Caught him lying again. What do I do?

[lovethebeach]

Today is day 12.

14 days ago my boyfriend was here and we were trying to work on things. We had such a great weekend together. I still can't comprehend what happened!

I caught him lying AGAIN. This was the third big lie in three weeks. One month ago, I also caught him on dating websites and he had a secret e-mail account where he was messaging other women on Craigslist.

Anyway,  12 days ago he said he was at school and Five Guys... .But, he was really at an Italian Restaurant with God knows who. I had his passwords to his accounts, so it showed that he was lying. When I caught him red handed, he said "I'm sorry for lying, but you shouldn't of snooped... .in the morning he changed everything. He flipped out at me for snooping and sent me money to mail his things back.

I've texted him twice, and he's so cold and distant.

Last night, I asked him to call me for "closure" and he took that opportunity to belittle me and tell me that I never tried FOR 2 YEARS. He changed everything about himself and I did absolutely no work on the relationship. He was so mean and downright rude.

He did change (mirror) yes. But, he was always a liar and I couldn't even get any acknowledgement or validation.

My question from here is: What do I do? Will he ever contact me again? Should I try to text him/call him? Is there any hope left, once your exBPD has turned "off"?

He really believes that he tried and I didn't. I don't know what happened to Ethan. He's gone. Completely gone... .AND YET HE WAS THE ONE WHO WAS CAUGHT LYING.

During our conversation, I couldn't even bring myself to throw that back in his face. I let him say what he had to say... .

Now, I feel like I should text him "I'm glad our conversation last night showed your true colors. You lied and cheated and I continued to try. I'm done. Your things are in the mail." Or something mean.

I feel like he only cares when I'm mad.

Ugh. I dont know what to do! Someone help!

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

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[myself]

Sorry you're going through this. The lies and projections are what really ended my r/s, too. I had to draw the line for my own well being and that meant focusing on myself and walking away. If that's what would be best for you, do that. If saying what you feel would be better, say it. I definitely expressed myself at the end, and even though it was kind of like flushing it down the drain as far as she didn't change her ways or apologize, it was a relief to have said what I felt, pointing out facts I knew to be true, and standing up for myself (and the r/s). Look ahead a bit, do you see yourself dealing with this better having spoken up, or not? If it's better to not play the game, just stay away. Good luck, I know how hard and confusing this stuff can be. Rejection mixed with betrayal mixed with disordered b.s.

[christoff522]

Today is day 12.

14 days ago my boyfriend was here and we were trying to work on things. We had such a great weekend together. I still can't comprehend what happened!

I caught him lying AGAIN. This was the third big lie in three weeks. One month ago, I also caught him on dating websites and he had a secret e-mail account where he was messaging other women on Craigslist.

Anyway,  12 days ago he said he was at school and Five Guys... .But, he was really at an Italian Restaurant with God knows who. I had his passwords to his accounts, so it showed that he was lying. When I caught him red handed, he said "I'm sorry for lying, but you shouldn't of snooped... .in the morning he changed everything. He flipped out at me for snooping and sent me money to mail his things back.

I've texted him twice, and he's so cold and distant.

Last night, I asked him to call me for "closure" and he took that opportunity to belittle me and tell me that I never tried FOR 2 YEARS. He changed everything about himself and I did absolutely no work on the relationship. He was so mean and downright rude.

He did change (mirror) yes. But, he was always a liar and I couldn't even get any acknowledgement or validation.

My question from here is: What do I do? Will he ever contact me again? Should I try to text him/call him? Is there any hope left, once your exBPD has turned "off"?

He really believes that he tried and I didn't. I don't know what happened to Ethan. He's gone. Completely gone... .AND YET HE WAS THE ONE WHO WAS CAUGHT LYING.

During our conversation, I couldn't even bring myself to throw that back in his face. I let him say what he had to say... .

