Back to basics- getting H to answer a question

[Depression = 72% of members]

Do your pwBPDs have trouble giving direct answers, then get upset if you push them for one?

I'm having troubles getting my uBPDh to answer even the most simple questions.

I asked him (all conversation vix text) whether he wants to join a dinner I'm having with my dad tomorrow, and if so, what time suits him best?  Will 7 be good?

His reply was: "So I will cancel my hit appointment."

Then I asked him when his appointment is due to end, and if he wishes to join, we could move the time back, so he doesn't need to cancel it.

Him: "You're the boss.  When you say I must do something, I must do.  There is no use suggesting otherwise... . "

So basically I texted him back and said I am happy to accomodate to his suggestions if he does wish to join, so stop putting words in my mouth because I didn't ask him to cancel the appointment nor forced him to join.

How do you get an answer from your pwBPD?  Argh I’m so frustrated.

[Chosen]

Do your pwBPDs have trouble giving direct answers, then get upset if you push them for one?

I'm having troubles getting my uBPDh to answer even the most simple questions.

I asked him (all conversation vix text) whether he wants to join a dinner I'm having with my dad tomorrow, and if so, what time suits him best?  Will 7 be good?

His reply was: "So I will cancel my hit appointment."

Then I asked him when his appointment is due to end, and if he wishes to join, we could move the time back, so he doesn't need to cancel it.

Him: "You're the boss.  When you say I must do something, I must do.  There is no use suggesting otherwise... . "

So basically I texted him back and said I am happy to accomodate to his suggestions if he does wish to join, so stop putting words in my mouth because I didn't ask him to cancel the appointment nor forced him to join.

How do you get an answer from your pwBPD?  Argh I’m so frustrated.

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[GreenMango]

I'm a firm believer that an evasive non-answer is a no.  Just like maybe is often a no.

When he got all cagey and rude when you asked the first time I would have let it go and gone to dinner with my folks. 

What was the fear in not letting it go after the first snarky reply and just having a good time out? 

[Chosen]

Not really afraid.  But I guess I was too "loose" and still wanted to involve him.

But he seems really dysregulated now, sending me hate texts and the last one was a mocking one saying how I'm wise and "I'm sorry for saying these stuff, please don't scold me".  I have made a final suggestion that perhaps now is not the best time to discuss the negative issues, and whether he is willing to just relax for today and let ourselves have some good time.  If he still continues with hate texts then I suppose I will need to stay at work late (to do my own stuff as I need to complete homework for my studies)... .   :'(

[GreenMango]

Boundaries are hard.

Sounds like he needs to soothe himself.

And you have homework.

It's okay to not make it all better for him all the time.

You know drill validate the valid, use SET and take a time out when the hate texts start.  also because you've mentioned the violence the safety plan is a must.

[Chosen]

This is getting really annoying.  I am at work so yes I'm safe, but then I need to think about my next steps of action should he not calm down (he claims he is calm  ).

He sent me lots of texts, and although no foul language it's all attacking me.  Even going so far as to say how can he be certain I had not cheated on him the night I left home (because he threatened my safety).  He wanted to know where I was and I didn't tell him.  And I wouldn't, because it was his choice to threaten me, and he doesn't need to know where I went.  That was last week.  And he has been slow-boiling because I set the boundary not to address the issue unless he addresses the threats he made to my safety, which I believe is not ok.  He refused to, so I refuse to discuss further. 

I hope it's an extinction burst (because he can't get me to engage, can't get me to take full responsibility- actually he can't get me to speak about that incident at all); by the way, how long do these things go on?  I don't feel that leaving home again will make things better; but of course if he's not calm enough I will have to 

[Chosen]

Argh.  Update.  Hate texts turned into mocking texts ("You failed to listen to me once?  You pretend to be the boss only once?  ... . " 

So in the end I texted him, "I do not like the mocking tone of voice.  I will no longer respond to your texts and I will call you before end of work to determine the situation."

