Marriage and Control with a BPD Spouse

[Cole]

As we have progressed through MC, my dBPDw has brought up that she feels our problems are due to an imbalance of control, where I have almost all of it and she has none.

I stepped back and looked at it. Yes, I am usually in a position of control in our marriage and have been for quite a while.

Then I looked at why. Am I a control freak? I don't think so. I believe it is due to a lack of control on my W's side, which is a part of the BPD.

Right from the beginning, she would not voice her opinions. Not say what she wanted. The fear of rejection was, in her mind, too great if she did. She refused to make a decision, so I had to make all of them.

She does not take control of things, or if she does, she does not finish them. When she tells me not to worry about something because she will handle it, I know the possible outcomes: 1) She will ignore/forget about it and I will end up doing it anyways. 2) She will start it, then not finish. 3) She will realize there is too much responsibility involved with it and throw it back at me to do. If she does not take responsibility, then no one can fault her if it is not done exactly perfect.

She is at any given time physically, mentally, or emotionally ill. Though that has diminished greatly as of late, I have spent most of our marriage as more of a caretaker than husband.

Does anyone else have this control imbalance in their BPD marriage? How do you deal with it?

 

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[teapay]

Yes, my W displays many of the qualities you describe.  She often accuses me of being controling as a way to gain control of me but that doesn't work anymore.

If something doesn't impact me or the family negatively then I let her do what she wishes.  If it dies, I maintain control as much as is in my power and she just needs to deal with it.  I'm not about to let her injure me or the family.

[flourdust]

Same here. I took over things like household finances and planning because she refused to do any of it. Or she would claim she was going to do it, then not get around to it, leaving behind a trail of late fees, missed appointments, etc. When she would feel anxious or upset, she would accuse me of controlling everything and leaving her in the dark. So I'd apologetically prepare bank statements, spreadsheets, budgeting apps ... .all of which she would ignore, until the next time she wanted to accuse me of being controlling.

[isilme]

Yes.  H refuses to be accountable for most household responsibilities, finances, cleaning, he WILL cook, but I clean and put things away, trash, most pet care, yard work, etc. 

I try to let him stay "in charge" of things that won't adversely affect us as a whole, and so if he fails to follow through, it's basically only hurting him - I hate that, but I think it's important to let him succeed if he will or fail if he chooses to do so on some things. 

When he had his own bank account, I still took care of the bills and most of the groceries from mine, because I could not verify what he had left in his, and what was still needing to go out.  I was scared about combining them, but it's actually helped me keep better track, I've taken charge of savings, ALL bills, and can tell him what we've got any day he asks rather than me asking and getting "I don't know". 

At times this has caused contention when he needs me to authorize something or enter a new card code - he calls it "asking Mommy for permission" as if this was how I wanted things, but he won't take care of it.  He won't do his taxes till April 14.  He won't pay property tax on time, and those were his two main responsibilities for years.  I do mine early, and the property tax is not late anymore.  We'll see how things go this year, filing as married for the first time.

I think it's sad that BPD affects Executive Contol to a point where these adults CAN function if they have to, but they do so badly.  And it drags anyone else down who relies on them to be reasonably responsible. 

So, when it's not going to hurt us badly, I let him choose to fail on his private projects (while giving him the support and whatever is needed, I can't MAKE him spend time on something) but have been responsible for keeping us afloat for years. 

I think it's part of what comes as the more emotionally responsible person in the r/s.  If you can't manage your emotions day to day, how can you focus on things like bills and deadlines?

[motherhen]

In a BPD relationship simply having a different opinion about something can be viewed as being controlling.  There is a huge fear of powerlessness and "losing control" which is ironic since they frequently do lose control emotionally. They tend to try to compensate for this by either being overly controlling of small details or shirking responsibility. My husband does both. He also has PTSD and GAD so not sure how much that plays into it. Feeling powerless is a huge trigger for him so he either tries to control every blessed unnecessary thing or does nothing. Always the two extremes, the middle can be reached but it doesn't come naturally for him.

