Mistook need for love and knew it

[Blaise]

It is probably more important to look at our own issues than to try and find reasons for the failure in our exBPD. I remember perfectly that before being deeply attracted by my ex girlfriend -- she suddendly looked to me as being so fragile and at the same time so strong -- I thought she was just a completely immature girld and she did not even look attractive to me. Later in the relationship, I would sense a great relief each time we separated, and then immediately run after her as I was missing her deeply. But each time we would be together again, this hole I had felt would be filled again and I would not feel love anymore for her. We separated six months ago and there has been no communication for almost two months. I am starting to feel better but know that if she were to come back, it would be extremely difficult to resist the urge to be with her. And then, most likely, I would immediately feel again that this is something else than love, something more close to an addiction to a drug. I cannot explain why I feel like this. What I know is that this addiction is extremely powerful and made me do some crazy things, like leaving my wife and two young kids in the belief that I had found the one I was looking for.

[Scout99]

Thank you for sharing this! I think you are touching on an important topic about why we as non's seem to get so easily attracted to a person w BPD... .

It just dawned on me recently, probably a thought that came up after a therapy session... .

I was babysitting my best friends daughter with whom I have a truly special bond. We were playing and doing fun stuff and at night when I read her bedtime story, and she had turned around and started to fall asleep when she suddenly whispered: I love you... .

My heart melted of course, even though she has said things like that before... .

But days later I thought about that incident and about my BPD bf, and then it dawned on me... .

They love just like five year olds! Nobody loves so purely, wholeheartedly, overwhelmingly like when we are kids and in that beautiful age when we still believe life to be somewhat of a fairy tale... . No grown up normal and responsible person loves so unguarded like that... .

But BPD's do... . And that is what I believe now, at least for myself is one of the reasons we get so attracted and attached to them... . ?

But the coin as we all know have a flip side... . a five year old's emotions also comes with the temper tantrums, the ranting nags and all other immature things that also comes with being five... . Our children thankfully grow up and mature... . And that is the problem with BPD... . They don't... . And even though I will miss my friends daughters unconditional love when she grows up and becomes a teenager... . I will still welcome the transition... .

But I have still some thinking to do about what it is in me that gets so drawn to these overwhelming and immature  expressions of love that initially is expressed from people w BPD... .

Just a few thoughts that your post touched on for me... .

Scout99

[Blaise]

The comparison with children love is a really interesting one.

I have two young kids and I love them unconditionaly. I know this love will last for ever, not in the sense that they can do whatever they want and everything will be forgiven, but rather in the sense that this is a love that can exist and will exist even if it is or becomes "onesided". I think that no parent expects his or her kids to love them unconditionally in the same way we love them. Rather, we expect them to grow up and become independent.

Now, with my ex girlfriend, diagnozed with BPD, I really think, and sometimes felt, that she was desperately looking for this unconditional, onesided, love. She was "abandonned" by her father (who separated from her mother when she was a baby), and it is like I was supposed to replace him. She would also say "I love you" but this sounded more like "I need you".

We will provide for the needs of our children and love them even if they do not replicate (they cannot replicate and are not expected to). But this is not how adult love works. Adult love is not about fulfilling the significant other's needs. I think that this is where my relationship with my girlfriend ended: at some point, she realized that my love for her was not that of a parent and that I was expecting to get my share of the relationship. She was just unable to provide this share, like a 3 years old child.

Believe me or not, I think that young children are capable of true love feelings. Mine will sometimes say to me, out of nowhere, ":)ad, I love you". Just like your friends' daugther and you can feel that it it is true and free love (and your heart melts . I do not think that my ex girlfriend was capable of that. She never told me "I love you" for free, without expecting anything in return. She would rather sometimes look at me and say "I love you unconditionally" (which is rather strange) or end emails/texts with "I love you... . ". I never figured out why she would always add those three dots and what they exactly meant.

