Too furious for words

[Lifewriter16]

Hello Everyone.

Yesterday, I was frightened all day. Almost terrified on occasion due to developments with my BPDxbf. He rang me and tried to support me, as best he could. At 9.30pm I texted him to say I was going to bed. He said "Me too I'm feeling a little unsettled". I sent a reply of the kind "Isn't life fun! Sleep well". He said "You too" and I turned off my mobile phone and went to bed.

This morning, I woke up to 6 accusational texts, sent throughout the night, telling me how I had hurt him, how he felt about my behaviour, how he didn't want to meet up this week after all. The final one said he'd sent me an email to give me chance to 'put things right'.

Here's what he sent:

"Last night I talked to you and tried to comfort you when you were feeling vulnerable. You text me to say goodnight and I expressed some vulnerability. You responded with sarcasm and it hurt.

Sarcasm is a form of low level anger and it's the last thing anyone should get if they show their vulnerable side.

I told you I wouldn't meet you this week but I also said I wouldn't leave you.

I think that if we do meet we need to talk about this because I can't let you get close if you're going to hurt me like this.

It's up to you"


I must admit, I wanted to react to that. However, I responded instead.

I sent this back:

"I can see why you would feel hurt if you felt my sarcasm was anger directed at you. I didn't see it that way. That sarcasm was directed at life and not you.

I can also see why you would feel hurt if you were feeling very vulnerable when you told me you were feeling unsettled. I took the word you used to describe your emotion on face value because that was the only information I had to go on.

It seems to me that perhaps it's your turn to have a panic about getting closer. It feels horrible. I hope you are feeling better this morning.

I read somewhere that where there are two hurting people in a relationship together, they can find they are not capable of meeting each other's needs. Sometimes, that will happen between us, like last night when I had simply gone to bed to sleep off the rest of my malaise. I'm sorry I wasn't there for you. Lxx"


He texted me to say my reply was okay, it was what he felt to be right and he proceeded to get quite lovey-dovey. However, when I got home this afternoon, I realised he'd sent an email before our text conversation. I read it when I got home and found myself feeling very angry indeed.

This is what he sent:

"Thank you, that's what I needed to know. I accept you made a mistake because you were hurting and although your anger hurt me I suspected it wasn't intended.

I gave you the chance to sort this because I love you. You did OK.

This is going to work. Xxx

PS. Even though I said I wouldn't see you this week I wasn't going to leave you. I said it because I was hurting."

I must say, I am so furious that I can barely put my feelings into words.

What angers me is that he takes an innocent comment and accuses me of hurting him with it. Then he deigns to give me the opportunity to make amends for something I never even did. And when he decides he's satisfied with my response, decides to forgive me for 'my' mistake. Clearly, he didn't understand a word I actually said either. All because I have committed the heinous crime of simply saying "Isn't life fun!" as an ironic jest.  Quite frankly, I could smack him, but he's all lovey-dovey. This is what I have to learn to live with because this is how the BPD mind works whether it is calm or dysregulating. I don't know if I can do it.

Lifewriter x

[patientandclear]

For what it's worth, this sounds quite successful to me :/

He was able to communicate that your words hurt him without threatening to leave you.

You were able to hear that he took the words differently than you intended, and validate without getting all defensive.  Initially.

But it seems you have a second wave of defensiveness that has now risen up.  Sparking off of what you are perceiving as a slightly snarky condescending tone in his last email.

But bear in mind: his email tone may have gone awry in just the same way that your text tone did.  He ends with "this is going to work!" which means that he perceives this to have been a successful mutual processing of something that could have gone off the rails entirely.

It's true that he views it as your mistake rather than him being oversensitive.

But now, you are viewing his last email as his mistake rather than YOU being oversensitive.

See how each person has a much better understanding of their own good intentions than you are prepared to accord to the other?

[Grey Kitty]

I must say, I am so furious that I can barely put my feelings into words.

What angers me is that he takes an innocent comment and accuses me of hurting him with it. Then he deigns to give me the opportunity to make amends for something I never even did.

I completely get that you are upset by this... .and it is upsetting. I don't think I would be THAT furious in your shoes, though.

Since this is the personal inventory board, let me ask you... .what is it in YOU that makes it so terribly upsetting? How is it that you find it so personally triggering?

[Lifewriter16]

Hi to you both and thanks for your honest feedback - that's why I posted here and not on one of the moan and whinge boards (oops, am I allowed to say that?)

Possible reasons why I am SO triggered:

• I don't like making mistakes and even the suggestion of it is too much to take.



