Feeling emotionally abused

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hello.  My wife is undiagnosed, but she exhibits all the behaviors described on this site.  I'm just constantly in the dog house.  I think "I'm sorry" is the phrase I hear myself saying all the time.  We're constantly having meltdowns which lead us to "we're going to divorce... .you've never loved me... .etc."

I was married once before her and had a son by that marriage.  He is now 11, almost 12.  His mother and I split up when he was 3 and I was devastated. "A" (my wife) came on the scene soon after and just swept me off my feet with the attention she gave me.  However, within a few months, I began to see some initial signs of what I believe now (8 years later) to be BPD.  We remained in our relationship for four years which was pretty volatile, but out of both fear and desire - it was like I was addicted to her sexually - I kept hanging in there or giving her another chance after we broke up (which was a lot.)  We got married almost 5 years ago and it's been one rocky road.  We've had two beautiful children of our own who have brought us so much happiness, but as Jim Croce once sang in a song called "Lover's Cross:"  For every time that we spent laughing there were two times that I cried. 

It's affected all my children.  My oldest son doesn't like to come here but puts on a brave face.  He sees how I'm treated and it's affected him.  As a result, he's getting more silent treatments from her now.  My two year old daughter stands between us if we're arguing - I've learned to keep it calm and minimize yelling, but the tension is still there - and my daughter stands between us with her arms stretched wide as if to keep us apart.  She's also done a lot to alienate my parents and brother and his family who are all good people and try to get along with her though she's constantly setting up hoops for them to jump through to prove their sincerity.  These hoops are just straw men.

Right now, it's really really bad and while I've wanted many times to just run, I'm actually thinking divorce might be the best thing for my family now.  I'm really scared that my oldest is going to get alienated from my life if I stay in this, but then I'm afraid I'll be alienated from my babies if I don't.  But now it's to the point that I'm willing to risk the latter, it's that bad.

[Texson]

Hello.  My wife is undiagnosed, but she exhibits all the behaviors described on this site.  I'm just constantly in the dog house.  I think "I'm sorry" is the phrase I hear myself saying all the time.  We're constantly having meltdowns which lead us to "we're going to divorce... .you've never loved me... .etc."

I was married once before her and had a son by that marriage.  He is now 11, almost 12.  His mother and I split up when he was 3 and I was devastated. "A" (my wife) came on the scene soon after and just swept me off my feet with the attention she gave me.  However, within a few months, I began to see some initial signs of what I believe now (8 years later) to be BPD.  We remained in our relationship for four years which was pretty volatile, but out of both fear and desire - it was like I was addicted to her sexually - I kept hanging in there or giving her another chance after we broke up (which was a lot.)  We got married almost 5 years ago and it's been one rocky road.  We've had two beautiful children of our own who have brought us so much happiness, but as Jim Croce once sang in a song called "Lover's Cross:"  For every time that we spent laughing there were two times that I cried. 

It's affected all my children.  My oldest son doesn't like to come here but puts on a brave face.  He sees how I'm treated and it's affected him.  As a result, he's getting more silent treatments from her now.  My two year old daughter stands between us if we're arguing - I've learned to keep it calm and minimize yelling, but the tension is still there - and my daughter stands between us with her arms stretched wide as if to keep us apart.  She's also done a lot to alienate my parents and brother and his family who are all good people and try to get along with her though she's constantly setting up hoops for them to jump through to prove their sincerity.  These hoops are just straw men.

Right now, it's really really bad and while I've wanted many times to just run, I'm actually thinking divorce might be the best thing for my family now.  I'm really scared that my oldest is going to get alienated from my life if I stay in this, but then I'm afraid I'll be alienated from my babies if I don't.  But now it's to the point that I'm willing to risk the latter, it's that bad.

