Coaching Others - Do you find it frustrating at times?

[gertrude]

This is an incredibly thought provoking topic.  I know how this worked for me, when I was just inhaling the words of advice and other posters' stories on this website.  I think, like many others, we listen to what we want to listen to and quickly scroll down through the rest.  But I found a balance of honest appraisal and opinion with acceptance to work best for me.  My therapist is a tough old bird.  When I see her, she kicks my ass, makes me - and I mean makes me - look at myself with honesty - even if produces anger and tears.  But then again, she knows I can take it.  Some people can't and must be led to understanding down a more gentle slope. 

I know that Elphie was so helpful - because I came on tough - I was going to be one of the success stories here on the staying boards - I could handle it, I could make this work.  And she was patient, and held my hand through cyber space, without judgment, while I failed and tried again, and failed and tried again several times.  Thank you.  I think Elphie has an extremely high tolerance level.  Always patient and kind.

And then there are others here, like bewildered2, who will tell you like he sees it.  These people were also extraordinarily helpful because it helped me become more objective about my circumstances.  Honest appraisal enabled me to step outside of my enchantment enough to really take a look at what was happening.

So, I think what happens here is that we have a good mix of people, and the newcomers to the Board get to pick and choose what is useful for them.

I myself have felt frustration.  I felt it mostly while serving as an ambassador, because an ambassador's role is to make people feel comfortable and welcome.  I found it necessary to level off quite a bit in my opinions while serving, and that was a major frustration.

I suppose much the same as a reformed cigarette smoker, we develop the attitude that if we can do it, you can do it, and why the hell aren't you doing it.  I grow so impatient.  Especially when I read a story of shocking, gut wrenching abuse that is ended with the words "but I still love him."  I feel like Cher, in Moonstruck, smacking Nicholas Cage's character in the face and telling him to snap out of it. 

My focus here has been on romantic relationships - husbands and wives, lovers and partners.  Not so much blood family members with BPD.  I think it's ultimately more difficult to leave family - especially children with BPD and I have not learned the tools for coping because I knew my relationship had to end.  When it comes to partner relationships, well, I know there are some success stories, but from empirical evidence on this website, those stories are few and far between.

So I have sort of divided up the partner nons into two categories - those that have realized that they need to take a long hard look at themselves, and those that are just so stuck in the behavior of their BPDs that if it weren't for their pain, the nons would not even know they exist any longer.  The former group are the ones that seem to eventually meet with success - either by leaving and moving on with their lives, or learning how to maintain their own lives, dignity and self respect in the midst of a BPD relationship.  My hats are off to those people.

The others frustrate me terribly, because sometimes I know we get stuck and it is hard to move, but sometimes I think we want to remain stuck.  And some of those focused strictly on their BPDs seem to want to remain stuck and this is where I must learn to let go and not be impacted by the bad choices that people make (which I see daily in my line of work).  My frustration comes from a lifelong belief that ultmately reason will prevail, that people will do what is in their best interest.  I have been so disabused of this belief, having worked with hardened criminals, and all kinds of very marginalized people, and yet I am still shocked when I see people operating against their own interest.  I think my frustration comes because the people I describe are operating against my own belief system.  And because I want to see people at peace and I know each minute of each day is going to be hell for them - that they have the power to change it but they don't realize it, and sometimes, there is nothing we can do to help them.

Lest my reply drag on too long, which I think it already has, I will wrap up by saying the frustration is certainly an element of life here at the Boards.  But it genuinely pales in comparison to the benefits we gain, both personally, and in helping others.  We get a lot of feedback here, so we know when we've said something that a non has found useful, or soothing.  It's been a heck of an experience.  Carol

[El]

No need to coach,  more important to share the life expirience and thoughts,

I feel sick whenever i read  the coaching posts ))  They are funny and bombestic.

Sometimes i had doubts in the psychological health of authors.

I am being sorry but it is my impressions from so-called caoching

[Christy2]

Especially when I read a story of shocking, gut wrenching abuse that is ended with the words "but I still love him." 

When I first discovered this board over ten years ago, I was one of those who would describe a gut wrenching bout of abuse and end with the words "but I do love him."  Why?  I think it stemmed from a variety of things - guilt because I was spilling the beans, my desire to be a devoted and faithful wife, and at times a genuine love and respect for the good qualities he does have.  At that time there was still some passion in our marriage too.  Whatever the reason, I said it.  Now you will find me saying "I love his good qualities" or "I will always care" or something similar - because that is true -  but not the proclamation of great love.  However, it took over ten years - and leaving this forum and erasing my user names two times (once for at least a year or two) before I got to the point where I am now.  So never forget, that a few of those who frustrate you so much right now may be the ambassadors a decade from now.  Sometimes it takes a long, long time. Like raising children - you may not see the good results for years. 

so stuck in the behavior of their BPDs that if it weren't for their pain, the nons would not even know they exist any longer. 

