How Could I Have Lasted 45 Years?

[Jimmybob]

How did I get to this place? I'm living in a Twilight Zone, facing a reality that I can hardly comprehend, even though it's an accumulation of the reality I've been living all my life.

At age 66, I'm telling my wife that after 45 years of marriage we need to be separated for an arbitrary length of time, six months, so that I can try to recapture who I am and who I might be able to become without her. It's especially difficult because we live abroad and she will have to return to the US and live in her sister's house.

I concluded many years ago that my wife has Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD), which piece by piece has helped me understand what it is I've been living through for the past 45 years and the six years we dated previously. I've wanted to divorce her for many years but never did because: the kids, the grandkids, finances, God, my ministry (I'm a pastor/missionary), conviction that it was wrong, shame. I also, with yet more embarrassment, realize it has taken me this many years to sort out my own real problems from the ones that years of her false judgments convinced me were true. The tricks I played with myself... .acting like things were going well while pressing down ever deeper the reality that I was slowly but surely being destroyed as a man, husband, father, Christian. Afraid, sometimes terrified of my own wife to the point of acting out "correct" and "loving" actions which I convinced myself were real, when in reality it was years and years of pretense and cover-ups.

No matter what anyone else might say, I know to the core of my being that she is a "witch" BPD. She has destroyed me more than anyone, and after me our children. Apart from us, only people who are my very closest friends have seen the worst of her. Outside those few, to the rest of the world she is the most loving, godly, wonderful Christian woman. Truth is, she is amazingly gifted. Personality disorders don't erase natural intelligence or positive personality traits, aptitudes or talents. But BPD kills the spouse and children while operating fine with most other people.

I'm an empty shell of a man. I've been taken apart piece by piece and there's hardly anything left. I'm fractured, which means that I could preach last Sunday (guest preacher; I only occasionally preach in churches) and the congregation clapped and cheered at the power of the truth that I was expressing. It was as though I was soaring on eagles' wings as I preached. And my wife was there at my side telling me how amazing I was. Then we went out to lunch and acted like everything is fine, having normal conversation like a happy old couple.

I could and should be doing many things in the ministry which brought me to this foreign country, but I simply can't because I'm depressed. I feel like a lazy bum. I sit around waiting for life to be over, so it seems, because I think I'm a complete failure in life, marriage, and ministry.

Living this lie for so many years has brought me to the place of total despair. I've got plans and dreams and things, and each day I think I'm going to get off my butt and do something, but I spend most days doing almost nothing.

I know what I could be and I so hate who I am. How can I actually be having a marriage separation at 66 years of age after 45 years of marriage? How can this possibly be? But we haven't had a real marriage for, well, nearly throughout the whole time. Why did I sit through it all like a battered, helpless bum and do nothing?

I've been so abused and I feel like I can barely follow through on this. She is agreeing to leave, making plans for beginning of March. But then she cries and says how can she leave the only man she ever loved, and then she gets angry and then hard and quiet, ugh. But I can't do this any longer. The deception of it all, the farce of our marriage. The children know it all, and they can't believe we didn't get divorced years ago. They know there's nothing but horror between us; we can't fool them for a moment, even when we try to play like everything's normal they see right through it. But we do fool most of the rest of the world.

This is the first time I've shared this in an online forum. So I hope that I can simply get some kind of support to keep on going.

[Lucky Jim]

At age 66, I'm telling my wife that after 45 years of marriage we need to be separated for an arbitrary length of time, six months, so that I can try to recapture who I am and who I might be able to become without her. It's especially difficult because we live abroad and she will have to return to the US and live in her sister's house.

Hey Jimmybob, Welcome!  Others here have been down this path before you.  Like you, I stayed much longer than was healthy for me.  I admire your courage to make a change after 45 years of marriage.  I was married for 16 years to a pwBPD and it almost destroyed me.  You must be a strong person to have stayed as long as you did, so give yourself credit!  Your reasons for a separation are quite familiar to me.  Let's face it, there's no "good time" to make the change, so don't beat yourself up!  Sometimes we have to go through short term pain in exchange for long term happiness.  Hang in there and let us know if you have any specific questions.

