A warning to heed: every recycle is worse

[NotAHero]

 This has been a very constant dynamic: Every recycle is worse. They get more emboldened that you recycled with them after their last act. They will keep all the bad acts from before and add to it, push it further.

 We need to learn from our mistakes and others - read the boards. Do not recycle, it is never going to be better. Cut the cord.

[drumdog4M]

That's an important warning, NotAHero. It's consistent with my experience thus far. Even behavior short of recycles seems to escalate each time a boundary is violated, but we continue to love them and reward or at least tolerate the behavior.

Thank you.

[SinisterComplex]

I will chime in here. First my thoughts are if you have weak boundaries and you show that you will forgive and put up with S behavior then you will never break the cycle. But I digress...

Please see this resource for a reference on this topic.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=95860.0

Cheers and best wishes to all!

-SC-

[PeteWitsend]

This has been a very constant dynamic: Every recycle is worse. They get more emboldened that you recycled with them after their last act. They will keep all the bad acts from before and add to it, push it further.

 We need to learn from our mistakes and others - read the boards. Do not recycle, it is never going to be better. Cut the cord.

This is all very true.

It seems to me that pwBPD - consciously or unconsciously - are keeping score and calculating what they can and can't get away with.

The non-disordered people in these relationships, wearing their hearts on their sleeves, are looking for emotional connections and love; but these are just not reciprocated.  Even if the pwBPD uses the right words, they are not feeling the same way as the Non, just parroting back what they think the Non wants to hear.

If they succeed in "recycling" a r/s, it just validates in their mind that the Non will tolerate everything they did up to that point. 

Like Lucy pulling the football from Charlie Brown, over and over. 

[NotAHero]

This is all very true.

It seems to me that pwBPD - consciously or unconsciously - are keeping score and calculating what they can and can't get away with.

The non-disordered people in these relationships, wearing their hearts on their sleeves, are looking for emotional connections and love; but these are just not reciprocated.  Even if the pwBPD uses the right words, they are not feeling the same way as the Non, just parroting back what they think the Non wants to hear.

If they succeed in "recycling" a r/s, it just validates in their mind that the Non will tolerate everything they did up to that point. 

Like Lucy pulling the football from Charlie Brown, over and over. 

 That is correct. If you couldn’t tolerate the act that caused the last breakup and you take them back, not only they will repeat it but they will do worse. That’s why you can’t recycle with them.

[once removed]

We need to learn from our mistakes

it stands to reason that there are no happily ever after stories on a breakup board

what this is evidence of is not necessarily that "every recycle is worse", or "it is never going to be better" (thats black and white thinking). if we need to learn from our mistakes, we shouldnt draw the wrong conclusions, or at least at the expense of important ones.

to learn from our mistakes, we have to make them in the first place. one of the primary reasons that we (or anyone) recycle a relationship is because we arent emotionally done with it, or ready to let go of it. that can be a powerful motivator. is it a mistake? maybe.

when a relationship is dysfunctional (multiple recycles is self evidence of dysfunction; one or two is normal), it becomes a taller and taller order to "make it function". with each recycle, trust is diminished, resentment builds, fears grow, people dig into, rather than change, what theyre doing. all while expecting the other person to change. thats the nature of dysfunction.

certainly, it is a mistake to continue on that path.

[NotAHero]

it stands to reason that there are no happily ever after stories on a breakup board

what this is evidence of is not necessarily that "every recycle is worse", or "it is never going to be better" (thats black and white thinking). if we need to learn from our mistakes, we shouldnt draw the wrong conclusions, or at least at the expense of important ones.

to learn from our mistakes, we have to make them in the first place. one of the primary reasons that we (or anyone) recycle a relationship is because we arent emotionally done with it, or ready to let go of it. that can be a powerful motivator. is it a mistake? maybe.

when a relationship is dysfunctional (multiple recycles is self evidence of dysfunction; one or two is normal), it becomes a taller and taller order to "make it function". with each recycle, trust is diminished, resentment builds, fears grow, people dig into, rather than change, what theyre doing. all while expecting the other person to change. thats the nature of dysfunction.

certainly, it is a mistake to continue on that path.

