Hoping we can stay together

[nedley]

Hello, I'm so glad a place like this exist, thank you for this.
I've been in a relationship with a loving person suffering with BPD for about 7 months now, I've read everything I could find since she told me about this, lots of disgruntled ex's and some hope (very little), I'm in love with someone I'm hoping we can stay together (we both do) but I recognize this task I will be help with and I hope this is a good place to find guidance.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[pearlsw]

Hi nedley,



Oh, it sounds like your partner is aware of her issues? Has a diagnosis perhaps? Is that correct?

What are some of the issues that are causing you strain?

Be sure to take a look at the lessons to right side of the board.  

It can give you a lot of information that will help you understand her as well as guide you on how you can make some personal changes that may make a difference in the dynamics.

wishing you peace, pearl.

[nedley]

Hi thank You for taking the time to reply.
Yes she is well aware and has been afaik going to a therapist for years and recently looking for a new therapist. At first I couldn't (though she was good about informing me in time) tell but soon enough I started to see some of the traits of BPD in her. she has good control of her temper but I know her emotions are all over the place. We can be really close one day and distant the other, this confuses me and don't know how to react some times. We are different personalities but we do agree on loving each other and wanting to stay together.

I've read and watched videos and everything I could possibly find for the last few months, there is a lot of disgruntled x's warning the soon to be x to run away. I do believe every person is unique in many ways and I believe this loving woman deserves to be loved, hopefully one day she can believe the same.

we have issues with intimacy now and for some time, also some times distant for no apparent reason, the belief that I will eventually tire and leave (from her) I cant imagine living with this thoughts but she has no choice.
I know I need help, I need guidance.

Thank You for pointing this out, I will read the text You suggested first. I'm also reading a book by Alan Fruzzetty, The High conflict Couple, I hope this can give me the knowledge I seek to be a better partner.

[pearlsw]

Hi nedley,

It is important to keep in mind that while a lot is written on BPD, not all of it is written with sensitivity. There is general information that may be useful, but a lot of variation in how these issues present themselves. It is a spectrum disorder so it can be more mild or very severe, and all points in between. I'm no expert, but after reading on these boards here it looks very different to me by gender.

It is not always easy to do, especially as we experience these problems in our personal lives and others don't always see them, but these issues are part of a mental illness. That does not absolve our partners of all responsibility, but it does move the dial towards understanding and working with the behaviors themselves. Depersonalization can be an important tool for you to manage with the ups and downs.

So you think she may try to leave you before you can leave her? Is that what you mean? Does she make breakup threats?

wishing you well, pearl.

[nedley]

It is important to keep in mind that while a lot is written on BPD, not all of it is written with sensitivity. There is general information that may be useful, but a lot of variation in how these issues present themselves. It is a spectrum disorder so it can be more mild or very severe, and all points in between. I'm no expert, but after reading on these boards here it looks very different to me by gender.

It is not always easy to do, especially as we experience these problems in our personal lives and others don't always see them, but these issues are part of a mental illness. That does not absolve our partners of all guilt, but it does move the dial towards understanding and working with the behaviors themselves. Depersonalization can be an important tool for you to manage with the ups and downs.

So you think she may try to leave you before you can leave her? Is that what you mean? Does she make breakup threats?

wishing you well, pearl.

Yes it is bc I know it is a mental illness that I don't blame her for things, she is a good person and I enjoy most of the time with her but I feel some times I need a break mostly bc I feel I drain myself and don't get much in return.

I will look for this tool You suggest, I still have to figure out how to find things here.

I can't say if she'll leave before me, I know she fears I will become tired of the push/pull and leave, I try to always remind her I love her and that I want to be with her yet some times I wish she wasn't affected by this illness and we could have a normal life. I think eventually this fear gets to her and she decides to leave her partner, though I love her I do not wish to go through this time and energy into someone and then one day be left behind without explanation. She had many short relationships, many short term affairs or sex with man she did not love and two long term (5year) relationships with two men that she left bc they did not move forward on the relationship and marry.
She says I am unlike the others, that I show love, interest and have patience. I hope I can always be this way with her and short term I will take time to think if this relationship has a future.
I already feel better bc I did not have anyone to talk about this before and here there is at least someone who will kindly take time and give their take on what is happening to us.

[nedley]

Depersonalization can be an important tool for you to manage with the ups and downs.

I've been looking for articles or pdf file on this and can't find it, is this something available on this forum?
I'm also reading a book about the High conflict couple to shed some light for Me.