:'(

[DreamFlyer99]

Chosen, that sounds like a good boundary, right? I feel some kinship with you in this (or else our husbands are "kin" at least in their verbal stuff!) I know that for me I often don't catch on soon enough when my H starts the mocking or sarcastic or whatever that kind of talk is, since I've grown used to it and am still pretty new at dealing with it. It sounds like you were doing that same thing I get caught up in, TRYING to do the soothing, TRYING to be the caretaker of their poorly handled emotions. I love what Green Mango said:

Boundaries are hard.


It's okay to not make it all better for him all the time.

I need to repeat this until I get it through my head! I think we're both the same place in it... . trying to disentangle our mooshed up boundary-less emotional relationships. :-P

It sure is one heck of a process!

[Chosen]

Thanks.

I know this is a boundary I should have.  And I also realise I have been so emotionally beaten up in the past that I haven't stuck up for my values and my well-being because I believed it's a selfish thing to do.

So I suppose the boundary "works" because he can't force/ threaten/ tempt me to respond.  He can say whatever he like, I don't need to respond.

But I feel like it isn't working and he just outright would not try and calm himself down.  So I don't know what to do next!

[DreamFlyer99]

i bet!

So have you looked at the Safety First info? I just looked and there's some really good stuff there.

i'm just past the space where I have felt selfish taking care of myself, so I know we can get there. But nobody NOBODY needs to feel threatened. You probably wouldn't have anybody threaten the neighbor's dog, right? so why would you want to feel threatened yourself. i'm pretty sure that during the time the person is dysregulated you really can't talk about anything. Have you thought of finding one of the moderators etc who is currently online and private messaging them so you could get a more immediate response? NOBODY should have to feel unsafe with the significant people in their lives, that's a stress-FULL way to live and is gonna tear you down physically as your body reacts to the stress. My H isn't generally a threatening sort physically, that's been very rare, and it really freaked me out when during one of those periods my T said I should have an exit plan. I thought, "seriously, it's that bad?" And I thought, "what would I tell my daughters to do?" because I can be ever so much more clear if i'm thinking about someone else in the situation.

I think I would want to try to talk to somebody with knowledge and experience SOON, and all I can think of, unless you have a therapist to talk to, is find someone here to private message, or call one of the domestic abuse hotlines for help.

just my thoughts... . if you were my daughter i'd want you to contact someone with, like I said, knowledge and experience soon.

[Chosen]

Thanks.  As far as safety is concerning, right now I'm very safe because I'm at the office 

If I have a feeling things won't be safe if I go home, I will check back later and even consider not going back if he may be dangerous.  I have a C and she also reminds me that safety is first, before everything else.

Actually I don't think he's dangerous now, but the problem I have is: so what am I supposed to do if he's still in a blaming, shaming/ mocking mood?  Not exactly "dangerous" but abusive all the same, and not somebody you can talk to at all.  Do I go back home or not?  If I go back home, I'd likely not be able to get any peace, and if he tries to keep me away then I'll be without rest too.

[DreamFlyer99]

I wish I knew so much more! I guess the question might be "will you feel safe at home?" Like you said, it's still emotionally threatening and abusive. So if you do go home and he's mocking/rude/verbally and emotionally making you feel unsafe, do you have a plan and a place to go? From what I've read so far we need to be consistent with our boundaries. So if leaving the house is the plan for your safety, can you continue with that boundary? I know I've had to repeat a few times "when we can talk respectfully ill be happy to discuss this with you" and when he got belittling or roaring I'd say "this doesn't feel respectful so I'm going for a walk." Others with more knowledge and experience are so much better with wording, I don't have that figured out entirely, but it's my understanding that we need to set boundaries for our own well being that we are willing to back up.

[Chosen]

My boundary has two parts:

Part 1 (which I have enforced prior to this time already): when he starts getting verbally abusive (swearing, yelling), I do not engage with him and will not discuss an issue further.  I may not leave but I won't speak to him.

Part 2 (which I started using this time): when there are signs that I may not be safe physically (such as him threatening to hit me), I will leave the place and go to a safe location (last time was my C's place.  Also have women's shelter number on my phone and can also go to my aunt if necessary.  If I have my wallet with me going to a hotel or something for a night will not be a problem).

