A letter to the new victim

[bettermentofsociety]

Hi --first post to this site.  Learned a lot of about BPD since April of this year, before that pretty limited knowledge.  

Below is what I am thinking of sending to her new man.

Advice?  Much of what I've read says don't send it but why not help another person avoid pain?  It is therapy for me to write it.  Thoughts?


signed, a  co-dependent fixer type.

-------------------------------------------

Hello ,

You don’t know me, and don’t think of this as creepy or anything it’s just meant to inform a fellow human being of impending danger.    Simply a small part to help stop a real issue from continuing in this country,  and that is dealing with mental illness.  We must try to spread the word and perhaps effect change to stop those who abuse others because of mental illness.

Before you delete this, hear me out.  First, what I ask you to do is simply spend a few hours researching one specific disorder.  It’s called Borderline Personality Disorder or BPD.   Read about it.  Go to reputable sites all over the internet including, nimh dot nih dot gov and mayoclinic dot com.  After that go to some other sites like bpdfamily dot com and read about others’ experiences. These sites will describe the illness and the potential hell that you are in for if you continue to be in the relationship you are in with the woman you just met.  I know, I speak from experience…she lied, cheated on and manipulated me for over three years, as she did with all of her exes.  The lies and manipulations  were so good and the hiding of information and actions so masterful, that I thought I was wrong.  Wrong many times.  Well after some work at finding the truth, I realized I was not.  

While she never disclosed to me that she was diagnosed with BPD, I believe she has this dreaded illness and that she is a deeply disordered person. You don't have to be a physician to know the signs of a heart attack, you simply have to recognize the symptoms... pains in chest, tingling in arms, shortness of breath etc.  And according to the DSM she has many symptoms.  But labels aside, and regardless of diagnosis--bad behavior is bad behavior.

I don’t want to spoil any fun you are having, but before you get in too deep, research it and heed the information.  GET OUT NOW!  You will save yourself a ton of abuse, heartache, headaches and money if you do.  This may sound like sour grapes, but it’s not it’s truly just trying to stop her from devouring yet another soul.

Right now I know that this is the last thing you want to hear.  You are in the throes of a new  relationship with a beautiful woman who is unlike many others.  But she is like a Siren calling to the sailors of the sea—their song said ready to love but doom is coming.  As you may have noticed, she is beautiful, sexy, charming, alluring and probably treats you great.   She may goof around and seem perfectly normal but really she has the emotional maturity of a kid.   She is a master at keeping the tell-tale signs of this disorder a secret from those that she chooses for them not to know.  She reserves the abuse for a special few.  You are next in line.

Right now things are riding on clouds.  Things will change.  Perhaps, you may not even notice anything wrong yet, or you might have seen some red  flags already (don’t ignore those, they are your instincts telling you something is not right), or you may have just experienced joy, excitement and fun so far, just wait that will change.  It may not be today or tomorrow, or next month, or even in a few months, but it will.  This is part of her plan.  Trust me,  I know.  I was with her (off and on) almost up until you met her, but near the end  I was just trying to get her help.  She refuses.  She cannot acknowledge anything is wrong.   It’s called lack of insight.     Her family cannot discuss it.  They say it’s none of their business nor is it any of mine.

Now, again, let me be clear I DO NOT want to be with her romantically anymore.  Obviously,  I did at many times in the past, as we broke up and got back together many, many times, but that was before I even knew the details behind BPD.   It is a sick and heartbreaking illness that she suffers from the likes of which you have never seen.  The illness is both caused by brain chemistry and environment --mostly by childhood abuse and abandonment.  

You may be tempted to go to her with this information.  She will just deny it and try to convince you that I am the one who is nuts.  But believe me, it would be best for everyone if you just acted on this information and never let her know, simply back out now while you can. You are only a few weeks in, you can get out now with little to no damage!   I say this because I have been down that road.  The road of sticking around too long.   Her ex tried to warn me very early on in my relationship with her in a few different ways-- not about BPD specifically, because he probably never heard of it, but about her lying and manipulative ways.  I ignored him simply thinking he was jealous that I had his ex-woman in my arms at that time.   I believed back then that even if she was those things, I would change her. I would be the hero who could do it. If anyone could I could!  I was so wrong.  And, well, many men think they can change her.  They can’t!  There is no cure.  There is only treatment and it would take years and years of therapy, and even then the prognosis = not good.  I have never approached any of her exes with the fact that she is BPD but now that she attempting to set her hooks into a new victim, I felt obliged to reach out to you. To help you and delay another person's pain.  Maybe she will get help between now and her next victim.

 

You may think that this is weird and you can simply ignore it, delete it and forget it if you’d like but it will be a very, very rocky road ahead for you if you do.  It will be a really crappy, highly addictive relationship full of heartache and emotional abuse.  You cannot imagine the relationship darkness you are spiriling toward and the emotional danger you are in.  I regret little in this life, but romatically I wish I had the last 3 years back.  Again, there is no cure and she will deny anything is wrong.   Good luck.

[DreamFlyer99]

Hi --first post to this site. 


signed, a  co-dependent fixer type.

-------------------------------------------

First off,    This is a great place to work through the aftermath of the storm!

My favorite bit of your whole message: "signed, a co-dependent fixer type"   Watch it, I resemble that remark!

I've been with my uBPDh (undiagnosed BPD husband, in case you haven't read up on all the shortcuts around here) for nearly 37 years. And I didn't understand what I was dealing with till the last 2, honestly. I just figured I didn't understand and made excuses for his behavior. He's mostly exhibited the traits of being emotionally young, reacting out of old hurt, that sort of stuff, so we have had a lot of good time together as well--guess that's why i'm still in the relationship!

Anyway, I've written many such therapeutic letters to various people, often fully intending to post them online or send them to the person, but in the end that's what they were, therapy for me.

Sounds like you've gotten a lot of reading under your belt already which is great, since you have a clear to you picture of 3 years of your life with this person. Great researching! It will help you see what drew you to the relationship and what kept you there.

