My son is an idiot I’m so mad

[Mickey47]

Well so much for that his best friend is having to save his money and move out. Because my idiot for a son wants to make that psychotic B happy. She is most definitely the whole reason why he hasn’t been getting his daughter and seeing his family. So if he goes back to not seeing his daughter and not communicating with us. IM DONE! I can NOT handle this anymore and this is the definition of insanity!

 GOD IM SO ANGRY I can’t even think straight right now! What in God’s name is this crap like why do these people have such a hold on their partners I just don’t understand it. I swear I’m going to drop dead of a heart attack because I just can’t stop doing what I’m doing for my grand daughters sake, but the stress is so much on me! I GIVE UP!

[Notwendy]

Mickey, I am so sorry. Unfortunately, I am also not surprised. I observed my parents doing this "push-pull" - it's a part of both of them. This push pull pattern is an aspect of this type of relationship. I don't know the answer to why your son's wife has such a hold on him, but it's at least half on his part. People have described this as a dance at times- and your son is doing his part of the steps.

There were times when my father was lucid about his relationship- present and in the moment. Sometimes he'd admit to what was going on. Then, it's almost as if something took over his thinking and he was all in again ,denying anything was wrong and speaking my mother's praised.

My guess, is that the wife threatened suicide. My mother did this and even attempted it. I understand how this must have scared my father. He did love her and feel responsible for her.

Sometimes ( as an older teen/adult when I was mature enough to ask these questions) I would ask my father why he stayed with her. His response was because of us kids. Divorce laws in those days mostly awarded custody to the mother and it was difficult to fight that. My mother had the capacity to appear completely stable in public and there would be no questioning that she was a good mother from people who didn't see what was going on at home when nobody was looking. Nobody believed us if we said anything.

That we understood. Yet, we grew up and left home for college and still my parents stayed together. My father had the opportunity to leave if he wanted to. He didn't. He didn't really want to. The reasons he stayed were not for the kids.

I used to see him as the stable one and as a victim of my disordered mother. In many ways he was the most stable one. I didn't understand his part in the relationship until I found myself in a less severe but still difficult marital situation. An MC told me to work on my own co-dependency. It was then that I began to see my father's role in this, and I have empathy for him. In his day there was little to no information about BPD/co-dependency. He fell in love with my beautiful and charming but disordered mother. There were good moments between them. She could be amazing at times. Then, as if a switch went off- a completely different person. I'm sure he believed he could help her and in ways he most certainly did but he had no information to work with.

He loved his kids but my mother's wishes prevailed. She was the center of the family. Her moods, her wishes - were the main focus. My father's family loved us kids. Our time spent with them was a highlight of our childhood and are still close to that side of our family and our kids - the next generation - are too.

It's tough for you in the present. Your son will make his own decisions. However, you can make a positive impact on that grandbaby that will persist into the future. I know it can't make up for the loss you feel about your son. I hope you can turn your focus on to some self care and care for that little girl who can benefit immensely from your love.

[Mickey47]

Notwendy thank you for telling me all that.
 I can’t tell you how sad I am for you not to have had a mother to love you like I love my kids, grandbaby heck my entire family. I’m the definition of Mama Bear and I’ve always been that way even when my sister was a baby and still to this day. I’m very protective of all my loved ones. But you’re right it is a dance and I’m getting off the dance floor. I will always put my GD first she will never doubt that me, her Papa and aunts uncles and cousin love her.

Because they do they all love her dearly. We all show her all the time we see her how much she means to us. We always make sure she has a good time and make good memories for her. We will always be here for her even when the day comes that the good Lord takes me home there will always be family here to love her. No matter if my son comes off the dance floor or not. She will hopefully never questioned if we loved her.

I’ve calmed down some prayer helps me a lot. The good Lord has helped me through 7 yrs of hell. But I got to tell you a little peace would be great. I often wonder if I’m being punished for something in my past that I did. Why I’m having such a long time of tribulations. Why I am not allowed some rest and happiness. First it was his issues in school of being bullied then his drug addiction which lead to his lovely choices in women.

Then with each woman it’s been worse and worse. The first was a disrespectful little snot and cheated on him. The second one which is my GD’s mother she was controlling in a different way. She treated him like a maid and punching bag. Course they were on drugs I found that out later on. He was smoking marijuana and she was doing coke (rolling my eyes) then she cheated on him and that was the end.

Now this wack job Lord help me I’m so tired in my body from fighting tooth and nail to save him from himself. I have learned from all of this with this one that I can’t save him. He has to save himself. I understand that, but it’s very hard for me to be happy when he isn’t. That goes for both my kids or my husband I feel their pain or hurt so deep. I know what I need to do and once I get the insurance on the car paid and help my son finish paying off his attorney for when he was fighting for his daughter.

I’m going to find a therapist I can go to, because I know I need help with letting go of other peoples problems. I make them my own and I drowned myself in it. My son gets it from me so it’s my fault and I’ve accepted the fact that a lot of his issues are my fault. I didn’t push him enough and let him do what he wanted all out of fear of losing him. Now look what I’ve created.