• I don't like being blamed for things, particularly when I perceive myself to be innocent. I got a lot of blame as a child for anything and everything, even when my brothers were the cause of it. They always got away with anything because I was the older one and 'should know better' (why precisely should I know better?)



• I know that in his world, I should have responded to his 'unsettledness' and taken care of him, but I just didn't want to do it and I'm feeling guilt and don't want to accept it.



• I deny my own anger and thus hate it when he identifies anger in me and it isn't purely projection on his part.

The second and third possibilities carry most emotional charge for me.

It's true that he views it as your mistake rather than him being oversensitive.

But now, you are viewing his last email as his mistake rather than YOU being oversensitive.

See how each person has a much better understanding of their own good intentions than you are prepared to accord to the other?

Our relationship has become one series of triggers after another, punctuated by breakups. I trigger him, then he triggers me, then we try to work it out and I trigger him again and either he bales out or I do, because we can't handle the pain. I know I'm as bad as he is in terms of oversensitivity though... .perhaps I can stop the cycle.

Lifewriter

x

[unicorn2014]

Hi Lifewriter, I can totally relate to your post and have experienced and am experiencing similar things. I think that text really allows pwBPD traits to play around with us, as does email, and even voice mail to a lesser extent. Although those things offer immediate gratification.

Perhaps you and I could work on supporting each other in slowing down our response time.

What do you think?

Have you been able to identify what needs these kinds of text exchanges have met for you?

[Lifewriter16]

Hi unicorn,

For me, texting stops me feeling so isolated and I tend to resort to it when I am feeling upset. Also, it's a way of keeping in touch when we otherwise wouldn't see each other. Those are the positive things I get out of it. However, it also causes a lot of problems. Having said that, my BPDxbf seems to have got to the point with his wife where he doesn't expect an immediate response to his texts to her, and he does seem to be being less demanding so far in his communication with me. That really helps, because it gives me time to process and then respond rather than react in the heat of the moment, which to me is the key.

How are you experiencing things at the moment unicorn?

Lifewriter x

[HurtinNW]

The idea of the two of you both triggering each other in an endless cycle is a good insight, and certainly something I can relate to. I've felt furious about this stuff too.

It's tough to maintain our serenity and stay calm when someone is throwing the emotional equivelent of nuclear bombs our direction.

I'm interested in the early part of the evening, when you said you had been "frightened all day" and asked your bf for support. If you feel comfortable addressing this, what do you think that panic was about, and was asking him to soothe you a healthy choice? I am asking because I would often ask my ex to soothe me. I thought it was a good idea at the time, but now I am wondering if it fed the cycle of being two needy, hurt people in a relationship... .that I should have been working more on healing myself. And also that it was part of the pattern of both of us being triggered.

[Grey Kitty]

Possible reasons why I am SO triggered:

• I don't like making mistakes and even the suggestion of it is too much to take.



• I don't like being blamed for things, particularly when I perceive myself to be innocent. I got a lot of blame as a child for anything and everything, even when my brothers were the cause of it. They always got away with anything because I was the older one and 'should know better' (why precisely should I know better?)



• I know that in his world, I should have responded to his 'unsettledness' and taken care of him, but I just didn't want to do it and I'm feeling guilt and don't want to accept it.



• I deny my own anger and thus hate it when he identifies anger in me and it isn't purely projection on his part.

The second and third possibilities carry most emotional charge for me.

This is all very good, and it draws the focus back to areas you can work on in yourself. Do you think you need more space from your exbf in order to work on these trigger areas?

[unicorn2014]

Hi unicorn,

For me, texting stops me feeling so isolated and I tend to resort to it when I am feeling upset. Also, it's a way of keeping in touch when we otherwise wouldn't see each other. Those are the positive things I get out of it. However, it also causes a lot of problems. Having said that, my BPDxbf seems to have got to the point with his wife where he doesn't expect an immediate response to his texts to her, and he does seem to be being less demanding so far in his communication with me. That really helps, because it gives me time to process and then respond rather than react in the heat of the moment, which to me is the key.

How are you experiencing things at the moment unicorn?

Lifewriter x

Hi Lifewriter, is your ex bf separated from his wife? With plans to divorce?

My pwBPD said some things to me during his last dysregulation , well, I don't even know how to describe how it affected me.

I have a 2 part thread on the deciding board about what happened when I told him he should not be talking to me about not giving me a hickey before he is divorced and the results of that.

I now recognize I could've worded that differently, I'm not comfortable discussing our romantic relationship until you resolve your divorce.