LuckyJim

[vortex of confusion]

Hi Jimmybob!

Welcome to the forums.

I held out almost 20 years. Something about what you wrote reminded me of my parents. My dad tried to separate from my mother a few years back.  She went nuts and dad ended up going back to her. As a child witnessing that kind of stuff, I know what it is like to secretly wish your parents would get a divorce.

It is never too late to try to change your life for the better. Hang in there! There are a lot of people on this forum that can offer you support and words of wisdom. It is a great place to be especially if you feel like you have been living a lie. Outwardly, ex (still not divorced but I can't bring myself to refer to him as anything else) and I had the perfect relationship. Everybody thought we were so cute together. We had a great "how we met story" yet inside I felt like I was dying at times.

[Jimmybob]

Here's what makes forcing this separation difficult, and perhaps our whole relationship crazy for me to process. Maybe it's because we've been married so long that I've become the perfect co-dependent partner. Let me give an illustration:

No matter how terrible our relationship is, or how unsafe, nervous, even frightened I can be, I have developed ways to relate to my wife that gives us some "good times." If I plan a vacation to a Mexican resort, just the two of us or years ago with our kids, I know we'll have a good time. Not really a "married" good time (our sex life is dead, I just can't even consider it for many reasons). But like we're very loving companions. Enjoy the resort. Love choosing places to eat out together. Hours sitting on the beach or in the pool. Walking through small local towns, buying roasted chicken and hot tortillas on the street, taking a drive to see sights in our rental car. Now I know I've learned what exactly to do to keep her happy, and I do those things so that I can enjoy a good time without any trouble between us. How to make her feel special. How to hold my tongue and say nothing if some awful comment happens to come out of her mouth. Some of the time I feel angry because I'm the one planning and doing everything.

So now it's going to be her birthday in ten days. We live in a place where there's a nice all-inclusive resort that we recently visited for the first time and loved. I'd like to go there, but it seems nuts to think that I'd do such a thing when I'm making her leave me and go back to the US for a long separation during which we'll see if we can divorce or not.

Maybe I'm just thinking to plan such a birthday because that's what I've always done. Even if the day before or the day after is hell. If I don't plan anything and say, "Good grief, I want you to leave me because I can't stand living with you any longer," it will be so terrible with crying and maybe screaming that I wonder is it worth it? But going to a resort for a night at this time makes me feel like I'm really certifiable crazy myself! Maybe I just have to keep up my coping mechanisms, the way we've lived for so many years, until the day she actually leaves. What do you think?

[vortex of confusion]

But going to a resort for a night at this time makes me feel like I'm really certifiable crazy myself! Maybe I just have to keep up my coping mechanisms, the way we've lived for so many years, until the day she actually leaves. What do you think?

I don't think you are crazy. You are deeply ingrained in a set of behavior patterns. I was there. Even though ex has been out of the house for 10 months, I still find myself thinking about doing stuff for him. When I am at a store getting stuff for the kids, I will see something and think, "Oh, ex would like that." And, then, I keep on walking. I am so programmed to think about him and what he likes and wants and needs. On his birthday this year,  the kids and I took him out to dinner and spent the day with him. I did it for me. I still have a lot of guilt for kicking him out. Doing some of those things helps me ease my guilt. Plus, it is what I would want somebody to do for me if I was in his shoes. That mindset is what kept me holding on so long.

Instead of asking what others think, ask yourself what YOU think.

What course of action would you feel best about? Try not to focus so much on how she would feel and think about how YOU would feel.

From my own experience, I don't think I began to really, truly feel stuff until he was out of the house. After he left, it has been an emotional roller coaster ride where one day I am trying to hold on to all of the good memories and cherish them and then the next day all of those memories feel like one big fat lie.