What a great observation!  So we must help them whenever possible to find themselves and their voice again or they can't escape emotionally, let alone physically. 

Gertrude, my hat goes off to you for the work you do - its amazing you can keep at it without getting burnt out.  I hope you have had some success stories along the way too to help you continue on.

They are funny and bombestic.

El, its interesting that you would bring this up, because I remember a thread I started once in which you made a statement that I felt was - since you have used the word anyway - "bombastic" - in that it didn't reflect an understanding of my belief system.  What I viewed as simply doing the right thing according to my belief system you felt was unnecessarily "being a martyr."  I'm not angry at that at all, nor was I then. I knew that you were simply stating what you felt was right for me according to your belief system.  I bring it up because I think this is an important issue to think about in this thread.

Sometimes is our frustration actually based - when we get right down to it - on someone not having the same beliefs as we do and thus not "agreeing" with us?  If so, then we need to come to terms with that on a different level.   Recognizing diversity doesn't mean agreeing with someone who has a belief system different from ours or feeling we must get them to agree with us, it simply means we accomodate their beliefs in our dealings with them.  Again, this is where having more definitions of success than just "in love and happily working on their relationship" or "leaving/left" can be so valuable. 

[united for now]

Our frustrations also come from our desire to "save" people, which is part of a non's dysfunctional co-dependent thinking patterns. It's hard to read the stories and not want to shake some of them to help them "see" what you see.

Perception is reality for all of us though, so what I believe to be true and how I see things won't always jive with what others see or believe - and that is where the frustration comes in. Some see the glass as half full, some as half empty - when the real facts are that it is just a glass... .Wanting someone to see or believe as we do creates the frustation... .come on - join the bandwagon... .

It's an easy thing to fall into (I know I've been guilty of it myself), and difficult to recognize in yourself.

To break it, we all need to remember that our goal is to offer compassion and empathetic advice, and that in the end we can't control what others do with that advice... .

[Nomoreblues]

NO, YES... .I feel like "House"... .

touching post this ... .

Not on this board I do, but I work with people professionally, not a therapist but related profession... .As a result of my experience with my BPGF I did and do a lot of work on myself an am winning. I notice that I get clients with ever more fundamental and complex issues, I don't ask for that, it just happens, they come over, I tell them that the issue at hand may be heavy (if it is), may be on the edge of my profession and that I am not a therapist and still they go out on the journey with me, the trust they give me is great. I'm very aware of my pleaser issues, me being a paternalized kid and I can handle it ever better professionally, switch it off or even apply it, with result they say. If I really dare to look at myself in my private life things are moving ahead as well... .It is not burning me out, applying my flaws gives energy as long as I do it because I can, not expecting anything back and if I don't want anything in return I get back so much... .

So now I work with two people with bonding issues (there's no such thing as coincidence), desorganised bonding, BP parents, heavy stuff and I let them decide to go on or not, and we're moving!  . Told them that the issue would get very close to me, advised them therapy, that if we would start out it would be as challenging for me as it is for them, that I don't have answers only questions myself. They came back to me. The deal is that I am not a therapist so they decide from step to step to go on, we always discuss the option of stopping the process because I think we should only work together if it means that they make progress and if not they should move over to a therapist and still they don't, keep returning... .So I am told that we are at least saving one relationship, after so many years realize the magic that can be there between two vulnerable people. It makes me feel great professionally.

How come I feel like House, the moody doctor in the British TV series who does unconventional things, is rewarded, then steps on his motorcycle and goes home where he is alone, pushes away all pretty female doctors and nurses who are really interested in him? Am I like this (no, I know I'm not based on reality). If this relationship of this client can be saved (and it looks like it can and that it is becoming better and more close), if I see the positive effects it brings for them I step in my car, drive home and I occaionally feel so lonely... .My BPex shows up on the windscreen... .why couldn't we? Yes I know, because we couldn't and because it was unhealthy, but also this other part was there... .

I know, the client fights with all his might, accepts and fights and progresses, it's his victory not mine, but why didn't she? and I know, that's not a question, it's a fact: she didn't.


Not my major concern, but sometimes it kicks in. I'm only human.

NMB.

[Christy2]

Our frustrations also come from our desire to "save" people... .

Just never forget that whether they stay or go, if you have helped them find themselves again - if they don't wake up every morning feeling like a piece of garbage, wondering what is going on, crying their eyes out with confusion and pain, if they feel joy and particpate in life again and their self esteem becomes independent of what the BPD in their life thinks - you have helped "save" them.   

[HeartOfaBuddha]

AMEN - Christy! If I get nothing else here - and I have gotten a lot - I know that I am not alone.  I have learned that I am not crazy or stupid.  I know that others understand and no one has the answers.  But, many will do what they can to help.

Peace & Meta.