[Blade99d]

For me, this was different.  I feel like I did give my ex unconditional love.  When I first met her, I was totally taken with her and she was so interesting to me.  She was educated, could hold a conversation,she was also incredibly beautiful - when we walked into a restaurant or bar, everyone seemed to stop and stare.  That, along with the idealization was incredibly powerful.  Anyways, we would go out to dinner 3-4 nights a week, to NFL, MLB and NHL games, to the Casino, on overnight hotel trips on a whim.  At the end however, I felt i was being used by her, even though I had so much fun with her.  Maybe I was the one that was using her... . I' m still working through this with my T. 

[charred]

Thank you for sharing this! I think you are touching on an important topic about why we as non's seem to get so easily attracted to a person w BPD... .

It just dawned on me recently, probably a thought that came up after a therapy session... .

I was babysitting my best friends daughter with whom I have a truly special bond. We were playing and doing fun stuff and at night when I read her bedtime story, and she had turned around and started to fall asleep when she suddenly whispered: I love you... .

My heart melted of course, even though she has said things like that before... .

But days later I thought about that incident and about my BPD bf, and then it dawned on me... .

They love just like five year olds! Nobody loves so purely, wholeheartedly, overwhelmingly like when we are kids and in that beautiful age when we still believe life to be somewhat of a fairy tale... . No grown up normal and responsible person loves so unguarded like that... .

But BPD's do... . And that is what I believe now, at least for myself is one of the reasons we get so attracted and attached to them... . ?

But the coin as we all know have a flip side... . a five year old's emotions also comes with the temper tantrums, the ranting nags and all other immature things that also comes with being five... . Our children thankfully grow up and mature... . And that is the problem with BPD... . They don't... . And even though I will miss my friends daughters unconditional love when she grows up and becomes a teenager... . I will still welcome the transition... .

But I have still some thinking to do about what it is in me that gets so drawn to these overwhelming and immature  expressions of love that initially is expressed from people w BPD... .

Just a few thoughts that your post touched on for me... .

Scout99

Well put... .

They also ignore the boundaries (think barriers) we use to keep people at a distance. They want someone to be with them so much (needy) that they mirror us and act like they like what we do, have same interests etc. And the giant attraction to them... . I think, is that  we (nons)... . have some issues of our own from our FOOs, and the apparent unconditional love they give us... . we eat it up, and put them in a primary bond position... . like the unconditional loving parent we never had. We think they are our soul mates (just like they say)... . then the act of being what they are not (us)... . weighs in and when they flip on us, or dump us... . we are devastated and it hurts like no normal r/s ever did.

Why... . it was like a primary bond... . the hurt is like losing a parent, not a typical person you dated.

I had it happen... . and 27 yrs later... . she chased me down on FB, and the electricity was still 100% there... . (ready for electrocuting me... . I realized after the divorce and subsequent 6-7 recycles.)

You have hit on something... . they do love without the normal reservations... . and its like technicolor HDTV vs an old black and white set... . especially the bad parts.

[bpdspell]

I'm with Charred.

I definitely had Family of Origin Issues that I had long ago buried inside of me and packed away tightly and neatly.

I had a really traumatic childhood and have always had difficulties allowing people to get emotionally close to me. My parents were young and too buried in their own dysfunction to emotionally take care of my child needs. I never got therapy for being raised this way and never realizes how emotionally damaged I was.

I buried myself in accomplishment to feel worthy of love and I was certainly a bonafide approval addict and people pleaser in the sense that what people thought of me mattered way too much.

My BPDexbf steamrolled my boundaries and triggered my codependent traits with idealization... . making me feel worshipped.

He essentially loved me the way I longed to be loved by my parents. It was EVERYTHING I had ever dreamed that love could ever be: nurturing, validation, being needed, wanted, desired and being accepted.

Even when things got nasty with my ex it seemed like I could be myself 100% with him and he'd still love me. For the first time in my life I felt like I wasn't wanted because of my accomplishments or what I could do for someone... . until it became just that.

I used my ex for approval just as much as much as my ex used me for need.