In your case she is identifying it and wanting it to change. Ask her what things she would like to have control over and let her so much as it isn't going to cost you your home, privacy or anything that is a big deal breaker. If she asks for help, point her to some resources and let her know that you are confident she can succeed. Don't fall into the trap of enabling or doing things that she could do for herself.

[howard]

you "control" things because they are incapable of dealing with things. They are like children. Would you want to rely on a 5 year old to take care of business? And as they blow things off or do them impulsively or half assed then you have to go and clean it up and take care of the mess.  It is nonsense.

I have been with my husband 7 years and it FINALLY ended over this last month and did so with violence. I tried to deal with all of the drama, I blew off soo many terrible things, I put up with the attacks, the threats, the whining, the suicide "tests" he put on to make me let go of all the issues out of fear he would hurt himself. 

I FINALLY did it and called 911 on him when he broke a glass and threatened to jab his neck. He broke my phone and I grabbed his then ran from the house. He is now on a no contact order and cannot contract me. It has been a week of peace and I honestly cannot care what he does now.  At first I was concerned where he would go, the police said, well mam he is a big boy and it is not your problem.  I have that sentence ringing in my ears. 

Seriously, there is no way to deal with people with this disorder. I have tried it all and all it did was drain my spirit and give me migraines.  This week with him gone, no headaches and I actually do not care what he does. My family and friends and his family know what has gone on. I have told some bits to my boss just in case. I am so done and trust me, it feels like a boulder has been lifted off my back. I have to deal with ending the marriage but I am not concerned because we have no kids and no commingled finances. He is so screwed, and I am sure he is not thinking, WOW she used to take care of everything, how stupid of me to attack her. No he is just focused on how terrible he has it. calling his friends and family and spewing his negativity until they then do not take his calls.  Will he kill himself? He hasnt for all these years. He threatens it. It is so cruel. And honestly I believe in Euphenasia. He is in terminal pain and nothing will repair it. But just to torture everyone some more he will just make his situation worse. Even his brother told him - then why dont you just do it... .  it is just too much.  There is no way out of it when they refuse to accept what they have and that they do not know how to give love. They just know how to have tantrums like children and demand they are cared for, to then say you didnt do enough.

Good luck, but honestly, RUN

[Lilyroze]

Same here. I took over things like household finances and planning because she refused to do any of it. Or she would claim she was going to do it, then not get around to it, leaving behind a trail of late fees, missed appointments, etc. When she would feel anxious or upset, she would accuse me of controlling everything and leaving her in the dark. So I'd apologetically prepare bank statements, spreadsheets, budgeting apps ... .all of which she would ignore, until the next time she wanted to accuse me of being controlling.

Could have wrote this word for word. I had to do budget, bills, taxes, all investments, and  his health records! I always thought due to his physical illness ( lungs, spent time in hospital, at one point dying), but even when well it all fell to me.

All repairs, instructions, etc. If he did try any usually unfinished, or wouldn't follow through. This is not to put him down or not give credit where credit due. As there were instances he has tried. Many things were left in pieces, or broken even then I am blamed as the part was cheap or came broken ( it didn't). I  just had to do all, plan all and take care of most for garden, home, family and life.

I did try to show bills, or where we were at, even debt free when sick, to never worry him to let him know all was OK ( now realize he never cared, appreciated or most times never understood or cared to).

Yes in end said I was controlling. I was beside myself turning myself inside out to help him when sick, or his jobs, or health, all here and all for family. To get those statements, was damaging to me and my health. I didn't care we were finalizing divorce as thought we were all along ( just care taker friend after years) just anything to hurt, put in FOG, not take responsibility. He was never wrong, most times never apologized and most times never wanted to be responsible.

