Who do I still want to believe?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Yesterday was a bad day for me (would of been 27 months together and he would always remember and make a big deal of it) this has spilled over into today and again im very tearful.

Although I havent seen him for around 8 weeks we were in contact up until 4 days ago, the week prior to that the messages were nast and accusing yet i found out he had been cheating etc... . The last 4 days have been hard as even nasty contact made me feel i hadnt totally lost him (although i know i have and thats good for me to of lost him) Im trying to hold onto something, that all that time wasnt me being made a fool of.

He did have a few moments where I thought he really meant things and was trying as he WAS in therapy but no longer is. He had a tattoo of my name,star sign and date we met as he said it really was his last relationship, he was fed up of moving around and wanted to settle down. Do you think at that moment he meant it but just struggled with the demons and shame within him and couldnt do it or was it again another lie to make me believe in him? I know what he does he cant help but im struggling with the acceptance of it all. Ive managed to get enough money to see my T again tomorrow but wish i could afford it more regular. Will i stop believing or will it always be a part of me?

[gallerykey]

Yesterday was a bad day for me (would of been 27 months together and he would always remember and make a big deal of it) this has spilled over into today and again im very tearful.

Although I havent seen him for around 8 weeks we were in contact up until 4 days ago, the week prior to that the messages were nast and accusing yet i found out he had been cheating etc... . The last 4 days have been hard as even nasty contact made me feel i hadnt totally lost him (although i know i have and thats good for me to of lost him) Im trying to hold onto something, that all that time wasnt me being made a fool of.

He did have a few moments where I thought he really meant things and was trying as he WAS in therapy but no longer is. He had a tattoo of my name,star sign and date we met as he said it really was his last relationship, he was fed up of moving around and wanted to settle down. Do you think at that moment he meant it but just struggled with the demons and shame within him and couldnt do it or was it again another lie to make me believe in him? I know what he does he cant help but im struggling with the acceptance of it all. Ive managed to get enough money to see my T again tomorrow but wish i could afford it more regular. Will i stop believing or will it always be a part of me?

[Lao Tzu]

Dear IMj72,

     There are no rules in human nature and every person with BPD is very different from every other one, so don't let anyone generalize about what something might have meant to your pwBPD or whether you will always believe in him.  The opinion here seems, generally, to lean toward the idea that 'they' aren't able to experience love in the way 'we' do, but there are also a lot of caveats with that. For instance, "Skip" has said that most of the people discussed here probably don't actually have BPD; they have traits of BPD, and I'm quite sure that's true.  I also think my pwBPD believed her own cr@p, so to speak, at the time.  Thirty years later I still hear her spouting the same nonsense about her current flame being her 'soul mate' or 'other half' (I work with her), so either she's incredibly consistent in her lies (which could be, I suppose) or she really still believes that baloney even after 30 years, several marriages, multiple affairs and almost certainly a thousand guys passing between her legs. 

     In the end, it isn't at all important what he felt at the time, despite the need we all have to be validated for the love we felt.  What's important is what he/she did for us that bound them to us in such a seemingly unbreakable way.  Once you understand this you have every chance to be happy again.  For myself, I think she will always be a part of me that will annoy me a little, but the battle to get her out of my head is, basically, over.  It takes a lot of soul searching to get where you need to be in your own self-analysis, but you can do it and people here can help you a lot.

LT

[gallerykey]

Now I have recieved a message "tattooists can do wonders these days, so happy with it... . reminders all gone"

Whether he has or hasnt had it covered is irrelevant, but why did he feel the need to tell me? Was it to hurt me more? If hes soo happy now hes moved on why keep putting the knife in? I havent replied and I wont as I dont want to break NC but this really has hurt, the one thing i had to hold onto that i might of meant something has been ripped from me.

[Lao Tzu]

Dear Imj72,

     Why?  Think of someone (if it's even possible) that you think of as completely bad in every possible way; Hitler? the guy who imprisoned those women for years in Cleveland, maybe?  Now, imagine yourself not as the mature person you are but, emotionally, as a child (a basic aspect of the pwBPD).  Finally, imagine you have the means to contact this person very easily.  What would you do?  I'd hurt that sucker to the very best of my ability, as I actually ain't all that emotionally mature anyway.   

     This is what we mean when we say we have been "painted black".  The pwBPD sees people as completely perfect or completely horrible, with nothing in between.  Never felt that way about anyone since, perhaps, when you were a kid?  Well, that would be because you don't have this ugly disorder. 