[ForeverDad]

So many here have faced that dilemma.  I did too, I tried to make it work but I was increasingly obstructed until I finally had no other choice.  When one parent is sabotaging the other parent and has refused to start, stick with meaningful therapy and apply it diligently for the years to come, then sadly the choice is effectively made for us. :'(  What's left is to be proactive rather than inactive, have better and firmer boundaries rather than acquiescing more and more.

Living in a calm and stable home, even if only for part of their lives, will give the children a better example of normalcy for their own future relationships.  Staying together would mean that's the only example of home life they would have known.  Some 30 years ago the book Solomon's Children - Exploding the Myths of Divorce had an interesting observation on page 195 by one participant, As the saying goes, "I'd rather come from a broken home than live in one."  Ponder that.  Taking action will enable your lives, or at least a part of your lives, to be spent be in a calm, stable environment — your home, wherever that is — away from the blaming, emotional distortions, pressuring demands and manipulations, unpredictable ever-looming rages and outright chaos.  And some of the flying monkeys too.

Very important — If the marriage fails or has failed, that does not stop you from being a meaningful parent to your younger children.  It's up to you (and a problem-solving proactive lawyer) to be a father as involved as possible in their lives.

As much as you hear how glacially slow courts are, how it is hard to get them to stray from the typical one-size-fits-all orders and how they seem to ignore all but the worst of the other parent's poor behaviors, domestic court is more likely to issue orders (eventually) that are far better than the crumbs your spouse would grant you if left up to your spouse.

[Texson]

Hi,

My wife is now extremely depressed.  I've seen her get down, but she is REALLY down now.  The good news is, she's not tearing me down with constant mean comments.  I do not miss those.  But I find now that I am worried about her - I feel for her.  She seems very lonely and I try to reach out to help but she tells me just go away.  (Of course, she's been saying for the past 48 hours how I don't care about her.)  Is this depression stage typical of BPD?

Texson

[ForeverDad]

My Ex did that, moped around the house after our son was born, moaning and groaning, staying in bed a lot.  I remember her telling me to leave and go to work and me answering, then please get up to watch our toddler.  We separated when he was three, the sideways glances convinced me she was trying to perceive me as an abuser, I knew my days were numbered.  It's been over 10 years since then.  Surprise, surprise, I haven't seen that moaning groaning since.  I'll never know whether it was how she really felt or more a sham to manipulate and guilt me, but she was never like that again.

Sadly, if you keep trying to be her yin to her yang, you'll always be trying to appease, mesh with and counter her ever-changing moods, whims and demands.  Have you been reading here how to set firm boundaries?  Boundaries are for you, not her.  You can't make her do anything.  But you can change, set limits, set boundaries of behavior for yourself and boundaries as to what behavior you will countenance around you and your children.  Unless court decides otherwise, you won't be able to protect them from contact with there mother but as I wrote in my prior post you can make a home where the discord and dysfunction do not exist.

You've no doubt tried to improve things but clearly she hasn't improved.  That's not unusual.  The only thing that will save the relationship is if she gets into meaningful and effective therapy, applying it diligently in her life for the years to come.  However, you can't make her do it.  Probably the court won't make her do it either.  Courts deal with people as they are, a concept we too often have to accept in our own relationships.  Your goal should be to determine how you can make a healthier, more functional life for yourself and what time the children are with you.  Confidentially get some consultations with family law attorneys.  Find out where you stand in your state and local court system.  Brainstorm strategies for getting the best overall outcome possible.  Document the rants, rages, staged conflict, manipulative blaming, etc so that when you are in court or in sessions with evaluators you won't have vague "she always... ." claims, you'll have specific accounts, instances that have witnesses, recordings or other supporting data.  Stick close to legal support, trusted friends/family support and peer support here.  Don't come here rarely.  We've been there, done that.  Make good use of the collective wisdom and experiences here.

Finally, remember one more thing.  This isn't about your spouse.  Yes, she's been the focal point of your energies until now.  But it's clear now she hasn't improved or behaved better.  Time to shift your focus to yourself and to your children, all three of them.

