I am tired and cannot hold on much longer

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello all,
First time posting, long-time lurker, found others' posts strikingly similar to my own story and finally am making an effort to reach out for help. I'll do my best to keep it brief as I know many of you know exactly what kind of predicament I am in.

Of course, like many of you, I too rushed into the relationship. I met my wife at the pique of what was the best summer of my life so far. She was everything I had been looking for and more, and we could not get enough of each other. I proposed within 3 months and we were married 5 months thereafter. Fast as hell and I received a lot of flack from friends and family for the haste I made in securing the love of my life, but I was convinced that she'd be my everything forever...

Long story short, we've been married for 11 years and have 3 amazing children together. The relationship has been the epitome of a nausea inducing and memory clouding roller-coaster, and it's a wonder that we're still together now. She was given the diagnosis of BPD in our 4th year of marriage, but to this day denies it and asserts that it was wrongfully placed upon her. Needless to say, with the lack of accountability in the diagnosis, the relationship has been rough and has had its fair share of severe altercations that are well beyond what would warrant a divorce. But, I absolutely love the woman to her core and even when I am in talks with my legal counsel, ready to initiate the arduous process, I back down remembering all that I love about her and how much she means to me. I can't bring myself to leave... Call it trauma bonding, or what you will, I cannot let her go.

Fast-forward to today... I've endured 2 1/2 years of accusations that I am a narcissist, verbally and psychologically abusive, controlling, mentally ill, delusional, misogynist, sexist, a psychopath etc...the list goes on, but the NPD thing has been the worst of it all and for a moment there I believed that I actually was a narcissist and sought out treatment for it. It was almost like a sadistic tactic of interrogation, one you'd see on those documentaries where the law enforcement is clearly planting false memories and dialogue into the alleged suspect's mind, which is exactly how it felt each time she'd accost me for something I inadvertently did. Such things were what my friends and family considered to be menial, trivial to say the least; I interrupted her, I didn't hear her correctly, I enforced my misogynistic regime on her (of which I am absolutely not. I have a daughter and in that regard consider myself a father that respects feminism and honors women, wanting nothing but success and empowerment to my daughter and even my wife), I disciplined the children wrong. All of which she'd somehow twist into me being a narcissistic a-hole that  lacks empathy...once more, the list goes on. My family is flabbergasted with how she can call them and complain of maltreatment from me when they know I treat her like a queen and adore her relentlessly.

I now find myself in a situation where I feel I've exhausted all my efforts into demonstrating that I am none of the above, and each time I reach that goal, somehow, I am still falling short and not making a consistent change. The biggest issue I have is when my emotions manifest (I break down and cry because I cannot show anger, and withdraw into myself) after enduring 4-5 days worth of demeaning and, I'll say it, dehumanizing treatment from her, all in front of our children. And yet, there will be days when everything clicks! We are in synchronicity with one another and loving each other's presence, cuddling in bed, talking about the promising future...and then the next morning she starts speaking of separation, saying that she's mistreated and disrespected, and that I am unreliable because I failed to clean our kids' humidifier properly (I forgot to take apart a piece of the reservoir). It's a cycle...and once I feel like I've cracked the code, found the piece to my missing puzzle, I am still not showing her enough respect, emotional maturity, etc...and then she speaks of being happier without me, wondering what a life without me would be like, being held back by me...all of which eat more and more into my psyche causing immense amount of pain and insecurity, which just perpetuates the self-deprecating consternation within my mind that I am not a good husband, not a good father, and a failure at life (things she has told me many times).

I am at the point where I've exhausted all I can mentally and physically to keep my marriage. I am making myself sick trying to improve whatever issue she's got with me and enduring her incessant criticism that I ask her to dial back on a little, but am told that I am man-child that cannot take feedback. It's not feedback, it's abuse... I've begged and pleaded to her to keep me and love me, which is just sad. I've set myself that low. As I type this, she is texting to me her inability to see how else this relationship can progress,  I am not as mature as she is, and that she still feels disrespected. I am in constant fear that she will cheat, or is already cheating on me because how she compares me to other men and tells me that I am not the leader she thought I'd be. It's killing me... I am tired of having to prove my worth and feeling like I am not worthy of love. I want to give up and tell her that if she feels this way, she can leave, but I always fall back into that trap of wanting to make it work, when I know I'll be right back where I am now within a few weeks, if not, days.