But once I get those debts paid I’m going to get some help.

[zachira]

I am sorry your son has gone back to his wife yet not surprised. The will power of someone to stay away is usually not very strong when involved with a spouse with BPD. I don't know which comes first, the low self esteem to choose a partner with BPD and/or the gradual erosion of self esteem that comes living day in and day out with a spouse with BPD. For your son to make a clean break and not be manipulated into going back and/or choosing another highly dysfunctional partner, he will probably need some long term therapy. You are doing the right thing by getting therapy for yourself as this can help you to be more emotionally removed from what is going on between your son and his wife, which may allow your son to take more responsibility for his actions.  It warms my heart to know you are making a big difference in your granddaughter's life and hope you are experiencing the joy of spending quality time with your granddaughter as much as possible despite how badly things are going with your son.

[Mickey47]

Okay I seriously need some advice. My son is NOT telling his best friend to leave the apartment. She told him that and the BF confronted my son in front of his wife. My son turned to her and said he is not leaving. If you don’t like then you leave and he told her it was over between them.

BF said he is waiting for her to walk out, because she keeps threatening suicide if their done. They live in an apartment we all live in Texas. Because they are married he can not just kick her out of the apartment. How does he go about getting her out without her making good on her threat or turn it around and try to hurt him?

Apparently non of her family want her around, because of everything she has put them through. Because I suggested to get a family member to come get her. Then have my son pack her things and take them to her and let her know he is filing for a divorce. Then go to the police and get a restraining order put on her. That way she’d be somewhere safe and her family could deal with her threats and my son could be free.

He feels trapped the best friend said he feels like a prisoner of his own home. He feels like he is grounded because he can’t watch tv or play a video game nothing because if a woman comes on screen the BF said she starts flipping out and breaking stuff and screaming. I said why doesn’t he just let her go nuts and just ignore her? Why does he give in to her BS?

He said the reason he gives in is because she’ll destroy the apartment if he doesn’t and he can’t have that. This is his last chance at having an apartment because of what she did last time. He is already having to pay extra rent money because of the eviction being on his credit. So the BF said he just feels like there’s no way out. Now I’m getting really concerned for my son and his well-being. Please tell me what can he do to get out of this situation. This is becoming scary!

[Turkish]

While it's good that the BF provides you info, he's an adult, free and able to make his own choices. So is your son,  and so is she (such as she is). This whole situation is causing you stress and grief.  What happens if you let these kids (who are adults) work it out amongst themselves?

[Notwendy]

Mickey- I don't want to sound pessimistic, but from my own experience there was always a "reason" that my father stated he couldn't leave my mother or do other things . This perspective kept him in "victim" mode. Victim mode is " I can't do _______because of your mother"

It wasn't just about leaving which he would bring up on occasion but about anything.

"I can't help you with college tuition because mother won't let me".

"I can't do this because mother would ________"

"I can't get a divorce because it is too expensive"

I can't leave her because she would get custody of you kids" ( but still didn't leave when we grew up).

My mother also trashed the house and threatened/attempted suicide. I think this is something he truly feared- that she would harm herself.

But in the long run, victim mode is a cop out. In victim mode, the person appears helpless. Sometimes people are truly victims- such as a child or elderly person who can not fend for themselves and truly has no choice at all. If my father had chosen to leave my mother, it would have been very difficult, but had he truly wanted to do it, he could have done it. It was not impossible for him. He also could have chosen to do other things too, like help with college or things he wanted to do, and it would have been difficult but not impossible.

I can't do this because of her" --- I don't fully buy into this now. It would be difficult to do it, and so he chooses to avoid that. But it is still his choice.

[Mickey47]

Okay well I gave them some ideas and told them what to do. So I guess like you say just wait and see what happens. If he really wants her to leave he’ll find a way to do it. Normally when my son makes his mind up there is no changing it. So we shall see.

Thank you for all your advice Notwendy and Turkish

[JNChell]

M47, how are you? Any updates?

[Mickey47]

Hi JNChell - Sorry I haven’t been on here lately, but I’ve actually been dealing with something about myself.

My son had stop texting me again and didn’t come on the weekend like he said he would. However, my grand daughter was with her mother for the Easter holiday. We had her last year so she had her this year. His BF was keeping me updated on what was going on. My son called his wife’s family for help and he messaged them. He received NO reply!

He only let them know that his wife had been threatening to kill herself since Saturday April 13th and he ended up calling the police April 16th, because things got much worse. He let them know where she was, but would like to talk to them about the situation. He did not tell them he was planning on getting a divorce or anything that had been going on. He left that voicemails and he sent text messages to everyone her mom, dad, grandparents and sister.

None of them responded! His BF said “so are we going to the apartment management to see if we can get her off the lease or move apartments?” Because my son had told him he was going to do something so she couldn’t come back. He told his BF let’s see if her family responds first. So his BF said okay man whatever you want to do. My son told his BF “I can’t allow her to just go out on the streets it’s not right and it could be potentially dangerous for her or others.”