Now, I feel like I should text him "I'm glad our conversation last night showed your true colors. You lied and cheated and I continued to try. I'm done. Your things are in the mail." Or something mean.

I feel like he only cares when I'm mad.

Ugh. I dont know what to do! Someone help!

Okay. Send him his things back. But under no circumstances should YOU attempt to contact HIM. He has to contact you. That should be the way things are right now. Any attempt that you make to contact him will add to his dysregulation.

A simple and twisted explanation of how he feels right now, he feels betrayed. Yes, I know he shouldn't but he does. He feels he cannot trust you anymore and that is why he left. Yes, its crazy, hes a liar and a cheat... but thats BPD for you.

A BPD cannot acknowledge (sincerely) that they've ever done anything wrong ever in their life, its not in their makeup to do so.

What he did after he found out was emotionally distance himself from you, basically he flipped on you. He turned everything negative. It's called splitting, and its basically he has two compartments in his brain, one for all your good stuff, and one for all your bad. He turned off the good stuff, and turned on the bad. So he no longer sees anything good about you, only the negative.

Now don't think that this is your fault, it's nobody's fault. But if you want to move on, or even if you want to get back with him, you must NOT contact him. Trust me, one day he WILL seek you out again. Until then you need to ascertain why you're in a relationship, learn about BPD, and utterly scour the web for information. Deal with your issues before you ever contemplate a relationship with someone like this. And... no, things will never change... he will always do this, always behave this way.

I watched my friend who has BPD go through the motions of ending a relationship, his main answer for breaking up was this "I'm bored and wanna sleep with other people". He was all over the dating websites, and he wanted free reign, he lived with his parents and they would never accept him bringing random girls home if he was in another relationship... so he made a decision. I'm pretty sure he hardly ever got other girls. But he was an absolute master at seducing girls, he knew all the tricks. Left me in the dust. He also studied all sorts of seduction material online, he knew what he was doing, he honed his skills and probably still studies this stuff now. So my advice to you from my own experience, do not make any effort to contact him. Take at least 60-90 days before you even think of giving in and sending him a text. Put everything you have that reminds you of him into a box photos, letters, gifts etc, maybe even take it to a friends and ask them to keep it until 60-90 days have passed. Put his number in that box too, and delete his number and any other contact details off your phone.

The idea is to do exactly what he's done, cut that stuff off. It'll allow you to have some perspective. Remember these two words

ITS OVER. Everytime you think about him, remember ITS OVER. It won't be easy, but its necessary. I bet that within that 60 days, he'll text you.

[Deeno02]

Today is day 12.

14 days ago my boyfriend was here and we were trying to work on things. We had such a great weekend together. I still can't comprehend what happened!

I caught him lying AGAIN. This was the third big lie in three weeks. One month ago, I also caught him on dating websites and he had a secret e-mail account where he was messaging other women on Craigslist.

Anyway,  12 days ago he said he was at school and Five Guys... .But, he was really at an Italian Restaurant with God knows who. I had his passwords to his accounts, so it showed that he was lying. When I caught him red handed, he said "I'm sorry for lying, but you shouldn't of snooped... .in the morning he changed everything. He flipped out at me for snooping and sent me money to mail his things back.

I've texted him twice, and he's so cold and distant.

Last night, I asked him to call me for "closure" and he took that opportunity to belittle me and tell me that I never tried FOR 2 YEARS. He changed everything about himself and I did absolutely no work on the relationship. He was so mean and downright rude.

He did change (mirror) yes. But, he was always a liar and I couldn't even get any acknowledgement or validation.

My question from here is: What do I do? Will he ever contact me again? Should I try to text him/call him? Is there any hope left, once your exBPD has turned "off"?

He really believes that he tried and I didn't. I don't know what happened to Ethan. He's gone. Completely gone... .AND YET HE WAS THE ONE WHO WAS CAUGHT LYING.

During our conversation, I couldn't even bring myself to throw that back in his face. I let him say what he had to say... .

