My Wedding and uBPD Mother - What Would You Do?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hi all,

I've been mostly NC with my uBPD mother for a couple months now on her request. She'll randomly text me messages intended to guilt-trip me, and I generally choose not to respond (if I do respond it's when I'm worried that she sounds suicidal, and I usually just ask "Are you okay?" and leave it at that). I've been planning my wedding, which is about a year and a half away, and it's time to start making some firm decisions there. My sister just got married a few months ago, and my mother feels that she was "attacked" and "abused" the entire time, though that's unrealistic and irrational--which is highly usual of her thoughts. As a result, she refuses to discuss my wedding with me--i.e. she shuts down, blames me for parts of my sister's wedding that I had absolutely no control over, asks me repeatedly whether it's okay for her to be treated like trash, and says she won't repeat that and needs to take care of herself since no one else cares about her.

I should start looking for a wedding gown soon. I've asked my mom twice whether she wants to do that with me, and she hasn't given me a real answer--the conversation devolves into arguing about my sister's wedding. At this point I'm not hoping for a miracle. I know that even if my mom does come with me it'll be a negative experience, but I'm not willing to not invite her to this type of thing since she is still my mom. All I want is an answer as to whether she even wants to be there, but I can't seem to get that out of her.

I'm considering making appointments, informing her of the times and places, and telling her that it's her choice as to whether she wants to come. My hesitation is that she's been calling all the shots in terms of when I can talk to or see her and what we talk about when we do see each other, and I honestly feel that I'll need time to emotionally prepare for her being there. I just cannot get her to give me a solid answer either way, and I know multiple parts of my planning and wedding will go this way if I keep allowing this non-response to my questions. If it were totally up to me and there were no repercussions I would just leave her out of everything having to do with my wedding, but I don't feel that's morally right, and I don't want to hurt her.

Have any of you been through this? How did you handle it?

Thanks for your thoughts.

[clip06]

Hi all,

I've been mostly NC with my uBPD mother for a couple months now on her request. She'll randomly text me messages intended to guilt-trip me, and I generally choose not to respond (if I do respond it's when I'm worried that she sounds suicidal, and I usually just ask "Are you okay?" and leave it at that). I've been planning my wedding, which is about a year and a half away, and it's time to start making some firm decisions there. My sister just got married a few months ago, and my mother feels that she was "attacked" and "abused" the entire time, though that's unrealistic and irrational--which is highly usual of her thoughts. As a result, she refuses to discuss my wedding with me--i.e. she shuts down, blames me for parts of my sister's wedding that I had absolutely no control over, asks me repeatedly whether it's okay for her to be treated like trash, and says she won't repeat that and needs to take care of herself since no one else cares about her.

I should start looking for a wedding gown soon. I've asked my mom twice whether she wants to do that with me, and she hasn't given me a real answer--the conversation devolves into arguing about my sister's wedding. At this point I'm not hoping for a miracle. I know that even if my mom does come with me it'll be a negative experience, but I'm not willing to not invite her to this type of thing since she is still my mom. All I want is an answer as to whether she even wants to be there, but I can't seem to get that out of her.

I'm considering making appointments, informing her of the times and places, and telling her that it's her choice as to whether she wants to come. My hesitation is that she's been calling all the shots in terms of when I can talk to or see her and what we talk about when we do see each other, and I honestly feel that I'll need time to emotionally prepare for her being there. I just cannot get her to give me a solid answer either way, and I know multiple parts of my planning and wedding will go this way if I keep allowing this non-response to my questions. If it were totally up to me and there were no repercussions I would just leave her out of everything having to do with my wedding, but I don't feel that's morally right, and I don't want to hurt her.

Have any of you been through this? How did you handle it?

Thanks for your thoughts.

[GeekyGirl]

Hi clip06, and congratulations on your upcoming wedding!

What would happen if you go dress shopping with your MOH or another close friend instead of your mother? I'm sorry that your mother hasn't responded--getting the silent treatment really hurts.   Know that when the big day comes, you'll be showered with love and affection from your loved ones, no matter how involved your mother is with the wedding planning.

What would you really like for your mother to be involved with, and what wedding details do you want to leave her out of? What worked well for me is to let my mother be involved in the things that didn't matter as much to me and DH (like the items at the buffet and flowers). You could give her choices, too... ."Mom, do you think I should serve salmon or steak?" "What kinds of flowers do you like?"

I just cannot get her to give me a solid answer either way, and I know multiple parts of my planning and wedding will go this way if I keep allowing this non-response to my questions. If it were totally up to me and there were no repercussions I would just leave her out of everything having to do with my wedding, but I don't feel that's morally right, and I don't want to hurt her.

I think it's very gracious of you to involve your mother--or at least give her the option of being involved. How are you doing otherwise?