Thanks again.

[pearlsw]

I've been looking for articles or pdf file on this and can't find it, is this something available on this forum?
I'm also reading a book about the High conflict couple to shed some light for Me.

Thanks again.

Hi nedley,

I don't have anything at hand that has that title per se... .But this might help: Empathy

I imagine depersonalization runs as a theme through a lot of what you read here though. Just being able to remind yourself that this person has a illness that can lead to them having serious cognitive distortions at times can help you not take things so personally.  You can think of it as an illness talking.

I remember when my grandfather's had Parkinson's and he said some things that were very upsetting at times for some of my family members - things he would say about my grandmother that were not true for example. But for me, it was just very clear that it was an illness speaking and that he had no filter in the last period of his life at times so I didn't feel hurt and I could work with his illness and try to redirect his thoughts. (But that is Parkinson's)

My SO (with some BPD traits) would say such outrageous and nonsensical things at times that, at least in those moments, it was kinda easy to depersonalize because it was so far removed from reality I just thought, "what?" and I just knew those things weren't real or true. I would just remind myself, I know what reality is and that I only deal with reality.

Also, it can help, a lot, to have good self esteem, otherwise a lot of negative messaging can be absolutely devastating. So, it is really important to work on your own self-esteem and keep a firm grip on reality!

Have you had any breaks this week? Do you have anything in mind to give yourself a break?

warmly, pearl.

[nedley]

Hi nedley,

I don't have anything at hand that has that title per se... .But this might help: Empathy

I imagine depersonalization runs as a theme through a lot of what you read here though. Just being able to remind yourself that this person has a illness that can lead to them having serious cognitive distortions at times can help you not take things so personally.  You can think of it as an illness talking.

I remember when my grandfather's had Parkinson's and he said some things that were very upsetting at times for some of my family members - things he would say about my grandmother that were not true for example. But for me, it was just very clear that it was an illness speaking and that he had no filter in the last period of his life at times so I didn't not feel hurt and I could work with his illness and try to redirect his thoughts. (But that is Parkinson's)

My SO (with some BPD traits) would say such outrageous and nonsensical things at times that, at least in those moments, it was kinda easy to depersonalize because it was so far removed from reality I just thought, "what?" and I just knew those things weren't real or true. I would just remind myself, I know what reality is and that I only deal with reality.

Also, it can help, a lot, to have good self esteem, otherwise a lot of negative messaging can be absolutely devastating. So, it is really important to work on your own self-esteem and keep a firm grip on reality!

Have you had any breaks this week? Do you have anything in mind to give yourself a break?

warmly, pearl.

Hi Pearl, thank you for your support there are times that is tough but after reading some of the experiences here I think she has done a lot of work to make herself better. She normally doesn't want to have intimacy the further we go into our relationship but she is working with her therapist and eventually might bring me in. After there is any kind she will push me away and try to find something that could break the relationship they are little tests to see if I will leave. She's never threatened me to leave herself however.
I wish there was somebody to talk to but there aren't any groups in my area for this. I'm also the lonely type and keep to myself most of the time my line of work doesn't require me to be with anyone either, this doesn't help but I'm working on hopefully finding some company.
I really wish I could see more couples affected by BPD who are successful and also understand to what degree are they actually being successful. This doesn't mean it we my case but I am sure it will give me more hope as I am at a time where I will have to make a decision and though I want to help her I don't want to do something I will regret. This is where talking to someone is much better for me.
I want to thank you all for taking the time besides although you already have to do having someone with BPD next to you you also take the time to come here and console other people.

[pearlsw]

Hi nedley,

I am glad you are sticking with the community here. You are right. These problems are not solved overnight so it is good that you come back and keep sharing and engaging the community. The more we can build community on this board, the more people have a chance to improve and save their relationships, or learn if they have done enough and it is time to wind things down.

Hopefully other members will join us and share their thoughts and support as well!

Reading your post I thought maybe this tool could help you a lot in terms of talking with her:

Validation Skill: Stop Invalidating Others

Validation Examples

Perhaps this approach could help increase the emotional intimacy which could lead to possibly more physical intimacy?

Do you have intimacy at times, but at others she keeps you at arm’s length? How does she view the level of intimacy between you two?

wishing you peace, pearl.

[nedley]

Hi nedley,

I am glad you are sticking with the community here. You are right. These problems are not solved overnight so it is good that you come back and keep sharing and engaging the community. The more we can build community on this board, the more people have a chance to improve and save their relationships, or learn if they have done enough and it is time to wind things down.