I hope you can find peace, and a middle ground. Don't let it destroy your health. If you are one to want to fix problems, help and make sure things are taken care of, then it is hard. When they say that you then start down road of making charts, trying to explain, let them in on it. Really it is just one more way to give you stress as most of time they could care less. You are like a tool that gets the job done, at least for me that is how it played out in end. I finally started healing when have him living separate as we are almost done, LC, and boundaries of no rages etc. I still take care of all till done, as it wouldn't get done, not to control. I would gladly have been a partner, helped or handed over if I had a responsible one to do that with.

I never realized how it affected my health ( and I am in Natural health field, as well as try to meditate, eat healthy etc), until had tests done. Getting better, working out, retreats, mindfulness, and eating healthy are helping. I have had to deal with a Cardiologist, and other tests never thought I would have to deal with.

Please understand I take my culpability in this of being a care taker or not seeing it for what it was, as well as walking on egg shells etc. I also realize and needed to heal that so could be healthy in next relationship. As I never control, hurt or want to take over but had to. Hoping someday to have someone to share those obligations.

Take care of you, I support you. You are not alone. Don't take to heart nor drive yourself crazy as it be liking nailing jello to the wall, to please the ones who won't nor can't take responsibility.

[Cole]

Or she would claim she was going to do it, then not get around to it, leaving behind a trail of late fees, missed appointments, etc.

Common theme for BPD. Procrastination is a big symptom!

In a BPD relationship simply having a different opinion about something can be viewed as being controlling.   

W has, with extensive help from her T, realized that someone disagreeing with her is not an attempt to control her or an all-out personal attack. But it took a while, as the T had to undo 40+ years of learned behavior from generations of FOO who act the same way.

 

[Cole]

I have been with my husband 7 years and it FINALLY ended over this last month and did so with violence.

As the spouse of a pwBPD: We all work hard to help our loved ones who have this disorder. It can be managed and a happy marriage maintained, but it is challenging.

As a former Police Officer: Violence crosses the line. At this point you are doing the right thing in protecting yourself. Listen to police, the courts, and domestic violence advocates if you are working with any and stay safe!   

[ArleighBurke]

My BPD wife accuses me of being in control all the time, and her not having a say or control.

I cannot understand it!

She's stated many time she has "no idea" where we are financially. So I'll remind her of her bank login, and print out the past 6 months of graphs and bills to show her. Full of detail, but also with a very simple overview. She looks at none of it. It sits around until I throw it away and a few months later she compains again. Is it just a "worry" that goes through her head at that time?

She says she has no say in things. Yet whenever she says it I can go back a week and see MANY large choices that I've folded into her on. Again "I FEEL LIKE I have no say" and "I have no say" are VERY different statements... .

Perhaps it's a defence mechanism - a justification. Perhaps she looks at where she is, or where the house is, or where the bills are and instead of OWNING that position (owing that they are unpaid or that we've overspent) she says "I have no say or control therefore none of this is my fault".

Of as another suggested, maybe she cannot compromise. It's either all her way - so "her choice" - or if it's not ALL her way, if there is ANY compromise then it's NOT her choice and she has "no control".

Despite what she says - I think my wife PREFERS that I make the big decisions. Less for her to feel bad about later.

[waverider]

Handing you the wheel then complaining that you are driving everything is normal.

A lot of this blaming is borne of guilt either by what you say, or by a deeper sense of failure.

They dont want to be lost, hence why they give you the wheel, yet they dont want to feel incompetent, so project responsibility for their avoidance on to to you.

A lot of people with insecurity issue use this method of avoidant armchair complaining.

Like many things it is more about the act of complaining to save face than reality. You know it is their choice so just shrug it off and let them have their vent, or even piggy backing credit onto your actions.

[Cole]

She's stated many time she has "no idea" where we are financially. So I'll remind her of her bank login, and print out the past 6 months of graphs and bills to show her. Full of detail, but also with a very simple overview. She looks at none of it. It sits around until I throw it away and a few months later she compains again.

Glad I am not alone. This happens almost exactly the same way here.

