we need to talk about my future daughter-in-law...

[CassandraComplex]

This is my first post. I'm so grateful you're all here & I'm so sorry we all need to be here.

My husband & I both have an extensive history with cluster B's. His mother has NPD & we suffered targeted abuse for ten years before painfully having to go no contact. We learned lessons. We don't play reindeer games with cluster B's.

My own mother, I've recently realized, has BPD. Additionally she had me in the 10th grade & I remained her only child. I grew up rough & have cPTSD from both childhood trauma & the poor choices I made as a 17 year old on my own.

The last 5 years have been insane for myself & our family. Mostly for me though, as I was very sick for a couple years & almost died while being medically gaslit. Five hospital stays, two surgery's, countless invasive medical test. It really triggered my trauma.

During this time, my son brought home his new girlfriend. He'd met her about a week after his ex of 6 yrs broke up w/him. The whole family loved his ex & felt as if we'd lost a daughter. We figured the new girlfriend was a rebound & we were a bit worried for my son but we didn't hold this against the new girlfriend, we felt worried for her too if anything.

The day she arrived, I had a little welcome gift for her. Just some lotion & candles & little things like that. She'd just finished her masters degree & her own mother died & she wasn't able to walk for graduation. So, our family had a small graduation party. My son made her favorite cake. She made fun of him, in a not so nice way, when he tried to ice her cake. I put up a few small decorations & we cooked out. Nothing big, we tried to be welcoming.

At some point that day, she made a point of telling me that she never got along with her boyfriends mothers and she 'just has mother issues'. That evening my husband found her sitting on the stairs eavesdropping and crying.

During her stay many odd things/behaviors happened. She'd storm through the house in a mood and take up all the oxygen. She wanted us to know we'd done something to upset her but she never told us what. She was moody and passive aggressive.

She had odd late night talks with me that I feel like are lucid dreams. I'd be on the sofa half asleep and she'd come with something to talk about. I'd invited her to watch a show with me but she usually refused. I do remember some things she said & they were very strange. For example she told me that she appreciated the house I built for my children & that when she inherited it she was going to paint it blue. Many times she cried.

This was terrifying to me as a mother. She was not well & this was not normal behavior. Especially for early on in a relationship. I understand people go through hard times but that's not usually the time you go to meet your new boyfriends parents for the first time.

They had only known each other 5 months & lockdown had started & it had been a rebound. I figured as soon as the world opened my son would move on. I felt for the young woman but I was also terrified for my son. I know too well what it means to suffer life with a bpd.

My own mother marginalized my step-siblings out of my step-dad's life. She damaged me in numerous ways as her favorite person. There was violence with her emotional outburst. She's driven everyone away.

I held it together until they left and then I had a breakdown with my husband. No one believed me that it was a bad as I said, but it's actually worse.

We had what I thought were decent holidays together. It wasn't the warmth & happiness that it had always been but I thought maybe we just needed time to develop a relationship. Now I think she forced herself to do these holidays because she didn't feel secure with my son yet.

As soon as they bought a house together, she started in hard again. My son asked me to go help & we talked about me staying a week. It takes me 2 days to drive each way, I don't want to stay for less time than I drive & I can't go often because of money. This was only the 2nd time I'd been to "their" place.

I arrived on Friday early evening. We had what I thought was a decent day Saturday working on their new home. I offered to take my son to get a BBQ and her to pick out new curtains. At one point I told her I'd like to get to know her more, if we could talk on the phone sometimes & go shopping for curtains together. She again told me she 'just has mother issues'.

That evening I took them to dinner. When we got back to their apartment (they still had their apartment & hadn't yet moved into their new house) she had my son upstairs for a long time with the door closed. I didn't think much of it, couples can have privacy.

I found out the next day that she had been telling my son that she didn't realize I was staying for the week & that I couldn't be there because she had to work. I wasn't even going to be there during the day, I was going to be working on their new house for them. Painting my son's office (with paint they picked out, I wasn't trying to decorate for them of anything). Refinishing some furniture they'd wanted done.

