Amoral behavior

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I am doing my best to detach from a failed relationship so please help me.

 My BPD tells me that he just wants to make people happy. He may well feel that way but I have been thinking that he is without fixed values and feels that he does what he needs to do to survive (I know that life is hard for him but he makes it harder). He lied about his whereabouts and lost his job. He has lied to me about being separated (not as separated as he claimed). He is letting his wife care for an elderly aunt although he has told me that the relationship is over (that part I believe although they are enmeshed). I have a feeling he is a little too interested in the aunt's money. and there is worse. He does terrible selfish things out of a sense of personal imperative and later feels bad because they were not the crises he thought (and adds to his feeling that he is a bad person). I am having a hard time reconciling this with the kind loving generous person he can also be.

So help me, do your BPDs do the same?

[Narkiss]

I am doing my best to detach from a failed relationship so please help me.

 My BPD tells me that he just wants to make people happy. He may well feel that way but I have been thinking that he is without fixed values and feels that he does what he needs to do to survive (I know that life is hard for him but he makes it harder). He lied about his whereabouts and lost his job. He has lied to me about being separated (not as separated as he claimed). He is letting his wife care for an elderly aunt although he has told me that the relationship is over (that part I believe although they are enmeshed). I have a feeling he is a little too interested in the aunt's money. and there is worse. He does terrible selfish things out of a sense of personal imperative and later feels bad because they were not the crises he thought (and adds to his feeling that he is a bad person). I am having a hard time reconciling this with the kind loving generous person he can also be.

So help me, do your BPDs do the same?

[married21years]

in none of this have you mentioned your wants and desires just him

focus on you and what you need

do you need a married BPD guy that is still with his wife or someone that can fulfill your needs?

are you stong enough to put yourself through this or do you deserve better

 

[Narkiss]

All good questions and ones I have been asking myself. It is so different from how I think people should behave that I emotionally can't believe that someone who can be so caring acts this way. And I am trying to figure out why. But yes, my needs and wants have come secondary. He will honor them but not consistently and not for long. I want a stable living relationship where problems can be talked through. Ours is so fragile that it falls apart whenever there are problems. We have not talked in over a week. I am doing my hardest to get from point A (in denial about how badly I am being treated) to B--awareness, anger even, and the ability to walk away.

You are married to a person with BPD right? How have you made it work?

[married21years]

You are married to a person with BPD right? How have you made it work?

i am married i am getting divorced i have suffered long enough

i am moving on good luck

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi Narkiss-

It is so different from how I think people should behave that I emotionally can't believe that someone who can be so caring acts this way. And I am trying to figure out why.

Three traits of the disorder per the trusty DSM are:

-A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation.
-Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self.
-Affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood (e.g., intense episodic dysphoria, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days).

Notice "unstable" or "instability" are in each of those, a consequence of not having a fully formed self of his own, so yes, it is different from how you think people should behave, because it's a personality disorder, a mental illness.  If he exhibits significant traits of the disorder, a stable, loving relationship is not available with him, he isn't capable.

So what's next Narkiss, where do you go from here?

[Narkiss]

Yes, he exhibits significant traits. Although he is not formally diagnosed he has identified it in himself. Where now? I know the relationship is over. Yet a small part of me says but... .But if I can get him into therapy. But if I tell him how it affects me -- and how it has affEcted his life. But if I can just hang on long enough things will be ok -- although I know they won't be.

[bunny4523]

I am having a hard time reconciling this with the kind loving generous person he can also be.

Hi Narkiss,

I know how hard it is to understand the extreme negative and the positives in these relationships but try to remember it is a package deal.  Meaning you will never have one without the other.  With enough negative, the positive decreases as well.   Even with therapy, often the emotional growth is stunted and you can only focus on coping skills which would leave you to do all the work and just react differently to it.  Not necessarily changing anything.  It will still be an emotional drain on you and you will be responsible for constantly validating your partners feelings and who will validate yours?  YOU.  Check out the other boards and see how hard is on the partner... .those boards sound alot like these boards with the confusion and trauma and many ready to throw in the towel.

Good luck to you,
Bunny

[fromheeltoheal]

Where now? I know the relationship is over. Yet a small part of me says but... .But if I can get him into therapy. But if I tell him how it affects me -- and how it has affEcted his life. But if I can just hang on long enough things will be ok -- although I know they won't be.