Now, I feel like I should text him "I'm glad our conversation last night showed your true colors. You lied and cheated and I continued to try. I'm done. Your things are in the mail." Or something mean.

I feel like he only cares when I'm mad.

Ugh. I dont know what to do! Someone help!

LTB. Listen. This isnt easy. At all. You need to cut the cord, period. Do not give in. Im 38 Days NC and, while difficult, its the best in the long run. When my exBPDgf insulted me and my daughter when I tried to patch things up, I walked out of the gym and never looked back. Its been hell, Im in therapy and Im jacked up as hell, but its the best. NO ONE deserves to be treated like that, no one.

[thatwasthat]

Hey there!

I've been in almost the exact same situation (if you read on the forums, you will have noticed that although there are often some differences it always follows a certain script.)

I've been at this point not too long ago. I know that it's something that is incomprehensible an also something you probably don't want to hear. But he will very likely no "understand."

As I said I had almost the same thing happen, total shutdown. The more you try to show how much you tried... .the more "they" shut down. Try to see it like this:

What he does makes no sense, is unfair, unreasonable... .the list goes on. He "knows" that. At the same time it is all he has ever known. If he would fully acknowledge what you did, what he did... .it would mean he would have to look into the mirror. Face the "insanity." So he has mechanisms in place that keep him from having to face all this. It's self preservation.

If you look at your situation from this point of view... .there's nothing you can say without attacking him.

If you write hime something "mean" (although understandable)... .you're the monster. If you are understanding and loving... .it would also make him face "reality." Not gonna happen.

It happened ONCE that my ex wife almost fully acknowledged her fault, her wrongdoing. And it was only for a couple of minutes.

It may sound weird... .but the way I am handling all this now... .LOVING BUT RADICAL ACCEPTANCE.

I won't be able to bring my point across. Although this point would be good. Whatever I do... .It will lead to more drama.

Yes, I love her. Very much so. But I understood... .If I love her... .I don't want to cause her pain. And every interaction, also very bad for my own well being... .is also painful to her, stirring the pot.

So I try to be neutral. I hope to maybe one day be  at least a good memory, something she will look back to and see that there was something.

Further involving myself with all this would inevitably cause the opposite.

It hurts. But it's the only way to go, at least in my eyes. Don't initiate contact unless you absolutely have to. If they initiate... .only answer if you HAVE TO. And answer when you see fit.

Maybe this is the true essence of... .loving also means letting go.

[lovethebeach]

Christoff522: Wow. That was really eye opening.

How long do they dysregulate for and how long will I be painted black?

And what makes you think he'll contact me again, considering last night he was so mean and hurtful?

I think he's out, totally fine ... .living his life again.


Thatwasthat: Does that mean he no longer cares? I can't even begin to believe that the two years we spent together have been wiped out of his brain? He lied and cheated. I was trying to work on things.

I'm supposed to be okay with letting him think so negatively of me? Will he ever see "me" again?

[Deeno02]

As thatwasthat said: "It hurts. But it's the only way to go, at least in my eyes. Don't initiate contact unless you absolutely have to. If they initiate... .only answer if you HAVE TO. And answer when you see fit."

If I may add to that, keep it SHORT! No long sentences or complex explanations. Yes/No.

[Deeno02]

Christoff522: Wow. That was really eye opening.

How long do they dysregulate for and how long will I be painted black?

And what makes you think he'll contact me again, considering last night he was so mean and hurtful?

I think he's out, totally fine ... .living his life again.


Thatwasthat: Does that mean he no longer cares? I can't even begin to believe that the two years we spent together have been wiped out of his brain? He lied and cheated. I was trying to work on things.

I'm supposed to be okay with letting him think so negatively of me? Will he ever see "me" again?