I need help, guys... I am not strong at the moment. I've isolated myself so much and am scared to reach out to my friends and family with my issues because, although they will not admit it, I know they are just as tired, if not more, of me and my topsy turvy relationship and my incessant crying to them about it. I wear a mask each day at the office that depicts a well put together man with a regular family, but inside I am heartbroken and wanting so much to be loved and supported in my career (i am about to apply to med-school but receive little to no support from my wife). I just want to let go... I don't want to care anymore... If she doesn't want me anymore, I want her to fade away into almost nothing other than the mother of my children, and never worry about not being loved by her ever again.

This was very cathartic to let it all out... I appreciate anyone that reads and or replies. Thank you for letting me reach out.

[Apollo-pilot]

Hello all,
First time posting, long-time lurker, found others' posts strikingly similar to my own story and finally am making an effort to reach out for help. I'll do my best to keep it brief as I know many of you know exactly what kind of predicament I am in.

Of course, like many of you, I too rushed into the relationship. I met my wife at the pique of what was the best summer of my life so far. She was everything I had been looking for and more, and we could not get enough of each other. I proposed within 3 months and we were married 5 months thereafter. Fast as hell and I received a lot of flack from friends and family for the haste I made in securing the love of my life, but I was convinced that she'd be my everything forever...

Long story short, we've been married for 11 years and have 3 amazing children together. The relationship has been the epitome of a nausea inducing and memory clouding roller-coaster, and it's a wonder that we're still together now. She was given the diagnosis of BPD in our 4th year of marriage, but to this day denies it and asserts that it was wrongfully placed upon her. Needless to say, with the lack of accountability in the diagnosis, the relationship has been rough and has had its fair share of severe altercations that are well beyond what would warrant a divorce. But, I absolutely love the woman to her core and even when I am in talks with my legal counsel, ready to initiate the arduous process, I back down remembering all that I love about her and how much she means to me. I can't bring myself to leave... Call it trauma bonding, or what you will, I cannot let her go.

Fast-forward to today... I've endured 2 1/2 years of accusations that I am a narcissist, verbally and psychologically abusive, controlling, mentally ill, delusional, misogynist, sexist, a psychopath etc...the list goes on, but the NPD thing has been the worst of it all and for a moment there I believed that I actually was a narcissist and sought out treatment for it. It was almost like a sadistic tactic of interrogation, one you'd see on those documentaries where the law enforcement is clearly planting false memories and dialogue into the alleged suspect's mind, which is exactly how it felt each time she'd accost me for something I inadvertently did. Such things were what my friends and family considered to be menial, trivial to say the least; I interrupted her, I didn't hear her correctly, I enforced my misogynistic regime on her (of which I am absolutely not. I have a daughter and in that regard consider myself a father that respects feminism and honors women, wanting nothing but success and empowerment to my daughter and even my wife), I disciplined the children wrong. All of which she'd somehow twist into me being a narcissistic a-hole that  lacks empathy...once more, the list goes on. My family is flabbergasted with how she can call them and complain of maltreatment from me when they know I treat her like a queen and adore her relentlessly.