I feel like sometimes my pwBPD is a snake charmer and I'm the snake and he's hypnotized me. I feel like his emotional needs get to dictate the relationship and mine get swept under the rug. At any rate I tried emailing him a version of what another member told me on my latest thread on this board. We will see what happens. Currently he is demanding I repair the relationship the way he wants me to repair it and I am telling him only he can repair the damage he caused, and I can repair the damage I caused. I told him he does not get to dictate what I did and how to deal with it just like I don't get to dictate what he did and how to repair it. I can only take responsibility for my part and he can only take responsibility for his part. I don't think this is going to go well as when I told him we were enmeshed and we needed to get unmeshed he suggested I break up with him.

[Lifewriter16]

Hi unicorn,

My BPDxbf has been separated from his wife for 2 to 3 years, but the likelihood of him divorcing her before they have been separated for 5 years is very remote. I'd say, it's a definite that he won't. At one point, I tried to push him on this, because I was getting my divorce I thought he should get his. He just dysregulated saying I was trying to control him. I made the decision that it wasn't worth fighting with him over this as it was pushing him away so I simply decided that I wouldn't move in with him unless he was divorced. I didn't tell him that. He doesn't need to know. It's a personal boundary - possibly one of the few clear ones I have. It is quite possible that there's more to his relationship with his wife than meets the eye, but I'm not really the jealous type. What I don't know about, doesn't bother me.

I also find that my emotional needs get swept under the rug. I get caught in fantasising about reality and thinking that I can change it, rather than accepting it. My current foray is probably more of the same. Today has made me realise that my BPDdbf's thinking is odd regardless of whether or he is calm or dysregulating, it's just more recognisable when he is dysregulating. I thought it would only be irrational during dysregulations because my thinking descends into irrationality when I am triggered, but is otherwise reasonably healthy. However, he is pretty much irrational all the time. That doesn't fill me with hope. The other thing that undermines my hope is the realisation that tiny things trigger him to act as if I have perpetrated a heinous crime on him and caused him immeasurable hurt. There's no way that I can ever prevent that from happening. I have found that I have to be very careful how I phrase things when I talk to my BPDxbf. I find I have greater success if I use words that are not emotionally florid. I need to keep my descriptions very boring because he reacts strongly to emotional words. It's not easy being damaged and having to deal with a very damaged person though. I guess that's the same for him.

Lifewriter x

[unicorn2014]

Hi unicorn,

My BPDxbf has been separated from his wife for 2 to 3 years, but the likelihood of him divorcing her before they have been separated for 5 years is very remote. I'd say, it's a definite that he won't. At one point, I tried to push him on this, because I was getting my divorce I thought he should get his. He just dysregulated saying I was trying to control him. I made the decision that it wasn't worth fighting with him over this as it was pushing him away so I simply decided that I wouldn't move in with him unless he was divorced. I didn't tell him that. He doesn't need to know. It's a personal boundary - possibly one of the few clear ones I have. It is quite possible that there's more to his relationship with his wife than meets the eye, but I'm not really the jealous type. What I don't know about, doesn't bother me.

I also find that my emotional needs get swept under the rug. I get caught in fantasising about reality and thinking that I can change it, rather than accepting it. My current foray is probably more of the same. Today has made me realise that my BPDdbf's thinking is odd regardless of whether or he is calm or dysregulating, it's just more recognisable when he is dysregulating. I thought it would only be irrational during dysregulations because my thinking descends into irrationality when I am triggered, but is otherwise reasonably healthy. However, he is pretty much irrational all the time. That doesn't fill me with hope. The other thing that undermines my hope is the realisation that tiny things trigger him to act as if I have perpetrated a heinous crime on him and caused him immeasurable hurt. There's no way that I can ever prevent that from happening. I have found that I have to be very careful how I phrase things when I talk to my BPDxbf. I find I have greater success if I use words that are not emotionally florid. I need to keep my descriptions very boring because he reacts strongly to emotional words. It's not easy being damaged and having to deal with a very damaged person though. I guess that's the same for him.

Lifewriter x

I guess what I am confused about is if he is your ex, then why are you still talking to him? I have an ex and the only time I talk to him is when I have to regarding our child and even then I am very careful to make sure it is necessary  and to be sure of what I am saying. I think the way people use the word ex on these boards is different then the way people use the word ex elsewhere. To me ex means done, finished with, over with, moving on.

