Help me out with this (DBT)

[heronbird]

Does anyone know, in DBT would they tell a person that if they were feeling anxious they should go out and buy something or do something to cheer them up.

My dd is anxious/grumpy because she is 40 weeks pregnant and baby has not come (common with everyone) so she decides that she will get £500 hair extensions done to help her get through the next two weeks.

Personally, I think it makes more sense to learn that life has its disappointments and its best to tolerate those horrible feelings. She was cross with me when I sensitivity suggested this. She said its the only good thing she learnt in DBT. She said I should agree because Im always saying how good DBT is. I did say you need to use your own common sense too.

She does rigid thinking so she couldnt hear anything else.

The hairdresser wouldnt do them because she said when you have the baby, you loose hair and it could all fall out if she has it done.

Dd was very angry/upset, then after about 5 minutes, she snapped out of it and said she would just go and get a nice hair doo done for £25 (bit different) she said she was fine and over it now, she also said that tomorrow she will probably be saying to me what a stupid idea it was.

Very changeable, I havent seen that for ages in her.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[griz]

I think the hair extensions would be self soothing however it would not be "wise mind".  A new hair do might be wise mind.  That being said, when I was pregnant wit DD they had to induce me in my 42 week... . I don't think I was in wise mind from week 30 on.

Can't wait to hear when the baby comes.

Griz

[heronbird]

Wise mind, hmmmm that does not sound logical to me. Its like a toddler who has not come to terms with disappointment in some ways. I mean, imagine if she went shopping everytime things didnt work out. She wanted to get hair extensions even though they cost far too much, she didnt care about anything else.

Id say she needs to learn to face up to disappointments in life. in this situation, it worked out well. We kept trying to tell her but she wasnt having any of it.

Yes, its getting really exciting now, baby is due today, no sign yet of him, shame for her. I was crying by 40 weeks, she has done better than me. Ill let you know when it happens 

[vivekananda]

If we are feeling low, then it is important for us to recognise that and do what we need to lift our spirits. We need to be in touch with ourselves and able to practise self compassion. We need to learn to recognise our own emotional needs and meet them ourselves.

What it seems your dd has done is taken a very superficial view of this. Buying something brings a temporary feeling of happiness. DBT is about a pwBPD learning the skills to achieve a deep inner ability to live a happy life.

If we are anxious, we should recognise that and do what we can to soothe that anxiety. Spending money on ourselves does not do that. If we are anxious we need to reassure ourselves that everything is ok, that we are safe. That's why we focus on radical acceptance and so forth. These concepts teach us how to care for ourselves.

Your dd has translated what she was taught to suit herself.

Vivek    

[jellibeans]

hmmm... . what if you are buying something to pamper yourself... . like a hair cut or a pedicure or some flowers at the supermarket? I don't know if I agree that buying things in general is wrong. Buying extension seems really expensive so I can see that might be wrong if I could not afford it.

For the past few months I have made it a habit to buy myself some flower at the supermarket ... . I have done this repeatedly... . it is a small cost and I get to look at them all week. Is this wrong? I am not sure I understand... . is it that she is anxious and that is her motivation which makes it wrong?

[peaceandhope]

Heronbird,

I noticed with my dd she always wants to go shopping and buy buy buy things all the time. Once she buys it either she does  not use them at all or uses it only once.

Maybe its a type of impulse dysregulation and whenever a thought enters their mind and they have to act on it irrationally.

Iam glad your dd did not spend all that money on expensive extenders( By the way there are cheap clip on hair extenders available too.

What a wierd impossible disorder  

[vivekananda]

There is nothing wrong with buying something to cheer you up... . but it is a temporary fix if you are looking for a life worth living... . this sounds really blunt, and I don't want it to be though... . I love the pants I am wearing now which I recently bought, I feel good in them.

My sis, bless her, has so many   she is almost BPD. She loves to buy things and goes into raptures about how happy she is and how because she now owns this thing (the last thing that did this was an electric appliance into which you measured ingredients and it then cooked them... . it costs $AU 2,000 - a bit more in US). The reality is she is deeply out of synch with the world, and while very able and 'normal' on the surface, in reality she is deeply dissatisfied with her life (but I bet she'd disagree with me... . )... .