[Lakoda]

How did I get to this place? I'm living in a Twilight Zone, facing a reality that I can hardly comprehend, even though it's an accumulation of the reality I've been living all my life.

At age 66, I'm telling my wife that after 45 years of marriage we need to be separated for an arbitrary length of time, six months, so that I can try to recapture who I am and who I might be able to become without her. It's especially difficult because we live abroad and she will have to return to the US and live in her sister's house.

I concluded many years ago that my wife has Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD), which piece by piece has helped me understand what it is I've been living through for the past 45 years and the six years we dated previously. I've wanted to divorce her for many years but never did because: the kids, the grandkids, finances, God, my ministry (I'm a pastor/missionary), conviction that it was wrong, shame. I also, with yet more embarrassment, realize it has taken me this many years to sort out my own real problems from the ones that years of her false judgments convinced me were true. The tricks I played with myself... .acting like things were going well while pressing down ever deeper the reality that I was slowly but surely being destroyed as a man, husband, father, Christian. Afraid, sometimes terrified of my own wife to the point of acting out "correct" and "loving" actions which I convinced myself were real, when in reality it was years and years of pretense and cover-ups.

No matter what anyone else might say, I know to the core of my being that she is a "witch" BPD. She has destroyed me more than anyone, and after me our children. Apart from us, only people who are my very closest friends have seen the worst of her. Outside those few, to the rest of the world she is the most loving, godly, wonderful Christian woman. Truth is, she is amazingly gifted. Personality disorders don't erase natural intelligence or positive personality traits, aptitudes or talents. But BPD kills the spouse and children while operating fine with most other people.

I'm an empty shell of a man. I've been taken apart piece by piece and there's hardly anything left. I'm fractured, which means that I could preach last Sunday (guest preacher; I only occasionally preach in churches) and the congregation clapped and cheered at the power of the truth that I was expressing. It was as though I was soaring on eagles' wings as I preached. And my wife was there at my side telling me how amazing I was. Then we went out to lunch and acted like everything is fine, having normal conversation like a happy old couple.

I could and should be doing many things in the ministry which brought me to this foreign country, but I simply can't because I'm depressed. I feel like a lazy bum. I sit around waiting for life to be over, so it seems, because I think I'm a complete failure in life, marriage, and ministry.

Living this lie for so many years has brought me to the place of total despair. I've got plans and dreams and things, and each day I think I'm going to get off my butt and do something, but I spend most days doing almost nothing.

I know what I could be and I so hate who I am. How can I actually be having a marriage separation at 66 years of age after 45 years of marriage? How can this possibly be? But we haven't had a real marriage for, well, nearly throughout the whole time. Why did I sit through it all like a battered, helpless bum and do nothing?

I've been so abused and I feel like I can barely follow through on this. She is agreeing to leave, making plans for beginning of March. But then she cries and says how can she leave the only man she ever loved, and then she gets angry and then hard and quiet, ugh. But I can't do this any longer. The deception of it all, the farce of our marriage. The children know it all, and they can't believe we didn't get divorced years ago. They know there's nothing but horror between us; we can't fool them for a moment, even when we try to play like everything's normal they see right through it. But we do fool most of the rest of the world.

This is the first time I've shared this in an online forum. So I hope that I can simply get some kind of support to keep on going.

20+ years for me and she is gone to live with her sister... .she left. Let me explain and I hope this helps. First off, I'm a devoted Christian myself for years and, you being a pastor, I understand the perception you are trying to keep for the sake of the church. Dont worry about the perception of the church because no one on this planet has it together. Your problems just mean you are human and not infallible. Nothing to be ashamed of... .also it sounds like you need as much prayer as you can get.