[eeks]

I also find that my emotional needs get swept under the rug. I get caught in fantasising about reality and thinking that I can change it, rather than accepting it. My current foray is probably more of the same. Today has made me realise that my BPDdbf's thinking is odd regardless of whether or he is calm or dysregulating, it's just more recognisable when he is dysregulating. I thought it would only be irrational during dysregulations because my thinking descends into irrationality when I am triggered, but is otherwise reasonably healthy. However, he is pretty much irrational all the time. That doesn't fill me with hope. The other thing that undermines my hope is the realisation that tiny things trigger him to act as if I have perpetrated a heinous crime on him and caused him immeasurable hurt. There's no way that I can ever prevent that from happening. I have found that I have to be very careful how I phrase things when I talk to my BPDxbf. I find I have greater success if I use words that are not emotionally florid. I need to keep my descriptions very boring because he reacts strongly to emotional words. It's not easy being damaged and having to deal with a very damaged person though. I guess that's the same for him.

It sounds as though he has a very anxious attachment style.  I have to be careful suggesting this because I've never met him, but think of it this way, when you observe your interactions with him.  Everyone has their own personal "danger" words, behaviours or emotions (e.g. turning away, walking away, tone of voice, missing "bids" for empathy, criticism, and many more... .)  Something that bothers me might not bother someone else, and vice versa.  Cues that trigger this particular person, based on their temperament and personal history, "this relationship connection is in danger".  The amygdala reacts to threats to relationship security the same way it does to physical threat.  Anxiously attached people will tend to respond to threat by ramping up efforts to connect (what we colloquially call getting "clingy", and avoidantly attached people will tend to respond to threat by withdrawing.  

In a secure relationship, if you compare it to a dance, secure partners still have missteps ("danger" cues) but they find a way to get back in tune with one another fairly quickly and easily.  

It sounds like your ex is very quick to interpret many different words on your part as "danger".  

So, question, do you feel safe and secure (and trusting) when all this is going on?  What do you need in a relationship to feel secure? 

[Lifewriter16]

I'm interested in the early part of the evening, when you said you had been "frightened all day" and asked your bf for support. If you feel comfortable addressing this, what do you think that panic was about, and was asking him to soothe you a healthy choice? I am asking because I would often ask my ex to soothe me. I thought it was a good idea at the time, but now I am wondering if it fed the cycle of being two needy, hurt people in a relationship... .that I should have been working more on healing myself. And also that it was part of the pattern of both of us being triggered.

The panic was a leftover emotion from the strong feelings of fear that I awoke with that day: fear of the verbal abuse recurring, fear he will reject me again, fear he'll ask me to stop relying upon my ex-husband for support accompanied by fear of trying to cope on my own. Early on in the relationship with my BPDxbf, I looked to him for soothing. As time went on, I became aware that I was doing that and started processing my emotions instead. In this particular case, I determined to talk to him because I thought it could stop me from wanting to run away from him by stopping me from feeling like he's the big bad bogey man.

This is all very good, and it draws the focus back to areas you can work on in yourself. Do you think you need more space from your exbf in order to work on these trigger areas?

We'd got to the stonewalling stage of relationship. We had lots of space and no opportunity to talk to each other to work things out or build trust. We'd got to the point where we were each the bogey man in each other's imagination. Meeting up was usually better than all other contact. It was the only good thing between us. So, meeting up more is essential, as long as we don't overdo it. We need to talk and he says he's up for that. I find him unpredictable, tiny things trigger him one day, yet another day, he can hear quite difficult emotional stuff and not dysregulate. I hate his unpredictability.

I guess what I am confused about is if he is your ex, then why are you still talking to him? I have an ex and the only time I talk to him is when I have to regarding our child and even then I am very careful to make sure it is necessary  and to be sure of what I am saying. I think the way people use the word ex on these boards is different then the way people use the word ex elsewhere. To me ex means done, finished with, over with, moving on.

I use the phrase BPDxbf because all we have actually done over the last month is bump into each other twice, meet up for coffee once and text/email in the last week. Initially he said he wanted nothing from me and had no expectations of me (that was a week ago). Now he's 'all loved up' and we seem to have made the transition to being back together, despite there having been no discussion about it because we haven't see each other to do that. Our recycles are so short (we were down to 2 weeks in Nov/Dec which was when we were last together), that calling him my BPDbf seems overly optimistic. We could be back to n/c any time. I don't trust it to last. I appreciate that it's confusing for people though.