     If you think about it for a second, how could he allow himself to feel any differently, regardless of the facts, about you?  If he allowed himself to think for an instant that you were actually the nice, sweet person you are that would mean that he would be consumed with guilt about how he has treated you.  That guilt would completely swallow him as it is a central theme in their lives, when it comes to relationships.  When I say 'completely swallow', I really mean that.  These poor folks have no other identity and this would take that away.  We "Nons" can't really understand the fear of loss of identity, but suffice it to say that such a thing would likely leave him in a bad state, and he won't allow that to happen under any circumstances. So, he has to paint you as black as the guy from Cleveland and his nature is to lash out at a hated person.

     You may not always be painted black, as they can turn on a dime just like he already did.  If that happened, however, it would mean he wanted to recycle you -- and that would be a lot worse (and you should be prepared for the possibility this could happen in the future).

LT

[gallerykey]

I know everything youre saying is true im just really struggling to accept it.

Im only day 4 and dont know how im going to cope, the stupid thing is when we were together and he used to do his silent treatment i could keep it up as long as him yet now im falling apart.

Despite everything he did, i miss him,but i dont wanttomiss him as i know it is ALL wrong

[dangoldfool]

imj72

The one defense you have is NC. You need to stop looking to find out what he is doing or asking friends about him. You are the enemy in his eyes at this point. And he will use words to continue to drive the wounds even deeper.

It's not going to be easy for you. Every minute of the day will drive you insane to look or ask about information as to what he is doing. Don't do it.   

Seeing a T is helpful, but it only goes so far. It takes work on your own to work through this. YOU CAN DO THIS. The NC will help to stop the continuing opening of the wound so that it can heal.

Do the NC. Don't take anymore calls from him. You'll be fine.

Remember he will try and call. My ex called me with a private number. I picked up the phone and said nothing. As soon as I heard her start talking I hung up. I don't want to hear anymore Bull sh-- lies.

You have to be firm, and stay firm with your decision. It's painful, heart breaking, sad, and one of the lowest points you'll have in your life. But to get feeling better, you have to commit to one choice. Staying  or Leaving. Sitting on the fence of un-certainty is really painful.  blessings     

[LoneWolf768]

imj72, I'm in the same boat as you: I would love to see my ex BPD'er again, but I know I can't. I've haven't seen her since last January and I was stupid enough to wait almost 3 months to see her while she hit me with all kind of ridiculous excuses. She lied to me constantly. She bullied me, put me down, insulted me, controlled me and wanted to get back at me for being with another woman although she and I weren't ever in a relationship at that point. After the breakup, which wasn't a traditional break up (but are the ever traditional with a BPD'er?), it just got worse and worse. This woman HATES me with a passion. Why? Because I retaliated, told her what I thought about her actions and how disgusting she is, said she had traits of BPD, was sick and needed psychological help. Later, she projected all of the negativity onto me. I didn't know what the term 'projection' meant until I began researching this illness. Everything I said to her, she told people I was the one who exhibited those traits. Typical BPD 'Woe is me' action to blame someone else entirely. You wonder if a BPD'ers friends have enough common sense and intelligence to tell themselves that their BPD'er friend isn't as innocent as they seem and they'd give the ex the benefit of the doubt.

Friends of mine would ask me how I could still be thinking about her after how toxic we were together and how messy the post-'break up' smear campaign went with her and how distraught I was that we both lowered ourselves to grade school level by the need to one-up each other. I vowed I'd NEVER let myself give anyone the satisfaction of getting me out of my frame of mind and doing and saying things I'd regret later.

Isn't it peculiar how we put up with all this emotional and verbal abuse from our ex BPD'ers. 

Lao Tzu and dangoldfool make great points in their posts. Those are some of the most solid posts I've read on any of the boards so far. dangoldfool is correct about seeking info on your ex BPD'er. It's driving you crazy to want to know, but imagine how you'll feel once you find out. That alone should change your mind about trying to find out what he's doing now or who he's with.

[dangoldfool]

A story that I think applies to people thinking or wanting to continue contact with a BPD ex.

You already know in your head that this person is toxic to you. Attacking you in a very emotionally hurtful ways. But for some reason you continue to go back for more.

Imagine you are enjoying a day at the park. You happen to be unfortunately enough to step in a very large and fresh soft serve type of poop on the grass. The smell immediately hits your nose, you’re so mad because of the smell and having to clean off your shoes. How irresponsible of this pet owner you think. How nasty of a job having to scrub off your shoes to clean them.

Your ex is much like the poop who (lies, cheats, blames, accuses) and for some reason you continue to want to step back into the poop. You seem to enjoy it. At least until the smell hits you in the face again. The poop is always going to stink. It will always make you feel bad after the encounter. It will never be anything positive for you. Maybe your leave for a period of time and think, I wonder if the poop is still there, if it still smells. And so you run back, and roll in it. And sure enough, it still smells, and you feel disgusted and foul, again and again and again... .

