'Feelings create facts'

[Issy]

Hi,

Can you help me getting a better picture of feelings create facts (and the otherway around?)?

Currently she doesn't want contact with me, so I must be a real trigger for her right now. We tried shortly, I sent her a message: "I dreamt of you last night, we were happily chatting again, and it was pleasant " She replied with 'right, I don't know what to say... It's not true'

Huh? What's not true? I guess you got my message, what it said was I missed her, and with sharing this I opened my heart/being vulnerable.

So why this peculiar response?

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[misuniadziubek]

If she doesn't want contact, then you shouldn't be contacting her and respecting that boundary. If she chooses to initiate contact, you can go from there.

It's not true. She meant: she doesn't know how to respond to that: Your dream is not reality. We're not happily chatting and things are not present.

I imagine she continues to not want contact. Perhaps giving her space is important?

[Issy]

 I had sent her bday wishes and she replied and communicated, so I said that aswell. I told her after that I'll wait for you (giving you space) if you want contact again, and so I'm doing that now.

I don't really understand it. My dream was true for I was dreaming it, it was pleasant for I felt it that way during the dream, and in the dream we were happily chatting... .So that's my thruth, her thruth is probably not a happy pleasant dream, but an unhappy, unpleasant reality, hence a dream in my case and a recollection sigh

It's obviously strange right? To say you didn't dream that, because thats what I read (I get it now though). And she missed the point I miss her andI am  sending her love, she's not only able to recieve love but she cannot read it aswell? Is that it?

[Issy]

Ulgh I wa trying to tweak my post then this thing came argh can't modify anymore! Angry emoticon?

[ArleighBurke]

Your original statement: Can you help me getting a better picture of feelings create facts (and the otherway around?)? hasn't really been answered.

For a BPD, when they FEEL uptight/annoyed etc, they will look for whatever facts support them feeling that, and ignore any facts that counter that.

So if they feel scared that you will leave, they assume this MUST be because you ARE going to leave. (their feeling = the true facts). Then they will justify/backup this feeling by remembering the things you've said, you packed your bag, you filled the car etc to support it, and ignore anything else.

Non-BPDs work the other way. They may feel scared you will leave, but then they can evaluate all the facts and decide that their fear is unfounded/silly, and probably change how they feel.

[Issy]

Thanks! It's clearer for me now. So sad it happens that way, it's so hard to correct her 'incorrect' thoughts.

But I haven't gotten an answere on this.

It's obviously strange right? To say you didn't dream that, because thats what I read (I get it now though). And she missed the point I miss her andI am  sending her love, she's not only able to recieve love but she cannot read it aswell? Is that it?

[Daniell85]

Bpd are highly sensitive. Probably she understood the message of love you are sending, but  she feels ambiguous about giving a response because of wanting the space thing. If you are feeling overwhelmed, then pressured... .its hard to want to engage more.

I learned in my relationship that giving space often calms down things. If you give her some space, then want to chat a bit, she will probablybe best able to talk to you about things that are not carrying a big emotional load with them... .hint, choose a neutral subject.

[waverider]

BPD is like an emotional filter. You could take a complete conversation and write it down. The BPD mind would scan it and highlight the words that match their mood, the rest is invisible. They then supply the links to mold these words into a story that validates that mood. Another day and they could scan the same message with a different emotion, highlight the words that match, then rejoin them to validate their current mood.

The result is two different interpretations of the same thing.

The same thing happens when thy recall memories from the past. Context is not filed away with those memories, they are simply a collection of snapshots and quotes, to be brought out and cut and pasted as fits best. The details being true and stated with confidence, and so they are believable, it can causes us to question our own recollections.

pwBPD are constantly in search of evidence to validate how they feel.

This is why their reactions are not always predictable unless you have a good idea of what their current emotional state is. What is taken as a complement today can be taken as an insult on a different day.

[Harri]

Hi Issy. 

We tried shortly, I sent her a message: "I dreamt of you last night, we were happily chatting again, and it was pleasant smiley" She replied with 'right, I don't know what to say... It's not true'

As someone who frequently needs to be knocked upside the head to get a message, I would not have interpreted your message as saying you are sending me your love and that you miss me.  I would, quite literally, take it as you telling me what your dream was, period.  When she says "It's not true", I think what she is referring to is that it was a dream, not reality (for her).  If it were me, after a breakup, I would be thinking you had a dream about our past relationship that has no resemblance to the present and I think that is another aspect to the "It's not true" part of her reply.

I hope that makes sense. 

[waverider]

There will always be misinterpretations, dont get too hung up on analyzing them, move on to steering things back to an even keel so that past misinterpretations dont get fueled and affect next issue

[Issy]

Bpd are highly sensitive. Probably she understood the message of love you are sending, but  she feels ambiguous about giving a response because of wanting the space thing. If you are feeling overwhelmed, then pressured... .its hard to want to engage more.

I learned in my relationship that giving space often calms down things. If you give her some space, then want to chat a bit, she will probablybe best able to talk to you about things that are not carrying a big emotional load with them... .hint, choose a neutral subject.

Yes absolutely true! Thanks.

But how long do I wait? She said she doesn't want to speak with me anymore, I told her I understand it and I'm here if she ever wanted to again. It takes months with her. And we haven't been really back with eachother scince last year, only trial and error.  So I wait till she comes out to me again I think that's the best thing to do, but it's horrible because it's hard to wait that long everytime... .What can I do?

[Issy]

Hi Issy. 

We tried shortly, I sent her a message: "I dreamt of you last night, we were happily chatting again, and it was pleasant smiley" She replied with 'right, I don't know what to say... It's not true'

As someone who frequently needs to be knocked upside the head to get a message, I would not have interpreted your message as saying you are sending me your love and that you miss me.  I would, quite literally, take it as you telling me what your dream was, period.  When she says "It's not true", I think what she is referring to is that it was a dream, not reality (for her).  If it were me, after a breakup, I would be thinking you had a dream about our past relationship that has no resemblance to the present and I think that is another aspect to the "It's not true" part of her reply.

I hope that makes sense. 

Yes but if I say I dreamt of you last night Harri and it was pleasant, what do you think? Simply hear what my dream was? 

But thanks for this information, it makes sense.

[unicorn2014]

Unfortunately I think you are going to get hurt if you keep reaching out to her. How long have you been in a relationship with her?

[Issy]

Unfortunately I think you are going to get hurt if you keep reaching out to her. How long have you been in a relationship with her?

Just over a year, yes I wait this one out. To me it's clear what happened and what we can work on, I don't see much other problems for the time being

[waverider]

even if things pick up again is this prolonged period of being pushed away going to a constant pattern.

The real problem with BPD relationships is not the individual issues and dramas, it is the repeating pattern of them.

[Issy]

So how to deal with a constant pattern? Can you make them less pushing you away?

[waverider]

So how to deal with a constant pattern? Can you make them less pushing you away?

Don't repeat the same pattern and dont focus on the current issue. Your life decisions need to be independent of their actions, not reactive to them.

If you dont make changes, nothing will change. Hope is just wishful thinking.

If you stay stable and doing your thing they can't push you away, yes they can move themselves away, but that is more effort and has less impact on you.

Taking more control of your life, they can oscillate around it, but you are not chasing them all over the plot always one step behind