Yes, letting go of hope is hard.  And going from a sliver of hope to no hope at all is a huge leap, but necessary to detach.  But letting go doesn't take a lot of work or energy, we just let go, let it fall away; is that something you're starting to focus on Narkiss?

[Narkiss]

Yes. I've been all over these boards... .Sometimes at the same time. For so many reasons (pretty much all the DSM criteria) it cannot work out. This relationship has been filled with moments of absolute joy and connection, but most of it has been incredibly painful and has distracted me from my real life. It's time the pain ends.

[fromheeltoheal]

has distracted me from my real life.

Interesting way to put that.  I agree.  My entire relationship felt surreal, like an alternate universe, and definitely not my real life.  Ever notice we value things more when we lose them and then get them back?

[Narkiss]

Yes, I would tell people that our relationship existed only between worlds. I couldn't live in his and he couldn't live in mine

[Narkiss]

Heel: I'm waking up to the realization that although there has been a lot of emotion and passion and connection, he has treated me terribly and dishonorably. Much has been on his terms and I have down most of the work. I keep hoping that this will change (irrationally I still hope) but it has not and likely will not and I don't want this anymore. This is very hard for me to say

[fromheeltoheal]

I keep hoping that this will change (irrationally I still hope) but it has not and likely will not and I don't want this anymore. This is very hard for me to say

And good for you for saying it!  That is the beginning of a shift, a decision that you don't want it anymore and the eroding of hope, steps towards detachment.  There's still that letting go of all hope, a hard step, and now that you've decided what you don't want, focusing on all of the behaviors that were unacceptable to you will help.  It's not easy, the intensity and instability of a relationship with a borderline is intoxicating, and confusing, although a real decision means you cut off any other possibility and act in your own best interest.  And of course you'll have conflicted emotions throughout, although if you focus on the goal it can guide you.  Take care of you!

[C.Stein]

He does terrible selfish things out of a sense of personal imperative and later feels bad because they were not the crises he thought (and adds to his feeling that he is a bad person). I am having a hard time reconciling this with the kind loving generous person he can also be.

My ex did the same.  She would do things for the most petty and selfish reasons without thought of consequence to me, my emotions or the relationship.  When I took issue with it she would then play the victim and effectively take the attention away from what she had done and my feelings.  Many times she would actually say something like if I am such a bad person why are you with me.  I let her do this many times to my own personal detriment.  Why did I do it?  The FOG was one reason, the other was because I loved her and wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt.

I too have a very hard time reconciling the good with the bad ... .the dark side with the good side.  Thing is she is both and no matter how good it was at times the dark side was always there, controlling her in ways that she simply can not see.  She would do something that hurt me and then expect me to forgive her immediately and just get over it letting her sweep it all under the rug.  I allowed her do this many times ... .until I didn't.  That one time when I couldn't move past what she had done without her making some effort to take responsibility for her actions, the consequences of those actions and repair the damage she had done she almost immediately began to devalue me.  That was the beginning of the end.

My ex can also be very loving and generous, supportive and caring ... .but she can also be thoughtless, cold-hearted, selfish, uncaring and cruel.  The thing is her dark side was so surreptitious that it appeared to be something other than what it was.  She played the victim like a pro and always had a "good" reason for all the hurtful things she did.  For some reason I continued to believe in the good, to hold onto the belief that if I just gave her more time, more patience and understanding it would get better ... .and it did somewhat I think due to me beginning to distance myself emotionally.    Sad thing is it didn't really get better despite her promises to the contrary.  Her words were never really backed up by her actions.  That is the hard truth both you had I have to accept.

Heel: I'm waking up to the realization that although there has been a lot of emotion and passion and connection, he has treated me terribly and dishonorably. Much has been on his terms and I have down most of the work. I keep hoping that this will change (irrationally I still hope) but it has not and likely will not and I don't want this anymore. This is very hard for me to say

This is one of the hardest things to accept I think.  Looking past the good, looking past the fantasy and dream and seeing him (her in my case) for who they really are.  At nearly a year after being replace then thrown away like trash I still struggle with this.  It is very frustrating but it has gotten better and I no longer am in the FOG even if it sometimes draws me back into the periphery at time.  I will get better for you too ... .trust in yourself and your ability to move past this.