My son came to me and told me they'd had a miscommunication & asked if it would be okay if they brought a mattress over from the apartment & I could just stay in the new house. Alone. With no curtains.

I went into traumatic shock. I said something reasonable & went into a room to paint. I closed the door & put on some music. I knew I needed to be alone or I was going to explode. I didn't have my car there & I couldn't leave.

My son came in & I told him I really needed to be alone. I guess he felt so uncomfortable that he couldn't stand his feelings (kinda like getting into this relationship because he couldn't stand the feelings from his last gf leaving him). He pushed it & ended up painting too. Then he decided that his girlfriend needed to join us too. He said, "See, isn't this fun!"
it was surreal.

I felt myself starting to panic. I went outside & called my husband to help me think straight. I asked my son to drive me back to his apartment because I needed some medicine. As soon as we got in the car I exploded. I've never in my life behaved like this around my son. I'd been holding in all my concerns about this girl & I just lost it.

I told him I was going to a nearby hotel. That I needed to calm down & we could talk the next day. I texted them both to let them know that I wasn't giving them the silent treatment but that I couldn't have a productive conversation right now & we could talk the next day.

This time, she refused to respect my boundaries. She kept texting over & over wanting to talk & I kept politely replying that I was okay but I needed to calm down. Eventually, under the guise of being "worried about me" she called my bpd mother at 12:30 to tell her she thought I was suicidal (no history).

At this point, with my PTSD, I started having a panic attack. Now my mother wanted me to take care of her needs, now I had to talk her off the ceiling from calling my son & making a very bad situation far worse, now I needed to explain to her why I hadn't "needed her right away and called".

I couldn't take anymore. I was in a worse state the following day than I had been earlier. My son stopped by & I vomited some words. We were going to try to all sit down & talk but his gf got mad when my mother told her my son had met her a week after his ex broke up with him.

I left. I took the night & finally had a small amount of sleep after 48 hours of serious stress. I called her & we had, what I thought was a decent enough conversation. I hadn't said anything in front of her. I told my son they weren't even engaged yet & I had to tell him what he was getting himself into. I realize now this was a mistake. I wasn't thinking clearly. I felt cornered, like a wild animal. Every time I'd told them I needed space, they'd refused & made it worse.

We agreed to work on it & I felt we were honest with each other. I was naive enough to think it may have even been a good thing. It was the first woman to woman conversation we'd had. I'd rather bond over something happier but maybe this had helped?

We had two phone conversations alone in the following 4 months. My son asked her to marry him a month after this all went down. I tried to look happy when they told me. I was quite raw for awhile. Especially because my son went to a wedding of one of her friends rather than seeing a band we both like for my 50th birthday. I have never celebrated my birthday other than a small cake at home w/family. I usually don't care but this year had meant something.

The 1st phone conversation was okay-ish. We spoke about her bridal shower & she gave me her aunt's # because her aunt & I were going to plan it. The 2nd I'd asked about Thanksgiving. My son had seemed excited for us all to come 2 months earlier. This time I thought I'd plan with her so there was no miscommunication. She acted weird, said she didn't want to cook a big meal, talked about sleeping spaces & how she'd need to get a futon, told me we couldn't have alcohol in the house (I don't drink).

This drinking thing got weird. My husband likes to make craft cocktails with various whiskey's. It's his hobby. But he generally has a 2 finger pour on Friday & Saturday, that's it/ He doesn't have a drinking issue. I explained this to her because I thought maybe she was talking about my husband. I also told her we had no problem not having alcohol at their house.

My son had told me they weren't having alcohol at the wedding because it cost a lot & they both don't drink. So, I'd said he should bring mixers & tell people to bring a flask. I was partly serious but partly joking because I don't care if they have alcohol. If I'd known it was a more serious issue, I would never have said such a thing. I think she's twisted this.

