What is financial abuse?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I keep hearing the term "financial abuse" and I am wondering what exactly it is. My uBPDh and I have our own separate accounts and make about the same amount of money. But he likes to hoard his while I like to make sure all the bills are paid. When we first met, his idea of paying bills was wait til a service, such as the phone or electricity, got shut off and then finally pay it, grumbling the whole time. I took over most of the bills as I couldn't deal with this. Of course that ended up with me paying almost everything, despite me getting laid off from my job and taking a lesser paying position. Eventually I started setting up auto bill pay for some bills from his account so he had to pay them, but to this day our son is 8 and he has not paid a single thing for him except daycare for 3 months out of 7 years. I just keep on keeping on, but I keep getting broker... . if that's a word. I have asked him to help, even just given him a Dr bill and said here pay this, but nothing works. I have even paid for his kids bills, because they were in his name and he refused, and I didn't want it to go on our joint credit. I have provided Christmas and birthday presents for his daughters and grand kids, even when he wouldn't help. Is this financial abuse? He always says he's broke and can't afford anything, but he has literally thousands in his account and can travel and gamble when he wants.

[mace17]

I keep hearing the term "financial abuse" and I am wondering what exactly it is. My uBPDh and I have our own separate accounts and make about the same amount of money. But he likes to hoard his while I like to make sure all the bills are paid. When we first met, his idea of paying bills was wait til a service, such as the phone or electricity, got shut off and then finally pay it, grumbling the whole time. I took over most of the bills as I couldn't deal with this. Of course that ended up with me paying almost everything, despite me getting laid off from my job and taking a lesser paying position. Eventually I started setting up auto bill pay for some bills from his account so he had to pay them, but to this day our son is 8 and he has not paid a single thing for him except daycare for 3 months out of 7 years. I just keep on keeping on, but I keep getting broker... . if that's a word. I have asked him to help, even just given him a Dr bill and said here pay this, but nothing works. I have even paid for his kids bills, because they were in his name and he refused, and I didn't want it to go on our joint credit. I have provided Christmas and birthday presents for his daughters and grand kids, even when he wouldn't help. Is this financial abuse? He always says he's broke and can't afford anything, but he has literally thousands in his account and can travel and gamble when he wants.

[DrJones]

Eventually I started setting up auto bill pay for some bills from his account so he had to pay them, but to this day our son is 8 and he has not paid a single thing for him except daycare for 3 months out of 7 years. I just keep on keeping on, but I keep getting broker... . if that's a word. I have asked him to help, even just given him a Dr bill and said here pay this, but nothing works.

Well, I think you have give an answer to your own question. He is abusing of you... . financially. It sounds familiar to me too, since my wife is quite the same. What she earns is for herself (because she has worked for it), what I earn is "ours" because "we are a family".

We have separate accounts, as you, but the problem is when we are not working or stuck in a place (like right now). She has spent all her money, there is no "common money" so who pays everything? me again

I have told her that from now 20% of our incomes go to a common box so that we can have good holidays and so on... . I know it will be hard because often she will say something like "this month I cannot pay that 20% because I need new shoes, coat, this and that... . " (next month most probably will repeat the same with different items) but I have to give it a go.

Could you do something similar?

[mace17]

I have tried something similar, came up with a budget once and figured out exactly how much each of us would have to put into a joint account out of each check to pay all the bills. He said there was no way he could do that because he wouldn't have enough money left for him and he'd be broke. Even though all bills would be covered and he would have $400 - $600 every month for "fun" money. So that didn't fly.

[OnceConfused]

you might want to sit down with a pad of paper and bills to show where the money is going out.

THings that are joined like rent/mortgage, utility need some $ from both.

THings that are his, need to be on his account.

You are abused, not because he is an abuser, but because YOU LET HIM ABUSE YOU. You have fought meekly with him, and no wonder he does what he wants.

[DreamFlyer99]

I had just read the below in "tools-domestic abuse": https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=61403.0

FINANCIAL ABUSE

- taking victim's money

- withholding money

- not allowing victim money

- giving victim an allowance

- keeping family finances a secret

- spending money foolishly

- pressuring victim to take full responsibility for finances

-not paying fair share of bills

- not spending money of special occasions when able (birthdays etc)

spending on addictions, gambling, sexual services

- not letting victim have access to family income

From that it looks like the answer is "yes."