Second, The fact that she wants to stay with you is more than what I have at the moment... .but people with BPD change like the wind. If your wife wants to be with you then you have something you can work with. Instead of just leaving her after 45 years my advice would be to meet her halfway... .tell her what you suspect she has and tell her she needs help and you will be there through it. After all, shouldn't you try to see if you can make it better if you can instead of just dropping out? Or at least help her to understand how others are affected by her. There is help out there for what she has... .she doesnt want to have BPD just as bad as you dont want her to have it. Perhaps an intervention with the family?

I suspect another part of your issue, I struggled immensely with this, is you need to set healthy boundaries... .thats why mine left. I started more and more to stand up for myself and apparently that wasnt okay after many years of humbling myself to her at great expense. I can understand why she was confused... .she just accused me of not loving her anymore despite what I claimed or showed. The silver lining is my wife is in treatment. Does that mean they will fix all of her problems... .no but at least its something. Even if she isnt with me anymore she is learning about herself.

Remember... .

Philippians 4:6
Proverbs 3:5-6

Hang in there... .I have seen many of miracles through those verses

[Dutched]

How could you?
Well because you are a good, compassionate and strong person with great values, my fiend!
No matter what others tell you!

Compared with your 45+6 yrs. together, mine 30+ yrs. seems short, but as others who replied having had a very long r/s I can relate of what you experienced.
It has been a process of many years that was almost unnoticeable, was a part of the dynamics in our r/s, at least we thought so.

For now, keep in perspective of all the good advises you will get from friends and family. Accept it with a grain of salt as they don’t know, not even are able to imagine what you went trough!  
Certainly don’t accept any ‘advise’ of just divorcing because all you went through.  

Been there. Telling friends an example (not going for a Sunday walk with exw, reason for exw to divorce), unbelief and silence as they can’t imagine the emotional impact.

As you describe, indeed also a person who expressed their worst only to the closest, me and her parents/family once.
Being the most social and lovable person in the community, ‘one to cherish and to be proud of’ as once said to me…

And yes again, exw destroyed the kids too. As mom being the primary caretaker, they were influenced and
developed her ‘views’ and some intense emotional responses, like how mothers spread Borderline.
Or maybe even better moms revenge via kids for what their father did.
I advise for that part to have a look at Borderline and Medea complex.

You are shattered after so many years, despite of knowing about BPD, as I did years before the end.
I needed a P, who diagnosed me, nothing wrong with me. Who put me on the path of  ‘drama queen’ and found BPD, learned techniques and exw’s outbursts could be canalised again.  

As you, I tried to believe, to see the positive in the one I loved for so many yrs., to hold onto my vow that was so important and last but not least for my kids! Giving them a family, keeping all together.
However deep down in my heart I knew it would be over one day and the same time believing to get old together.

So please try to take more and more care of yourself as I did these yrs.!
So change the way you are responding (in a way more detached, but being there), try to live your own life more.
 
Jimmybob for me exw blew it up in one of the typical outbursts, for you I see it is not over.
Being well over 50 myself please consider that with a divorce your whole live as you knew it will be gone too.
Yes even the bad, but will that out weight all? Certainly when you take care more of you?
Then, ones life is gone, really gone (trying to built up a new life takes yrs…).
Not growing old together after so many, many years.
No best mate (despite all), no one to talk to, to hold hands, nothing left that will be familiar ever again.
Your plans, all you worked for and how about financially?
Even the simple family gatherings will be gone, there will develop 2 camps…  
Kids that can’t visit their parents anymore, only dad or mom.
The dream of being there for the grandkids playing and being nurtured by their grandparents, will be gone.
I am there... .still building from scratch... .

Been there too and relate to many other stories on this board, separating from a person with BPD(traits) will be a severe battle on its own.
A battle in which you will see a face you even never saw before in all these yrs.

Dutched

[Jimmybob]

I wrote a first post, got some good replies. Not sure if this creates a whole new post or adds to my previous post. I'd like to respond to those who already replied to me, but want others to see this too... .?

