Overwhelmed and worried about my mom’s behavior toward my kids

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Hi!  I found this forum while searching the web for resources on dealing with my mom, who I am pretty sure has undiagnosed BPD.  I’m married and have 4 kids, and have lived far away from her until recently.  She’s always been hard on me, but she had a very bad episode over Christmas and this time it involved my children.  She told me on Christmas Eve that my children make her feel like an intruder in our home and that she would not spend any time with us for Christmas.  She dropped off presents but refused to watch the kids open them or to allow us to give her her gifts.  I told her that it was hurtful, and she told me not to overreact, so I let it go.  But then she wanted me to text her all day on Christmas.  When I failed to do that, she sent me a long list of grievances against my family, starting with the words, “I didn’t want to tel you this, but if you’re going to insist...”. She said my husband makes her feel like she doesn’t exist, that my 10 and 12 year old boys think she is an annoying old lady, and that all 3 of them are influencing my 3 year old daughter to not want her around, either.  My 15 year old son is the only one who makes her feel loved.  When I asked her to please not say things like this about my family on Christmas Day, she said that I made her say it, and that I don’t get to “bawl her out” because I don’t want to admit the truth about my family, especially when I demanded to hear it.  I finally blocked her number from my phone.  Then my family went to see my husband’s family in another state for Christmas, and an hour after we got to my mother-in-law’s house, my mom showed up.  She stayed for a few minutes, then left and started messaging me on facebook, saying “thanks for showing me how much you love me.  Don’t worry, you won’t hear from me again” (..and .the lie detector test has determined...that was a lie).  She continued to message me, but slightly changed the narrative.  Now she is claiming that my  children don’t love her because she annoyed them by being inadvertently overbearing.  She is talking like I started the conflict because I was mad at her for annoying my family, and that I am refusing to talk it through like an adult and forgive her, even though she’s promising to be less annoying.  That made me mad, and I told her that if she wants to keep talking about it, I wanted her to go to a therapist and that I would come to a session with screenshots of all her Christmas texts.  She responded to that by saying that she thinks we can work it out ourselves, but if I need to see a therapist, she’s willing to go with me. .

She wants to apologize to my kids for being so annoying that she made them stop loving her, and I’m not able to make her understand why I won’t allow that.  She says “there’s no law that says kids have to love their grandmother unconditionally”, and can’t conceive of any possibility that it could be painful to my kids (who actually adore her) to feel like they made her feel so unloved that she didn’t want to be with them for Christmas.  In fact, I don’t think she can conceive of the possibility that anyone other than herself ever experiences pain at all. 

I’ve tolerated a lot from her in the past few years, kind of accepting that there is something about me that triggers her.  My earliest memories are of her accusing me of only loving my dad.  When she felt like I wasn’t taking her side against him during their divorce, she would burn herself with a curling iron and show me bottles of pills she could kill herself with  because “‘my own daughter doesn’t love me and thinks I deserve to be with a man who abuses me”.  I blamed myself for that stuff, but her behavior this week caused me to look at those memories with the eyes of a mother, and to see my own children in my position, and I realized that she did was toxic and abusive.  My life has been sort of flashing before my eyes ever since, and I think I’m realizing that I have some  trauma in my past that I’ve never dealt with.  I feel confused and overwhelmed, and like I desperately need to protect my kids.  I want to act rationally and come up with reasonable boundaries, but I’m finding it impossible to do that with her constantly pressuring me to accept her version of events and do what she wants me to. I blocked her from contacting me, but am afraid that it’s only a matter of time before she shows up on my front porch and tries to force a confrontation. 