 I have yet to come across a relationship story with a BPD that recycled many times and ended “happy ever after”. Not even in the boards. That’s why I had to draw the conclusion that it’s a mistake in hopes of avoiding and helping other avoid that painful path.  I have only been here for 7 months or so though.

[WhatToDo47]

Thank you for the warning and I agree. I think the only way it works out is if you have such low expectations and so little boundaries and self respect that you let yourself get walked all over and abused. I suppose maybe if the pwBPD is super high functioning and self aware and one of the few that stick to DBT therapy then maybe. My wife used to be super self aware and stuck to therapy for years and then just dropped it because she "changed her mind," decided she loved me but wasn't in love with me, and that I was controlling and abusive because I wanted her to get help and take care of herself.

I challenge anyone to find a story where it truly worked out in any sense of what would be considered a healthy and normal relationship. That's not meant to be cruel to pwBPD, but I don't think we should normalize abuse just because the other person has a mental illness. It's just not safe to be in relationships with pwBPD, a lesson I learned the very hard way. And thank God we didn't have any kids. It's not fair to bring kids into the world in a situation where they are going to be abused and also at genetic risk for pwBPD, the onus of responsiblity for this is on the pwBPD not on the nons who didn't know about BPD or the extent of the abuse and craziness.

For all the posters here who do have kids with their pwBPD, I have so much empathy for you because I don't know how you do it. It's so messed up that some pwBPD basically trick the non into having kids and then use them to further abuse and manipulate and then the non is stuck in the horrible situation of staying for the kids or leaving but knowing the kids will suffer. My heart goes out to all of you, I was almost in that situation and probably would be right now if it wasn't for this site and all of you.

Sorry if this sounds jaded or judgmental, I'm just sick of all of us kind, loving, genuine people being abused over and over and over again.

Notahero, what inspired you to start this thread?

[NotAHero]

Thank you for the warning and I agree. I think the only way it works out is if you have such low expectations and so little boundaries and self respect that you let yourself get walked all over and abused. I suppose maybe if the pwBPD is super high functioning and self aware and one of the few that stick to DBT therapy then maybe. My wife used to be super self aware and stuck to therapy for years and then just dropped it because she "changed her mind," decided she loved me but wasn't in love with me, and that I was controlling and abusive because I wanted her to get help and take care of herself.

I challenge anyone to find a story where it truly worked out in any sense of what would be considered a healthy and normal relationship. That's not meant to be cruel to pwBPD, but I don't think we should normalize abuse just because the other person has a mental illness. It's just not safe to be in relationships with pwBPD, a lesson I learned the very hard way. And thank God we didn't have any kids. It's not fair to bring kids into the world in a situation where they are going to be abused and also at genetic risk for pwBPD, the onus of responsiblity for this is on the pwBPD not on the nons who didn't know about BPD or the extent of the abuse and craziness.

For all the posters here who do have kids with their pwBPD, I have so much empathy for you because I don't know how you do it. It's so messed up that some pwBPD basically trick the non into having kids and then use them to further abuse and manipulate and then the non is stuck in the horrible situation of staying for the kids or leaving but knowing the kids will suffer. My heart goes out to all of you, I was almost in that situation and probably would be right now if it wasn't for this site and all of you.

Sorry if this sounds jaded or judgmental, I'm just sick of all of us kind, loving, genuine people being abused over and over and over again.

Notahero, what inspired you to start this thread?

 The last recycle inspired me. I responded to you in the other post with more details. 

 To be clear here on the detaching board we are dealing with BPDs who are not willing to do work on themselves. There are better stories on the other boards. Not all BPDs are the same. I think in my case my pwBPD has an NPD comorbidity going. There is no chance in hell she will change until maybe she is older and can no longer thunder strike men with her looks. Until then I am leaving her to her own misery and only protecting my son.

[WhatToDo47]

The last recycle inspired me. I responded to you in the other post with more details. 

 To be clear here on the detaching board we are dealing with BPDs who are not willing to do work on themselves. There are better stories on the other boards. Not all BPDs are the same. I think in my case my pwBPD has an NPD comorbidity going. There is no chance in hell she will change until maybe she is older and can no longer thunder strike men with her looks. Until then I am leaving her to her own misery and only protecting my son.