At the end of every month, I fill out a spreadsheet showing where our money went, what was deposited to retirement accounts, all balances, etc... .They are on the desktop of a shared laptop in my office. Years worth. In great detail. Including monthly, quarterly, and yearly forecast.

Yet, she says I am a control freak who will not tell her what our financial picture looks like. I tell her to read the spreadsheets and offer to go over them with her. She always says, "Yes, let's do that... .tomorrow." And we all know tomorrow never comes for pwBPD.

[flourdust]

She's stated many time she has "no idea" where we are financially. So I'll remind her of her bank login, and print out the past 6 months of graphs and bills to show her. Full of detail, but also with a very simple overview. She looks at none of it. It sits around until I throw it away and a few months later she compains again.

Glad I am not alone. This happens almost exactly the same way here.

Ditto. The complaints would pop up a few times every year. I'd give her a spreadsheet or show her how to log in to the bank website or app, tell her where the paper records are (all hiding in a labeled folder in an unlocked cabinet in the house) ... .and she wouldn't look at them at all.

Same issue with the complaint about me making all plans without her involvement. This even happens now that we are separated. She's complained a few times in strident victim language that I made all of the summer plans for our daughter without involving her. I used to avoid responding to this sort of thing, but now I'm documenting for court, so I simply responded by citing the dates of the emails that showed she was fully involved in the planning. No response to that, of course... .

[livednlearned]

It may help to phrase things more as a choice rather than telling her how it will be. Not for everything, though small changes can add up to create an environment in which she feels she can be competent.

It is amazing to me how even the smallest things can trigger a sense of adequacy in a BPD loved one.

So perhaps:

Let her choose between two things that are both ok with you.
On many more things that may seem small to you, frame it as a choice.
When you feel the urge to lecture or explain or are knowledgeable about something, pause and ask her if she has thoughts about it herself.
If she has done something competent, notice it (without patronizing) and say that you admire her for doing xyz.

Remember that when she is emotionally aroused, her ability to do even simple cognitive things will be harder for her. The same is true for us, though it happens with much less frequency.

It is run-of-the-mill for her to struggle with tasks and decision-making when she is emotionally aroused. She may also not be aware how flooded she is, and may have a bad memory piecing all the parts together, especially if there is shame about how she handled something.

When you are trying to support her in feeling less controlled, and focusing on her adequacy and agency, it's important to remember that her moods are fluctuating (sometimes wildly), and she may be more or less receptive and capable depending on what her emotions are doing. This can take practice on our part, to learn when presenting choices is going to be received well, and when it may induce stress.

[Cole]

It may help to phrase things more as a choice rather than telling her how it will be.

COLE: Honey, should we do A or B?

MRS. COLE: I don't know, just make a decision and let me know.

COLE: OK... .which sounds better to you? I am happy with either.

MRS. COLE: Just pick one! I don't care! 


Forward one week... .


MRS. COLE: I wanted B, but you insisted we do A! Why do you have to be such a control freak?

She has got much better about this over the last 8 months, but it still happens every once in a while. AAAUUUGGGHHH!

[livednlearned]

It is true, she will flip the table at times, whether she made all the choices or not.

We aim for a validating environment, and let go of the hope that we can control the outcomes 100 percent of the time 

Our efforts to help them regulate their emotions will have limits. We are looking for incremental improvements, especially at first, moving toward a validating environment.

It is much, much easier (though still difficult) to recognize that their feelings are truly out of our hands.

[waverider]

COLE: Honey, should we do A or B?

MRS. COLE: I don't know, just make a decision and let me know.

COLE: OK... .which sounds better to you? I am happy with either.

MRS. COLE: Just pick one! I don't care! 


Forward one week... .


MRS. COLE: I wanted B, but you insisted we do A! Why do you have to be such a control freak?

She has got much better about this over the last 8 months, but it still happens every once in a while. AAAUUUGGGHHH!

Flip a coin and let her choose heads or tails, if either choice is ok with you.