LTB, Im trying, as are most of us, to wrap our heads around the fact that we are treated like we didnt exist. Mine was only 16 months, some folks have been wondering the same after a 20+year r/s. Im not sure theres any answer I can provide to lessen that hurt as it still affects me greatly. Im sorry kiddo, wish I had the answer, but if I did, I wouldnt be on here.

[lovethebeach]

I don't think I'll ever hear from him again after last night.

He hasn't initiated contact once in the past 12 days. I had only out of love. I never expected that argument to end our two year relationship.

He was caught lying, so he left. Makes no sense.

I miss him everyday. I suppose the old him. Who-ever he is any more, I just don't know that person. He's so cold. How does he not care?

[christoff522]

Christoff522: Wow. That was really eye opening.

How long do they dysregulate for and how long will I be painted black?

And what makes you think he'll contact me again, considering last night he was so mean and hurtful?

I think he's out, totally fine ... .living his life again.

This is why I say don't contact, they dysregulate for as long as they dysregulate. If you disturb them and message them all the time it will increase the duration. But if you say nothing, move on somewhat you will trigger his abandonment fears and he may reach out. Of course it's no certainty, but usually dysregulation is a short period of time... it can be a few days, maybe a couple of weeks. Not to say he will reach out that quickly, but he will reach out - they always do.

Trust me on this. I thought my BPDx would never ever contact me again, i ended up giving in and contacting her. They don't want it. But then my birthday came and on her own she messaged me saying happy birthday.

Let me just add something, your relationship will never be the same. Even if you declare one another to be boyfriend and girlfriend again, they won't ever be the same. The longer you two stay out of contact the better in my opinion. It may allow you to start fresh if you so wished. But the best thing to do, is avoid all contact for as long as possible. Let him reach out to you, and feel good knowing he will because he will. But don't let that be your focus any more. Find new things to do with your life, fill the time with something else.

We all here know they come back, just for contact's sake, and it won't be about you it'll be about them. You ask why he would contact you... because he's lonely, because he needs someone to talk to and his other supply is unavailable. You need to acknowledge and work on your feelings, and not worry, because he will be back, the question I want you to have when he does come back is this WHY SHOULD I ALLOW HIM BACK INTO MY LIFE?

[thatwasthat]

Christoff522: Wow. That was really eye opening.

How long do they dysregulate for and how long will I be painted black?

And what makes you think he'll contact me again, considering last night he was so mean and hurtful?

I think he's out, totally fine ... .living his life again.


Thatwasthat: Does that mean he no longer cares? I can't even begin to believe that the two years we spent together have been wiped out of his brain? He lied and cheated. I was trying to work on things.

I'm supposed to be okay with letting him think so negatively of me? Will he ever see "me" again?

He cares. Way too much. So much that he has to dissociate, paint you black. It's just as paradox as everything that comes with the disorder. Push/pull. Abandonment/Engulfment... .

I know I might seem like I'm trying to talk you out of your feelings. Trust me, I've been there and have seen "advice" that way too.

BUT. If you love him. And love yourself... .let things go for now. For your good and for his "good."

You need to be a strong person to face this, and you are not at the moment. You are hurt, confused... .probably more than you have ever been before.

You don't have to be okay with it. But... .see it as what it is. It's a defense mechanism. He needs to protect himself. The person in him you love... .this person will suffer just as much as you do if he has to face his disorder. That is why the "other person you got to know now protects him.

You don't have this "luxury."

I think he "sees" YOU. At least temporarily... .but as soon as this happens... .the mechanism kicks in. See?

Give it time. I know it is hard. But it is the only way to gain a position of strength (not in the sense of fighting.)

I am here for you when the going gets tough. As are many others. You are not alone.

Don't go the seemingly easy way. It will lead into more and more pain for everybody involved.

I can PROMISE you. You will come out of this as a person you would have never even dared dreaming about being. NO matter if there will be contact or not (and there will.) But this is not your concern right now.

GET STRONG FIRST. And that requires distance.