Fast recap: We are expat missionaries living abroad. I've known for some years that my wife is BPD. Have held on for 45 years through lots of hell, so often wanted to quit but many reasons just kept me going. Now I'm asking her to go back to the US for six months, an arbitrary amount of time. Perhaps it will end up being divorce but don't know how we could do that. As always in this nightmare marriage, here are the things that fight against one another inside me:

1) She's a true "witch" BPD. I am a leader; I am authoritative, used to running the show... .except at home. I'm often afraid of her, just feel like why let her know exactly what I'm thinking or really want to say because of the horror that will ensue? I'm smart and quick-thinking, but with her... .ugh. She can blame and judge and twist things with such outright lies that I feel she's truly insane (I know, bad word choice on a site like this). I am vulnerable and talk easily about my sins, faults, weaknesses. But she blames me for things that I am not, she tells me that I am exactly what is the truth about her! Oh the lies, lies, lies... .all our children know that Mom tells lies constantly. For many years there would be screaming and slamming of doors. Constant crying. Psychologically-induced sickness that now makes my children roll their eyes if I call to say Mom is sick. Many years of stealing from stores. One two-year affair with another man early in our marriage.

2) The above is my wife with me and our kids (when they were growing up). Now she tries to control herself when we visit them and the grandchildren, but a couple of them have a hard time being with her and one has refused to see her for the past year. All wonder why we didn't divorce many years ago and think it would have been better for them. A few other people who get very close to us, especially my closest friends, have also seen the BPD behavior in her. Other than that, the whole world LOVES her and think we've got the best thing going. She does amazing hospitality, cooking, counseling people, praying with people, teaching both adults and children... .they all adore her.

3) Then there's the part of our ongoing daily life that we've developed over 45 years of marriage, what can often be a very normal-seeming existence. I couldn't describe it as a marriage, though, more like companionship. We know each other well. When I'm sick, she's compassionate and dotes over me. If we go on a trip or vacation or even just out to eat, it's normally a good time of normal conversation and even enjoyment. I've just learned over so many years how to act in just about every situation, except when the witch thing escalates at home and then sometimes I blow, though more often now I just get terse and numb. Lately I sit her down from time to time and speak truth right into her face, and she often listens... .but of course nothing ever ever changes.

Here's my problem. If I wanted to live the rest of my life with a companion who regularly sticks a knife in my back while smiling... .or worse, perhaps I would just endure. But I feel I can't go on like this any longer. Don't know why I waited 45 years to get to this place.

I can say for sure that I never, never have any feeling of attraction and certainly no romantic feelings at all. That died entirely many years ago. I feel like she emasculated me in my manhood and my sexuality in ways perhaps too intimate to detail here. There are so many things about her that just plain annoy me, but these things by themselves would probably be normal differences that a decent marriage would learn to put up with because of love. I don't think my wife knows what love is, although she thinks she does.

I've asked her to leave for six months at least. She will go live with one of her sisters initially, try to get a part-time job, and find a counselor who specializes in BPD if possible. At least that's what I'm asking her to do, and even though for so long she ridiculed the whole idea of BPD, she seems to be going along with it... .we'll see.

Normally when we're apart for reasons of business (ministry) travel or her returning to US to visit kids and grandkids alone, we communicate by Facebook every day, sometimes more than once a day. But I always feel like I'm still under her control and judgment. This time I want it to be like we're separated. No communication except emergencies or absolute necessities, I've still got to pay the bills and get account of her credit card use, etc.

Does this have any chance of working? Will I feel "free" without her? When she's been gone for a month I love it. But I don't know what no communication will be like. Will I be lonely? I wonder. I'm not the kind of guy to go out and find women or go to bars and get drunk or anything like that (though the last few years I've taken to drinking every day to just get a coping "buzz". But just to do whatever I want without always having to answer the 20 questions, won't that feel free and good? Still, going to a restaurant alone or spending a day at the beach alone does not sound fun at all.