Yes I need to be consistent so unfortunately at this moment, it is not realistic to say "every time he is rude I will leave our home", because that will amount to more than half of the time.  And even last time after I left I clearly let him know that I left due to threats made to my personal safety.

[bruceli]

Do your pwBPDs have trouble giving direct answers, then get upset if you push them for one?

I'm having troubles getting my uBPDh to answer even the most simple questions.

I asked him (all conversation vix text) whether he wants to join a dinner I'm having with my dad tomorrow, and if so, what time suits him best?  Will 7 be good?

His reply was: "So I will cancel my hit appointment."

Then I asked him when his appointment is due to end, and if he wishes to join, we could move the time back, so he doesn't need to cancel it.

Him: "You're the boss.  When you say I must do something, I must do.  There is no use suggesting otherwise... . "

So basically I texted him back and said I am happy to accomodate to his suggestions if he does wish to join, so stop putting words in my mouth because I didn't ask him to cancel the appointment nor forced him to join.

How do you get an answer from your pwBPD?  Argh I’m so frustrated.

What I've come to notice about this one is that when I am face with this situation with DW is when the question I ask is about the ludicris statement she just made.  The stop cold in their tracks because the can not come up with a logical reply fast enough to answer for there illogical statement/question.  This is when I get... . Stop pressuring me... . I need to think about and process this... . BTW, to date, I have not got answers to questions I have ask for over six months.

[GreenMango]

Chosen

Sometimes it can be small timeoouts.  Like a coffeeshop for a couple of hours to do homework. 

He's badgering and from his statements it has roots in your leaving for the night because of the violence threat.  Remember fast to escalate slow to come back down.

I think youre fast approaching a point where you might need to consider the DEARMAN conversation with him regarding the DV and him getting help.  Until youre ready for that its small steps.

Ps I say this with respect have you thought about CODA meetings? I notice you jumping thru hoops to try to fix his behavior or feelings.

[DreamFlyer99]

It also occurred to me today to ask you "what is 'calm' about mean/angry/belittling texts?"

The fact that it took me HOURS to even THINK of that tells me I still have a lot of thinking to change. Words may not seem as overt a threat as someone telling you he's going to hit you, but if it still hurts you the bruises are just on your soul instead of your skin. At least that's how mean words affect me.

[DreamFlyer99]

"Sometimes it can be small timeoouts.  Like a coffeeshop for a couple of hours to do homework.  "

And I LOVE this!

Now I'm going to go look up what a DEARMAN conversation is.

[Grey Kitty]

If going home means 50% chance of verbal abuse... . go home, but be ready to go back out if he starts putting you down.

This isn't about how bad his behavior is, or how bad it has to be to justify it for you.

This is about you feeling safe and comfortable at home. You have been threatened (with physical harm) and emotionally injured already. You are not as strong or as resilient as you were before that. It is completely appropriate to protect yourself by making sure your environment is extra safe right now, whatever that takes.

If you are almost certain to get a lot of crap from him rather than 50% likely, it might be better to just plan on going away ahead of time.

 GK

[DreamFlyer99]

True GK--if he's texting disrespectfully then what are the odds of his behavior being respectful when she gets home?

I know I grew up feeling unsafe at home, so I didn't recognize what a safe home should look like, leaving me quite unprepared for the occasional events if the past 35 plus years.

[Chosen]

Hi all,

He sent me some texts near the time I went home last night.  While his point of view was still twisted, he wasn't mocking, belittling or mean (but blaming, but that's this points of view).  So I went home.

It wasn't all happy and laughter, and we pretty much each did our own stuff.  But at least instead of sitting there being angry, he went to the room to read and listen to YouTube music.  Which I thought was good.

Hope he keeps on finding ways to sooth himself... .

[GreenMango]

That's good news!

Small steps. 

[DreamFlyer99]

Oh happy day! for the small steps.

I also find it difficult to remember to allow my H to self soothe.