I now find myself in a situation where I feel I've exhausted all my efforts into demonstrating that I am none of the above, and each time I reach that goal, somehow, I am still falling short and not making a consistent change. The biggest issue I have is when my emotions manifest (I break down and cry because I cannot show anger, and withdraw into myself) after enduring 4-5 days worth of demeaning and, I'll say it, dehumanizing treatment from her, all in front of our children. And yet, there will be days when everything clicks! We are in synchronicity with one another and loving each other's presence, cuddling in bed, talking about the promising future...and then the next morning she starts speaking of separation, saying that she's mistreated and disrespected, and that I am unreliable because I failed to clean our kids' humidifier properly (I forgot to take apart a piece of the reservoir). It's a cycle...and once I feel like I've cracked the code, found the piece to my missing puzzle, I am still not showing her enough respect, emotional maturity, etc...and then she speaks of being happier without me, wondering what a life without me would be like, being held back by me...all of which eat more and more into my psyche causing immense amount of pain and insecurity, which just perpetuates the self-deprecating consternation within my mind that I am not a good husband, not a good father, and a failure at life (things she has told me many times).

I am at the point where I've exhausted all I can mentally and physically to keep my marriage. I am making myself sick trying to improve whatever issue she's got with me and enduring her incessant criticism that I ask her to dial back on a little, but am told that I am man-child that cannot take feedback. It's not feedback, it's abuse... I've begged and pleaded to her to keep me and love me, which is just sad. I've set myself that low. As I type this, she is texting to me her inability to see how else this relationship can progress,  I am not as mature as she is, and that she still feels disrespected. I am in constant fear that she will cheat, or is already cheating on me because how she compares me to other men and tells me that I am not the leader she thought I'd be. It's killing me... I am tired of having to prove my worth and feeling like I am not worthy of love. I want to give up and tell her that if she feels this way, she can leave, but I always fall back into that trap of wanting to make it work, when I know I'll be right back where I am now within a few weeks, if not, days.

I need help, guys... I am not strong at the moment. I've isolated myself so much and am scared to reach out to my friends and family with my issues because, although they will not admit it, I know they are just as tired, if not more, of me and my topsy turvy relationship and my incessant crying to them about it. I wear a mask each day at the office that depicts a well put together man with a regular family, but inside I am heartbroken and wanting so much to be loved and supported in my career (i am about to apply to med-school but receive little to no support from my wife). I just want to let go... I don't want to care anymore... If she doesn't want me anymore, I want her to fade away into almost nothing other than the mother of my children, and never worry about not being loved by her ever again.

This was very cathartic to let it all out... I appreciate anyone that reads and or replies. Thank you for letting me reach out.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[kells76]

Hi Apollo-pilot, glad you felt ready to reach out today and get some support --

You do sound exhausted, like you've had zero in the tank for a long time, both physically and emotionally. That's a really hard place to be in for a prolonged period, and it's a really hard place to make decisions from and see clearly from. It makes sense that you feel like you "did all the right things", that it somehow still "wasn't enough" for her, and so you're really questioning -- so is this it? is this as good as it gets, me giving 200% all the time and it never being enough?

We get it here, truly. So many members have started where you find yourself: trying for years to "give more", "do more", believe every criticism and "change more"... and they too have felt exhausted, resentful, depleted, and very unsure of what to do next. You're not alone -- and there are other options (though sometimes new and unintuitive) besides driving yourself to exhaustion.

couple of things I'm curious about in your post:

Long story short, we've been married for 11 years and have 3 amazing children together.

How old are the kids, what's their school setup (homeschool, public school, other), and what's their social life like -- friends, grandparents, sports, clubs, church, etc?

The relationship has been the epitome of a nausea inducing and memory clouding roller-coaster, and it's a wonder that we're still together now. She was given the diagnosis of BPD in our 4th year of marriage, but to this day denies it and asserts that it was wrongfully placed upon her.

Back when she was diagnosed, how did she respond? Was she more open to it back then?

Who gave the diagnosis (psychiatrist? Ph.D. psychologist?) and do you still have contact info for that professional?

Needless to say, with the lack of accountability in the diagnosis, the relationship has been rough and has had its fair share of severe altercations that are well beyond what would warrant a divorce.

Those sound serious. What happened?

But, I absolutely love the woman to her core and even when I am in talks with my legal counsel, ready to initiate the arduous process, I back down remembering all that I love about her and how much she means to me. I can't bring myself to leave... Call it trauma bonding, or what you will, I cannot let her go.