[christoff522]

I can PROMISE you. You will come out of this as a person you would have never even dared dreaming about being. NO matter if there will be contact or not (and there will.) But this is not your concern right now.

This is true, BPD relationships cause the 'nons' to become stronger than they've ever been. You see, they reflect upon us our own insecurities and failings, and in order to grow out of them we have to acknowledge them in our own way. I have to say, that had I gone NC 8 months ago, I'd be a wreck right now. Instead I'm strong, and you will too lovethebeach. We're all here with you. 

[Deeno02]

Christoff522: Wow. That was really eye opening.

How long do they dysregulate for and how long will I be painted black?

And what makes you think he'll contact me again, considering last night he was so mean and hurtful?

I think he's out, totally fine ... .living his life again.

This is why I say don't contact, they dysregulate for as long as they dysregulate. If you disturb them and message them all the time it will increase the duration. But if you say nothing, move on somewhat you will trigger his abandonment fears and he may reach out. Of course it's no certainty, but usually dysregulation is a short period of time... it can be a few days, maybe a couple of weeks. Not to say he will reach out that quickly, but he will reach out - they always do.

Trust me on this. I thought my BPDx would never ever contact me again, i ended up giving in and contacting her. They don't want it. But then my birthday came and on her own she messaged me saying happy birthday.

Let me just add something, your relationship will never be the same. Even if you declare one another to be boyfriend and girlfriend again, they won't ever be the same. The longer you two stay out of contact the better in my opinion. It may allow you to start fresh if you so wished. But the best thing to do, is avoid all contact for as long as possible. Let him reach out to you, and feel good knowing he will because he will. But don't let that be your focus any more. Find new things to do with your life, fill the time with something else.

We all here know they come back, just for contact's sake, and it won't be about you it'll be about them. You ask why he would contact you... because he's lonely, because he needs someone to talk to and his other supply is unavailable. You need to acknowledge and work on your feelings, and not worry, because he will be back, the question I want you to have when he does come back is this WHY SHOULD I ALLOW HIM BACK INTO MY LIFE?

Even if you've already been replaced?

[lovethebeach]

What makes everyone say he'll come back?


He's so mean. He screamed at yelled last night and took every opportunity to tell me how done he was. How much I didn't matter anymore.

Youre saying that because he cares, he did that?

[thatwasthat]

What makes everyone say he'll come back?


He's so mean. He screamed at yelled last night and took every opportunity to tell me how done he was. How much I didn't matter anymore.

Youre saying that because he cares, he did that?

Twisted, isn't it?

In a nutshell, yes. He cares.

[lovethebeach]

Does any part of him remember "us" or our relationship? Is there anything I can do at this point?

I feel like he's just forgotten all about us.

This is so difficult.

[Skip]

My question from here is: What do I do? Will he ever contact me again? Should I try to text him/call him? Is there any hope left, once your exBPD has turned "off"?

Quick question... .

Why would you ask a "hope" question on a detachment Board?  

Forget for a moment about the argument of who tried harder... .

~ he's on a dating sites and Craig's list

~ sounds like he went on a meet and great (or even a date)

~ when confronted, he pulled back and tried to blame shift.

The biggest issue is that he is trolling for another female connections - either to replace you or to be in addition to you.

So why not politely ask this questions with no emotion via email or text.  I say no emotion so as not to be enabling.

So are you wanting to see other people?  

Do you want us to also still see each other?

I don't want an open relationship (or for things to end) - are you will to end all this (so I can be certain) and work on us?

Don't let him turn it on you or freak out out at his answer.

See what he says.

[Deeno02]

Does any part of him remember "us" or our relationship? Is there anything I can do at this point?

I feel like he's just forgotten all about us.

This is so difficult.