I'm glad you are doing the right thing and protecting your son. I'll check out your post on the other thread. Mine definitely has an NPD comorbidity as well. It's sad how they destroy their lives. I know that all pwBPD are different, but I've also been told by 2 therapists with over 25 years experience each, one of which was her therapist for 2 years before she left, and the other a marriage counselor who specializes in personality disorders, and also by a psychiatrist with 25+ years experience as well that in the end the disorder almost always (not always, but almost always) wins out. Just depends on how long and if the partner is willing to give chance after chance.

I hope that this is wrong but my experience and every expert I've spoken to has told me the same thing. They are not capable of healthy, stable, long term relationships. Whether it's 5 months, 5 years, 25 years, it will eventually fall apart.

[NotAHero]

I'm glad you are doing the right thing and protecting your son. I'll check out your post on the other thread. Mine definitely has an NPD comorbidity as well. It's sad how they destroy their lives. I know that all pwBPD are different, but I've also been told by 2 therapists with over 25 years experience each, one of which was her therapist for 2 years before she left, and the other a marriage counselor who specializes in personality disorders, and also by a psychiatrist with 25+ years experience as well that in the end the disorder almost always (not always, but almost always) wins out. Just depends on how long and if the partner is willing to give chance after chance.

I hope that this is wrong but my experience and every expert I've spoken to has told me the same thing. They are not capable of healthy, stable, long term relationships. Whether it's 5 months, 5 years, 25 years, it will eventually fall apart.

 I want to thank you for that information. An affirmation from 2 experienced therapists to what I believed provides good affirmation. My therapist whom I started seeing at first to save the relationship kept telling me to leave just a few weeks after therapy.

[WhatToDo47]

I want to thank you for that information. An affirmation from 2 experienced therapists to what I believed provides good affirmation. My therapist whom I started seeing at first to save the relationship kept telling me to leave just a few weeks after therapy.

I'm so glad that it helps! I am a medical professional myself, and so I have A LOT of friends who are doctors, therapists, psychiatrists, etc. I have asked probably 20 different medical professionals about this. I never lead with "she has BPD," I just tell them the story as objectively as I can, and let them teach me about BPD like a newbie. They all tell me to get away from her, not to get my hopes up for recovery, and that even if she recovers she will still likely be dysfunctional in relationships. I sure wish they taught me about BPD and personality disorders during my education, but they didn't.

I read in a post on this site a while back that someone's pwPWD had been in DBT for years, and they were technically considered a success because they didn't self harm anymore, but they still cheated, lied, spent all the money, manipulated, etc. It's so sad but that's reality. The hardest part, I think, for me has been accepting that this really does exist and that these people really don't want to or have the self insight and emotional capacity to change. You wouldn't expect a diabetic to be able to eat donuts all day, even on insulin. You shouldn't expect a pwBPD to have healthy relationships that last forever, even on DBT.

The experts I've spoken with said that DBT can work, but that it takes years, and that most pwBPD quit long before it really makes a lasting impact. Also that the outcomes of the DBT studies are things like self harm, not things like functional, healthy relationships.

Hope this helps somehow. What else did your therapist say? Anything else you'd like to ask?

[NotAHero]

I'm so glad that it helps! I am a medical professional myself, and so I have A LOT of friends who are doctors, therapists, psychiatrists, etc. I have asked probably 20 different medical professionals about this. I never lead with "she has BPD," I just tell them the story as objectively as I can, and let them teach me about BPD like a newbie. They all tell me to get away from her, not to get my hopes up for recovery, and that even if she recovers she will still likely be dysfunctional in relationships. I sure wish they taught me about BPD and personality disorders during my education, but they didn't.

I read in a post on this site a while back that someone's pwPWD had been in DBT for years, and they were technically considered a success because they didn't self harm anymore, but they still cheated, lied, spent all the money, manipulated, etc. It's so sad but that's reality. The hardest part, I think, for me has been accepting that this really does exist and that these people really don't want to or have the self insight and emotional capacity to change. You wouldn't expect a diabetic to be able to eat donuts all day, even on insulin. You shouldn't expect a pwBPD to have healthy relationships that last forever, even on DBT.