I received a text the following day saying that "in light of what happened last summer...we'd need to all stay in a hotel because she needed more time...". This was signed by her & my son. I felt like the whole family was being punished because they failed to communicate, came up with the worst solution possible, & refused to give me space when I repeatedly asked for it not to mention the crazy of calling my mother. But she's going to punish me for that? And drag the kid into it?

That meant both my husband & I but also his little brother who my son adores. So, we had a family meeting & all agreed we no longer wanted to go. We don't have the money for a hotel & we didn't feel welcome & wanted.

I sent them a text that we all approved saying "We had a family meeting & decided we wouldn't feel welcome & wanted so we feel it's best we don't come up there anymore. We hope you have a nice holiday in your new house".

She stopped talking to me. My son said nothing. Eventually my son agreed to attend family therapy with me. The hope was that we could bring her in & reset this situation. My son & I are doing better somewhat. But over the course of therapy I've confirmed my high suspicion that she has bpd. I haven't even spoken to her in 8 months but it's been one petty grievance after another.

This has caused me so much distress. I've moved through all the phases. From how dare you too I can't believe this is happening to acceptance. Now I'm at tactics for survival & I could use some advice.

I've had to shift my entire vision of the future. Grandkids will be used as a weapon so I don't plan on being in their lives. Family vacations that won't happen. Holidays. This year she wouldn't come for Christmas & wouldn't let my son come on Christmas so he came for a few days early. On Christmas it was just hubby & I & little brother. We ordered Chinese food & went to the museum. My parents weren't invited because I can't take anymore. I just wanted a quiet & different non Christmas like day. We actually had fun.

My family is broken. Last week the therapist helped us address navigating a dysfunctional family. My son says I've been negative for the last couple years. He never even called when I was so sick & he offers no empathy for what I've been through the last couple years. I'm like, "YEAH I've been negative, it's been hell". I also had a breast cancer scare right after the serious illness, moved, renovated myself, ended up in court...& a lot more in the last few years.

For awhile I felt I may be to blame. But recently I discovered she's reading my son therapy books in bed at night, got mad at him for going to therapy w/me 4x's a month (I pay) & w/her only 2x's (he pays). She refuses to join therapy with us & will only talk with me & my husband or a friend. She's paranoid the therapist would be bias. I offered to pay for a session or two for her to go alone but she refuses.

At this point I feel I need to change my goal, which had been an intact happy family, to the way you cope with a bpd. Go as close to no contact as possible. She has targeted me, it's making me sick, as long as I'm in the picture she's continue to find new grievances no matter how well I walk on eggshells.

This started in on me on day one. Day one.

I've tried. At this point I'm scared my son will resent me so it's time to move on. I'm very scared for what he's walking into & the worst thing would be losing all contact with him & he feel alone. I want to be there for him when the poo-poo hits the fan. I want him to know he's always welcome at home & keep working on our relationship over the phone, keep it light. Currently he text pictures a few times a week. I just want to cut my losses before we're totally no-contact. I want him to know my heart & my door are always open to him. Without explanation or shame. Just love.

I know that's where she wants to take this but I figure my son & I can remove the fuel from the fire. He understands why I can't be around her & it's easier for everyone. He does love me & I know he very much wants to keep us all in his life. I want to talk to him about making a promise that we will always talk, that she should have no more reason to complain about me so to please not engage in bashing as I will also not.

I'm seeing the therapist alone this week & I'm going to ask her advice about basically saying that we'll only see her if it's unavoidable & then we'll be civil. Otherwise, no contact. Anything I do will be wrong but I figure this way, I'm doing the least things wrong. The best chance of maintaining some relationship w/my son & hoping "this too shall pass".

I have no hope that therapy can fix this long term. After dealing with enough cluster B's I see it as an uncomfortable temporary fix. The thought of attending therapy with her now makes me panic because I know she may pretend everything is okay but then do the whole cycle again & I'll have to live through this pain again & risk totally losing my son again. I also think I need to get into therapy for the PTDS & I can't afford two different therapist. This is all more than I can handle at the moment.

