Todays thoughts

[Octoberfest]

Each day of this journey surprises me. A totally new perspective, a deeper understanding, a new found appreciation for something, every day my understanding of both my relationship with my BPDex as well as the reasons that I stayed and how I behaved deepens.

Todays' ah ha! moment is that when we are dealing with pwBPD, we are dealing with people who are TRULY disordered. I know that is very "duh" sounding, as most all of us learned that or were told upon first coming to this board, but I guess I don't know that I fully appreciated what that meant, and because of it I have caused myself a lot of mental anguish.

For the past few months I have been going back through my relationship remembering certain events, certain conversations, defining moments that, for me, set the tone of the relationship.  I have been comparing those things to the outcome of the relationship, how it ACTUALLY progressed, and finding huge discrepancies... . kind of like if you were to add 3 + 3 and get 7.  It has been horribly confusing and distressing, causing myself a lot of pain and anguish and overall keeping me trapped in the past, trying to make sense of it all.

I have realized that the reason trying to make sense of all of it has been driving me crazy is that it is impossible to; I am trying to reason through things that someone said and did as though they think logically and consistently- and that just is not the case.  I have noticed recently more than ever as I have looked backwards, that my BPDex has ZERO consistency in her life. No consistency in the people in her life, how she thinks, or how she acts.

A friend of mine who met her while we dated talked to me after we split and after he heard about all the cheating she did and said something to the effect of, "that is so surprising... . she seems like such a cool girl when you talk to her".  I found a quote by Winston Churchill which I have found very telling on the matter,

“You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.”

She seems like such a cool girl, and everyone seems to like her, because she is a people pleaser.  Whoever she is with, whoever she is around at the time, is who she is seeking validation from.  That makes it IMPOSSIBLE to be faithful or to maintain a lasting relationship.  The fact is, not everyone is supposed to like you.  If they do, there is not a whole lot of substance to who "you" really are.

I look back at how my BPDex has been married and divorced at 19, engaged 2-3 more times on top of that, been pregnant on purpose and chosen to later abort the child, been with MANY different men, and how she dives headfirst into every relationship she has all at the age of 22, and realize that this is not a person who has any sort of consistency in her thought process.  How quickly she can devalue a partner and move towards marriage with the next one (who just messaged her randomly on facebook) is a testament to how NOTHING is lasting for her.

The entire thing is scary to think about, and I think I understand a little more about why the whole experience has been so traumatizing... . for one of the first times in my life, I have had NO control over a major part of my life.  I certainly tried to influence things in that relationship, to make things better, try  different strategies, but the fact is if everything that you work towards goes in one ear, stays there for 5 hours, and then goes straight out the other, NOTHING YOU DO will impact the result.  It is a very helpless feeling, one that has make me very uncomfortable.

Just the idea that someone's brain could actually NOT BE WORKING CORRECTLY as opposed to it working correctly and them actively choosing to do these things is mind boggling to me.

I was always amazed at how she KNEW she had BPD, she was in treatment for it, she always talked about how much she hated it and wanted to be better, and yet a day later she would be off repeating problem behaviors and causing more issues.  It was like a lightswitch awareness, there one second and totally lost the next. 

It is very confusing to talk to and connect with someone who is so sure of something, so dedicated to being better, doing things right, and then a little bit further down the road seeing them doing the same old things.

Perhaps this post speaks to someone else on this board- again, it seems like a pretty basic thought, but it is a pretty profound realization for me.

[Hazelrah]

I was always amazed at how she KNEW she had BPD, she was in treatment for it, she always talked about how much she hated it and wanted to be better, and yet a day later she would be off repeating problem behaviors and causing more issues.  It was like a lightswitch awareness, there one second and totally lost the next. 

It is very confusing to talk to and connect with someone who is so sure of something, so dedicated to being better, doing things right, and then a little bit further down the road seeing them doing the same old things.

Octoberfest,

This portion of your post does resonate with me.  My separated BPDw has also been in targeted therapy (~3 months) after having been previously diagnosed as Bipolar II.  She had a really hard time in dealing with the new diagnosis... . probably because her mother is BPD, too.  It caused her to question whether anything in her life had actually ever been 'real', including our relationship.  Eventually, she began to say the right things in regards to battling it, etc.  She even claimed she was ready to re-enter the workforce, which was shocking, yet conversely seemed like a great sign to me.

And despite all that, she seemingly falls right back into a pattern of destroying a loving relationship, acting impulsively and leaving a trail of chaos in her wake.  It just all happened so fast--the diagnosis, the beginning of treatment, the walking out and the wild behavior.  I sometimes wonder if she decided to use the label as an excuse for her actions... . almost as if understanding why her mind and emotions work the way they do gives her free license to push things to the hilt.