[coldNheartless]

Hi Clip06, Congratulations!

What a happy time! I am in a similar place as you, as my wedding is 4 months away and much is to be done! Enjoy this planning, and remember; this is not about the dress, who you pick the dress with, or anything other than making the lifelong commitment and vows to the person you love and starting your new journey together.

My advice to you, since you have a 1.5 years till the wedding, prepare for ups and downs from Mom. My BPDmom has been through every phase, she loved the idea, hated the idea, and now is NC (and I expect more too  ). I am getting random texts from her as well, see https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=239826.0

We can expect our BPD mothers to try everything in the book to be the the center of your attention (just search "wedding" on this site an see... .yeah it helps!). Whether that means being there or not being there, making a scene during the wedding or stressing you so hard about choices or if she was invited (either dress shopping, food or flower picking etc... .). BPD's have a very hard time with change and letting go. The marrying off of family is a rough time for them, not that you need to be all that sympathetic, but know that she will try her tricks, all of them. If you are prepared and feel you can ride it out, then just put on that happy face, and be the woman you are working to become.

However, you do not need to ride it out if you do not want to. I too wanted very much to have my mom with me to pick out the dress, or gmom too. I initially went with close friends but found them terribly distracting, and i had a very hard time finding a dress I liked. I went back again by myself for an appointment (seriously you need an appointment its worth it!), and tried on dresses at my own pace. I did get stove up and shed a few tears in the dressing room, but I found a modest dress that I liked, and I spent some time thinking of good memories of my aunts and gmom dress shopping for my youngest aunt years back. Sometimes a good memory makes a better substitute than a person with BPD!

I think your idea of giving her appointment times and locations is great, but got over in your mind what you will do and feel if she doesn't show, or any other possibility. Sometimes giving yourself the peace of mind to do something on your own is so gratifying. It's ok either way. Just know that. It feels big now but focus on the most important part, your vows.

Definitely emotionally prepare as best possible. Whatever you do, don't let her pay for anything because she will throw it in your face or the face of all your guests.

I am close friends with a top wedding planner in Scottsdale, Az who has seen it all, her advice is "if mom isn't playing friendly, then she doesn't need to come. A wedding is about the couple and friends celebrating and supporting their new commitment, anyone who is in the way of that should not be a part of it." Think of your mom as a guest and treat her as such, all guests on my list must be on good behavior!

Very good luck to you. Keep posting, I want to keep up with how it goes!

hugs, you blushing bride to be!

[coldNheartless]

Hi Clip06,

I kept thinking about your post as I woke up this morning.

I know it feels like a Mom should be there, helping you along the way, supporting you and telling you how great you look in the dress or how she prefers the salmon to the steak. And she should be there, especially if she were a mentally healthy normal mom. They may not be able to, or may not want to, or just plain refuse to be the normal parent and friend we need and deserve. That is not to say its ok, and they can get help, but its just what we have to work with. You may not be able to get her to behave the way you need and want, which is a loss, but the win is when you have everything lined up so that you know that you will not be manipulated by FOG (fear, obligation & guilt), or harassed in anyway on your wedding day. Whatever level of involvement you choose her to have, just set it up so you have peace and can focus on what is the most important thing.

"If it were totally up to me and there were no repercussions I would just leave her out of everything having to do with my wedding... ."

It is totally up to you. She can be there with you and enjoy the festivities without have to make choices on them. She is your guest and mother, not your wedding planner. She might have repercussions, but you should shield yourself from that, she has no right to punish you for anything, you are an adult.

"... .but I don't feel that's morally right... ."

There is no right and wrong here, you are planning an a ceremony and expensive party to celebrate the ceremony, there are no rules or laws on how things should be laid out. Its all flexible, she can be as much a part of the plans or as little as you want. You have the power here to call the shots if you are spending your own money.

"... .and I don't want to hurt her."

It seems that she is hurting you  but you are more worried about her feelings than your own. Remember to take care of your feelings first. BPD's love to make you feel compromised enough that you are thinking (and fearing) of their feels and actions even when they are not around.  Are afraid of her feelings or her reactions? You used the word "repercussions", which makes me worry... .


I wish you so much luck and hope you find a way to navigate this time in peace.

 

[clip06]

Thank you for your responses, GeekyGirl and coldNheartless. I definitely plan to invite others to my appointments, including my sister and possibly a friend or two. The fact that my mom becomes so negative when I so much as bring up the idea of going to look for dresses with me is not a good sign, and I know this process will be long and difficult. I hope you're coping all right, coldNheartless--I went back and read some of your posts, and I definitely feel for you! I hope your planning continues to go well for the next four months.

I think part of the reason that I'm having such a hard time excluding my mom from wedding planning is that I realize how difficult this must be for her, and I know that acting and thinking the way she does must be horribly exhausting and lonely for her. Sometimes I wish I could forget about that and just focus on how she treats me. Darn my overly empathic mind!