I know this is really long, so huge thanks to anyone who read it all.  If anyone has any ideas for how I can handle this, I would appreciate it very much.  ❤️

[Much_confused]

Hi!  I found this forum while searching the web for resources on dealing with my mom, who I am pretty sure has undiagnosed BPD.  I’m married and have 4 kids, and have lived far away from her until recently.  She’s always been hard on me, but she had a very bad episode over Christmas and this time it involved my children.  She told me on Christmas Eve that my children make her feel like an intruder in our home and that she would not spend any time with us for Christmas.  She dropped off presents but refused to watch the kids open them or to allow us to give her her gifts.  I told her that it was hurtful, and she told me not to overreact, so I let it go.  But then she wanted me to text her all day on Christmas.  When I failed to do that, she sent me a long list of grievances against my family, starting with the words, “I didn’t want to tel you this, but if you’re going to insist...”. She said my husband makes her feel like she doesn’t exist, that my 10 and 12 year old boys think she is an annoying old lady, and that all 3 of them are influencing my 3 year old daughter to not want her around, either.  My 15 year old son is the only one who makes her feel loved.  When I asked her to please not say things like this about my family on Christmas Day, she said that I made her say it, and that I don’t get to “bawl her out” because I don’t want to admit the truth about my family, especially when I demanded to hear it.  I finally blocked her number from my phone.  Then my family went to see my husband’s family in another state for Christmas, and an hour after we got to my mother-in-law’s house, my mom showed up.  She stayed for a few minutes, then left and started messaging me on facebook, saying “thanks for showing me how much you love me.  Don’t worry, you won’t hear from me again” (..and .the lie detector test has determined...that was a lie).  She continued to message me, but slightly changed the narrative.  Now she is claiming that my  children don’t love her because she annoyed them by being inadvertently overbearing.  She is talking like I started the conflict because I was mad at her for annoying my family, and that I am refusing to talk it through like an adult and forgive her, even though she’s promising to be less annoying.  That made me mad, and I told her that if she wants to keep talking about it, I wanted her to go to a therapist and that I would come to a session with screenshots of all her Christmas texts.  She responded to that by saying that she thinks we can work it out ourselves, but if I need to see a therapist, she’s willing to go with me. .

She wants to apologize to my kids for being so annoying that she made them stop loving her, and I’m not able to make her understand why I won’t allow that.  She says “there’s no law that says kids have to love their grandmother unconditionally”, and can’t conceive of any possibility that it could be painful to my kids (who actually adore her) to feel like they made her feel so unloved that she didn’t want to be with them for Christmas.  In fact, I don’t think she can conceive of the possibility that anyone other than herself ever experiences pain at all. 

I’ve tolerated a lot from her in the past few years, kind of accepting that there is something about me that triggers her.  My earliest memories are of her accusing me of only loving my dad.  When she felt like I wasn’t taking her side against him during their divorce, she would burn herself with a curling iron and show me bottles of pills she could kill herself with  because “‘my own daughter doesn’t love me and thinks I deserve to be with a man who abuses me”.  I blamed myself for that stuff, but her behavior this week caused me to look at those memories with the eyes of a mother, and to see my own children in my position, and I realized that she did was toxic and abusive.  My life has been sort of flashing before my eyes ever since, and I think I’m realizing that I have some  trauma in my past that I’ve never dealt with.  I feel confused and overwhelmed, and like I desperately need to protect my kids.  I want to act rationally and come up with reasonable boundaries, but I’m finding it impossible to do that with her constantly pressuring me to accept her version of events and do what she wants me to. I blocked her from contacting me, but am afraid that it’s only a matter of time before she shows up on my front porch and tries to force a confrontation. 

I know this is really long, so huge thanks to anyone who read it all.  If anyone has any ideas for how I can handle this, I would appreciate it very much.  ❤️

[Methuen]

Hi Much_confused

What you describe of your mom sounds very familiar as BPD disordered thinking and behavior.  It is overwhelming to realize at first- especially when one first begins to comprehend what uBPD means for you and all the family relationships with uBPD mom.

Deep breaths.  Repeat.  

S-l-o-w  d-o-w-n.

My life has been sort of flashing before my eyes ever since, and I think I’m realizing that I have some  trauma in my past that I’ve never dealt with.  I feel confused and overwhelmed, and like I desperately need to protect my kids.

Focus on your H, 4 kids and yourself for now.  Try to do something together as a family unit with your H and kids, to get your mind off of your mom.  

Reminder to   s-l-o-w  d-o-w-n, and breathe deeply, repeatedly.