[LetItBe]

Todays' ah ha! moment is that when we are dealing with pwBPD, we are dealing with people who are TRULY disordered. I know that is very "duh" sounding, as most all of us learned that or were told upon first coming to this board, but I guess I don't know that I fully appreciated what that meant, and because of it I have caused myself a lot of mental anguish.

She seems like such a cool girl, and everyone seems to like her, because she is a people pleaser.  Whoever she is with, whoever she is around at the time, is who she is seeking validation from.  That makes it IMPOSSIBLE to be faithful or to maintain a lasting relationship.  The fact is, not everyone is supposed to like you.  If they do, there is not a whole lot of substance to who "you" really are.

The entire thing is scary to think about, and I think I understand a little more about why the whole experience has been so traumatizing... . for one of the first times in my life, I have had NO control over a major part of my life.  I certainly tried to influence things in that relationship, to make things better, try  different strategies, but the fact is if everything that you work towards goes in one ear, stays there for 5 hours, and then goes straight out the other, NOTHING YOU DO will impact the result.  It is a very helpless feeling, one that has make me very uncomfortable.

Just the idea that someone's brain could actually NOT BE WORKING CORRECTLY as opposed to it working correctly and them actively choosing to do these things is mind boggling to me.

I was always amazed at how she KNEW she had BPD, she was in treatment for it, she always talked about how much she hated it and wanted to be better, and yet a day later she would be off repeating problem behaviors and causing more issues.  It was like a lightswitch awareness, there one second and totally lost the next.  

It is very confusing to talk to and connect with someone who is so sure of something, so dedicated to being better, doing things right, and then a little bit further down the road seeing them doing the same old things.

Perhaps this post speaks to someone else on this board- again, it seems like a pretty basic thought, but it is a pretty profound realization for me.

Hi, Octoberfest.  Your post -- especially the parts above -- REALLY resonate with me!  

My ex is also a people pleaser, and like you said, whoever he is around at the time is who he's seeking validation from.  He'd flirt back with the gay men at the grocery store.  He'd flirt with the older ladies at work.  I watched him soak up the attention of one of his female friends who was tipsy one evening and hanging all over him.  Now, he has a new gf, and I suspect a lot of that's about validation, too.  I know he got a lot of attention and validation from me.  You're right -- this people pleasing behavior doesn't promote faithfulness or a lasting relationship.

Like you, I tried to make things better.  I learned how to communicate better, validate, etc.  Things seemed to improve, but that was temporary.  Agreements that we'd make wouldn't stick.  He'd forget them, or I suspect sometimes just not have control over the impulse not to follow through, even though it would be something so easy to fulfill -- and something that made perfect sense to him before.  That was so hard for me to wrap my mind around, but it's not logical.  It's a DISORDER.  Yeah, "duh," exactly.  I did (and still do) feel helpless not being able to impact the result.  Just imagine how they feel.

My ex mentioned having "disorders" but never said explicitly what they were.  He does have all 9 BPD traits, though.  He's been in therapy for 10 (yes TEN!) years.  He really, really tries so hard and has some incredible self-awareness.  However, like your ex, he'd be so sure of something, so dedicated to being better, doing things right, using DBT skills, surprising me with his improvements, and then a little further down the road doing the same old things.  It must be SO hard to be trapped like they are.

[mcc503764]

Each day of this journey surprises me. A totally new perspective, a deeper understanding, a new found appreciation for something, every day my understanding of both my relationship with my BPDex as well as the reasons that I stayed and how I behaved deepens.

Todays' ah ha! moment is that when we are dealing with pwBPD, we are dealing with people who are TRULY disordered. I know that is very "duh" sounding, as most all of us learned that or were told upon first coming to this board, but I guess I don't know that I fully appreciated what that meant, and because of it I have caused myself a lot of mental anguish.

For the past few months I have been going back through my relationship remembering certain events, certain conversations, defining moments that, for me, set the tone of the relationship.  I have been comparing those things to the outcome of the relationship, how it ACTUALLY progressed, and finding huge discrepancies... . kind of like if you were to add 3 + 3 and get 7.  It has been horribly confusing and distressing, causing myself a lot of pain and anguish and overall keeping me trapped in the past, trying to make sense of it all.

I have realized that the reason trying to make sense of all of it has been driving me crazy is that it is impossible to; I am trying to reason through things that someone said and did as though they think logically and consistently- and that just is not the case.  I have noticed recently more than ever as I have looked backwards, that my BPDex has ZERO consistency in her life. No consistency in the people in her life, how she thinks, or how she acts.

A friend of mine who met her while we dated talked to me after we split and after he heard about all the cheating she did and said something to the effect of, "that is so surprising... . she seems like such a cool girl when you talk to her".  I found a quote by Winston Churchill which I have found very telling on the matter,

“You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.”