Hopefully other members will join us and share their thoughts and support as well!

Reading your post I thought maybe this tool could help you a lot in terms of talking with her:

Validation Skill: Stop Invalidating Others

Validation Examples

Perhaps this approach could help increase the emotional intimacy which could lead to possibly more physical intimacy?

Do you have intimacy at times, but at others she keeps you at arm’s length? How does she view the level of intimacy between you two?

wishing you peace, pearl.

Thank you Pearl, I appreciate that you take the time to help me, I've read some of your posts and that read some questions too. I feel like many eventually give up on their relationship, is this the Norm? I can't start something knowing it is doomed to fail.
We do have intimacy but I feel like I press to much for it so I stopped and then nothing happened so I asked her and she said she's working on it. Some times I feel she gets tired/sick/it simply doesn't want to whenever she knows it's possible I will want to get close, this makes me feel terrible.
We are at a stage of this relationship where she is sharing more with me about a lot of things and I feel like I want to help get in there and help her but sounds like only the therapist can help with that.

[pearlsw]

Thank you Pearl, I appreciate that you take the time to help me, I've read some of your posts and that read some questions too. I feel like many eventually give up on their relationship, is this the Norm? I can't start something knowing it is doomed to fail.

Hi nedley,

Interesting question! It’s hard to say! I think some posters come here, read a lot, get nervous and slide over to the Conflicted Board. Some people stick it out and work on this board for awhile and we go through the ups and downs with them. Others probably read the tools, see just enough of a difference and move on - they may not see the need for the extra support of an online support group.

From time to time people pop back up and say that they learned things here, things got better, and they want to come back and let us know.

I think often times people come here when there is already a significant amount damage to the relationship, so that is a lot to work back from, but successes can happen. I think others come here wanting to work on things, but then realize that domestic violence has also become part of things and they need to focus on that.

I guess all in all, it is your story to write. You can only control yourself and find the answers within yourself as to whether you want to make more effort or cut your losses so to speak. Both options might make sense, and it is normal to shift around a bit until you find a place to settle for awhile and then you may become uncertain again. And of course, the factor of what our partner might want or be able to do to make things better is also a major consideration.

In terms of being “doomed to fail” I’d take a step back and try to embrace good communication as an end in itself. If you take this on like a practice, like yoga is for example, you might see it as an investment in yourself and in understanding and relating to the world in a new way. Perhaps in that sense it is a bit depersonalized - not about her I mean - and you make it about you and just learning. It might bring you more peace that way.

It may be too early for this concept, but keep this around for later:
Radical Acceptance

What are you hoping for?

warmly, pearl.

[nedley]

Hi nedley,

Interesting question! It’s hard to say! I think some posters come here, read a lot, get nervous and slide over to the Conflicted Board. Some people stick it out and work on this board for awhile and we go through the ups and downs with them. Others probably read the tools, see just enough of a difference and move on - they may not see the need for the extra support of an online support group.

From time to time people pop back up and say that they learned things here, things got better, and they want to come back and let us know.

I think often times people come here when there is already a significant amount damage to the relationship, so that is a lot to work back from, but successes can happen. I think others come here wanting to work on things, but then realize that domestic violence has also become part of things and they need to focus on that.

I guess all in all, it is your story to write. You can only control yourself and find the answers within yourself as to whether you want to make more effort or cut your losses so to speak. Both options might make sense, and it is normal to shift around a bit until you find a place to settle for awhile and then you may become uncertain again. And of course, the factor of what our partner might want or be able to do to make things better is also a major consideration.

In terms of being “doomed to fail” I’d take a step back and try to embrace good communication as an end in itself. If you take this on like a practice, like yoga is for example, you might see it as an investment in yourself and in understanding and relating to the world in a new way. Perhaps in that sense it is a bit depersonalized - not about her I mean - and you make it about you and just learning. It might bring you more peace that way.

It may be too early for this concept, but keep this around for later:
Radical Acceptance

What are you hoping for?

warmly, pearl.

I want to be with her as a couple, so does she. I really want her to get better she isn't bad really but she does bring up some topics at times that really trow me off. We are very close one day and then she starts to drift back into the 'I'm not good enough for You' and all that comes with that statement.
Some times I fear like despite all my efforts she might just decide to leave one day bc she gets the idea I will leave her or that she isn't enough and I would feel really sad if that happened, to love someone so much and part way for no apparent reason.
I watched videos of some people that say they have recovered from BPD and it gives me hope but the idea of her leaving for no reason haunts me some times. She also said she does not want me to be sad or stressed out bc of her behaviour and that there may not be a reward to being with her, I wonder if this is her talking or her BPD?