Maybe continue low contact for now, to keep yourself and your family feeling safe.

 

I blocked her from contacting me, but am afraid that it’s only a matter of time before she shows up on my front porch and tries to force a confrontation.

You are stressed and afraid, and so this could make you more vulnerable to be drawn into a confrontation with your mom.  Try to avoid that if you can.  Can you discuss this with your H, and form a plan what to do if your mom tried to draw you into a confrontation?  

Five - six months ago.  I was pretty panicky too.  Terrified of my mom, and had an escape plan with my runners at the front door and my bicycle in the bushes outside.  I have learned a lot since then about BPD's and what I need to do to manage a BPD relationship with my mom.  While it's not great and never will be, I feel more centered because I have more tools for how to cope with her, and I'm not panicky all the time.  It does get better.

Welcome to our board forum.  

[Panda39]

Hi Much_Confused,

I wanted to join Methuen and welcome you to the group and share some of the site's information.

I hear a lot of FOG (Fear, Obligation, Guilt) or emotional blackmail in your post.  Your mom is using it to try and get you to do what she wants...where there is pressure there is usually FOG.  I find that recognizing it can help us take things less personally.  Here is more on FOG...
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=82926.0

I also wanted to share information on emotional incest because I think this is what she is seeking.  I'm curious if you experienced this as a child particularly when your parents divorced? 
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=274516.0

I also wanted to say that your children, husband and you should be your priority.  Your mother is an adult, her feelings are not yours to manage, her feelings are hers to manage. 

One thing you could think about are boundaries.  I like that you blocked her on your phone when things blew up next time maybe block sooner.  I know this feels "mean" but boundaries are about protecting ourselves not punishing someone else.  By blocking her you protect yourself from verbal abuse and you allow her the opportunity to "self soothe" and get her own emotions under control.

I found when I first discovered BPD that reading about it really helped me get grounded in what BPD is below are a couple of books that you might find helpful.

Stop Walking on Eggshells: Taking Your Life Back When Someone You Care About Has Borderline Personality Disorder by Paul Mason MS, Randi Kreger

Understanding The Borderline Mother: Helping Her Children Transcend The Intense, Unpredictable, And Volatile Relationship by Christine Ann Lawson

Again welcome, I'm glad you found us and decided to jump in and post, know that you are not alone everyone here has someone with BPD or BPD Traits in our lives...we "get it".

Take Care,
Panda39

[Much_confused]

Thank you both for your replies.  This is the first time in my life that I’ve told anyone these things, or even allowed myself to think of them this way, and the validation means a lot.

I have talked to my husband a little bit over the past week or so.  I don’t think he can understand how profound it is for me.  I was looking around on here and found a post about a breakthrough crisis, and I think that’s what’s happening to me.  But to him, it’s just a fight with my mom.  I have asked him not to let her in the house if she comes over and he said he’s not sure he’s comfortable with that — even just to not go to the door if he’s closer, and wait for me to come tell her to leave.  I don’t know how much I can expect from him in dealing with her.  She has always pulled me into her conflict with other people and it has ruined my relationships with a lot of family members.

Which brings me to the question of emotional incest, and yes, I think that has definitely been a defining feature of my relationship with her.  When I was 13, she told me what kinds of pornography my dad liked, and that he had affairs with both men and women, and got drunk at home, and forced her to do painful, degrading sexual things.  I believed her and my relationship with my dad has been estranged since then.  I almost want to throw up now, considering the possibility that it t wasn’t true and I’ve missed all these years with my dad. She still involves me in every conflict that she has.  I’m the person that she turns to when she has something to say about someone that no one else will accept because it’s ridiculous and selfish.  For a long time, I thought she just couldn’t get along with people, but my eyes are being opened to the possibility that it’s much more than that.

Thank you so much for the resources.  I’ve ordered the books and read the links, and am very encouraged to finally be able to make some sense out of this.

[formflier]

Much_confused,

You have found a group of people that "get's it".  We've got you on this!