How long have you had a lawyer (i.e. just got one yesterday, have been in talks for years, somewhere in between)?

What have you learned from your L about how divorce/custody might go for your situation in your area?

Does your L understand "high conflict personalities"?

It makes sense to pause and get yourself in a more stable and grounded place emotionally before making a big life decision like divorce. Like I mentioned, it's really difficult to make wise choices from a place of physical and mental exhaustion. I wonder if there are some things you can do to get a little respite, before deciding how to move forward -- get your head more clear. There's no right or wrong answer here.

Fast-forward to today... I've endured 2 1/2 years of accusations that I am a narcissist, verbally and psychologically abusive, controlling, mentally ill, delusional, misogynist, sexist, a psychopath etc...the list goes on, but the NPD thing has been the worst of it all and for a moment there I believed that I actually was a narcissist and sought out treatment for it.

What was the outcome of that treatment? Are you still in touch with the professional?

I now find myself in a situation where I feel I've exhausted all my efforts into demonstrating that I am none of the above, and each time I reach that goal, somehow, I am still falling short and not making a consistent change. ...

I am at the point where I've exhausted all I can mentally and physically to keep my marriage. I am making myself sick trying to improve whatever issue she's got with me and enduring her incessant criticism that I ask her to dial back on a little, but am told that I am man-child that cannot take feedback. It's not feedback, it's abuse... I've begged and pleaded to her to keep me and love me, which is just sad. I've set myself that low. As I type this, she is texting to me her inability to see how else this relationship can progress,  I am not as mature as she is, and that she still feels disrespected. I am in constant fear that she will cheat, or is already cheating on me because how she compares me to other men and tells me that I am not the leader she thought I'd be. It's killing me... I am tired of having to prove my worth and feeling like I am not worthy of love. I want to give up and tell her that if she feels this way, she can leave, but I always fall back into that trap of wanting to make it work, when I know I'll be right back where I am now within a few weeks, if not, days.

I know you're just getting started here, so we can keep this short and then dive in more later.

People with BPD (pwBDD) struggle to have a stable sense of self (this is me, that is you). They also struggle with wildly varying, often harmfully intense emotions, that "come out of nowhere" and may or may not be related to anything that anyone else is actually doing or saying. pwBPD have a "skills deficit" (few skills, and/or poor skills) when it comes to managing those huge emotions, and often do and relationally destructive things in an effort to not feel so overwhelmed, shamed, or horrible inside.

One way to think about that is a pwBPD might get hit with a huge feeling of anger, out of nowhere. The pwBPD feels that inside, but doesn't know where it came from, and it's huge and overwhelming and frightening. The pwBPD "finds" an external reason for the feeling: "you looked at me hatefully" (even if you didn't) and then tries to make you do something different so they don't feel angry any more. This is not the exact clinical description, but an analogy for the key thing happening:

there is not a necessary relationship between how she feels about what you're saying and doing, and what you're actually saying and doing... and that's a feature, not a bug, of the serious mental illness of BPD.

I think at some level, you could agree to that, it's just difficult in your day to day life to separate out that her feelings don't necessarily track with what's really happening in life.

Starting on the new path of "separation of stuff" may be good to try: her stuff (her feelings, desires, beliefs, moods, etc) are hers to own; your stuff (your feelings, desires, beliefs, moods, etc) are yours to own. You are yourself and she is herself. There is a place where you end and she starts.

I need help, guys... I am not strong at the moment. I've isolated myself so much and am scared to reach out to my friends and family with my issues because, although they will not admit it, I know they are just as tired, if not more, of me and my topsy turvy relationship and my incessant crying to them about it. I wear a mask each day at the office that depicts a well put together man with a regular family, but inside I am heartbroken and wanting so much to be loved and supported in my career (i am about to apply to med-school but receive little to no support from my wife). I just want to let go... I don't want to care anymore... If she doesn't want me anymore, I want her to fade away into almost nothing other than the mother of my children, and never worry about not being loved by her ever again.