The experts I've spoken with said that DBT can work, but that it takes years, and that most pwBPD quit long before it really makes a lasting impact. Also that the outcomes of the DBT studies are things like self harm, not things like functional, healthy relationships.

Hope this helps somehow. What else did your therapist say? Anything else you'd like to ask?

 I happen to be a healthcare professional myself and have a few friends in the professional medical field. I did know about BPD before I met her but somehow allowed myself to be duped. Now that I experienced the dysfunction first hand I know better than to ignore red flags in the future. It is much more intense when you experience it than when you read about it. There are things I didn’t know until the last 2 years too. For example I didn’t know that the “love tests” will continue to escalate no matter how you react to them. I also didn’t know that even with therapy they do not become loving partners, just less harmful. I think it was “stop caretaking NPD and BPD” book is where I read that if you are looking for empathetic loving partner then you are looking in the wrong place. I have come to learn that first hand too. They can’t form real bonds, those only exist on the surface. 

 She will ignore red flags in a random guy but create delusional negative ideation about you once you are painted black.

 I even told her when we first met, a quote from Belzac “when women love is they will forgive our transgressions even our crimes. When women don’t love us they will not see the good in us even our virtues”. Of course that was during the mirroring and idealizing phase…

 Now anything I say is like talking to a wall. In my case, she never ever stopped recycling me even as she got involved with others sex was always on the table. I finally learned to cut her off, removed her from social media, stopped talking to her about anything but the essentials about our child.

 I realized that this is the only way for her to move on because their world is in the here and now. Out of sight out of mind. The same tools they use to torture us with, learn them and use them to distance yourself.

 As for if I have any questions, not really but I do enjoy what you right.  That affirmation that it’s hopeless, even that I heard it in a book, was still useful because it’s from first hand experience and everyday therapists.

 My therapist only encourages me to stay away and cut all unnecessary ties.

[drumdog4M]

WTD47 & Hero,

I just woke in the middle of the night longing for my ex. It happens more often when my defenses are down and I don't have the business of the day to distract me. Reading what you both wrote helped get me grounded again. I too struggle with the myth that she will suddenly get better and could be a good partner to someone, even if not me, but that I will have missed the chance to be with my "soulmate" if only I'd hung in there longer and loved her more. I know it's the addiction lying to me and giving me some form of amnesia.

I can tell you that my ex was in the process of a DBT course for either a year or 18 months when I met her and continued weekly therapy with a DBT trained therapist thereafter -- during the whole three plus years I knew her. As noted before, I didn't realize that it had anything to do with BPD but did understand that it was related to reducing self-harm and controlling emotions. She told me she suffered from Major Depressive Disorder, which is true and was on antidepressants, mood stabilizers, and sometimes anti-anxiety medication. I had only a vague idea what BPD was and certainly did not connect the dots until later. That's a different story.

The point I wanted to share is that, even with DBT, she struggled. There was less self-harm at least as far as I was aware. But the emotional volatility persisted. DBT builds various distress tolerance, communication, and coping skills. It is a powerful tool, but what I experienced is that when she was emotionally dysregulated, she would not use the skills. When she didn't use the skills, many of the associated BPD behaviors came back depending on how triggered she was.

On one occasion when I was not with her, she was staring at herself in the mirror reportedly became dissociated, smashed the mirror and then used a shard to cut herself across the chest quite badly. I don't know how many stitches it required, but a lot, and she has a hell of a scar (which she one naively asked what should she tell people when she takes her shirt off -- I guess not realizing that it might upset me that she would be doing that in front of someone else besides me or a medical professional -- silly naive me). She checked herself into a psych ward for a week after that incident. After we broke up this last time in January, she cut herself pretty seriously too on her arms and legs to "dull the emotional pain." This was after a long course of DBT.

DBT is wonderful and seems to be among the few effective therapies. Based on my experience, however, I do not believe it is cure. Rather, it can help lessen symptoms if one uses it. It offers a powerful set of healthy coping skills, but it seems like the emotional dysregulation and associated thought processes persist. I think the goal of Marsha Linnehan, the creator was largely to decrease suicide attempts and self-harm and build "a life worth living." I'm not sure it purports to enable pwBPD to have healthy stable interpersonal relationships, racially romantic ones which are among the most emotionally charged.