I lost a decade of my life to trying to work things out with my husbands mother. It's been a lifetime of my own mother. I don't have much life left & I want to know what it is to live without this abuse.

I've never seen a mil/dil situation escalate this quickly. The day I met her. The day they bought their house. She clearly wants me gone & my son is under her spell. This is the greatest pain I have ever known. It's hurting everyone & I refuse to be that poor grannie who loses all dignity by dancing around on eggshells so she can serve as free babysitting or see her grandchildren for an hour a year.

Does anyone have thoughts? Anyone else decide early on to stop the madness? Were you successful in maintaining a relationship with your child? I want to do what's best for my child, family, and myself.

Thank you if you made it this far.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Pook075]

First off, welcome to the site and thank you for sharing.  I could tell by your story that writing that out was therapeutic, which I can certainly relate to.  I'm so sorry you're going thru this.  In fact, I can relate to most of your story with a BPD ex and a BPD daughter.  My kid also jumped into marriage and it was pretty much a nightmare for everyone involved- they made it just over 18 months before it all blew up.  I was honestly impressed it made it that long, because the abuse (both ways) was horrible.

My situation was obviously different since it was my kid who had BPD.  And for reference, she grew up resenting me/my ex just as much as you're resented now.  But she's still my baby so of course I love her unconditionally...I just hate her every now and then as well.  With counseling, she did mature and learn to handle her emotions much better though.  However, the relationships she burned with other family, I don't know if those ever get repaired.

My only advice to you is to focus on the good you see in your daughter in law and try to be supportive, even if it's through your son.  Don't burn that bridge completely!  NC with her is fine if that's what you need, but remember that this is a mental illness that she has only limited control over.  It stems from her not loving herself in a healthy way and lashing out at you because that's probably what she did with past relationships.  In other words, it's not a "you thing".  It could be any other mom and it would likely play out exactly the same way.

Also, please read the help sections of this website and I recommend "Stop Walking on Eggshells, 3rd Edition".  There's some major insight throughout that book.

One last thing, it may sound like I'm defending my daughter and BPD, and I guess in a way I am.  But that's not the point I was trying to make.  Your relationship can be saved in time and it will come through your son saying, "I need my parents more in my life."  That only happens if you continue to work on the relationship and stay positive...don't bad-mouth your in-law to your son because that will bite you.  I realize that its not fair and this is the very last thing you'd want in life, but we have to work with the hand we're dealt. 

Again, I am so sorry you're going through this- feel free to ask me anything and I'll answer as honestly as possible.

[CassandraComplex]

Thank you for being here. Yes, it did help to write it all out somewhere. To have people who understand bear witness and to organize it in my head. It's been a lot with this coinciding with my illness, ptsd, and menopause.

I'm sorry your daughter and yourself are suffering from bpd. I hope I didn't sound as if I lacked empath or hope. I just need to put up a boundary for my own sanity & the rest of the family. I feel as if removing myself will give her no more fuel for the fire to drive a wedge between my son and I.

I've ordered the book, thank you!
 
I'm terrified for my son & I'm just trying to do what I think will be most likely to keep our communication open with the least damage. I don't plan on calling it "no contact" with my son. I'm meeting with the therapist alone tomorrow to talk with her about how close she thinks I can safely go to no-contact without causing more damage.

Thank you for validating that it's not me. It would have happened with anyone. I've had to pass through shock and shame and panic. That's part of why I don't want to keep trying. I know the cycle of abuse & I don't want to be abused. I'm exhausted & not well. I can't take it. If something changes, we can re-evaluate but for now, I need to stop being their trauma-bond scapegoat.

Hopefully the therapist can help me find a way to set this boundary without burning a bridge.

[Pook075]

Thank you for being here. Yes, it did help to write it all out somewhere. To have people who understand bear witness and to organize it in my head. It's been a lot with this coinciding with my illness, ptsd, and menopause.