I do believe that there are many faces to love and I do believe my ex loved me because he told me he needed me... . but BPD love is toxic, unhealthy and cannot sustain itself in the long run because both participants are unloading unhealthy schema's onto each other... . both are looking for a rescue fantasy... . and both have unrealistic expectations of each other... .

For them love=need. And for me love for my ex certainly equalled need as well.

Spell

[charred]

I'm with Charred.

I definitely had Family of Origin Issues that I had long ago buried inside of me and packed away tightly and neatly.

I had a really traumatic childhood and have always had difficulties allowing people to get emotionally close to me. My parents were young and too buried in their own dysfunction to emotionally take care of my child needs. I never got therapy for being raised this way and never realizes how emotionally damaged I was.

I buried myself in accomplishment to feel worthy of love and I was certainly a bonafide approval addict and people pleaser in the sense that what people thought of me mattered way too much.

My BPDexbf steamrolled my boundaries and triggered my codependent traits with idealization... . making me feel worshipped.

He essentially loved me the way I longed to be loved by my parents. It was EVERYTHING I had ever dreamed that love could ever be: nurturing, validation, being needed, wanted, desired and being accepted.

Even when things got nasty with my ex it seemed like I could be myself 100% with him and he'd still love me. For the first time in my life I felt like I wasn't wanted because of my accomplishments or what I could do for someone... . until it became just that.

I used my ex for approval just as much as much as my ex used me for need.

I do believe that there are many faces to love and I do believe my ex loved me because he told me he needed me... . but BPD love is toxic, unhealthy and cannot sustain itself in the long run because both participants are unloading unhealthy schema's onto each other... . both are looking for a rescue fantasy... . and both have unrealistic expectations of each other... .

For them love=need. And for me love for my ex certainly equalled need as well.

Spell

Buried in accomplishments... . ditto, but no matter what I achieved, it didn't seem to mean anything to me or make any difference.

"He essentially loved me the way I longed to be loved by my parents. It was EVERYTHING I had ever dreamed that love could ever be: nurturing, validation, being needed, wanted, desired and being accepted."

I believe this is what gets us hooked, we see the pwBPD as unconditionally loving like a parent, and then when the bad side of the BPD hits, we are often decimated.

Clearly the issue is we all needed parents that were unconditionally loving, available, warm... . caring... . and far too many of us didn't have that, and it keeps happening all around us.

[Blade99d]

"I used my ex for approval just as much as much as my ex used me for need."

Wow... . ths is really hitting home.  I was just coming out of a ugly divorce and didnt reslize how vulnerable i really was.  My BPD ex said to me many times, wow you have been neglected for a long time... . and it was so true, but I didn't see it then. 

I don't know that she showed the unconditional love as she had a lot of NPD traits as well, but my god did she have sexual energy.  As my T said this week, it sounds like we had a teenage sex life and to a large degree we did.  Working on this part of me as welll. 

[Clearmind]

Mistook need for love and knew it - me too. I also took the intensity of the relationship to mean that he loved me.

__

I agree with you Charred only we did much the same thing:

They also ignore the boundaries (think barriers) we use to keep people at a distance.

We didn't have boundaries to start with - thats what drew us into this relationship. If we had good boundaries it would never have gone past the first date. Relationships without boundaries will inevitably fall apart. Boundary busting is not noticable while you are being idealized however for a long lasting relationship, boundaries are paramount.

They want someone to be with them so much (needy) that they mirror us and act like they like what we do, have same interests etc.

We also mirrored the Borderline – mirroring is not purely a BPD term – everyone mirrors and the case with a BPD/non, who yes has their own FOO issues mirror each other... .

And the giant attraction to them... . I think, is that  we (nons)... . have some issues of our own from our FOOs, and the apparent unconditional love they give us... . we eat it up, and put them in a primary bond position... . like the unconditional loving parent we never had. We think they are our soul mates (just like they say)... . then the act of being what they are not (us)... . weighs in and when they flip on us, or dump us... . we are devastated and it hurts like no normal r/s ever did.