To be able to live a life worth living means more than being able to have the latest appliance, car, hairdo, shoes or hat. These are but superficial things that can please us for a bit. Real happiness is an inner feeling that comes from deep within.

If we are anxious, buying something won't fix that. If we are depressed, buying something won't fix that. If our relationships don't work, buying something. If we have difficulty controlling our emotions... .

DBT aims to teach us how to be more at ease within our lives... . more happy and at ease with ourselves through mindfulness, relationship training etc. it doesn't extoll spending money.

I think you have something there peaceandhope, regarding impulse disregulation. Spending more than we can afford is an at risk behaviour, no?

Viv   

[griz]

I agree that if we Always you buying things as a quick fix it doesn't really solve the issue at hand but I believe that there are times when all we need is a quick fix.  Maybe we are just feeling low or maybe we need to just pamper ourselves a little bit. 

jellibeans:  I love the idea of buying flowers to have around all week to look at.  I love flowers but I mostly love them in my garden.  Recently I received a small bonus from my boss for a job well done on a project.  I have debt to pay for medical bills that are outstanding but I went to the local home depot and purchased wild flower seeds and mulch and perennials and a few pots to put in my garden and on my patio.  This does make me feel good.

Maybe heronbird, your daughter just needed to feel pretty.  Extentions might be over the top but I can understand unless this is something she does all the time to make herself feel better everytime her emotions are out of wack. I remember what I felt like at the end of my pregnancy with DD.  I had gained 50 lbs, I was exhausted and had spent 5 months on bed rest. I remember my dh having someone come to the house to give me a manicure and pedicure. My non BPD daughter was recently diagnosed with a condition that we know there will be no cure for.  It is not life threatening but she will have to deal with it for the rest of her life.  A pretty big pill to swallow when you are only 23.  She cried her eyes out for a few days, talked to her T and then did what she called "retail therapy".  She went to the mall and bought herself a few outfits, a Michael Kors bag and some new sandals.  She knows this won't heal her condition but it lifted her spirits enough to just make her feel a little better.

I am glad she scaled down from the extentions but it sounds like she just needed a pick me up.

Griz

[heronbird]

Hi all,

Yes thats so true, all the comments are true, and I know that too. I guess one of the issues was that dd could not hear me or her dh or her dad trying to give her advice she was fixed and had to buy them, her argument was she is 9 months pregnant and cant wait and its getting her down, haha,

What a novelty, my dd having to wait for something

She had no money so she was begging us to lend it to her, she always pays us back so we try to help her. I dont know, I thought maybe it may be nice for her to have lovely hair after the baby, I know I didnt care what I looked like after my babies but not everyone is like that.

She was clever with her words to me, saying that I always say how good DBT is and this is the one thing she has learnt from DBT and Im knocking it. I realised at that point there is nothing I could say and this was not going anywhere.

Viv, I think she got confused there as she only did DBT half heartedly   and it was 2 years ago. I need to talk to her when she is in the right frame of mind.

So, its interesting that dd has been so well with BPD for the last 7 months, but it still comes out in her personality, such a shame.

[heronbird]

Oh, just thought, I bought kittens to help me, and they did, If Im sad they put a smile on my face when I see them. I love them and they love me, they were money well spent and I didnt really have the money. haha

Also, when I was 9 months preg I was in such a state, I was even crying. So dd is doing ok really, in some ways better than me. We have to expect blips.

In the end dd went and got a massage, her hair and nails done and felt better, that was a lot cheaper so she is not in debt now.

[Reality]

heronbird,

Your daughter took such good care of herself.  Quite brilliant of her to find some strategies to make herself feel better, more herself.  I remember your daughter loves to have her hair done. Interesting that you think she is doing better than you were doing at this stage in the pregnancy. 

I am so happy for you, your daughter, her husband and all the family.

Keep in touch,

Reality

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[heronbird]

Yes it is interesting how well she is doing. And she used to look anorexic, so painfully skinny and now she looks so healthy. Because she has been so much more content she eats properly. Its lovely to see her like this.