If this is about your spouse's allegations playing the Victim in court, then you need to Accept reality.  Protect yourself.  First.  Remember the instructions given before every airplane flight:  "In the event of an emergency, first put on your own oxygen mask before helping others."  If you're heading into court and your spouse has made or is making allegations, then Protect Yourself so you can help yourself, your children and others.

[livednlearned]

Hi Texson,

I'm sorry for what you're going through. It's so hard when there are kids involved. We do have some helpful materials on the Coparenting board (Lesson 5: Raising Emotionally Resilient Children with a Parent has BPD).

Since you're posting on the Family Law board, it sounds like you are at ropes end and wondering if divorce is around the corner. Most of the people on this board made the decision to leave. There are others in marriages that are working to try and improve the marriage, and they post on the Improving board. If you want to give it one last shot and learn some skills, that's a good board to post on.

If you feel that you want to cover all bases and at learn what's in store (especially if she threatens divorce), then this is a good board to gather information. A word of warning: there is a category of BPD we refer to as High Conflict Personality (HCP). According to Bill Eddy who wrote the book Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing a BPD/NPD Spouse), not all people with BPD are HCP, though all HCPs have a personality disorder of some kind. Most of us on this board (though not all) were dealing with an HCP. These tend to be people who recruit negative advocates, are persuasive blamers, and have a target of blame (us). They can be particularly destructive when they hit the legal system.

If your wife is not HCP, that's good to know. It means she might be difficult, but she won't be the most difficult. Usually, it is women who abuse the legal system, especially with kids involved, although I was the target of legal abuse myself (my son's N/BPD father was a former trial attorney and had a fondness for taking things to court). This can mean false allegations of domestic violence, false allegations of child molestation, false protection orders. These can be devastating experiences for anyone, but men in particular because a lot of the system is not set up to deal with victims of legal abuse. In fact, it can feel like it is designed particularly well to make your life miserable. And courts are terrible at understanding mental illness in the context of the law.

All this is to say that I personally think it's wise in these relationships to document everything and have a safety plan for both you and the kids, especially if there have been prior incidents. By document everything, I mean everything. Keep a running calendar. Keep receipts. If you ever feel threatened, keep a digital recorder handy.

I do also think that people with BPD are very different, some are sub-clinical and don't meet the full criteria, and there are people here who have drastically changed the way they interact with their spouses to positive effect. The Improving board can help you learn about validation and other communication skills that can change things not only with your wife, but help protect your kids as well. They are growing up in an invalidating environment (part of being BPD) and will desperately need you to validate how they feel. Often our tendency is to protect them from the very real negative feelings they are experiencing, and that can be invalidating on a deeply devastating way.

You're not alone, and no matter what you decide to do, there are people here who understand and here to support you.

LnL

[ForeverDad]

LnL makes excellent, thoughtful and comforting posts.

It's possible your spouse has become depressed.  Has she seen her doctor, and more importantly, can you get her in to start counseling or therapy?  Be aware that most with BPD have a heightened sense of Denial, creating a behavior of Blaming and Blame Shifting.  If she utterly refuses, you can try to see if you can start out with joint sessions, but be very careful they don't devolve into Blamefests.  Hopefully the counselor or therapist would be experienced and perceptive enough to catch that and subtly divert the focus back to the needs of the session but if not then you need to speak up and not let the Blaming take over the session.  It also means you need to make sue the counselor learns about all the behaviors, especially hers.  No one wants their dirty laundry aired out to others but in this case it's necessary.

As I sometimes quipped in the past, my Ex's sins were largely sins of commission, mine were largely sins of omission.  So before of being blacklisted to the counselor, that's a real risk you face because your spouse will be quick to Blame Shift.

As for counseling, that would be good for you too.  And especially for the children, they need help to see what normal perspectives and proper validation are.

And if the marriage does fail, then there would be therapists in place to help you both as well as the court and custody evaluator to sort the real issues out.