This was very cathartic to let it all out... I appreciate anyone that reads and or replies. Thank you for letting me reach out.

Even though I have to wrap up for now (posting at work), just know you've been heard, and that there are other options in your marriage besides what's been tried.

Take a look at our article on What Does it Take to Be in a Relationship with a pwBPD, especially the section on preserving your own emotional health. In line with that, I'd be curious if you have a therapist or counselor for yourself right now -- it can make a huge difference in livability of your experience (I have an individual T and it's been beyond helpful).

Looking forward to learning more of your story;

kells76

[Notwendy]

It's good that you reached out. People here understand. It's important to not isolate yourself.

I second Kell's advice to get yourself a therapist/counselor- for your own support. This is important. Your wife may be the person with the "issues" but you will benefit from the support of someone who is objective and supportive to you in a theraputic way. It's good to have friends and family but a therapist has the objectivity and skills to help you make personal changes to improve your situation and is helpful.

It's hard to have your spouse say critical things and you have exhausted yourself trying to prove otherwise. It will help to understand that her perspective is influenced by her projections. They are the result of her own disordered thinking. Trying to change her perspective- proving that you aren't what she thinks sometimes is trying to change her thinking, but we aren't able to change someone else's thinking.

You know what is true about yourself and what isn't. That's a boundary- what is you, what isn't you. You know what color your hair is, what your name is. If your name was Fred and someone told you you aren't Fred, you are Steve, you would know that isn't true. It's easy to lose sight of our own boundaries when we are close to someone and we want them to think well of us, but if someone says we are something- with the boundary we examine it- is this true, is this not true. If it's not true, then what they say won't make it true.

The accusations are difficult to hear because they aren't completely absurd. What helped me to not react emotionally was to substitute something absurd for the accusation. If your wife told you that you are a pink elephant - would you try to prove to her that you aren't one? Would her telling you that make it true?

Also, a therapist can help you to determine which of your behaviors are reinforcing her behaviors. We all do things for reinforcement. If you do a good job and get a raise at work- well that may result in more of the same behavior. It may be maladaptive to call someone a narcisist, but if the result is more attention, more trying to please them, well then that is something they may repeat again when they want attention. A therapist can help you to change your part in reinforcing behavior.

This is just a start, but behaviors and situations don't change all at once- it's a bit at a time. I hope you can take some steps for your own self care, and do things to reconnect with yourself and feel more grounded. It's commendable you've been able to prepare to apply to medical school, but you do know that medical school will require a lot of studying and focus. This is your dream and you have worked hard to get to this point. You are worth investing in your own well being and following your dream.

[Apollo-pilot]

Hi there, Kells76

To answer your questions, my kids are 10, 7, and 6, and they're all in public schools. We live quite a distance away from family as my career takes us all over the world, so although the kids are familiar with their grandparents, they're not able to see them as often as I would like. We are a very athletic family; my wife and I are into fitness, and our kids follow suite as well as play sports.

When she was given the diagnosis 7 years ago by a psychiatrist, she was devastated... It tore her apart and was in disbelief. It didn't help that she had grown up in a family wrought with mental disorders (brother was schizophrenic, sister downs syndrome, other sister major depressive disorder) and so she was very much afraid of the stigma. What's more, I wasn't well equipped to help her with such thing and, I'll admit, wasn't the best support at that time. I don't have contact with that psychiatrist anymore, however, I do have contact with another clinician that bestowed upon her the same diagnosis just two years ago. But, even though I am her husband, I've not been granted the liberty to speak with said clinician about the nuances of the diagnosis.