I find that many of us NONs are kind hearted people who honestly thought we were doing the right thing in our relationships, then many of us realized, "hey! This is really painful!" Some of us removed ourselves from the situation, and some of us stay and work hard on making ourselves the best "us" we can be. It's a totally individual decision. Looks like you would be quite at home on the Leaving: Detaching from the wounds of a failed BPD relationship board,https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=8.0 where lots of people are working through the pain that shows so clearly in your letter.

I gotta--I just gotta--point out your words:

Her ex tried to warn me very early on in my relationship with her in a few different ways-- not about BPD specifically, because he probably never heard of it, but about her lying and manipulative ways.  I ignored him

... . um, I think you may have answered your own question here about whether or not to send the email. Yet in the end, I suppose that's your choice too. I suppose you could just sit on the letter for a while and see how you feel when it's not so fresh.

Yunno, that would probably be a great question to post on the Leaving board, actually.

Meanwhile, give us a chance to get to know you better--what makes you say you're co-dependent? did you realize you are in this relationship or before? Do you think you have something in your past that made it easy to get involved in the r/s? I know I grew up with a mother who probably was BPD, so I was pretty unprepared to stand up for myself in marriage. (But things have been a-changin'!)

ANYway, FTBoS, welcome again to the bpdfamily site, it's full of awesomeness for the road trip to healing.

[Undone123]

Hi --first post to this site.  Learned a lot of about BPD since April of this year, before that pretty limited knowledge. 

Below is what I am thinking of sending to her new man.

Advice?  Much of what I've read says don't send it but why not help another person avoid pain?  It is therapy for me to write it.  Thoughts?


signed, a  co-dependent fixer type.

-------------------------------------------

Hello ,

You don’t know me, and don’t think of this as creepy or anything it’s just meant to inform a fellow human being of impending danger.    Simply a small part to help stop a real issue from continuing in this country,  and that is dealing with mental illness.  We must try to spread the word and perhaps effect change to stop those who abuse others because of mental illness.

Before you delete this, hear me out.  First, what I ask you to do is simply spend a few hours researching one specific disorder.  It’s called Borderline Personality Disorder or BPD.   Read about it.  Go to reputable sites all over the internet including, nimh dot nih dot gov and mayoclinic dot com.  After that go to some other sites like bpdfamily dot com and read about others’ experiences. These sites will describe the illness and the potential hell that you are in for if you continue to be in the relationship you are in with the woman you just met.  I know, I speak from experience…she lied, cheated on and manipulated me for over three years, as she did with all of her exes.  The lies and manipulations  were so good and the hiding of information and actions so masterful, that I thought I was wrong.  Wrong many times.  Well after some work at finding the truth, I realized I was not. 

While she never disclosed to me that she was diagnosed with BPD, I believe she has this dreaded illness and that she is a deeply disordered person. You don't have to be a physician to know the signs of a heart attack, you simply have to recognize the symptoms... pains in chest, tingling in arms, shortness of breath etc.  And according to the DSM she has many symptoms.  But labels aside, and regardless of diagnosis--bad behavior is bad behavior.

I don’t want to spoil any fun you are having, but before you get in too deep, research it and heed the information.  GET OUT NOW!  You will save yourself a ton of abuse, heartache, headaches and money if you do.  This may sound like sour grapes, but it’s not it’s truly just trying to stop her from devouring yet another soul.

Right now I know that this is the last thing you want to hear.  You are in the throes of a new  relationship with a beautiful woman who is unlike many others.  But she is like a Siren calling to the sailors of the sea—their song said ready to love but doom is coming.  As you may have noticed, she is beautiful, sexy, charming, alluring and probably treats you great.   She may goof around and seem perfectly normal but really she has the emotional maturity of a kid.   She is a master at keeping the tell-tale signs of this disorder a secret from those that she chooses for them not to know.  She reserves the abuse for a special few.  You are next in line.

Right now things are riding on clouds.  Things will change.  Perhaps, you may not even notice anything wrong yet, or you might have seen some red  flags already (don’t ignore those, they are your instincts telling you something is not right), or you may have just experienced joy, excitement and fun so far, just wait that will change.  It may not be today or tomorrow, or next month, or even in a few months, but it will.  This is part of her plan.  Trust me,  I know.  I was with her (off and on) almost up until you met her, but near the end  I was just trying to get her help.  She refuses.  She cannot acknowledge anything is wrong.   It’s called lack of insight.     Her family cannot discuss it.  They say it’s none of their business nor is it any of mine.

Now, again, let me be clear I DO NOT want to be with her romantically anymore.  Obviously,  I did at many times in the past, as we broke up and got back together many, many times, but that was before I even knew the details behind BPD.   It is a sick and heartbreaking illness that she suffers from the likes of which you have never seen.  The illness is both caused by brain chemistry and environment --mostly by childhood abuse and abandonment. 

You may be tempted to go to her with this information.  She will just deny it and try to convince you that I am the one who is nuts.  But believe me, it would be best for everyone if you just acted on this information and never let her know, simply back out now while you can. You are only a few weeks in, you can get out now with little to no damage!   I say this because I have been down that road.  The road of sticking around too long.   Her ex tried to warn me very early on in my relationship with her in a few different ways-- not about BPD specifically, because he probably never heard of it, but about her lying and manipulative ways.  I ignored him simply thinking he was jealous that I had his ex-woman in my arms at that time.   I believed back then that even if she was those things, I would change her. I would be the hero who could do it. If anyone could I could!  I was so wrong.  And, well, many men think they can change her.  They can’t!  There is no cure.  There is only treatment and it would take years and years of therapy, and even then the prognosis = not good.  I have never approached any of her exes with the fact that she is BPD but now that she attempting to set her hooks into a new victim, I felt obliged to reach out to you. To help you and delay another person's pain.  Maybe she will get help between now and her next victim.

   

You may think that this is weird and you can simply ignore it, delete it and forget it if you’d like but it will be a very, very rocky road ahead for you if you do.  It will be a really crappy, highly addictive relationship full of heartache and emotional abuse.  You cannot imagine the relationship darkness you are spiriling toward and the emotional danger you are in.  I regret little in this life, but romatically I wish I had the last 3 years back.  Again, there is no cure and she will deny anything is wrong.   Good luck.

Mate that has her going to the cops screaming harrassment all over it... . I thought about this loads. If it was me, I wouldn't have listened. Remember her new guy will have heard how terrible you are. Speak to the previous ex!