I'm sorry your daughter and yourself are suffering from bpd. I hope I didn't sound as if I lacked empath or hope. I just need to put up a boundary for my own sanity & the rest of the family. I feel as if removing myself will give her no more fuel for the fire to drive a wedge between my son and I.

I've ordered the book, thank you!
 
I'm terrified for my son & I'm just trying to do what I think will be most likely to keep our communication open with the least damage. I don't plan on calling it "no contact" with my son. I'm meeting with the therapist alone tomorrow to talk with her about how close she thinks I can safely go to no-contact without causing more damage.

Thank you for validating that it's not me. It would have happened with anyone. I've had to pass through shock and shame and panic. That's part of why I don't want to keep trying. I know the cycle of abuse & I don't want to be abused. I'm exhausted & not well. I can't take it. If something changes, we can re-evaluate but for now, I need to stop being their trauma-bond scapegoat.

Hopefully the therapist can help me find a way to set this boundary without burning a bridge.

Yes, boundaries are critical- you get to decide what behaviors you accept or reject.  It's ALWAYS your choice. 

Removing yourself from the situation will probably confirm your daughter-in-law's fear that she can't have a relationship with you, and she'll point that out to your son whenever the topic comes up.  It's so important for you to support him though and avoid putting her down- come from a place of empathy and clearly state your intentions- you want a healthy relationship when she's ready for that, but she has to respect some of your boundaries as well. 

Depending on where she's at in her mental health journey, it could play out a number of different ways.  But you need to reinforce how much you love your son at every opportunity and support him no matter what.  That's the key to everything you eventually want to achieve.  If she's bad for him, then let him figure that out on his own. 

I was in this exact same situation with my BPD wife and my mom telling me to divorce very early on- I chose my wife.  It wasn't until decades later that I realized I should have listened to my mother.  We had no idea of my wife's mental health though or that my daughter would inherit that as well.

[CassandraComplex]

I'm deeply curious how your relationship with you mom is now. That's something I think about a lot. If he ever realizes, what things might be like for our mother/child relationship and his relationship with the family. I'm trying very hard to garner empathy for my son from the other family members, who are so in their own pain and/or confusion that it's hard.
But I'm the mom. I love my kids unconditionally, even when I don't like their choices.

I'm also a human being & this (so far) is the most painful experience I have ever had to live through. Every instinct in your body wants to pull your child away from danger the way you used to pull their hand away from a hot stove. But you can't. I've had to learn that & grieve.

But I hang my hope on the phrase "this too shall pass" and hope that someday we'll have those happy family moments again. Hikes, museums, camping, bonfires, board games...

I hope so much things improve before I die. I can't imagine leaving this world so sad and feeling like such a flawed failure of a person & mother.

[Pook075]

I'm deeply curious how your relationship with you mom is now. That's something I think about a lot. If he ever realizes, what things might be like for our mother/child relationship and his relationship with the family. I'm trying very hard to garner empathy for my son from the other family members, who are so in their own pain and/or confusion that it's hard.
But I'm the mom. I love my kids unconditionally, even when I don't like their choices.

I'm also a human being & this (so far) is the most painful experience I have ever had to live through. Every instinct in your body wants to pull your child away from danger the way you used to pull their hand away from a hot stove. But you can't. I've had to learn that & grieve.

But I hang my hope on the phrase "this too shall pass" and hope that someday we'll have those happy family moments again. Hikes, museums, camping, bonfires, board games...

I hope so much things improve before I die. I can't imagine leaving this world so sad and feeling like such a flawed failure of a person & mother.

Hey Cassandra.  Unfortunately, my mom passed a few years ago and I miss her deeply.  But we had a good relationship throughout my life.  She stayed mad at my wife on and off throughout our 24 year marriage but also loved her as well, and in time they became somewhat close.  Never best friends, but they got along pretty well. 

I do agree with you, this too shall pass in time, and I think you'll get there whether their relationship lasts or not.  Just keep supporting your son however you can and let him know that he's loved.  He will figure this out and find a happy balance in time, and he certainly sees the red flags in his relationship as well.