She seems like such a cool girl, and everyone seems to like her, because she is a people pleaser.  Whoever she is with, whoever she is around at the time, is who she is seeking validation from.  That makes it IMPOSSIBLE to be faithful or to maintain a lasting relationship.  The fact is, not everyone is supposed to like you.  If they do, there is not a whole lot of substance to who "you" really are.

I look back at how my BPDex has been married and divorced at 19, engaged 2-3 more times on top of that, been pregnant on purpose and chosen to later abort the child, been with MANY different men, and how she dives headfirst into every relationship she has all at the age of 22, and realize that this is not a person who has any sort of consistency in her thought process.  How quickly she can devalue a partner and move towards marriage with the next one (who just messaged her randomly on facebook) is a testament to how NOTHING is lasting for her.

The entire thing is scary to think about, and I think I understand a little more about why the whole experience has been so traumatizing... . for one of the first times in my life, I have had NO control over a major part of my life.  I certainly tried to influence things in that relationship, to make things better, try  different strategies, but the fact is if everything that you work towards goes in one ear, stays there for 5 hours, and then goes straight out the other, NOTHING YOU DO will impact the result.  It is a very helpless feeling, one that has make me very uncomfortable.

Just the idea that someone's brain could actually NOT BE WORKING CORRECTLY as opposed to it working correctly and them actively choosing to do these things is mind boggling to me.

I was always amazed at how she KNEW she had BPD, she was in treatment for it, she always talked about how much she hated it and wanted to be better, and yet a day later she would be off repeating problem behaviors and causing more issues.  It was like a lightswitch awareness, there one second and totally lost the next. 

It is very confusing to talk to and connect with someone who is so sure of something, so dedicated to being better, doing things right, and then a little bit further down the road seeing them doing the same old things.

Perhaps this post speaks to someone else on this board- again, it seems like a pretty basic thought, but it is a pretty profound realization for me.

OUTSTANDING POST!  THANK YOU SOO MUCH FOR YOUR WORDS!

“You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.”

I love this quote, and I am going to keep it!  It is soo true, especially with our x's and when we get to the point to where we are able to set boundaries and stand by them!  This was such a turning point in MY life, when I was finally able to tell her that she was NOT going to walk over me again!  Funny how she disappeared after that?

I am sure there are many new players, but that doesn't even matter anymore!  what matters is ME and the things that I have control over in MY life!

It felt so nice to reclaim my testicles from her purse!

I know what you mean about her understanding of her illness... . Mine was hospitalized 2x for bulimia in her early 20's.  She is a high functioning THERAPIST, so she knows.  What she chooses to do with it is her choice / problem, not mine any longer!

Thanks for your post!

MCC

[Hazelrah]

As an addendum, I also saw the people-pleasing tendency in my W.  She became best friends with my mom, grew very close with my step-father and engaged socially with my SIL.  All of my friends adored her, as she was always on her best behavior around them and my family.  They couldn't believe how 'lucky' I was.  I even had ex-girlfriends comment on what an amazing wife I had. 

They never saw the days she spent laid up in bed due to some illness, pain, or mental affliction.  They never saw the drunken rages in which she begged me to have her hospitalized, or screamed that she wanted to end it all.  It broke my heart to see my W in such horrible pain... . yet strangely, she could always hold it together when we were in some sort of social situation. 

[mcc503764]

As an addendum, I also saw the people-pleasing tendency in my W.  She became best friends with my mom, grew very close with my step-father and engaged socially with my SIL.  All of my friends adored her, as she was always on her best behavior around them and my family.  They couldn't believe how 'lucky' I was.  I even had ex-girlfriends comment on what an amazing wife I had. 

They never saw the days she spent laid up in bed due to some illness, pain, or mental affliction.  They never saw the drunken rages in which she begged me to have her hospitalized, or screamed that she wanted to end it all.  It broke my heart to see my W in such horrible pain... . yet strangely, she could always hold it together when we were in some sort of social situation. 

How TRUE this all is... . at family events it would literally startle me when my xwife would show me some form of attention (hug, etc... . ) and looking back, it was just a show to my family.  Once home and behind closed doors, she was back to her passive, dismissive behavior that I was trained for... .

It's really insulting how she treated me!

MCC

[Iamdizzy]

bravo octoberfest   

fantastic post, thank you

Just the idea that someone's brain could actually NOT BE WORKING CORRECTLY as opposed to it working correctly and them actively choosing to do these things is mind boggling to me.

This really is boggling to me! I just can't concieve this notion at times. I guess we see them physically OK, they're able to excel at work, school, or what have you, they have a in our eyes a normal functioning brain. As much as they rage and BPD comes out, we still see the other aspects of them the 'normal functioning brain' and when we try to add them up despite so much data, we still have a hard time grasping the fact that perhaps they MIGHT JUST BE wired differently. I must thank you again for this post!

[Octoberfest]

It is amazing that so many of us could be on the same page... .

What an experience all of us have had in having these pwBPD in our lives.

Peace and Strength to all