[Peterpan]

Yes there will be a lot of advice NOT to send this. I advise the same... . please don't send this.

I will speak from my own experience.

I had strong suspicions that mine was also seeing someone else, right under my nose, he kept us both apart as much as he could, and panicked if we came close to talking, I also knew by the way she acted around me that she also suspected he was seeing me too.

I eventually got proof, which left me totally devastated, there was no denying it... . but he still did.

He manipulated me and gaslighted me afterwards for so long that I put it all in the back of my head and convinced myself that I had imagined it all.

I was in such a state after a while that I decided to confront her... . I needed someone to tell me outright that I WASN'T GOING MAD, I needed some answers, but also I knew that she was being reeled in the same as I was,,I like you, thought at least I could try to warn her. I was so low at the time, I knew just how deeply I had been duped, conned and heartbroken.

I was met with total denial from her, she listened to me, was even (apparently sympathetic),told me she felt for me, but that she had no involvement with him and never had.

I knew she had, I knew she was lying, and I also knew that she would still continue to do so.

You see, her other man is now in the pedestal stage... . he is being totally blindsided, manipulated, hoodwinked, and is probably very much in love by now, and he won't want it to stop.

YES, she will deny it all, you will be the jealous obsessed ex who just can't let go. HE WILL BELIEVE HER!

It isn't worth the smear campaign you will inevitably get, it isn't worth trying to save someone else from the torture YOU endured.

If someone had told me all those things about him as I entered my relationship, I would have listened, but it wouldn't have stopped me, I was too hooked by then.

I had actually seen that he was very flirty with particular women before me,,but I still chose to believe that I was the one he was serious about.

I wish I hadn't tried to save her, in fact now, I hope she gets it all, I know he would have lied to her, convinced her I was the crazy ex, jealous, and couldn't let him go. In fact it has been HIM who wouldn't let me move on.

The only thing I can say now is that I hope one day she will WANT to talk to me about it, I know she will never do that though because she lied to me, and that makes her as bad as him.

Your ex's new man will find out for himself in due course adn very probably nothing you say to him will stop him from going through the same stages.

Please, for your own future wellbeing... . don't send it.

Take care of you x

[bettermentofsociety]

Hi --first post to this site. 


signed, a  co-dependent fixer type.

-------------------------------------------

First off,    This is a great place to work through the aftermath of the storm!

My favorite bit of your whole message: "signed, a co-dependent fixer type"   Watch it, I resemble that remark!

I've been with my uBPDh (undiagnosed BPD husband, in case you haven't read up on all the shortcuts around here) for nearly 37 years. And I didn't understand what I was dealing with till the last 2, honestly. I just figured I didn't understand and made excuses for his behavior. He's mostly exhibited the traits of being emotionally young, reacting out of old hurt, that sort of stuff, so we have had a lot of good time together as well--guess that's why i'm still in the relationship!

Anyway, I've written many such therapeutic letters to various people, often fully intending to post them online or send them to the person, but in the end that's what they were, therapy for me.

Sounds like you've gotten a lot of reading under your belt already which is great, since you have a clear to you picture of 3 years of your life with this person. Great researching! It will help you see what drew you to the relationship and what kept you there.

I find that many of us NONs are kind hearted people who honestly thought we were doing the right thing in our relationships, then many of us realized, "hey! This is really painful!" Some of us removed ourselves from the situation, and some of us stay and work hard on making ourselves the best "us" we can be. It's a totally individual decision. Looks like you would be quite at home on the Leaving: Detaching from the wounds of a failed BPD relationship board,https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=8.0 where lots of people are working through the pain that shows so clearly in your letter.

I gotta--I just gotta--point out your words:

Her ex tried to warn me very early on in my relationship with her in a few different ways-- not about BPD specifically, because he probably never heard of it, but about her lying and manipulative ways.  I ignored him

... . um, I think you may have answered your own question here about whether or not to send the email. Yet in the end, I suppose that's your choice too. I suppose you could just sit on the letter for a while and see how you feel when it's not so fresh.

Yunno, that would probably be a great question to post on the Leaving board, actually.

Meanwhile, give us a chance to get to know you better--what makes you say you're co-dependent? did you realize you are in this relationship or before? Do you think you have something in your past that made it easy to get involved in the r/s? I know I grew up with a mother who probably was BPD, so I was pretty unprepared to stand up for myself in marriage. (But things have been a-changin'!)

ANYway, FTBoS, welcome again to the bpdfamily site, it's full of awesomeness for the road trip to healing.

Dreamflyer99-- Thanks so much for the welcome and your kind insightful words.  I think I am codependent to an extent because of a fatherless (died when I was 2) upbringing with an older mother who coped early with booze then with emotional distance.  I was married for 15 years to a Bipolar woman.  Divorced from her, got with two decent women, could not feel "in love" then wound up with the BPD girl.

Good for you for standing up after all these years. I will check out the board your recommend.

[bettermentofsociety]

Mate that has her going to the cops screaming harrassment all over it... . I thought about this loads. If it was me, I wouldn't have listened. Remember her new guy will have heard how terrible you are. Speak to the previous ex![/quote]
Thanks... . Do you think she could file some harrasment if I were simply stating an opinion?  You are right though, i remember her telling me how f**ed up her exes were and how I "understood" her.  I just want to help him avoid the problems, but also I am somewhat jealous because I know he is weathier than I am.  Much shorter but he makes a lot more money.    Stupid , I know.

[bettermentofsociety]

Yes there will be a lot of advice NOT to send this. I advise the same... . please don't send this.

I will speak from my own experience.

I had strong suspicions that mine was also seeing someone else, right under my nose, he kept us both apart as much as he could, and panicked if we came close to talking, I also knew by the way she acted around me that she also suspected he was seeing me too.

I eventually got proof, which left me totally devastated, there was no denying it... . but he still did.

He manipulated me and gaslighted me afterwards for so long that I put it all in the back of my head and convinced myself that I had imagined it all.

I was in such a state after a while that I decided to confront her... . I needed someone to tell me outright that I WASN'T GOING MAD, I needed some answers, but also I knew that she was being reeled in the same as I was,,I like you, thought at least I could try to warn her. I was so low at the time, I knew just how deeply I had been duped, conned and heartbroken.