I'm certainly not an expert, but my little bit of insight seems consistent with your comments. As one of the ambassadors here noted in a post, studies suggest that the brains of pwBPD show differences in size and activity from normal brains. That doesn't just go away because we love them so hard or they took a course. Can the symptoms improve? Yes. Can they remit to the point that the person might no longer meet enough criteria to no longer meet the criteria in the DSM-V? Yes.

But being a stable, consistent, loving, empathetic, and interdependent partner over the course of a long-term relationship with the typical emotional and externals pressures entailed, I am sad to say that it seems like the odds are heavily against it.

Although I believe pwBPD are worthy of love and empathy (notwithstanding their behavior), I also have read and been told by my T. that the normal partner likely will have to adjust their expectations in terms of how healthy and reciprocal a relationship is realistic. My T. flat out asked me if I want to be her caregiver for the course of the relationship. And if I did, that I needed to ask myself why (suggesting that it was my co-dependent tendencies, anxious attachment, etc. thinking it was my responsibility or even within my power to "save" her). This comment was quite some time ago, in the middle of the highs of the relationship, so I sort of dismissed what she said. I now know how correct she was. I wish I'd taken her words to heart at that point. But I had to experience it firsthand over and over before the reality of a relationship started to hit home.

Hang in there everyone!

[drumdog4M]

One correction to my post, the word "racially" was supposed to be "particularly."

One comment as well, WTD47, wrote "The hardest part, I think, for me has been accepting that this really does exist and that these people really don't want to or have the self insight and emotional capacity to change."

I believe the lack of will to change may well be the case for some, especially those who have not sought and committed to treatment. But I think the lack of capacity to change should not be underestimated. I believe my ex-pwBPD did want to change and worked to but only could to a certain degree. The disorder was always there waiting to be triggered, then she was either able to manage it or not, depending on a variety of factors. Put another way, it seems like BPD wan be managed and mitigated with very hard work and maybe go into remission, but it does not seem to go away.

I'd welcome any others' insight into this. It does help me let go when I am able to remind myself that it was not within my capacity to make her better (and not my responsibility either), and that she is unlikely to become consistently loving and stable after she meets the next "right" guy.

[NotAHero]

One correction to my post, the word "racially" was supposed to be "particularly."

One comment as well, WTD47, wrote "The hardest part, I think, for me has been accepting that this really does exist and that these people really don't want to or have the self insight and emotional capacity to change."

I believe the lack of will to change may well be the case for some, especially those who have not sought and committed to treatment. But I think the lack of capacity to change should not be underestimated. I believe my ex-pwBPD did want to change and worked to but only could to a certain degree. The disorder was always there waiting to be triggered, then she was either able to manage it or not, depending on a variety of factors. Put another way, it seems like BPD wan be managed and mitigated with very hard work and maybe go into remission, but it does not seem to go away.

I'd welcome any others' insight into this. It does help me let go when I am able to remind myself that it was not within my capacity to make her better (and not my responsibility either), and that she is unlikely to become consistently loving and stable after she meets the next "right" guy.

 From what I have seen and learned, the “burn out” or the instability subsides in some cases when they are older. Reasons proposed are that they get burnt out by their own behavior, others suggest they can no longer charm and bait new targets.

 In my pwBPD case I strongly believe she has a narcissism comorbidity. There was no direct self body harm - although on occasion she would hit herself screaming she wants somebody to just love her…whatever that means.

 That didn’t make things any better. Narcissism can develop with BPD as a protection mechanism for their fragile ego. What your therapist asked you was on point. Do you want to caretake her neglecting your own needs and fulfillment and why? One of the books I read put it more bluntly “do you want to spend the rest of your life caretaking a mentally I’ll person for an illness you had no hand in causing ?”

 Another point to keep in mind is that their emotional attachment even to you doesn’t have much to do with you as a person. Look at their new attachments, you will realize it is and always will be about HER.