Thank You for being  here and giving Your time 'listening' to other people's problems.

[pearlsw]

I want to be with her as a couple, so does she. I really want her to get better she isn't bad really but she does bring up some topics at times that really trow me off. We are very close one day and then she starts to drift back into the 'I'm not good enough for You' and all that comes with that statement.
Some times I fear like despite all my efforts she might just decide to leave one day bc she gets the idea I will leave her or that she isn't enough and I would feel really sad if that happened, to love someone so much and part way for no apparent reason.
I watched videos of some people that say they have recovered from BPD and it gives me hope but the idea of her leaving for no reason haunts me some times. She also said she does not want me to be sad or stressed out bc of her behaviour and that there may not be a reward to being with her, I wonder if this is her talking or her BPD?

Thank You for being  here and giving Your time 'listening' to other people's problems.

Hi nedley,

When she speaks like this do you try to talk it out or do you withdraw? Do her emotions overwhelm you?

So she will seem to feel bad and will say "I"m not good enough for you." Hmmm. It might seem strange, but telling her "Yes, you are good enough!" When she is feeling this way could be invalidating. Like you are arguing against how she feels.

Instead do you try speaking to the feelings? I wonder what would happen if you said something like this:
Sympathy: "Thanks for letting me know how you feel."
Empathy: "This must be difficult for you."
Truth: "We are together as a couple."

You add more to the S and E parts!

You might want to check out these readings as well:

Supporting Your BPD Partner
Behaviors: How it Feels to Have BPD
Being An Emotional Caregiver

Rather than putting the focus on wanting her to change, it is a good to idea to work on the changes you can make to yourself and see what happens from there. I know people often think that both people have to change to improve a relationship, but even one person changing their behavior can lead to improvements. As you observe your struggles with making changes (we all struggle to be better) it could also help expand your empathy for the struggles she would face in trying to change given her emotional challenges. I am not saying you don't have empathy! I see that you care for her very, very much!  

warmly, pearl.

[nedley]

Thank You Pearl, I really appreciate it, I have read those articles and some others as well but I'm a knuckle head and some times feel like I'm a bull in a china house. I have 'trouble' figuring out how to apply the good articles to my situations but Your example really helps me!
I don't know if this adds to the problem but I am an immigrant and some things are just difficult for me to grasp when there is something so simple to do another way and I have to remind myself its just not how it works.
I know I make her happy and I do try my best to show it as much as possible. This is a wonderful human being who has tried many times but it is possible ( I only know one side of the story) she didn't get much help.
I've been reading some of the good experiences lately to cheer me up and not so much of the horror stories.

[pearlsw]

Thank You Pearl, I really appreciate it, I have read those articles and some others as well but I'm a knuckle head and some times feel like I'm a bull in a china house. I have 'trouble' figuring out how to apply the good articles to my situations but Your example really helps me!
I don't know if this adds to the problem but I am an immigrant and some things are just difficult for me to grasp when there is something so simple to do another way and I have to remind myself its just not how it works.

Hey nedley!

I am immigrant too! I was telling a good friend the other day you have no idea how hard it can be! Just getting waxed dental floss, just that is an ordeal like you would not believe!

I know me being an immigrant has added stress to my household and it has challenged me in ways I could never have anticipated! On the other hand, how lucky are we to get to experience the world in this way? Wow! When I think of the things I've seen and done in the last number of years while living overseas... .wow! Just wow! What an adventure my life has been!

Dark as it has been in times one thing I have learned is to be grateful for everything in life, the good and the bad times. You can learn so much from life and grow and grow and grow! And... .maybe all that can help others too! Ya never know! I find a way to laugh and smile every day! And oh how I laugh at times, that good rolling on the floor kind of laughter from your gut!

Yes, your frame of mind matters! I have managed to joke and laugh my way through some pretty unbelievable stuff. It made life worth living!  I was never quite like this before so I must say I secretly pat myself on the back for that side of my personality because it has saved me! hahaahhaha. ;) Well, now I've spilled the beans! hee hee.

I really get it! I read this stuff over and over and sometimes I can't quite make it fit either and I feel like a real knucklehead too! Argh! But I am here, and happy to learn side by side with you anytime so let's keep at it friend!

take care, pearl.