You can polish up a turd , but it’s always going to be a turd. 

Sadly, every sweet and good comment your ex told you, has been to hook you in. Like everyone on here, we were all hooked. Some of us by treble hooks,(the three prong type hook) and really deep. The only way to be free is to stay away, and don’t go back to the area to be hooked again. No contact means no giving or receiving information about the ex from friends, family, facebook, online, text, letters, voice mails, gifts, B-day, anything.

Can you keep contact? Sure if you want to keep stuck in this forever running loop of abuse. Or if you never want to find a healthy relationship with someone who truly loves you.

True change starts with you. Change is hard and un-familiar at times. We don’t feel good with this type of change we fight it, and deny it. You must accept it. Change has all the time in the world, What about you? Are you going to wait your life time, just to prove me or anyone you were right 30 years later? Being able to say on your death bed, see he/she did love me.

Cry your eyes out, get angry, walk, journal, and talk to trusted friends who will not repeat your conversations to anyone. Post your thoughts. See a therapist. There are lots of tools to help, but no simple quick fix.  It really sucks but what's worse, is staying stuck in this loop forever. Good luck to you.       

[gallerykey]

I dont believe he will call, this will make it easier for me as I wont have to make that decision of do i or dont i... . When we were first together i found out he was in contact with his ex, he said to collect post and we are now talking friend on fb and she has said thats all it was but he obviously felt the need to keep in contact with her but i dont see it happening with me. The lies and then ultimately finding out he was on a dating website meeting another woman while declaring undying love for me (yes while he was satying at hers!) hit me hard and i let rip at him, i knew it was the end so didnt care what i was saying.I think because of what i said he hates me so there is no need to contact me. He still has all my stuff and i know i wont be getting it back but im ok with that now.

Saw my T this morning and it was more about me rather than how im still feeling about him which was really good. I know i was partly to blame as i stayed andallowed but i can and will improve on all of that.

I actually feel better about me today, done my hair, make up etc... . which i hadnt done in a while as it always caused accusations i was cheating (if i knew then what i know now )

The NC is the hardest thing I have EVER done but i know i have to do it. There are no friends to ask what hes doing as he doesnt have any and mine never really knew him anyway. I will survive but its a crappy long journey

[Lao Tzu]

IMJ72,

    As you said, you're only 4 days out.  Give yourself a break, my dear!  I'm 30 years out and a little part of me still wants my pwBPD back; it's the way this works.  Let's also understand that you might even end up back with him briefly in a recycle (or 2... or 200).  It isn't the end of the owrld.  If you do go back you will be evn more angry with yourself when the inevitable devaluing and discarding happens again, but you might well believe the baloney even after that.  None of this is the end of the world, although it seems so.  Even staying with a pwBPD is not always the end of the world.  Give yourself a chance to be human and make even more 'mistakes' if you need to.  You'll figure out what is best for you along the way.  

    The main thing I suggest, though, is that as you do what you feel is right for you, work in parallel very diligently (and this isn't easy) on understanding what it is that he gives you that you need so desperately.  Figure out why this r/s is so different fom others you've had and you will be on the path to controlling your own destiny rather than having it controlled by someone with a mental disorder.  People here will help you with this, of course.

LT

[gallerykey]

Im sure there will always be a part of me that wants him,if he had stuck to therapy and not cheated then there would be a bigger part of me still wanting him. I know i will never really be ridof these feelings and emotions but at least i can start to process them better.

I hope next week to delve deeper into why, but today even brough up things i hadnt thought of. I always thought i had a good childhood and i did in terms of no abuse etc... . but we did touch on how i felt growing up one of 6. It was only when answering that i felt none of us got individual time, i never felt special in any form as there too many of us to get special time or feelings. This def has been a factor as he very quickly made me feel special and he had all the time in the world for me.

I am a very long way off ever being able to look back and think he did me a favour i know but a little positive thinking does help me.

Tomorrow i could be spending all day crying again back to posting how i feel my life is over but at least i can look back and think i know i can have good days, with him i know there wont be good days as i spent all day worrying what i said and did.

Am i thinking i will be better in 6months, a year, 10 years NO but i will start feeling better and thats a step, every step will be to a better future

[Lao Tzu]

AMEN, sister!  You said it all.  By the way, I used to believe the often stated position that the pwBPD is actually giving you a gift by what they did to you.  "Charred" blew that nice piece of touchy-feely baloney up when he said it would be like expecting the Japanese to be grateful for being hit with nukes since they did so well post-war.  No, you are going to make sweet lemonade from the very sour lemons you have been given and it's all about your strength and your alone.  You go girl!

LT