I was met with total denial from her, she listened to me, was even (apparently sympathetic),told me she felt for me, but that she had no involvement with him and never had.

I knew she had, I knew she was lying, and I also knew that she would still continue to do so.

You see, her other man is now in the pedestal stage... . he is being totally blindsided, manipulated, hoodwinked, and is probably very much in love by now, and he won't want it to stop.

YES, she will deny it all, you will be the jealous obsessed ex who just can't let go. HE WILL BELIEVE HER!

It isn't worth the smear campaign you will inevitably get, it isn't worth trying to save someone else from the torture YOU endured.

If someone had told me all those things about him as I entered my relationship, I would have listened, but it wouldn't have stopped me, I was too hooked by then.

I had actually seen that he was very flirty with particular women before me,,but I still chose to believe that I was the one he was serious about.

I wish I hadn't tried to save her, in fact now, I hope she gets it all, I know he would have lied to her, convinced her I was the crazy ex, jealous, and couldn't let him go. In fact it has been HIM who wouldn't let me move on.

The only thing I can say now is that I hope one day she will WANT to talk to me about it, I know she will never do that though because she lied to me, and that makes her as bad as him.

Your ex's new man will find out for himself in due course adn very probably nothing you say to him will stop him from going through the same stages.

Please, for your own future wellbeing... . don't send it.

Take care of you x

I know.  I want to help him, but at the same time some how sabottage they relationship because I want her to suffer as I have.  But I must know she won't because she can't!

[babyducks]

Hi forthebettermentofsociety,

I just wanted to add my welcome to everyone else's. 

I liked what dreamflyer had to say, there was some good stuff there.

What I have found to be true for me is that when my emotions lead, they lead me astray, especially in my relationship with my pwBPD.  Things just never were or are quite what they seem on the surface.

It would be my suggestion, and its just a suggestion mind you, that you take the energy you poured into your letter and pour it into yourself, and the people who are already here on this site.

And I would suggest that for two reasons,  one is because you and this community deserve that kind of effort and second and most important, is because you and this community can fully appreciate and benefit from it.

babyducks

[Undone123]

Mate that has her going to the cops screaming harrassment all over it... . I thought about this loads. If it was me, I wouldn't have listened. Remember her new guy will have heard how terrible you are. Speak to the previous ex!

Thanks... . Do you think she could file some harrasment if I were simply stating an opinion?  You are right though, i remember her telling me how f**ed up her exes were and how I "understood" her.  I just want to help him avoid the problems, but also I am somewhat jealous because I know he is weathier than I am.  Much shorter but he makes a lot more money.    Stupid , I know.[/quote]
If you are in the UK the police could issue you a harrassment warning, to advise you to stop contacting them... . I''ve never had one. I have had police threats made... . Once a BPD splits they will do anything to get you out of their life. The FOG will remain as long as you keep dancing to their tune... . What ever you say to him, he is unlikely to believe. I definitely would not have listened. I posted a thread before about talking to a previous ex, and there where mixed reactions, some thought it a good idea some a bad. I have had a chat with a previous ex, and it was "nice" to know he suffered like I did. A BPD not in therapy, can not have a functional relationship. If you were abused, this guy is likely to be as well... . So don't sweat it. You will only come over as a jealous possessive ex... . Re-ajust your thinking. I am not a single bit jealous of my exes new men, because I KNOW she's not going to go miraculously to a new man and it be all sunshine and rainbows, when there are god knows how many men before me, who have all been affected by her. There are two I know she left some serious wounds on, and of course me... . When I think of my ex it's not indifference or hate, it is still with love, just a healthier love. Hoping she one day gets help and becomes a happy person. Because there is one thing we MUST remember as nons... .

Although we suffer, and some of us have suffered terribly... . For the BPD every day is an internal Hell.

It took me a long time to listen to the advice of others, and there where times I didn't. I made mistakes, but I learned. I would never make any contact with my ex now.

[Scout99]

I too want to welcome you to the board, as I myself found it just about a month ago and have already through it learned so much here, both about my own r/s but mostly actually about myself and my patterns of behavior that I think are more valuable than words can express!

I think many very good things have already been said and equally good points being made concerning whether or not sending a letter like this is a good or a bad idea. And I second and third and so on in the choir that maybe thinks such letters best remain as written to us and to you yourself... . As a good, even a very good tool to self reflect from during the different stages of healing and recovery that you are going to come through along your way... .

Like so many have already written, the likelyhood that a new love-interest would listen to the contents of a letter like this is imo slim to nothing. Simply because people do not really like to be told what to do, no matter the cause... . I mean if you have a sugaraddiction or are a smoker... . What good does it do even if your friends, your close friends, loved ones or work buddies or whomever preach themselves blue int he face about the disadvantages of your addiction - if there are to you any, and I mean any benefits with keeping your bad habit, you will keep it, regardless what people might think or suggest you should do... . It is just simply human nature... .

Writing the letter is a whole other thing! Writing about your hardships, about your feelings and even sharing it like here on this board is productive to You, because it opens up your perspectives and helps you vent. And good things always come up from doing so. (When you share it here it also becomes productive for so many of us too, since it opens up for identification and brings new light to many others too, who are or have been right where you are now... . And there is power in that!

This quote from you is a true witness to that fact:

Dreamflyer99-- Thanks so much for the welcome and your kind insightful words.  I think I am codependent to an extent because of a fatherless (died when I was 2) upbringing with an older mother who coped early with booze then with emotional distance.  I was married for 15 years to a Bipolar woman.  Divorced from her, got with two decent women, could not feel "in love" then wound up with the BPD girl.

Good for you for standing up after all these years. I will check out the board your recommend.

I think you touch here upon a very important factor for many of us who "allow" ourselves to become involved in relationships with people who we might not understand from the beginning are BPD, but who still chooses to stay or have a hard time detaching from even when the s*it has hit the fan so many times it is almost hard to believe... .