As for the altercations...(sigh), there are many, but the some of the most salient involve a suicidal attempt by ingesting a bottle of narcotics (she received them for a surgery months prior), and told the police that it was my fault, that I coached her into it. I certainly did no such thing. Another incident involved her getting upset about me standing up to her about her verbal abuse to myself and the kids. She threw a porcelain plate across the house, stabbed a butcher's knife into our kitchen counter, and ran out of the house to call the police to remove me from the home. Police came and interrogated me in the home asking what had happened and although my anxiety was piqued, I maintained my composure and showed them statement from my child's teacher about what my son had reported my wife had said to him after he spilled his dinner one night (explicit language no 7 year old should hear his mother speak to him). Although I was cleared of any allegations she conjured up, I was still removed from the house and had a no contact order placed upon me for 2 weeks. My job was informed of the altercation, and I was given punitive action even though I'd done nothing wrong. More or less, the same scenario played out again 2 years later.

Lucky for me, my career has given me access to immediate legal counsel and I have been able to engage with them frequently to go over the nuances of a divorce with a spouse with BPD. Although they've not dealt with a case like that before, I have been given great advice on how I should conduct myself should I chose to push that button. However, they've also been honest with me about the difficulties I may incur and the inevitable slander I will encounter. As far as respite, that's a difficult one, and not because of what I'm enduring, but simply because I am not good at taking care of myself. It's hard for me to do things of my own without feeling guilty about it.

In seeking my own treatment, the outcome was that I was diagnosed with severe anxiety and CPTSD, and treated for that and crippling insecurity and self-esteem issues. I am still engaging in said treatment with the same therapist who is trying to help me separate myself from the relationship, which brings me to your second to last reply. I believe your advice is sound in the separation of what's hers to deal with and what is mine. The enmeshment has taken so much out of me, but it is difficult to keep my distance at times, especially when the undulation stop for a moment and I feel the trajectory of our relationship to be in a positive curve. To help me with this new endeavor of mine, I've recently taken up studying philosophy in the school of stoicism, which teaches the dichotomy of control: the acknowledgement of what's ours to implicitly control and what is not, and not stressing about what we cannot. (There's obviously more epithets, but that's for another time).

I cannot tell you how happy I am that you replied...again, it's cathartic to say the least, and I will read that article you've linked in your reply as well. I greatly appreciate you and this forum and all the people within it.

Thank you again!

[thankful person]

Hi Apollo Pilot and welcome,

I totally relate to your story and many of the issues you have faced in your marriage. I am a married lesbian and we have four small children my dbpd wife has birthed them all for us. My wife was diagnosed bpd before we met, but considers herself cured. I have been in bpd family for nearly four years. Honestly I am still figuring it out, but I’ve had so much support from the awesome team here and particularly not Wendy and Kells  I couldn’t have got through it without bpd fam, honestly they have saved my sanity and I used to say my marriage but the boat has well and truly rocked again since then so I can never be certain.

2021 I joined and made huge progress with learning to stand up for myself, look after myself, do what I wanted without my wife’s permission etc . The process was hard work and stressful but I was also proud of myself and in some ways it was actually enjoyable learning to be me again. I thought I had solved the problem and things were under control. Wrong. 2023 for me was one of the worst years of our relationship and it was constantly my wife putting me down accusing me, telling me I’m not good enough etc, and my trying to prove myself to her. I know this vicious cycle doesn’t help but it was so difficult to get out of it. Like my wife would ring me when I was one minute out the house and be on the phone while I drove to work and usually verbally attacking me etc. and I just wished I could drive to work in peace and enjoy my music and time away from her. So anyway, now we’re at a point where I can drive to work and not hear from her at all, all day. Whilst I have changed many things about my own words and actions, I know I’m not in control because I know if she starts behaving like that again I’m going to struggle to respond differently, though I certainly intend to. Enmeshed was certainly the word for us too.

How are your kids doing? Do you feel you have to protect them from their mother, do you worry about their mental health? This has been a massive concern of mine, though my wife is recently behaving quite sane but again if I sound like I’m worried she’ll turn again that’s because I am worried. I wish you all the best with your journey. Have you read stop caretaking the borderline or narcissist? It is highly recommended by all.