 Even with the deepest understanding your emotions will take time to catch up to your mental understanding. You just have to trust that NOTHING GOOD will come out of trying to reconnect. Every bad behavior they did before they will do again because you reconnecting means there was no consequences for it. If you wanted out once why would you want back in to get burnt again ? That includes replacements and discard that can happen any time. Not a good way to live.

 Doesn’t matter what other perks they have, if the BPD was willing to put you through discard once there is nothing left there.

 

[drumdog4M]

Thanks for those additional points. I'm coming to realize that most of the "love" she showed to me was a facade, an illusion of love designed to elicit love to me to fill the emotional void due to her lack of self, and thus lack of an ability for self-love. It was all designed to feed her emotions. She told me when drunk texting several weeks ago that she never acted "selflessly" except when she had helped paint my home and care for my pets. When sober, I asked her what she meant, but she just said she wasn't making sense. I think she had unwittingly led the facade down. She was the perfect vehicle for milking love and emotion from me in abundance. 

When I look back objectively and intellectually, besides the sex, the "love" she gave was the bare minimum to keep priming the pump. I really supplied the emotional fuel for the relationship and did the repair work. She just judged whether it was enough. And when not, she would say we needed to "take a step back" and then she'd look elsewhere for a hit.

You are also absolutely correct that my intellect is far ahead of my emotions with regard to getting over her and healing. But having the understanding of what was actually happening, helps me lay the foundation for our emotions to catch up to the distorted reality in which we were living. SC posted about "Stockholm syndrome" in another thread. I feel like I was brainwashed and allowed myself to be because she drew out my neurotransmitters of love.

I'm not resentful (though I was I were) and genuinely do love her. I also do not think it's productive to vilify pwBPD even if much of their behavior is inexcusable. That being said, I keep envisioning her as a succubus, emotional vampire, or emotional blackhole. In reality, though she's just a person with a disorder who has struggled to survive and dull her pain in destructive ways since she hit puberty. With work, we can escape and recover. Sadly they have to live with themselves and thus seek escape through so many of the behaviors that wreak havoc on themselves and the lives of those who love them.

[WhatToDo47]

Such a great conversation and thread. I completely agree with all of the above. I think we shouldn't vilify them, but we sure can and should vilify the abusive behavior. I had very similar, almost identical experiences to everything described above.

It helps a lot to read about someone who has experience with a pwBPD that has had some DBT therapy, and the anecdote lines up with what I've been told and read about what it really does.

My expwBPD had a lot of self awareness when calm and her needs were being met, but as soon as she was lonely, hungry, tired, bored, etc she lost it. Especially when we she was triggered, which was almost always at the end, she forgot her coping skills or just chose not to use them. She called her therapist when she was going to leave me, and he strongly advised her against it. He didn't have to take her call, he was on vacation. The end result was that she left anyways and split me and him black.

I think when they are triggered there seems to be a tipping point where they just can't control themselves anymore. Mine definitely has at least an NPD comorbidity. So does her mom, and I can tell you her mom is worse than her in many ways. My ex claimed that her mom had mellowed out with age, but she was still awful in her behavior, and so was her mom's mom, so I think it mellows out in some ways but certain traits get worse, especially the paranoia and lack of trust because they've been through the cycle so many times.

It is interesting how many of us here are well educated professionals, and that you really can't understand what BPD really looks and feels like in a romantic context until you've lived it.

I never realized how selfish my pwBPD is until me and my T went line by line through some of her texts that I thought were "nice." He pointed out how every line was selfish, about her and her pain, no empathy or true love. Sad.

[WhatToDo47]

And I’m glad you mentioned the escalating love tests. I was subjected to so many of these. I didn’t recognize it at the time but I do now. Her words were saying she will never abandon, leave me, etc but her actions were constant manufactured, painful, dangerous, and unnecessary love tests.

Even when she left moved across the country (I flew there a few weeks after and came to see her begging her to come back), blocked me for months, filed for divorce, etc, when she did unblock me, she berated me that she “thought I would chase her” “felt lonely and hurt” when she left and even “lonelier and more hurt” that I didn’t chase her. She blocked me, moved in with another man, called the police for false DV, had her sister’s husband threaten me never to contact me again. How the hell was I supposed to “chase her” without ending up in jail or worse?