It’s a dance for two and both parties idealized one another. Neither party feels like the other has any flaws hence the reason we also believe they are the one. As it progresses, in time, both parties begin to have flaws and you each devalue/invalidate each other – this is what creates the cycle of conflict because neither knows how to relate any other way.

Why... . it was like a primary bond... . the hurt is like losing a parent, not a typical person you dated.

It's a trauma bond for both each needing something from the relationship and each other to feel loved and needed and valued. When this bond we travel through our own abandonment cycle - Great book "Journey from Abandonment to Healing" by Susan Andersen - explains the abandonment cycle for the 'non' brilliantly. Well worth the read if anyone wants to understand why they feel so shattered in the aftermath.

I had it happen... . and 27 yrs later... . she chased me down on FB, and the electricity was still 100% there... . (ready for electrocuting me... . I realized after the divorce and subsequent 6-7 recycles.)

Recycles occur when we have not healed from the last contact. That is – finding the reason that attracted us in the first place. If we go back, then we have more to learn about ourselves.

You have hit on something... . they do love without the normal reservations... . and its like technicolor HDTV vs an old black and white set... . especially the bad parts.

For the “non” too! Our own FOO will dictate our own twisted thinking – black and white thinking is one of them. There is a far bit of B&W thinking on the board! Its OK, we hurt however we do need to remind ourselves that we can also persecute the Borderline as we grieve and lay blame on the BPD without taking any responsiblity for our decisions.

[Blaise]

It seems that in this type of relationship, both partners are in need of something. When I started dating my ex BPD girlfriend, my wife and I just had had our second child (I do not feel proud about this). I felt just unexistent as the kids had become -- which is just normal -- the center of her universe. A normal person would have accepted the situation and found the resources in himself to go through this period. Me not. My ex BPD girlfriend provided me what I needed more: validation, approval, self-esteem, sex, etc. Everything was emotional and to me this was also a sign that I truly had found THE ONE: I am a rather reserved and rational person and for the first time I could see myself have emotions and be able to speak about them. She seemed to like all what I like and to share my views about everything. There were some red flags in her behaviour but I simply disregarded them. In some ways, all this isolated me and was, I felt, destructive. She basically convinced me that I was way better in my work -- we used to work together at the time -- than my colleagues, that they were all asss and that I deserved more and should leave. She convinced me that my ex wife was a monster, cold and without emotions (my ex wife is certainly not a passionate lover but she probably is the most stable person I know). After a while, things started to change. I felt trapped in this r/s, with to much weight on my shoulers (it was like I was the only one who could save her). The mirorring ended as I became less and less tolerant of her sometime outrageous and/or immature conduct. On her side, she started to say she in fact did not like things that she had said she liked in the honeymoon phase. What strikes me most is that I sometimes told myself that she was not the person I wanted to live with. But I did not leave her and, on the contrary, each time she left (a couple of times and probably for ever two months ago), I desperately ran after her. I think that not only her, but me as well, had been looking for unconditional parent-type love. This is what makes the detaching so painful. It is like losing a parent and I now realize that me running after my ex BPD girlfriend was not because I loved her or our relationship, but because she had provided for a short while the unconditional love I was looking for. It was more like a child who fight not to be abandonned by a parent. The fact is that I miss my ex BPD girlfriend when I feel a little bit depressed or when my self-esteem is low. When I feel well about myself, doing things I like, taking care of the children, providing myself for my needs, I do not miss her anymore and, on the contrary, have an optimistic view about my future. I know that I am stronger now in many ways. I have learnt about my emotions and I am able to communicate about them. I take care of myself and learn to live on my own, providing myself for my needs and not expecting someone to do it for me. I am almost 40 but I feel like I am where I would and should have been when I left my parents' home 20 years ago if only they had provided affection, validation and thaught me to be independent instead of overprotecting me. It feels good to be a 20-year old again!