I know it is true for me... . I didn't realize it until I started going to therapy myself after crashing and burning from my first r/s with a person with NPD, (and I have still not come out on the other side completely yet, since I have managed to get myself yet again involved in a r/s with a man w BPD this time... . (even though I am beginning to detach now... . in a more aware manner than before... . ). In my case I have through therapy been able to see things I just couldn't och didn't dare to see before... . But like you I grew up with a mother who may or may not have a PD, but in anyway have had very selfish traits, but also a very unhealthy obsession with me... . In short I learned through childhood that my mom only really loved me, that is showed me love, if she was happy, and especially then happy w me... . So I made it my job to keep her happy, and also to make sure that my dad, (whom my mom was jealous of everytime he hugged me or we talked, since she then thought I loved him more than her... . she still baheaves that way, btw, to this day... . ), didn't come into harms way, when her mood or jealousy got unleashed... .

I learned that way too that love has to be surrounded with grand gestures and that if things are just quiet or calm, catastrophe is lurking around the corner... . In short again, I have never learned to feel at peace unless there is drama and passion in a r/s... . Hence I get either bored easily or uneasy with most "normal" men... . Since what is normal is not what I have learned to be normal... . I even left a ten year long relationship with a man with whom I am still friends with because of that boredom, and a lingering feeling that since there was nothing grand about how he showed me his love and affection, I couldn't shake the lingering worry inside of me that he probably didn't really love me for real... . since it didn't show, the way I had been taught in my dysfunctional upbringing... .

With both my PD r/s that in soo many ways have been devastating and still is, I have never felt insecure about their love, when they have given it to me... . It only takes a glance into the eyes of my uBPD sort of bf to just make me feel soo loved and consequently also soo alive in his presence... . But again, equal devastation when he keeps wanting to break us up... .

What I am trying to say with all this rant, (I beg you pardon for the ranting... . ), is that it is not all about them, that is the reason these r/s's so often doesn't work... . We also have our issues, and it is in the combination that it becomes truly destructive... . I also want to point out that not all pw BPD are the same, they too are individuals. And some like DreamFlyer99's H, manages to stay within r/s's for their whole lives too... . depending on partners tolerance of course, willingness to seek out help, and also if the symptoms of their BPD might not be all about having multiple partners or cheating or such stuff that easily makes r/s messy and impossible to maintain... .

And that again goes to show that they are not all alike... . And different combos in r/s's also give different results... .

I know for instance that my ex NPD guy lives seemingly happy with the woman he started seeing just weeks after we broke up. But not necessarily since she is any better than me, but probably because she is just as selfish as he is, and doesn't care that he has an estranged son, (who went NC with him just before I met him several years ago), and is also from an in his eyes prominent family in his community... . He has cut contact with all of our friends who still remain friends w me, and has even started to diss his own sister, since she also wants to remain friends with me... . However if it will last or not in the long run, I have no idea. And nowadays I don't even care. Not one bit. All I know is that I do not want to live my life in the presence of all the horrors of his behaviors... .

I feel confident that one day you will feel the same way too about your ex girl... . Even though it doesn't feel like it right now... . But as they say - this too shall pass... .

Best wishes

scout99

[Undone123]

I too want to welcome you to the board, as I myself found it just about a month ago and have already through it learned so much here, both about my own r/s but mostly actually about myself and my patterns of behavior that I think are more valuable than words can express!

I think many very good things have already been said and equally good points being made concerning whether or not sending a letter like this is a good or a bad idea. And I second and third and so on in the choir that maybe thinks such letters best remain as written to us and to you yourself... . As a good, even a very good tool to self reflect from during the different stages of healing and recovery that you are going to come through along your way... .

Like so many have already written, the likelyhood that a new love-interest would listen to the contents of a letter like this is imo slim to nothing. Simply because people do not really like to be told what to do, no matter the cause... . I mean if you have a sugaraddiction or are a smoker... . What good does it do even if your friends, your close friends, loved ones or work buddies or whomever preach themselves blue int he face about the disadvantages of your addiction - if there are to you any, and I mean any benefits with keeping your bad habit, you will keep it, regardless what people might think or suggest you should do... . It is just simply human nature... .

Writing the letter is a whole other thing! Writing about your hardships, about your feelings and even sharing it like here on this board is productive to You, because it opens up your perspectives and helps you vent. And good things always come up from doing so. (When you share it here it also becomes productive for so many of us too, since it opens up for identification and brings new light to many others too, who are or have been right where you are now... . And there is power in that!

This quote from you is a true witness to that fact:

Dreamflyer99-- Thanks so much for the welcome and your kind insightful words.  I think I am codependent to an extent because of a fatherless (died when I was 2) upbringing with an older mother who coped early with booze then with emotional distance.  I was married for 15 years to a Bipolar woman.  Divorced from her, got with two decent women, could not feel "in love" then wound up with the BPD girl.

Good for you for standing up after all these years. I will check out the board your recommend.

I think you touch here upon a very important factor for many of us who "allow" ourselves to become involved in relationships with people who we might not understand from the beginning are BPD, but who still chooses to stay or have a hard time detaching from even when the s*it has hit the fan so many times it is almost hard to believe... .

I know it is true for me... . I didn't realize it until I started going to therapy myself after crashing and burning from my first r/s with a person with NPD, (and I have still not come out on the other side completely yet, since I have managed to get myself yet again involved in a r/s with a man w BPD this time... . (even though I am beginning to detach now... . in a more aware manner than before... . ). In my case I have through therapy been able to see things I just couldn't och didn't dare to see before... . But like you I grew up with a mother who may or may not have a PD, but in anyway have had very selfish traits, but also a very unhealthy obsession with me... . In short I learned through childhood that my mom only really loved me, that is showed me love, if she was happy, and especially then happy w me... . So I made it my job to keep her happy, and also to make sure that my dad, (whom my mom was jealous of everytime he hugged me or we talked, since she then thought I loved him more than her... . she still baheaves that way, btw, to this day... . ), didn't come into harms way, when her mood or jealousy got unleashed... .

