hurt me but blame neurons in her brain sparking up and messing with her perception and so she is victim of a terrible disease. Neither did she mean to hurt me when she broke up with me the first time and claimed to be in love with an ex from 4 years ago who lives in a far off country. I can say she was confused and needed support because she genuinely cried about it and was in pain insisting she IS a good person and that she's only breaking up because she wants to do things with all honesty of her heart and she can't put me through the pain. Sounds lovely. Poor girl, right?

I can also see the actions of a person and realize I've been duped instead of believing that the side I didn't like did not define her. And that how she saw me as an amazing person was not misperception. Why would I let nylonsquid go through more abuse from a person who treated me with low regard based on a pattern of actions instead of making excuses and feeling sorry for her? Why can't I feel sorry for nylonsquid? Why is he doing this to himself? If he's giving so much love and care he surely deserves that in return rather than being abandoned. Or is that really a repetition compulsion he's had that stems from his FOO?

The side I clung to is the side I believed, that she loved me dearly and we were perfect for each other. HUH? I'm human and have flaws. No, I'm not the person she perceived me the first time that can do no wrong, and no I am not the person who abused her. Its called transference and she's living her past through action. A past she doesn't remember though she is a walking memory of it. What she did to me she will repeat with many others.

Every situation is different and so mine may not apply to you though you may take from it. You can choose to be with this person because this is what you feel you deserve and she can be with you. You will live 'happily' ever after in love and chaos believing whatever truth you wish to perceive. It can feel euphoric for sure, passionate and it reinvogorates all kinds of emotions. You feel like you are pushing your human capacities for emotion. You feel alive. Better that than feel numb right? It is what you choose.

[Phoenix.Rising]

Yes. I experienced it.  But people without BPD can do this, too. 

My recent ex was high-functioning, too.  Excellent job with a top firm, intelligent, owns nice house in good neighborhood, two beautiful children, etc.  I don't believe she is the only pwBPD I've dated, but her emotional volatility seemed by far the most extreme to me. 

She was not hateful in the traditional sense, but her switches from professing undying love to please don't call me again, her silent treatments, the blank stares... . this was absolutely horrible.  I'm still not over it.  I am way better than I was, though.  High-functioning BPD is still BPD, don't fool yourself.  The underlying patterns remain the same, and in my case, they were worse.

High functioning aside, she had recently filed for bankruptcy, was most likely an alcoholic, and had been through several marriages.  These are not judgments, per se, because we all have our character flaws, definitely myself included.  However, the part for me that makes it unacceptable is her unwillingness to change anything.  She would say the words, but not follow with the action for any length of time.  I wish her well, but I am best off without her.