It sounds as though he has a very anxious attachment style.  I have to be careful suggesting this because I've never met him, but think of it this way, when you observe your interactions with him.  Everyone has their own personal "danger" words, behaviours or emotions (e.g. turning away, walking away, tone of voice, missing "bids" for empathy, criticism, and many more... .)  Something that bothers me might not bother someone else, and vice versa.  Cues that trigger this particular person, based on their temperament and personal history, "this relationship connection is in danger".  The amygdala reacts to threats to relationship security the same way it does to physical threat.  Anxiously attached people will tend to respond to threat by ramping up efforts to connect (what we colloquially call getting "clingy", and avoidantly attached people will tend to respond to threat by withdrawing. 

In a secure relationship, if you compare it to a dance, secure partners still have missteps ("danger" cues) but they find a way to get back in tune with one another fairly quickly and easily. 

It sounds like your ex is very quick to interpret many different words on your part as "danger". 

So, question, do you feel safe and secure (and trusting) when all this is going on?  What do you need in a relationship to feel secure? 

This is very useful, eeks. I think looking at specific triggers could really help me.

I don't feel safe, secure or trusting at all. I was probably being far too optimistic when I decided to give it another go 'because I love him' and because I'm miserable without the man I love. I need predictability, reassurance, support, affection and to be told I am loved. I know, I made a bad decision. I'm only just beginning to realise that he has a mental illness. I've had it in my head that he could heal and get better. I'm still in denial and still hoping for that happy ending.


Thanks everyone.

Lifewriter x

[Grey Kitty]

This is all very good, and it draws the focus back to areas you can work on in yourself. Do you think you need more space from your exbf in order to work on these trigger areas?

Meeting up was usually better than all other contact. It was the only good thing between us. So, meeting up more is essential, as long as we don't overdo it. We need to talk and he says he's up for that. I find him unpredictable, tiny things trigger him one day, yet another day, he can hear quite difficult emotional stuff and not dysregulate. I hate his unpredictability.

I want to clarify and confirm what I think you are saying here:

Meeting with him in person is risky--it can be either good or mutually triggering.

Other contact with him (Phone, text-chatting, social media, etc.) is worse / usually goes badly.

[unicorn2014]

Lifewriter, I am wondering the reason this is an acceptable relationship to you?

[Lifewriter16]

Hi unicorn,

I guess many of us wonder that when we hear other people's stories.

If this were just a relationship, it wouldn't be. It's because he feels like my other half, the other slipper to the pair, my soul mate, that I try so hard to make it work. And because I am flawed too and my fears and freak outs play a big part in the problems. I'd rather be working it out with the man I love and who loves me, than be without him.

I've got to go.

Love Lifewriter

[HurtinNW]

Hi unicorn,

I guess many of us wonder that when we hear other people's stories.

If this were just a relationship, it wouldn't be. It's because he feels like my other half, the other slipper to the pair, my soul mate, that I try so hard to make it work. And because I am flawed too and my fears and freak outs play a big part in the problems. I'd rather be working it out with the man I love and who loves me, than be without him.

I've got to go.

Love Lifewriter

I very much identify with this. It is good you are able to be so clear with yourself. I felt this way about my ex, and still often do, which is why the grief tearing me apart right now is so sad and hard.

I think a lot of us play roles in these relationship problems. I know my PTSD really triggered my ex. My behaviors were sometimes less than stellar. I freak out too. But it was like not going to get better. I am also working on realizing that admitting to playing a role in the problems doesn't mean you can change the problems.

Hugs to you, Lifewriter!

[unicorn2014]

I guess what I find confusing is you and lifewriter both refer to your partners as your exes yet you're still attached to them as if they were your partners.

I know that many of us find each others relationships perplexing, I guess that's why we post here, to get objective feedback.

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Hurtin,

the grief tearing me apart right now is so sad and hard.

I know. I really, really KNOW... .

I only wish I could make it better for us both. For me, either choice is painful, whether it is to renew the relationship and keep trying or whether it is to walk away, both involve substantial grief.

Love to you,

Lifewriter

[HurtinNW]

Hi Hurtin,

the grief tearing me apart right now is so sad and hard.

I know. I really, really KNOW... .

I only wish I could make it better for us both. For me, either choice is painful, whether it is to renew the relationship and keep trying or whether it is to walk away, both involve substantial grief.

Love to you,

Lifewriter

Exactly. For me the realization has been I cannot continue with the pain of the relationship. His repeated recycling is destroying me in a way that I cannot bear. Perhaps more importantly, I have realized it is harmful to my children. That I cannot and will not tolerate. In a sense his behavior is making me chose between him or my kids. I will pick my kids every time. I really don't want them to experience the hurts I did as a child.

I think this is a journey we are all walking and only we can know what is right for us at the moment.

Hugs to you!