I learned that way too that love has to be surrounded with grand gestures and that if things are just quiet or calm, catastrophe is lurking around the corner... . In short again, I have never learned to feel at peace unless there is drama and passion in a r/s... . Hence I get either bored easily or uneasy with most "normal" men... . Since what is normal is not what I have learned to be normal... . I even left a ten year long relationship with a man with whom I am still friends with because of that boredom, and a lingering feeling that since there was nothing grand about how he showed me his love and affection, I couldn't shake the lingering worry inside of me that he probably didn't really love me for real... . since it didn't show, the way I had been taught in my dysfunctional upbringing... .

With both my PD r/s that in soo many ways have been devastating and still is, I have never felt insecure about their love, when they have given it to me... . It only takes a glance into the eyes of my uBPD sort of bf to just make me feel soo loved and consequently also soo alive in his presence... . But again, equal devastation when he keeps wanting to break us up... .

What I am trying to say with all this rant, (I beg you pardon for the ranting... . ), is that it is not all about them, that is the reason these r/s's so often doesn't work... . We also have our issues, and it is in the combination that it becomes truly destructive... . I also want to point out that not all pw BPD are the same, they too are individuals. And some like DreamFlyer99's H, manages to stay within r/s's for their whole lives too... . depending on partners tolerance of course, willingness to seek out help, and also if the symptoms of their BPD might not be all about having multiple partners or cheating or such stuff that easily makes r/s messy and impossible to maintain... .

And that again goes to show that they are not all alike... . And different combos in r/s's also give different results... .

I know for instance that my ex NPD guy lives seemingly happy with the woman he started seeing just weeks after we broke up. But not necessarily since she is any better than me, but probably because she is just as selfish as he is, and doesn't care that he has an estranged son, (who went NC with him just before I met him several years ago), and is also from an in his eyes prominent family in his community... . He has cut contact with all of our friends who still remain friends w me, and has even started to diss his own sister, since she also wants to remain friends with me... . However if it will last or not in the long run, I have no idea. And nowadays I don't even care. Not one bit. All I know is that I do not want to live my life in the presence of all the horrors of his behaviors... .

I feel confident that one day you will feel the same way too about your ex girl... . Even though it doesn't feel like it right now... . But as they say - this too shall pass... .

Best wishes

scout99

This sort of stuff is so valuable, to the individual I think. Clearmind speaks a lot of sense on this stuff... . I've identified my own family dysfunction, and literally once you do, and resolve it you feel so much stronger. Mine personally is this... .

My father is a full blown narcissist. Empty, grandiose, flash, charming. Every trait to the extreme. Affair after affair. Doesn't care about anyone but himself. My parents divorced at a really early age. I don't remember living with him, and there was little contact after we moved areas aged 6... .

All I wanted growing up was to have a relationship with that guy I so fondly remember coming to pick me up in his flash car and cowboy boots. However, whenever I so much as even mentioned his name to my mother, I would be dismissed. My feelings dismissed, "you don't want him he's a bad man". Now whether removing me from the exposure to a man with NPD was a good or bad thing, I don't know? But my mother made her problems mine. I was burdened with adult problems. My feelings dismissed, and I needed to put her needs before my own. This went on until about a month ago... . Couldn't really talk about my father with my mother, without hearing some crap of what a jerk he is... . Now I've asserted my self. He may be a narc, but he's still my dad. I make the decision because of me, no one else, and although my mother and I are exceptionally close, I will now make my decision on whats good for me! Instead of worrying about upsetting her.

We do learn our relationships and behaviors. I don't even think BPD is inherited. I think you may be prone to something, but its the environment your raised it that shapes you. That goes the same for us!

[Perfidy]

Yeah... . Don't send it. They already think you are the crazy one so don't confirm it. Just sit back and make popcorn and enjoy the show. Either that or just go on with your own life and forget about her. (i know you cant) She already played the wounded bird card with the new guy and you are the villain that wounded her. My ex did the same thing. It's a pattern in them. For them it is a survival tactic. Using people. I know you are decent person with a good heart but that is not how the ex sees it. Exes be exes for a reason. Don't try to be friends. That will just make you suffer more. I tried. It sucked. I am burning the bridge now. It is easier for me. Wish her well in your mind and mean it. Don't talk to her. Just hope the best for her and it will be reflected back on you. Anger is healthy if its properly directed and harms no one. Not even yourself. It is a release . It's over. Grieve it. You really have no other option. Don't go back if you have the chance. Remember the pain. Remember the feelings of betrayal.

[bettermentofsociety]

Hi forthebettermentofsociety,

I just wanted to add my welcome to everyone else's. 

I liked what dreamflyer had to say, there was some good stuff there.

What I have found to be true for me is that when my emotions lead, they lead me astray, especially in my relationship with my pwBPD.  Things just never were or are quite what they seem on the surface.

It would be my suggestion, and its just a suggestion mind you, that you take the energy you poured into your letter and pour it into yourself, and the people who are already here on this site.

And I would suggest that for two reasons,  one is because you and this community deserve that kind of effort and second and most important, is because you and this community can fully appreciate and benefit from it.

babyducks

I wish I could just turn inward and pour it in.  I wish I could invest more into my health and into all of you rather than worry about a relationship that was like a roller coaster for 3 plus years. I guess writing to her newest victim is just maybe hoping she will fail more quickly than will likely happen.  I don't know him, I just know what she is capable of and in a way isn't  almost like someone standing in the street with their back to traffic and then not yelling a warning when a speeding car is approaching.

I guess I have to ponder more... .

[bettermentofsociety]

I too want to welcome you to the board, as I myself found it just about a month ago and have already through it learned so much here, both about my own r/s but mostly actually about myself and my patterns of behavior that I think are more valuable than words can express!

I think many very good things have already been said and equally good points being made concerning whether or not sending a letter like this is a good or a bad idea. And I second and third and so on in the choir that maybe thinks such letters best remain as written to us and to you yourself... . As a good, even a very good tool to self reflect from during the different stages of healing and recovery that you are going to come through along your way... .

Like so many have already written, the likelyhood that a new love-interest would listen to the contents of a letter like this is imo slim to nothing. Simply because people do not really like to be told what to do, no matter the cause... . I mean if you have a sugaraddiction or are a smoker... . What good does it do even if your friends, your close friends, loved ones or work buddies or whomever preach themselves blue int he face about the disadvantages of your addiction - if there are to you any, and I mean any benefits with keeping your bad habit, you will keep it, regardless what people might think or suggest you should do... . It is just simply human nature... .