I would advise you to realize that "other people's lightbulbs" aren't going to  "turn on" at the same time that yours do.  So...at the same time that you expect (and should get) your hubby's support, please realize that he is at a much different place than you are (and traveling at a different speed).

While you are still "getting up to speed" on different resources, perhaps try some bite sized conversations with your hubby. 

How do you think your hubby would describe his relationship with your Mom?  How do you think he would describe your relationship with your Mom?

Be kind to yourself.  Extra self care during times of sorting things out is definitely called for!

Best,

FF

[Harri]

Hi and welcome!  I too am glad you found us.  Things can get better for you as you work your way through all the realizations and discoveries that are happening and may continue to happen.

I was looking around on here and found a post about a breakthrough crisis, and I think that’s what’s happening to me.

Could you have read it in our Survivor's Guide?  Having a break through crisis can be tough and I would recommend taking things slowly, like Methuen said, as you adjust to your 'new' reality.   Keeping the steps in mind and reading them over and over can be quite helpful.

I feel confused and overwhelmed, and like I desperately need to protect my kids.  I want to act rationally and come up with reasonable boundaries, but I’m finding it impossible to do that with her constantly pressuring me to accept her version of events and do what she wants me to. I blocked her from contacting me, but am afraid that it’s only a matter of time before she shows up on my front porch and tries to force a confrontation.

I think there are two separate, though related, issues here.  One is establishing boundaries which should be made with your personal values and safety for you and your family in mind.  The other is how she continues with her behaviors.  

What have you tried in terms of boundaries with your mom?  What does not allowing her in your home mean for you?

[Much_confused]

Remembering that our lightbulbs don’t turn on at the same time helps.  I’ve had some talks with my husband and he is supportive, but just doesn’t have any experience with anything like this.  I think he would describe his relationship with my mom as good.  He loves her and looks out for her because she’s my mom.  I think he would describe my relationship with her as good but stressful.  He sees me put a lot of energy into making sure she’s ok and avoiding things I know will make her upset or critical.

I did read about the breakthrough crisis in the Survivor’s Guide. I read it in tears because it describes exactly what I’m feeling right now. I’ve avoided thinking about my childhood for a very long time, but have always felt like there was something about myself that I don’t understand.  My mom’s behavior toward my kids caused a flood of memories and now I know what that thing is.  

 I really haven’t ever tried to implement boundaries with my mom before.  My childhood was very difficult, but I got married at 18 and moved away.  We have lived far away from her for 19 years, but she moved to our city fairly recently.

What does not being allowed in my house mean to her?  She’s said that I’m going to be mad at her forever, that I hate her and never want to see her again. It’s wrong, unfair, and ungrateful of me.  She will see it as abandonment.  I don’t think she will tolerate it for very long.  She will either try to force herself back in, or she will make a suicide threat and check herself into the hospital, which she did twice when I was a teenager.

What does not allowing her in my home  mean to me?  Honestly, I’m very conflicted. The thought of it brings relief and peace, but also fear and sadness.  It would probably mean being cut off from my extended family.  My connection to them has always been through her.  It would damage my relationship with my sister, who is several years younger and the “all good” child.  I had a few mini panic attacks today, worrying about her being alone.  I was tempted to reach out and offer reassurance, but that’s what I did before we went to visit my in-laws, and there was another blow up a few hours later, so I’m thinking that I might have to be very stringent on enforcement, and it’s probably going to be extra rough for a while.  I was reading about Extinction Bursts on here today, though, which also helps some with the fear.  If she could possibly have a burst of over the top behavior and then eventually adjust, that feels more manageable to me.

You all are so wonderful for talking to me on New Year’s Eve.  Thank you so much, I can’t tell you what a relief this has been.

[formflier]

I really haven’t ever tried to implement boundaries with my mom before.  

https://bpdfamily.com/content/setting-boundaries

https://bpdfamily.com/parenting/06.htm

Listen, there are many more threads on boundaries I could link to.  Also several books.

At the heart of boundaries are YOUR VALUES...

You will also get a sense that boundaries are not (or should not be) done "quickly" or "impulsively".