I've been having every-worsening depression that makes me unable to do just about anything. I waste lots of time just sitting at home almost unable to function. I'm wondering if I'll get back to the way I really am if she's gone and I'm not constantly playing back all kinds of thoughts and actions in my mind.

A couple people who have already responded to my first post have been understanding but seem to be telling me that my life without her will be worse, that facing life alone will be terrible after these many years together. But I wonder how anything could be worse than the abuse that I've endured for all these years.

Sometimes the thing that has kept me from divorce previously (besides impossible finances and possibility that missionary supporters will simply stop and I'll be penniless, and how hard it is to divorce if you depend on social security and also if you live in a foreign country) is that I begin to think that she is unable to control the way she is. I can begin to pity her because she treats me so often like she hates me and denies she's doing it. Although how can a BPD not be aware they are crafty, manipulative, choosing exactly who to spew venom at and who to be nice to.

At age 66, is there any chance my wife could find a BPD counselor (that we could afford), really change, and come back to me a different person? Or should I just move forward with the assumption that once she leaves, she won't be back?

Should I take down our wedding and other photos when she leaves, get rid of a bunch of stuff, and do my best to establish life as a single person? Or should I leave everything as is and live each day with some hope that this is just a temporary situation and she'll come back changed? Truth is, I have no hope at all for the latter.

[livednlearned]

Hi Jimmybob,

Deep breath  

You can take this in steps, and do some experimenting. You don't have to jump into the deep end. When you live with BPD partners for a long time, you're likely to feel as though things have to be black or white, which is an extreme way to think. Problem solving skills can get stunted because we feel chronically desperate.

There are relationship skills that can help prevent things from getting worse (like validation, SET communication, asserting boundaries, etc.). There are also skills to help you regain some of that lost self. Both will help you, no matter what you decide.

It's hard when you have competing values (e.g. marriage is a commitment, stay married for the kids, etc.) versus taking care of yourself, which is a universal human need. Your BPD wife has made the latter value incompatible with the first ones. And not tending to your own self-care leads, as you know, to depression.

Leaving is a process, and you may want to start taking some steps to assert your independence. It takes strength to do this, and you don't have to drop a bomb and make rash decisions unless you feel that things MUST happen during your six months back in the U.S. During the experimentation stage, you can go slow, and figure out what feels doable.

Have you already asked her to go back to the US? Will you be going with her? Does she have any clue that you are thinking about divorce?

A small step toward achieving some of your self-respect might entail telling her to stop raging at you when she insults you. Hold up your hand and say, Stop. Repeat it until she stops. Don't engage her argument, don't change anything except your insistence that she stop. Walk into another room if she does not stop. Or leave the room.

You have to come first here for a bit, and build up some strength. Leaving and staying require you to be strong.

[Sluggo]

Jimmybob,

Thank you for sharing.  I feel the pain you are feeling.  I was 18yrs.  I can relate to the fact you said everyone who knows my wife thinks she is a godly person and very calm and gentle.  Very few have seen her when she is in a rage (my father, her family, our therapist). 

There are great people on this board with a lot of wisdom.  If anything it is just nice to tell someone else.  That is when I started healing when sharing with some close friends (and then also anomalously on this board). 

[Notwendy]

The timing- age 66 or 26 may be less relevant than arriving at the emotional place you are at. The way through this is to start with you- your co-dependency issues. As a minister, you give spiritual and emotional support to others- but who helps you? Seeking help for you may not feel natural, but if your emotional/spiritual tank is on empty and you keep giving, then it makes sense to feel this way. For a long time, the focus has been on your wife. Turn it to you.

[ACObound]

right where you are.  Me, 36 year marriage with high functioning uBPDw. For all practical purposes, the only real relationship I really have had.  Been through alot of cycles and I still find myself stuck on what to do next.   Like others have told you, this site helps wade through the confusion.