My fiance has mentioned a few times that he'd be happy with a courthouse wedding with just close family members and our closest friends, but I think that would be worse than surrounding myself with everyone who makes me happy. It would just make it that much more obvious to me that my mom is either not there or is present but unhappy. I don't want to revise my idea of what I want for my wedding just to avoid dealing with her--that isn't fair to me, and I can't keep choosing her happiness (if she could ever actually be happy) over my own.

I've talked to my fiance about the fact that perhaps the most frustrating part of this is that my mom still has a significant hold over me--I am still under her health insurance, and it would make no logical sense for me to get my own since I'm still in school and would be required to buy my program's (outrageously expensive) insurance policy. I feel like I haven't been able to become truly independent with this arrangement (and at 26 and living with my fiance it seems that I should feel independent), but I just can't deny the fact that it makes sense to stay on her policy until I graduate, which is right before my wedding. I even considered getting secretly married to be on my fiance's insurance and then still having a wedding later, but it seems like that would make our wedding less special.

My fiance and I plan to pay for the wedding by ourselves, but my mom has mentioned that she wants to give me the same amount of money that she spent on my sister's wedding, which I thought was fair, but I agree that she would find a way to throw it in my face. I'm not sure how much that amounts to, but my guess is somewhere in the range of $2000 to $3000. My mom has always been the type to show her "love" through money, though--just this past year on my birthday she gave me a $500 blender and then cut off contact with me for the next two months. For Christmas, after having minimal contact for several months, she gave me a $300 pair of earrings, then we immediately got into the wedding dress argument culminating in her telling me to leave, and then when I got back to my house I had received an email from her with a link to the earrings to show me how much they cost and to emphasize that she had bought the earrings because they're called "Wrapped in Love." I certainly felt wrapped in love after my mom told me to leave when I brought up wedding planning! It's always been very bizarre, and while I'm certainly uncomfortable accepting gifts and money from her, in a way it's the only relationship I have with her and I'm scared to let that go.

I'm also experiencing the slight inconvenience of my therapist being away on leave, which I completely understand, but it just leaves me with one less person to turn to for support.

Thanks again for reading and responding! I know I still have a lot to work on here, and it means a lot to me to be able to get this out to people who respond with true understanding rather than pity.

[clip06]

As for the "repercussions" statement... .yes, I'm sorry to say that I am afraid of her reaction. She's brought up her suicidality before, and I can't help but imagine that this might be the thing that pushes her over the edge. I understand that people with BPD tend to threaten more than they actually act on those feelings, but I also feel like being excluded from a daughter's wedding would be very painful for any parent. My mom thinks she's a great mother and consistently tells my siblings and me how much she's given up for us and done for us, so in her eyes it would be the ultimate insult to be excluded.

Based on her behavior at my sister's wedding I can say that I don't think she's emotionally capable of handling herself well at my upcoming wedding and I think it would be in both of our best interests if she didn't attend and weren't involved in any part of the process, but in her mind that would mean that I simply don't appreciate her (which she brings up constantly) and don't want her there. She expects me to hold her hand through the whole process, and I'm not willing to do that for her, but I also can't bring myself to completely exclude her. Not totally sure where to go from here, really.

[coldNheartless]

Good morning Clip,

Wow, I am 28 and I have felt almost everything you are going through. I so totally understand.

"The fact that my mom becomes so negative when I so much as bring up the idea of going to look for dresses with me is not a good sign, and I know this process will be long and difficult."

... .Yup, when i got engaged she was super fake happy, it desolved (when we were still in contact) into me mentioning the wedding and her response "ugh I just hate going to weddings, so fake. especially when you know everyone gets divorced".

If your Mom is not supporting you then she is a road block. Planning a wedding is a big job!

"I think part of the reason that I'm having such a hard time excluding my mom from wedding planning is that I realize how difficult this must be for her, and I know that acting and thinking the way she does must be horribly exhausting and lonely for her."

This too I have been through. But this is a trap. No matter what your mom has been through and goes through on a daily basis, she can improve it. She can get help and stop her self torment and the torment of you! Treatment and therapy can work if they honestly work on it. I don't care if she is one legged and has a horn, she can find a way to improve her own life, she doesn't need your two feet to stand on, you were not put here on this earth to be her keeper.

But being a victim is working for her. Look how its making you behave? Why on earth should she pursue help when you are waiting on her hand and foot, how lovely is that? Self work is hard, where is her motivation when everything is going her way. Why change what is working?

"Sometimes I wish I could forget about that and just focus on how she treats me."

You can. You are an adult. You are not her mother. The only persons you are responsible for is yourself, and your soon to be husband and your future children. Period. Ask you therapist, s/he should have your back on this one!