Given that you have a fresh "event" and that you've never done boundaries before (most of us here hadn't until we got here)...I'm wondering how it would feel if you "tried on" a few extra words with your boundary about "Mom not being in your house."

What if you added?..."for now..."

You need space...you deserve space...you need to process, think and learn things that are going to be new and likely "feel odd" to you.  Many feelings to process.

Let's suppose you added "for now" to your boundary and we helped you clarify the values (and valuable things) you are trying to protect and honor.  

How does that feel?

Best,

FF

[Much_confused]

Yes, it does help to remember that I’m not making and don’t have to make any permanent decisions right now. She messaged me today wanting to meet up and finally exchange Christmas gifts and I got an almost instant tension headache when I read it.  I don’t want to see her yet, but I think if I ignore the message, she’ll just show up at my house.  She’s trying really hard to come across as reasonable right now - I’m being histrionic and she’s being so patient. She needs to change the narrative of what happened, I think, and I don’t feel very confident that I could stand up to the manipulation if I started dialog with her again.

[formflier]

OK...probably best not to ignore.

"Got your message.  Let me discuss with (insert hubby name) and we'll get back to you in a couple days"

Does that seem fair/wise?  I get the feeling you need space to think.  Perhaps your hubby can make the call for you?

Thoughts?

Best,

FF

[formflier]

Much Confused

Often I have found "that a good offense" is better than a "good defense".

So taking the initiative away from a pwBPD and setting your own schedule is often better than letting them sort it out.

So my suggestion is a way to "take back the initiative".

I hope that makes sense. 

Best,

FF

[Methuen]

I really like this by FF:

"Got your message.  Let me discuss with (insert hubby name) and we'll get back to you in a couple days"

...and this:

So taking the initiative away from a pwBPD and setting your own schedule is often better than letting them sort it out.

It's the same advice I got from my T a while back...but have kind of forgotton about.  It slows things down, and gives you some space, and some control back.  I have to remember that one for myself next time I need it.  Our mother's have us so trained to "react", but FF's suggestion is a really great idea.

Onto that advice, I would add this:  that when you do meet up with your mother again, that you "set it up" so that another adult is there as well.  It could be H, or a friend.  She is unlikely to create chaos or misbehave if someone else is there.  It will help to keep you feeling emotionally safe after recent events, and will keep her behavior in check.

[formflier]

It slows things down, and gives you some space, and some control back. 

 

And...most importantly, how do most people "feel" when they have control back? 

  so that another adult is there as well.   or a friend.  

She is unlikely to create chaos or misbehave if someone else is there.

I love this and I would add some important nuance.

This friend should be someone very familiar to you, yet unfamiliar to the pwBPD.  Perhaps not a stranger...but unfamiliar.

BPD is an disorder of "intimate relations", so introducing someone "not intimate" sort of short circuits things.

And...if the Mom makes an issue of "private time" (only intimate people)

kick it down the road

"Oh..absolutely.  This is just how it worked out this time.  You know life is so busy, it's hard to fit everything in.  Let's get something on the calendar for just us...soon."

Then...you meet at a public place for "just us" time, then you have something at your home but with "friends there".

Next thing you know it's been 6 months and you haven't "been alone" with her in your house.

What do you think?

Best,

FF

[Methuen]

I also love this:

Then...you meet at a public place for "just us" time, then you have something at your home but with "friends there".

Really good practical do-able suggestions FF  

I get the feeling it may all be overwhelming right now Much_Confused.  It will get better, and when it does, you'll look back on this experience, and you'll see how far you've come, and you'll feel better.  It does get better.

In the meantime, remember to s-l-o-w  things d-o-w-n, and breathe  As FF said:

"Got your message.  Let me discuss with (insert hubby name) and we'll get back to you in a couple days"

You've got this, and we've got this with you.

Keep us posted on how it evolves.

[Much_confused]

Thanks for the helpful advice. My husband ended up meeting her with the Christmas gifts.  He said she seemed really sad, which makes me feel really sad, too.  She sent me a message to thank me for the gifts. I responded briefly, and so far, I think that’s ok. 