Writing the letter is a whole other thing! Writing about your hardships, about your feelings and even sharing it like here on this board is productive to You, because it opens up your perspectives and helps you vent. And good things always come up from doing so. (When you share it here it also becomes productive for so many of us too, since it opens up for identification and brings new light to many others too, who are or have been right where you are now... . And there is power in that!

This quote from you is a true witness to that fact:

Dreamflyer99-- Thanks so much for the welcome and your kind insightful words.  I think I am codependent to an extent because of a fatherless (died when I was 2) upbringing with an older mother who coped early with booze then with emotional distance.  I was married for 15 years to a Bipolar woman.  Divorced from her, got with two decent women, could not feel "in love" then wound up with the BPD girl.

Good for you for standing up after all these years. I will check out the board your recommend.

I think you touch here upon a very important factor for many of us who "allow" ourselves to become involved in relationships with people who we might not understand from the beginning are BPD, but who still chooses to stay or have a hard time detaching from even when the s*it has hit the fan so many times it is almost hard to believe... .

I know it is true for me... . I didn't realize it until I started going to therapy myself after crashing and burning from my first r/s with a person with NPD, (and I have still not come out on the other side completely yet, since I have managed to get myself yet again involved in a r/s with a man w BPD this time... . (even though I am beginning to detach now... . in a more aware manner than before... . ). In my case I have through therapy been able to see things I just couldn't och didn't dare to see before... . But like you I grew up with a mother who may or may not have a PD, but in anyway have had very selfish traits, but also a very unhealthy obsession with me... . In short I learned through childhood that my mom only really loved me, that is showed me love, if she was happy, and especially then happy w me... . So I made it my job to keep her happy, and also to make sure that my dad, (whom my mom was jealous of everytime he hugged me or we talked, since she then thought I loved him more than her... . she still baheaves that way, btw, to this day... . ), didn't come into harms way, when her mood or jealousy got unleashed... .

I learned that way too that love has to be surrounded with grand gestures and that if things are just quiet or calm, catastrophe is lurking around the corner... . In short again, I have never learned to feel at peace unless there is drama and passion in a r/s... . Hence I get either bored easily or uneasy with most "normal" men... . Since what is normal is not what I have learned to be normal... . I even left a ten year long relationship with a man with whom I am still friends with because of that boredom, and a lingering feeling that since there was nothing grand about how he showed me his love and affection, I couldn't shake the lingering worry inside of me that he probably didn't really love me for real... . since it didn't show, the way I had been taught in my dysfunctional upbringing... .

With both my PD r/s that in soo many ways have been devastating and still is, I have never felt insecure about their love, when they have given it to me... . It only takes a glance into the eyes of my uBPD sort of bf to just make me feel soo loved and consequently also soo alive in his presence... . But again, equal devastation when he keeps wanting to break us up... .

What I am trying to say with all this rant, (I beg you pardon for the ranting... . ), is that it is not all about them, that is the reason these r/s's so often doesn't work... . We also have our issues, and it is in the combination that it becomes truly destructive... . I also want to point out that not all pw BPD are the same, they too are individuals. And some like DreamFlyer99's H, manages to stay within r/s's for their whole lives too... . depending on partners tolerance of course, willingness to seek out help, and also if the symptoms of their BPD might not be all about having multiple partners or cheating or such stuff that easily makes r/s messy and impossible to maintain... .

And that again goes to show that they are not all alike... . And different combos in r/s's also give different results... .

I know for instance that my ex NPD guy lives seemingly happy with the woman he started seeing just weeks after we broke up. But not necessarily since she is any better than me, but probably because she is just as selfish as he is, and doesn't care that he has an estranged son, (who went NC with him just before I met him several years ago), and is also from an in his eyes prominent family in his community... . He has cut contact with all of our friends who still remain friends w me, and has even started to diss his own sister, since she also wants to remain friends with me... . However if it will last or not in the long run, I have no idea. And nowadays I don't even care. Not one bit. All I know is that I do not want to live my life in the presence of all the horrors of his behaviors... .

I feel confident that one day you will feel the same way too about your ex girl... . Even though it doesn't feel like it right now... . But as they say - this too shall pass... .

Best wishes

scout99

Scott99,

Thanks for that.  Being around BPD or NPDs makes you realize that life is certainly not fair.  Not fair to them and not fair to those victimized Nons who know them.

Still pondering... . I have to put myself into the positiion of the new guy and wonder if I'd do anything with the information.  Hmmm.

[bettermentofsociety]

Yeah... . Don't send it. They already think you are the crazy one so don't confirm it. Just sit back and make popcorn and enjoy the show. Either that or just go on with your own life and forget about her. (i know you cant) She already played the wounded bird card with the new guy and you are the villain that wounded her. My ex did the same thing. It's a pattern in them. For them it is a survival tactic. Using people. I know you are decent person with a good heart but that is not how the ex sees it. Exes be exes for a reason. Don't try to be friends. That will just make you suffer more. I tried. It sucked. I am burning the bridge now. It is easier for me. Wish her well in your mind and mean it. Don't talk to her. Just hope the best for her and it will be reflected back on you. Anger is healthy if its properly directed and harms no one. Not even yourself. It is a release . It's over. Grieve it. You really have no other option. Don't go back if you have the chance. Remember the pain. Remember the feelings of betrayal.

No friends.  I blocked her on FB months before we made it "final" for the FINAL time.

Not sure what final means with her. She lives in another town near her new man.  It's only been a week of NC, but she is enmeshing at a breakneck speed I am sure with the new guy and he is eating up like there's not tomorrow.  I guess I just want to  stop that process.  Sucks.  So disheartening.  I even thought that if I did not send the letter I would go talk to him... . but really why should I?  ?

[Suzn]

Welcome  Forthebettermentofsociety

I'm sorry you've had to go through all of this with your ex girlfriend. Bpd is a confusing disorder and it can be painful for all involved. I know how hard it can be to detach, we all get that here. I've been in your shoes.

It would be best to continue this conversation by posting here:

Leaving: Disengaging from a Partner with BPD

This way you will get the benefit of the senior membership at large. You are not getting that on this board.  