[flourdust]

Flip a coin and let her choose heads or tails, if either choice is ok with you.

I think the point is that it doesn't matter how the choice is made; it will still be used as a pretext for a BPD-style accusation.

One of my wife's go-to rationalizations for attacking me was around planning for the week. Anything that upset her was due to us (read: me) not having collaborated on planning the week. So I began to hold weekly planning meetings with her. She would often blow up during these planning meetings for the typical dysregulations-of-the-moment: she didn't like how I phrased something, or my facial expression, or whatever. Even when things were planned, she would still blow up and blame it on my poor planning. (One Saturday, we had skating lessons at 11 and lunch at 12, but the 30 minutes between skating and lunch were not 'planned', and so I was a terrible person who needed to be chewed out.) On other occasions, she would melt down if I wanted to talk about planning something and she felt I had not given her sufficient forewarning that I was going to bring up the subject.

Ultimately, I figured out that it was easier for me to just do the damn planning and let her melt down whenever she wanted. It worked out exactly the same but saved me a lot of effort.

[livednlearned]

I think the point is that it doesn't matter how the choice is made; it will still be used as a pretext for a BPD-style accusation.

I think this depends a lot on other factors -- part of what we do with skills is manage (to our best ability) emotional arousal. Giving someone choice when emotional arousal is manageable creates a validating environment, one in which you are overtly showing your confidence in their abilities and competence.

When a pwBPD is becoming emotionally aroused, a different set of skills might come into play. Like checking body language, facial expression, tone, examining our own distress in the moment, etc.

Once emotional arousal is underway, we might use other skills like depersonalizing the attack or asserting a boundary, ending the conversation, leaving the room.

[flourdust]

Let me expand on that, because I don't disagree with you. Using your skills and trying a strategy like giving choices might lower emotional arousal in that moment. That's a good thing.

However, that won't prevent the issue of "control" from coming up again as a pretext for a fight later on ... .you will still need to try using tools to manage that situation.

In other words, getting Cole's first scenario "fixed" (where she complains that she doesn't want to make a decision) so that she's happy with it won't stop her from calling him a control freak a week later.

[waverider]

"I never get to choose" is simply another phrase for "I dont want to do this now'.

Dont take it literally, unfortunately we get tempted into arguing the technicalities of the former.

Rather than "thats not true" response use "what would be your choice now?". Think in the moment about going forward not back.

Likewise if what they are doing now is a good idea, it becomes theirs not yours.

Ownership of choices is transferable depending whether they perceive it good or bad in that moment.

[Cole]

"I never get to choose" is simply another phrase for "I dont want to do this now'.

Refusing to choose can also be a way to avoid the responsibility for the choice. If she chooses X and it turns out to be the wrong choice or does not turn out EXACTLY as she had expected it to, then the blame is on her. By forcing me to make the choice, she avoids any responsibility for the outcome.

She wants control, but only if she can guarantee the results will be perfect. Goes back to being raised by an extremely critical BPD mother.     

[teapay]

There have been many times where I've done things my W wanted or the way she wanted it against my will and afterward she'd try to convince me that I really wanted it too.  It seemed like she was trying to get away from guilt of pressuring me or the fear of my displeasure with the decision or both.  I think she gets stuck between  impulsive or distorted strong desires and my displeasure and doesn't want to make a decision.  She would rather have me choose what she wants, even if it involves reading her mind.

I also noticed in the first few years of our marriage how terrified my W was of bad outcomes and consequences too.  I guess nobody likes bad consequences, but she took that fear to a new level.  She'll try to dump those consequences on me or others or try to get out of taking responsibility for them herself.  I remember letters from her apologizing for the things she was doing, yet asking me to let her keep doing them and not hold it against her because she couldn't help it.

At the end of the day, though, I do think the solution is to place her in the position to make the decisions she needs to make and accept the consequences.  Hopefully she will learn and it will start to click, but even if it doesn't she still needs to live as much as possible in the real world of normal living and break the dysfunctional cycle.