I was replaced 2 days after she dumped me. Didnt mourn the relationship at all. So in my case, no. I was just a replacement to get her through her rough spot,(separation,divorce, then death of a parent, alimony issues) encouraged her to get her coaching certifications to teach Volleyball after being a stay at home mom for 15 years and then, as her confidence improved and she was coaching at High school and private clubs and private lessons, I was gone. Nothing we did, nothing I did with her kids, icluding taking her autistic son under my wing, teaching him to tie his shoes, getting him into football where he thrived as a quarterback and coming out of his shell, mattered nothing to her at all. Because I didnt take her on vacation, or spend enough time with her, or I didnt adhere to the treat me special or else rule, or I didnt buy her alot of stuff, I was tossed aside. Every morning I look at the engagement ring I was going to give her on her birthday that she never got to see.Because she dumped me. To soon for me to take back, but I will. But the thing I wish I could take back were those 16 months together. I would rather spend the rest of my life alone, then relive those moments.

[lovethebeach]

Skip, because we're no longer together. We haven't been for twelve days now. He made that especially clear last night.

I was only wondering if there was anything I could do.

I think I've already been replaced because he's not contacting me. Every other time he used to beg and gravel at my feet. Now that I've caught him in too many lies, everything is my fault.

[Skip]

We haven't been for twelve days now.

I think I've already been replaced because he's not contacting me.

If you have a desire to hold this together, it will help to step back from the immediate emotional of it all. 

12 days is long, but not that long.  And it doesn't mean you have been replaced.

Look, you caught him red-handed and that has a mountain of shame attached because it is poor character on his part. In everyones eyes - mother, friends, you - he knows this will be seen as being a slug.

He putting this off on you - its dysfunctional coping.  We see this even when BPD is not the case.  He can blame it on you.  He may even vacate the relationship as that is easier than facing the shame.

What has to happen is for you to let the emotions and the games subside and take the threat away- and then ask what he wants to do. 

See this for what it is, not what it feels like.

1. He reaching out to other women because he feels something is lacking.

2. Something may be lacking. Or it may just be selfishness.  You can't know right now.

3. The conversation shifting the blame to you is a cover for shame.  Don't engage it and don't shame him right now.  Let this cool.  How long will that take?

4. When its all cool, ask him what he wants?  Don't try to sway him - let it come out.

5. Don't assume things you can't know, yet.  That will make this harder.

Does that make sense?

[lovethebeach]

He has vacated the relationship. He made it perfectly clear that he wants nothing to do with the relationship any longer and he shifted all the blame onto me.

Yet, he was caught lying multiple times.

I'm hurt and confused. How could he be so cold and so distant from me? I've made attempts to talk and its gotten no where. I think it's safe to say after last night, it's over.

But, what do I do moving forward?

[Skip]

He has vacated the relationship. He made it perfectly clear that he wants nothing to do with the relationship any longer and he shifted all the blame onto me.

Yet, he was caught lying multiple times.

I'm hurt and confused. How could he be so cold and so distant from me? I've made attempts to talk and its gotten no where. I think it's safe to say after last night, it's over.

But, what do I do moving forward?

You can:

1. emotionally back away, lets this cool, and try to figure out what is real and what is just emotional and extinction bursts.

2. engage the emotional chaos (and risk escalating this and narrow the likelihood of recovery)

Read this on breakup/makeup cycles.  It may help put this in perspective:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=120215.0

Someone has to stay cool and guide this.  A person with BPD is not good at this - so its up to you.

[lovethebeach]

Thank you for all your help and advice Skip!

So, moving forward ... .I think it's best to not reach out to him? I'll mail his things back tomorrow.

Last night was just so damaging to me. It's like I'm split black and I nothing I say/do will help.

[Deeno02]

Thank you for all your help and advice Skip!

So, moving forward ... .I think it's best to not reach out to him? I'll mail his things back tomorrow.

Last night was just so damaging to me. It's like I'm split black and I nothing I say/do will help.

I think we all agree with Skip. If you dont have to, dont.