Is this something I should go to therapy for?  Will a therapist work with me on dealing with someone else’s illness?  I guess I probably have my own issues that a therapist could help me with - I suddenly feel like I can’t trust my own memories anymore. As I’ve been remembering my childhood, I have realized that there are many things that I don’t remember directly.  I just remember her telling me about it.  Like she said that my dad would get drunk and scream obscene abuse at her.  I don’t remember him doing that, ever, and now I’m not sure what to believe about it.

[formflier]

Have you ever done therapy before? 

One of the biggest blessings in  my life is a long term relationship with a PhD level psychologist. 

She educates, encourages, corrects, is a sounding board and place where I can go when the crazy shows up.

The important thing is to find a good relationship.  Since there is BPD in the mix I would encourage you to find someone with more experience.  PDs aren't a place for "beginners". (IMO)

Best,

FF

[Harri]

Is this something I should go to therapy for?  Will a therapist work with me on dealing with someone else’s illness?  I guess I probably have my own issues that a therapist could help me with - I suddenly feel like I can’t trust my own memories anymore. As I’ve been remembering my childhood, I have realized that there are many things that I don’t remember directly.  I just remember her telling me about it.  Like she said that my dad would get drunk and scream obscene abuse at her.  I don’t remember him doing that, ever, and now I’m not sure what to believe about it.

Therapy can help a great deal.  A therapist can help you learn strategies to help deal with your mom.  More importantly, IMO, as an adult child of, we were conditioned to take care of our moms and can have some pretty intense reactions when trying to differentiate.  It is very common for us to question what we thought was true growing up and sometimes memories can flood back.  It is a struggle and lots of triggers can come up as well as memories.  So for us adult kids of, the process is a lot more complicated than just learning the techniques and tools we talk about here and that can be learned in therapy.  Having as much support to get through all of that can be very helpful.

IMO, therapy is worth the time, money and effort.   

[Methuen]

Is this something I should go to therapy for?  Will a therapist work with me on dealing with someone else’s illness?

Well yes, it is your mother's illness.  But the fact is, our mother's helped raise us.  So that BPD influence is probably going to have an impact on many of us.  For some of us, it will be profound.  For others of us, less so, although it's still going to be there.  I think it makes sense some of us might need some expertise to deal with the fallouts of that impact.  And that's ok!  I'm grateful there are people trained to help me navigate the fallout of my feelings, and help me learn strategies that work with my mom's dysfunctional behavior.  My mom is never going to be the mother I thought I had, or wanted.  But getting help from a T is helping me lessen the blow, deal with the pain and disappointment, and manage my relationship with her (which is difficult) for the remainder of her lifespan.

IMO T has worked for me together with this site/board, and my own work outside of T and this site.  This triad has given me hope, helped me to take back some control, and helped me to become positive again.  Before, I was frustrated, angry,  negative, and sometimes hopeless and helpless.  For me, T has made a significant difference, and works in conjuction with this site and my own work. 

You'll figure out what will work best for you.  If you decide to try a T, just know that finding a T that you connect with can be like shopping for shoes.  Sometimes you need to try on more than 1 pair to get the right fit. 

[Much_confused]

These are helpful things to think about regarding therapy. I’ve had therapy in the past, to help cope with my husband’s combat deployment and my sister’s death but it’s been several years.  Finding one with experience with personality disorders sounds like a good idea.
Do your mom’s know that you go to therapy and why you go? 

My first book came in the mail today,, “I Hate You, Don’t Leave Me”, and “Stop Walking on Eggshells” is still on the way.  I was able to find Understanding the Borderline Mother on audio through the library, and that was really helpful.  Binged the whole thing in 2 listens, and will probably listen again.  I’d really like to have that one in print, but the price is really high. I unblocked her from my phone  today and she sent me a funny poem out of the book my kids gave her for Christmas, so hopefully that’s a good sign.  I’m planning to ask her to meet us at a playground or her favorite pizza place at a time when my husband can come sometime next week. 

Can’t thank you all enough for helping me through this!  Having some simple, practical steps to take made a huge difference.  So glad I found this forum.