"past year on my birthday she gave me a $500 blender and then cut off contact with me for the next two months."

My mom did that too. It was a fancy juicer, her way of giving me a gift and telling me that I was fat and needed to go on a juice diet. The guilt is terrible for me because she is broke and I know she bought it on a credit card. I don't want to laugh but I have to, the similarities are too bazaar!

My mom did jewelry too! In this case it was a little different, my mom bought herself a silver engagement ring when I was born, she never ever takes it off, apparently it is supposed to symbolize her undying commitment to me, her one and only. Just thinking about it makes me feel like I am being strangled! How on earth could we be "wrapped in love" in your case, or "engaged" in mine, when they treat us like garbage? LOL

I swear the saving grace of people who have to deal with BPD's is that they are cookie cutter, all alike. At least we can find fellowship among each other!

You are strong. Hang in there. I hope your therapist gets back soon. You have a good amount of time before your wedding, good luck, you can do it, its not easy but we are here for you!

[clip06]

Thank you for the thoughts, coldNheartless. The similarities are ridiculous! When I read about BPD I'm often struck by how well my mom's personality, which I used to view as being extremely complex, can be summed up in one or two paragraphs. Maybe they should add a juicer/blender clause to every description. 

Everything you're saying makes sense. I know I have struggled and continue to struggle with fully separating from my mom--in many ways I've acted as her mother for as long as I can remember.

To complicate matters further, my mom has been in therapy for almost three years with an unbelievably enabling therapist (I've been to an appointment with her and my therapist--it's really bad, worse than I had suspected, to the point that even my therapist took issue with how my mom's therapist was acting). I've suggested DBT directly to my mom, but of course my mom wouldn't try something new when she can be completely validated when she sees her current therapist. It's incredibly frustrating, and she's gotten way worse since seeing this therapist. She thinks she's enlightened and "free from all the drama," but everyone else can see that she's worse than ever. I've even pointed that out to her, but she can't see it at all and just accuses me and everyone else of not working as hard as she is to see "the truth." I can't understand why any therapist would provide encouragement when a patient decides to cut off or severely reduce contact with literally every person who's "important" in her life, but that's what happened.

I'll keep chipping away at becoming more independent and making decisions that make sense in my life. I know my mom will never be truly happy with any decision I make, so I understand how futile it is to place her desires above my own. I just wish that were easier to do.

Thanks again for all the support.

[coldNheartless]

Dear Clip,

Actually, its not so uncommon that a BPD has a T wrapped around their finger. My moms T had to cancel her because she was getting under his skin too, but he resisted. Sound like your mom is being validated and encouraged by her T, but maybe the silver lining is a bit less contact.

I am so sorry that things are like this, daughters especially tend to be the caretakers of BPD parents.

My fiance's mother is an undiagnosed BPD, and he withdraws and blanks out on her behavior, like its so weird. My point is, we are all trying, and all at different stages, but the most important thing is we keep trying to recover from its affects and have a healthy  happy life.

Keep posting and good luck. Your on the right path.

[Tiredbride313]

Dear Clip,

I'm sorry you're dealing with this during such a happy time in your life. I went through the same thing with my BPD/npd parents when planning my wedding last year. I can tell you that I tried everything to make them feel involved in the wedding process and to share my happiness with them, but it didn't work. You can't please people like them because they will never be pleased. It was really hard for me to come to that realization because I spent most of my life making my decisions based on their approval and happiness. I too was consumed by how awful my mother must feel to be excluded from the most important day of her daughter's life, it's normal for you to feel like that. But that was her choice (and my father's).

Your wedding day, and more importantly your marriage, is about you and your soon-to-be husband. Do what makes you happy. If you don't want to include your mom in any of the wedding plans, then don't. Like coldNheartless said, planning a wedding is a big job and you don't need anyone in the way who is going to complicate things! Rely on the other people in your life, who I'm sure would be happy to step in. My bridesmaids, family friends, and now mother-in-law were there for those special moments where my parents weren't because of their selfishness.  As far as inviting her goes, do what you have to do to make you feel emotionally safe on your special day. It should be the norm that your mother should be at your side on your wedding day, but sometimes the norm isn't always the best. You don't have to invite her if you don't want to. It is up to you. If you do decide to invite her, have a trusted person nearby who can intervene if she starts to act up.

Either way - I would suggest hiring security for your wedding day. If you decide not to invite her and she shows up, or if you do invite her and she begins to act up, then she can be discreetly escorted out. I did that for my wedding day. He was very discreet and blended in as a guest. Although no drama ensued, the peace of mind for me was worth it.

Stay strong - you're doing great. I know it's not easy. It's all about taking things one day at a time. It's all worth it to be married to the love of your life. I promise.