The early love tests were pretty easy to stand by her, even when they involved threats of or actual attempts at suicide, because she was always SO grateful and loving when I “saved” her.

Since then she has given me many chances to “prove my love,” (I’m just supposed to magically know how to do that). But if I “pass” this test, what’s next? The tests always always escalated. I know her mom did this to her dad and he is a shell of a man, and her mom is just as nasty and abusive as ever.

I really hope and pray she gets the help she needs, but one thing I have learned is that I don’t need to be saved, can’t save anyone, and don’t want anyone in my life who needs this level of saving.

Sorry for the rant, but I so much identify with the escalating love tests.,

[NotAHero]

And I’m glad you mentioned the escalating love tests. I was subjected to so many of these. I didn’t recognize it at the time but I do now. Her words were saying she will never abandon, leave me, etc but her actions were constant manufactured, painful, dangerous, and unnecessary love tests.

Even when she left moved across the country (I flew there a few weeks after and came to see her begging her to come back), blocked me for months, filed for divorce, etc, when she did unblock me, she berated me that she “thought I would chase her” “felt lonely and hurt” when she left and even “lonelier and more hurt” that I didn’t chase her. She blocked me, moved in with another man, called the police for false DV, had her sister’s husband threaten me never to contact me again. How the hell was I supposed to “chase her” without ending up in jail or worse?

The early love tests were pretty easy to stand by her, even when they involved threats of or actual attempts at suicide, because she was always SO grateful and loving when I “saved” her.

Since then she has given me many chances to “prove my love,” (I’m just supposed to magically know how to do that). But if I “pass” this test, what’s next? The tests always always escalated. I know her mom did this to her dad and he is a shell of a man, and her mom is just as nasty and abusive as ever.

I really hope and pray she gets the help she needs, but one thing I have learned is that I don’t need to be saved, can’t save anyone, and don’t want anyone in my life who needs this level of saving.

Sorry for the rant, but I so much identify with the escalating love tests.,

 When she left me on my birthday to go live with “friends “ for absolutely no reason whatsoever, she came back a few days after for sex. She was blaming me for not showing up to their door step to beg her back or even drag her from her hair back home ….

 I told her I would never force someone to be with me, she was mad. Like I said she always recycled me but she kept escalating and blaming me for not “begging her back”. Before that love tests were always there and escalating from “easy mode “ couple years ago to a level no sane or healthy person would put up with.

  That’s the seesaw accelerating and I don’t think there was anything me, you or a world class therapist could of done.  If you don’t react to the love test she will escalate. If you do then she will blame you. If you leave they blame you and if you stay they will escalate.  I literally tried everything including leaving for a few days. It only delays the cycle but then they will take revenge for the “abandonment”  later on when they secure you again.

 Trust me my friend there was NOTHING you could of done to change the outcome. The similarity in the stories and how we acted differently yet ended with the same outcome confirms that.

[WhatToDo47]

When she left me on my birthday to go live with “friends “ for absolutely no reason whatsoever, she came back a few days after for sex. She was blaming me for not showing up to their door step to beg her back or even drag her from her hair back home ….

 I told her I would never force someone to be with me, she was mad. Like I said she always recycled me but she kept escalating and blaming me for not “begging her back”. Before that love tests were always there and escalating from “easy mode “ couple years ago to a level no sane or healthy person would put up with.

  That’s the seesaw accelerating and I don’t think there was anything me, you or a world class therapist could of done.  If you don’t react to the love test she will escalate. If you do then she will blame you. If you leave they blame you and if you stay they will escalate.  I literally tried everything including leaving for a few days. It only delays the cycle but then they will take revenge for the “abandonment”  later on when they secure you again.

 Trust me my friend there was NOTHING you could of done to change the outcome. The similarity in the stories and how we acted differently yet ended with the same outcome confirms that.

Sorry for the slow reply but wow your post was so helpful to me. I don't know what else to add other than you perfectly summed up the last 6 years of my life. Thank you truly for that clarity. We both deserve better and I think we are both at the point where staying in would be a danger to our safety, physical, mental, etc. The love tests turn into a form of emotional abuse.

There's nothing you could have done to change the outcome either.