His BF understood and then a couple of days went by with no response. He found out his wife was being put on more meds. So yeah he fell right back into it again, but I understand his situation is not a fair one. It wouldn’t be right to put her on the streets and I do agree with my son on that. So it’s just a really difficult situation.

She is back in the apartment and the BF told me yesterday was “okay I guess” we’ll see how the days progress. Apparently she was on meds after the first time and she still flew into a jealous rage over stupid stuff and my son couldn’t even play video games because she’d start flipping out and start trying to destroy the apartment.

So in order for her to stay calm and not do that my son stopped doing everything he liked to just apparently sit beside her while she played on her phone. Then he got sick of that and said the hell with it I’m going to play a game or watch TV. She started flipping out again and the BF said my son told her to sit the F down shut the F up and grow the F up! That’s when she switched to saying she’s going to “off herself”

So I’m sure a third time is coming. But who knows.

[Notwendy]

Can you see the pattern here?

I think a suicide threat needs to be taken seriously.

Yet, when your son seems to get "fed up" with his wife's behavior, she threatens or has some kind of scene. Then, your son feels badly (FOG), stops doing what he usually does and just sits next to her.

That's powerful reinforcement. When she thinks he might be fed up with her, she threatens and this draws him close.

While it is shocking that her family didn't respond, it is possible that they are also dysfunctional, or just have seen this so many times, or are glad that your son is now taking her on and they don't have to.

If not for your son taking care of her, she may need to be hospitalized. Maybe this is exactly what she needs to get professional care? I can understand your son not wanting to have her out with no roof over her head and no way to take care of herself. I hope she doesn't harm herself, but with continued threats he might consider calling 911 and getting her evaluated again.

[Mickey47]

Notwendy- thank you for your advice and I will definitely let them know that next time to call 911.

Although he wants out of this marriage and apparently that mind set hasn’t changed, because he has told her it’s over. He told he wouldn’t throw her out, but that this just wasn’t going to work. She needed to figure something out and he told her and suicide is not the answer at all and that he would call again and have her taken in again.

So my question to you do you know if medications are going to work? Will they help her stop flying into these jealous rages and extremely dangerous violent anger episodes? She is being forced to take this medication, because she doesn’t believe in it and she refuses therapy. So I personally don’t think it’s going to work, because she’s being forced to do something she doesn’t want to do. I feel like until she realizes for herself she has a problem and needs serious professional help I don’t see this helping.

You can’t make someone help themselves they have to want the help in order for it to work.

Thank you again so much for your insight. Have a great weekend and I’ll keep you updated.

[Notwendy]

I am not an expert, but my mother has taken many kinds of medications. The main reason I don't think these work, or therapy works for her is that she denies she is a problem and isn't motivated to follow through on treatment. I have read about, and there are cases of, people who have made improvements with therapy and BPD- but the ones I have heard about have been motivated to work on it.

Medication alone won't help BPD but it may help some symptoms like depression and anxiety. My mother hasn't stuck to any prescribed medicine. She likes alcohol 

[JNChell]

Hey there, M47. Thanks for the update and I apologize for my delayed response. I recall from your previous thread that your son might take her back. This has happened. This may happen several more times. This is speculation, but have you considered this? This might be a wise place to watch, not approach, the situation from.

I imagine that your Son feels a great deal of pressure from the suicide threats. As dysfunctional as the relationship is, he loves her. That should be taken into consideration. You know how love feels. Yes, she’s abusing and manipulating him. He’s the only one that has control over his well being.

His exit from the relationship has started. It’s a matter of time. No one knows how many recycles will occur, hospitalizations over suicide threats, etc. The momentum has shifted and that relationship isn’t built to last.

Your OP struck me as being very angry with your Son. I get it. Keep in mind that he is, or thinks he is, in love. He may have feelings that he thinks he can make everything ok. Let this run it’s course. That’s all you can do.

I don’t think that it’s beneficial to have those types of communication with his best friend anymore. That’s triangulation.

Your son is the only one that can make this better. What approach can you take to support him?

[Mickey47]

Notwendy - thank you for that information, because I feel the same way you do. I feel like she’s being forced into this and doesn’t believe in medication. She also loves alcohol so I know sooner or later she’s going to blow up and get angry for him making her do something she doesn’t want to do.

JNChell - Yes I am very angry with my son and I too have also decided to not communicate with his best friend about their situation at the apartment anymore. I want to know how he is doing how his emotional state is, but that’s it. Because when he is around us he hides his feelings. Other than knowing what his well being is really like I don’t care to know anything else.

I’m going to just keep praying like I have been, because I feel there has been progress all be it very small and slow it’s there. I’ll keep y’all updated on things.

Again I just want to say how much I truly appreciate y’all and y’all have really helped me a lot. I was just talking to my sisters mother in law about this website and I call y’all my group therapy friends, because you are and you’ve helped me so much. Y’all are all in prayers and thoughts always.