Difficult times ahead

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Kells, just wanted to say that I'll be thinking of you and your H - and SD too.


Plenty of less extreme examples of people accepting difference out there - millions, actually.

It can be particularly difficult to see now, with a lot of rhetoric promoting rejection of difference as somehow the right thing to do. Acceptance and tolerance are not en vogue, at least according to the media... 

Whatever is behind SD's current views, you've always had her best interests - and H's - front and center. On some level, SD must know this.

I agree- it's not only politics, it's how a pwBPD processes political messages and their own lack of a strong sense of self, along with modern media.

Politics seemed to be less of a focus when I was a teen. I knew when there was an election and who my parents voted for but it wasn't a part of their identity. During the early days of the "women's movement" my mother joined a group with her friend but the ideas didn't lead to her taking action. The focus was women being able to get into the workforce- which this friend did, but BPD mother didn't act on the ideas. Dad rarely mentioned politics.

I think the combination of political rheroric and black and white BPD thinking may enhance each other. One side all good, one side all bad but each situation is more nuanced than this. In more recent times, I'd hear BPD mother repeat a slogan about a candidate that I think she must have heard from a friend or read somewhere but if we discussed it further, I am not sure she entirely believed the slogan either.

19 year olds are impressionable and also lack the experience and critical thinking skills of an adult. They are also more concerned with peer pressure and fitting in. Add to this, a parent with BPD and how that parent processes- and their peer group. I agree that Kells- you and your H have provided a lot of stability and done a lot of good for the girls and I think they know that at some level, even if they aren't able to comprehend it all yet.

[Notwendy]

Kells, just wanted to say that I'll be thinking of you and your H - and SD too.


Plenty of less extreme examples of people accepting difference out there - millions, actually.

It can be particularly difficult to see now, with a lot of rhetoric promoting rejection of difference as somehow the right thing to do. Acceptance and tolerance are not en vogue, at least according to the media... 

Whatever is behind SD's current views, you've always had her best interests - and H's - front and center. On some level, SD must know this.

I agree- it's not only politics, it's how a pwBPD processes political messages and their own lack of a strong sense of self, along with modern media.

Politics seemed to be less of a focus when I was a teen. I knew when there was an election and who my parents voted for but it wasn't a part of their identity. During the early days of the "women's movement" my mother joined a group with her friend but the ideas didn't lead to her taking action. The focus was women being able to get into the workforce- which this friend did, but BPD mother didn't act on the ideas. Dad rarely mentioned politics.

I think the combination of political rheroric and black and white BPD thinking may enhance each other. One side all good, one side all bad but each situation is more nuanced than this. In more recent times, I'd hear BPD mother repeat a slogan about a candidate that I think she must have heard from a friend or read somewhere but if we discussed it further, I am not sure she entirely believed the slogan either.

19 year olds are impressionable and also lack the experience and critical thinking skills of an adult. They are also more concerned with peer pressure and fitting in. Add to this, a parent with BPD and how that parent processes- and their peer group. I agree that Kells- you and your H have provided a lot of stability and done a lot of good for the girls and I think they know that at some level, even if they aren't able to comprehend it all yet.

[ForeverDad]

I think the combination of political rhetoric and black and white BPD thinking may enhance each other. One side all good, one side all bad but each situation is more nuanced than this.

Even more than this, in recent years it has grown to an extreme across the population: Disagree with me and you're evil.  How can you have a normal discourse with that conviction running rampant?  To some extent this is how the girls were overwhelmed by the other household.

It's been termed Mass Formation Psychosis, a quite awkward and forgettable title.  I've also seen Dr Drew Pinsky often interviewed mentioning this.

[Pook075]

I agree- it's not only politics, it's how a pwBPD processes political messages and their own lack of a strong sense of self, along with modern media.

I was telling my daughter the other day that while there have always been political divides, this stance of "not my president" wasn't really a thing until 10-15 years ago.  Before that, people voted for a candidate or their party, but then the nation rallied around whoever won since that was our leader.  People simply didn't bad-mouth the president in the open and there certainly wasn't the endless attacks on social media and late-night TV.

