Sister and brother in law clingy with children

[Depression = 72% of members]

This is an issue I've experienced now on a repeated basis. My sister is extremely clingy with her young children and it seems like she needs them to "choose" her over others - she needs them to play "you're my favourite" in front of others and they comply. When I'm around her and her kids they seem to "mimic" intimate moments with eachother -ie: they hug but in a rather "look at us we're so close" eyeing me for my reaction. I realize how bizarre this sounds but trust me it's even weirder to see. I've had moments where I've been around them, and no one even spoke a word to me - they were a heap of humans just leaning on eachother saying and doing nothing- no interaction, no real affection or attention either, just kind of glued to eachother.  Once I protested and said it was rude that no one was even talking to me and my sister took a temper tantrum and told me to leave, telling the kids I was leaving because they were bad - let me say they looked traumatized.

Another time we were walking and one of her kids took my hand and we walked on ahead (he almost seemed to try and run away from his parents with me) - but my sister caught up a little bit and asked her child "What are you doing? Wait for me? Why did you leave me? (He's 3)... and started to give him really strange looks of reprimand - All we were doing was walking ahead - but she seemed like she'd been left behind, even though she was with her husband and her other kid. I should have said something like: "we are just walking ahead. It's nice for me to spend some time with him don't you think?" But I'm afraid to say anything to her because she might again take a temper tantrum.

I am trying to spend time alone with her kids which works really well and they are great when their parents aren't around. I don't want to play "who's your favourite" with them - it's not fair to ask children to chose whom they love the best. How should I react when I'm with all of them though and have to interact with the lifeless, formless "blob" of attached humans clinging to eachother and my sister alternating between "poor me - these kids are all over me" and "I'm the favourite - look at me" (she was the golden child for a lot of our upbringing - so I guess she's getting it from her children now). There are situations where I can't just up and leave and have to sit through this - her husband is not any better and often will simply physically pick up the children when they are interacting with me and take them away... .it's so insidious.  I once remember playing with my niece when she was younger and she was happy and playing and suddenly her father appeared behind me and I remember she was instantly fearful - as though playing with someone else was betraying him... .it's so sad. Still, I know it's not my job to "fix" what's going on - just how do I better handle being around them when this type of dynamic is going on? What can I do, first to be a better role model for the children, and second so that this situation is less uncomfortable for myself? It's like being with a really clingy couple who essentially sit on each other all the time but don't have anything to say - interaction is really difficult and it's so not fun for me to be around.

[hotncold]

This is an issue I've experienced now on a repeated basis. My sister is extremely clingy with her young children and it seems like she needs them to "choose" her over others - she needs them to play "you're my favourite" in front of others and they comply. When I'm around her and her kids they seem to "mimic" intimate moments with eachother -ie: they hug but in a rather "look at us we're so close" eyeing me for my reaction. I realize how bizarre this sounds but trust me it's even weirder to see. I've had moments where I've been around them, and no one even spoke a word to me - they were a heap of humans just leaning on eachother saying and doing nothing- no interaction, no real affection or attention either, just kind of glued to eachother.  Once I protested and said it was rude that no one was even talking to me and my sister took a temper tantrum and told me to leave, telling the kids I was leaving because they were bad - let me say they looked traumatized.

Another time we were walking and one of her kids took my hand and we walked on ahead (he almost seemed to try and run away from his parents with me) - but my sister caught up a little bit and asked her child "What are you doing? Wait for me? Why did you leave me? (He's 3)... and started to give him really strange looks of reprimand - All we were doing was walking ahead - but she seemed like she'd been left behind, even though she was with her husband and her other kid. I should have said something like: "we are just walking ahead. It's nice for me to spend some time with him don't you think?" But I'm afraid to say anything to her because she might again take a temper tantrum.

I am trying to spend time alone with her kids which works really well and they are great when their parents aren't around. I don't want to play "who's your favourite" with them - it's not fair to ask children to chose whom they love the best. How should I react when I'm with all of them though and have to interact with the lifeless, formless "blob" of attached humans clinging to eachother and my sister alternating between "poor me - these kids are all over me" and "I'm the favourite - look at me" (she was the golden child for a lot of our upbringing - so I guess she's getting it from her children now). There are situations where I can't just up and leave and have to sit through this - her husband is not any better and often will simply physically pick up the children when they are interacting with me and take them away... .it's so insidious.  I once remember playing with my niece when she was younger and she was happy and playing and suddenly her father appeared behind me and I remember she was instantly fearful - as though playing with someone else was betraying him... .it's so sad. Still, I know it's not my job to "fix" what's going on - just how do I better handle being around them when this type of dynamic is going on? What can I do, first to be a better role model for the children, and second so that this situation is less uncomfortable for myself? It's like being with a really clingy couple who essentially sit on each other all the time but don't have anything to say - interaction is really difficult and it's so not fun for me to be around.

[Naughty Nibbler]

Hi HotnCold:  
I'm sorry that your sister and brother-in-law are so clingy with their children.  I can see how that makes it difficult for you to have a normal relationship with them.

I've had moments where I've been around them, and no one even spoke a word to me - they were a heap of humans just leaning on each other saying and doing nothing- no interaction, no real affection or attention either, just kind of glued to each other.  Once I protested and said it was rude that no one was even talking to me and my sister took a temper tantrum and told me to leave, telling the kids I was leaving because they were bad - let me say they looked traumatized.
I know it's not my job to "fix" what's going on - just how do I better handle being around them when this type of dynamic is going on? What can I do, first to be a better role model for the children, and second so that this situation is less uncomfortable for myself? It's like being with a really clingy couple who essentially sit on each other all the time but don't have anything to say - interaction is really difficult and it's so not fun for me to be around.

I can hear how frustrated you were.  That's understandable, and you had to feel unvalidated.  The only thing you have control over is how you interact with them and react to them.  You will never improve things for you, if they feel invalidated.  So you will need to be the emotionally mature person.

What might be possible the next time you are gathered together and everyone is sitting in silence?  Some type of game, maybe a simple board game?  Watch a movie together?  

A communication skill called, SET, can be a helpful tool.  Check out the link below and let us know what you think.  
bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=143695.0

You might gather some helpful information from the two links below that relate to children who have parents with mental illness:

CHILD DEVELOPMENT AND PARENTS WITH MENTAL ILLNESS:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=167128.0;all


WHEN THE CHILDREN OF A BPD PARENT ARE AT RISK:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=97979.0;all

[hotncold]

Thanks for this. I appreciate it - I always think that i am the one over reacting but having read through your links the "emotional" incest part really sounded like what's going on.  It makes me sad - the children are cared for materially but both parents are extremely clingy to the extent where everyone still shares a bed together. My sister tried gaslighting me when I broached the topic of the rages that my niece is experiencing: "All children have meltdowns." - she often uses the "you don't have children so STFU" card with me. Except I happen to know that these rages have turned violent against my sister, and they last for several hours. I've heard through the family grapevine that they were considering marriage counseling because the rages of their child are so severe... .I'm not sure if they are following through on this. I try to spend time with the children - it's such a delicate line to walk down though just to get there - my niece once told me she wanted to spend time with me and openly said "but mom and dad aren't going to help so you have to come pick me up"... .I feel bad I wish I could spend more time with them - but between their schedule and mine it's not always easy.