[Scout99]

Scott99,

Thanks for that.  Being around BPD or NPDs makes you realize that life is certainly not fair.  Not fair to them and not fair to those victimized Nons who know them.

Still pondering... . I have to put myself into the positiion of the new guy and wonder if I'd do anything with the information.  Hmmm.

I am thinking... . Now do you really have to put yourself in the new guys position? Is that not just a way to avoid or postpone having to deal with your own feelings of hurt and emotional issues regarding relationships as a whole?

Truthfully, writing or talking to him will not be productive in any way while you are still in a place of vulnerability, still jealous, still harboring feelings of wanting to make your ex feel hurt the way you do and so on... .

I think it is important that you stay true to yourself and your own feelings at this time,and allow yourself to feel just hurt, and not try to project that into trying to act like a helper or a soldier for truth or a vigilante of some sort... . Where you are right now you don't have neither the tools nor the perspective you need for doing so... . Since underlying it all you have alterior motives behind such an action. And can't really see what the consequences of such an act would be for you... . From an outsiders perspective a letter like this would in all probability just add to you own hurt, since the result from sending it won't be a thank you note from this guy, but rather just scorn or accusations and negative reflections on you, that you truly don't deserve.

We really are not responsible for other people's choices or mistakes. It really is quite enough to struggle with and try to handle our own... .

You don't know this guy and what he is capable of. He might be a balanced guy who will see faster than you did what this woman is all about, and choose to leave all by himself, or he may not and then have to go through some rough times. But then again, he may be a guy who is so stable too that he won't be bothered as much as you or I get in a r/ s with a person with these dysfunctions... . There is no way of telling really. And the bottom line is; it is not for you to decide or try to control... . It is up to him and her... . There are also other factors. You have from what I understand had a long distance r/s, they live in the same town. That too can effect the outcome of a r/s. I know it was a factor in my former r/s with a NPD man. He is now in a r/s with a woman from his hometown who is also a from what I hear from mutual friends and so on a very selfish person, and very different from me and even his former ex... . And you know what, maybe that is a match made in heaven, (or h*ll), that just might work. Today, when I have done some serious work on myself and are in a better balance as a person than I have been in all my life, even before my r/s with him, couldn't care any less!

What I am trying to say is that once you start focusing on you and choose to learn and make the necessary changes in you to get back into, or as in my case create a whole new balance that wasn't there to begin with, that is really the (only) way to finding peace and solace in life. Not in any act for or against anyone else... .

I too from my hurt and scorned position of being dumped after all the horrors and struggles I put myself through trying to salvage both him and our r/s, too contemplated writing his new woman to warn her off... . But my motives were not pure and what I truly wanted like you was to inflict pain in him, which wasn't going to work, and thankfully I had people around me who stopped me then... .

It would not have done me one bit of good to do so, instead it would all have backfired on me... .

Do instead like the moderators here suggest, continue to vent your feelings here, where you will find understanding and good responses to them on the suggested boards. That will do you  way more good than sending that letter or trying to contact that bloke... .

Best wishes

Scout99

[DreamFlyer99]

Hi forthebettermentofsociety,


What I have found to be true for me is that when my emotions lead, they lead me astray, especially in my relationship with my pwBPD.  Things just never were or are quite what they seem on the surface.

Great statement of truth!

And Scout99, let's call it "thoughtful rambling" instead of "ranting."

Welcome  Forthebettermentofsociety

It would be best to continue this conversation by posting here:

Leaving: Disengaging from a Partner with BPD

This way you will get the benefit of the senior membership at large. You are not getting that on this board. 

What Suzn said! Truth! I just got so caught up I didn't even think of that--usually the "post here first" board is for introducing yourself, getting your basic story out, but then you can get specific advice from people with lots of experience when you move your questions etc. to the best fitting board, like she said. i'm guessing this very question has come up a lot on that board.  They'll be great for helping you work through the stages you're gonna go through as you work toward healing yourself--the only person you can really change.

Glad to have you here, and i'll have to look in and see how things are going for you!

DF99

(wow. I seem to have a case of the "winkie-winkies"... .    )

[Lao Tzu]

Dear forthebettermentofsociety,

     Let's do a 'thought' experiment here.  Let's say you send it and, defying all logic, the new player actually totally buys what you're saying and decides to go permanent, full n/c with her immediately (a lot to imagine, but this is only a series of thoughts, so why not?).  What happens now?      Uhhh... . she just moves on immediately to someone else.  In fact, she likely already has someone else in the "batter's box", sexual innuendo fully intended. So, what was accomplished? Nothing; and that was accepting the rather preposterous assumption that anyone would be dim and weak-willed enough to just change their entire life based on a letter from someone they don't know who has every reason to be highly biased.  Makes sense to write this, but silly to send IMHO.

LT

[charred]

Fully understand your wanting to contact the new guy, both for a touch of getting back at her and to warn him. I had same thoughts. My r/s involved about 7-8 recycles, and by the last one (and last guy)... I no longer wanted to get back at her, felt sorry for her, and really wanted to warn the guy. But I didn't.

He went from wonderful, perfect and ideal... . to being off her FB pages, and then she was talking about needing a procedure... . turned out Mr. Wonderful gave her an STD, then called her "forgettable" and she then reached out once again to me... . but after so many times and so much heartache I was done.

If you decide to warn him... . would love to hear how it plays out.

[Newton]

Forthebetterment ... . the advice you've had so far on this thread has been excellent... . read it again and again... .

I would suggest you look at your username... . why is it so important to you that you help people?... . how many can you "save"... . all of us?... . some of us?... . why are you trying to do this?... . (it sounds like you are well on the way to addressing these questions, thats great news  )... .

[bettermentofsociety]

Yes,  so much good advice here.  I have decided to postpone at a minimum, sending of such a note to him.  I appreciate everyone's advice on this matter. I agree that I should wait if at all send.

Scout99, I concur, perhaps it would not be prudent to send at this juncture.  Perhaps wasted energy on her and on him.

I have moved this to the other board as well.

Thanks for the info and guidance.

[Aussie0zborn]

I know where you're coming from but wouldn't do it. Hopefully just writing it will be therapeutic enough.