My kid was shocked at this news and at first, she didn't believe me.  She even asked, "Dad, you didn't vote for Biden...you're saying that you supported him?"  And I had to explain that the president was the ultimate decision-maker in our country, and it's in everyone's best interests if that person does well. 

Why on Earth would I label that person my enemy?  That's like hoping your country will fail.

This generation desperately needs a history lesson on some of the tougher times in America and how we all had to pull together to get through those eras.  The great world wars, 9/11, the great depression, etc.  It should never be me versus you...it should be about us and openly discussing our differences as fellow Americans.  That's what made this country great and we're losing that at a record pace.

[Notwendy]

I think a big contribution to these new circumstances is social media. People can be rude on these platforms and complex situations are presented in short memes or video clips that are frequently biased or inaccurate. I also think the media and the news plays a part.

It must be hard to be a kid and exposed to all of this and wonder what is true and what isn't.

[PeteWitsend]

I think a big contribution to these new circumstances is social media. People can be rude on these platforms and complex situations are presented in short memes or video clips that are frequently biased or inaccurate. I also think the media and the news plays a part.

It must be hard to be a kid and exposed to all of this and wonder what is true and what isn't.

Social media has absolutely ratcheted up the tension.  People are exposed to more political nonsense and arguments than before, and the anonymity provided contributes to more name-calling and extreme statements. 

But there were always political arguments and tensions.  I remember growing up and being taught that it wasn't polite to discuss politics or religion, especially with strangers, and for good reason.  Perhaps we've forgotten our manners more and more.  I think it would help to have a "no politics" at the dinner table rule - or in the house at all - in most families. 

[PeteWitsend]

...  I think it would help to have a "no politics" at the dinner table rule - or in the house at all - in most families. 

Of course, good luck getting a pwBPD to agree to that, if screaming about politics is their thing.

At least it would help improve relations between a lot of parents and kids, or aunts and uncles and nieces and nephews.

[kells76]

Thanks for all the comments & thoughts. I'll try to reply to them at some point.

H invited both kids to dinner out tonight, and to our surprise they both showed up. It was only 45 min but they seemed to be in good moods and conversant. SD17's temp job is going fine and SD19 has another trip planned to see her partner. No deep topics but they weren't icy or blamey. SD17 is having car problems and did listen to H suggest what was wrong & offer to help her fix it.

Next Friday could be totally different... who knows. Guess we just have to do one day at a time.

This (not just the last month, but the last 4-5 years+) has taken a significant toll on our marriage and we are getting help again. Right now it'll be with my T but it'll probably be better long term for H to get his own T or for us to get a marriage T that is not my T.

So that's where we're at.

[Pook075]

Next Friday could be totally different... who knows. Guess we just have to do one day at a time.

That's really the key to life- one day at a time, one task at a time.  You can't worry about what might happen or what could blow up; that anxiety used to eat me alive inside.  It wasn't until I accepted that my BPD kid loved me, even though she was flawed, that allowed me to stop focusing on what "could be" and just live in the moment.

Why does this matter?  I used to be so stressed about what could happen, that I'd enter every conversation tense and on edge...which brought out the worst in my BPD daughter or BPD ex-wife.  It's like a pet or a baby when they sense nervousness, it makes them nervous too even though they don't know what they're afraid of. 

I had to learn to stop doing that and our interactions completely changed.  It was me as much as it was them.

[Notwendy]

This (not just the last month, but the last 4-5 years+) has taken a significant toll on our marriage and we are getting help again. Right now it'll be with my T but it'll probably be better long term for H to get his own T or for us to get a marriage T that is not my T.

So that's where we're at.

Kells, you have been an amazing step mom. Understandable that this whole situation took time and attention from your marriage. I think the idea of an independent mariage T- who isn't your own T, and also your H having his own T- are both good ideas.

While the soon to be empty nest is seen as a time to do more things together as a couple and more time as individuals, it's also an adjustment. If the focus has been on the kids, then sometimes things that have been put on the "back burner" come to mind.

As to your SD- I am glad the dinner went well. Seems like she still wants connection- that's a good thing.