One of the things i really lost sight of in my long years of being married to my uBPDh was of what were the markers of a good relationship. Reciprocity rates high on that list, that give and take of a relationship of peers. That reciprocity often goes away in these relationships where one partner is really only looking at how things affect them and not the two of them as a team.

[AllisG]

You are abused, not because he is an abuser, but because YOU LET HIM ABUSE YOU. You have fought meekly with him, and no wonder he does what he wants.

That's a little harsh, no?


My bf did the opposite.  He uses money as another way of controlling me. 

He witholds, refuses to pay his share of bills unless I do what he wants, I have to ask him for money or to do anything.

[hergestridge]

I don't know when to talk of "abuse" or not, but I know that I end up paying for a lot of things.

We set aside a certain amount of money every month for common expenses, and my BPDw *refuses* to keep track of how much money is left on that account. When she comes along to the store (which is like once a week), she just spends like there is no tomorrow. And for every item I *gently* questions the necesity of buying, it's like another rejection to her and finally the just snaps.

Consequently, the account is empty a week or two before payday, and I end up paying for food and gas until then.

For her the problem was not that we spent money. The problem was that we ran out of money. I have tried talking to her about that for fifteen years now. Her brain is permanently re-wired not to understand her own  part in her (or my) misfortunes so I have just given up to be honest.

Yesterday I though I'd do something about. The account for common expenses was empty again. I told her that we now had to put a 100euros each so we can buy food and gas for the next few weeks. She sulked a bit as usual, but she did the transfer. But the first thing she did when she came into the store was to go the kitchenware department, grabbed two pans and some tools because she was now fed up with having the pancakes getting stuck in those old f*king pans.

There is no way she will take the situation known as "NO MONEY" seriously. She keeps acting as if it was something I made up and spend the money we needed for food just to piss me off. Every visit to the store is like that. Even though we have separate economy it turns into a fight where she wants to spend and I try to stop her.

My point is that this kind of thing can be just as damaging as any form of control or abuse. We spend like 7-800 euros each months on gas and food, which is way too much for a two person household with one small child. Every attempt to change the sitauation ends either with her blaming me (!) or with her crying, sobbing and just generally dysregulating.

Planning food and cooking is hell too. If I  do it it works OK, but I'm not home from work having picked up our daughter from daycare until 18.00. My BPDw is bored by cooking and only does it if it's an advanced dish that she finds amusing to cook which means that

a/ it's semi-experimental and 50% likely to be non-eatable, especially for a small child

b/ it requires many special ingredients and tends to be expensive

c/ she will rage if it doesn't work out and if we don't eat

d/ I will have to stay up late to clean up the kitchen

I prefer to do it all myself, needless to say... .

[Forestaken]

You are abused, not because he is an abuser, but because YOU LET HIM ABUSE YOU. You have fought meekly with him, and no wonder he does what he wants.

That's a little harsh, no?

My bf did the opposite.  He uses money as another way of controlling me. 

He witholds, refuses to pay his share of bills unless I do what he wants, I have to ask him for money or to do anything.

As an abuse survivor, I will tell you these words are VERY HARSH.  The quest for peace for your kids and yourself will drive you to give into their demands or take the abuse then give in.  My kids and I were abused verbally, emotionally, physically and financially. My Xw controlled the money despite the fact I was the sole earner.  I was only allowed to keep the coins from purchases she made.  

My credit cards were in her purse.  She didn’t pay the bills, I did but had to give her an accounting every month in a form she could understand.  She took money from the kids (Birthday gifts from Grandparents).

Abuse doesn’t come in a day, it’s a slow boil.  

[mace17]

Now this one is strange to me... . I have asked for help from my H several times with paying for daycare, but he just won't do it.  Last night we took the dog to the vet to get vaccinations, and he unexpectedly paid the bill. His explanation was since he won't pay for daycare he can at least pay for the vet bill. Huh? The vet bill was only about $70, and a one time thing.  Daycare is that per week.  His excuse - if he could just swipe a card at daycare instead of having to write a check he would think about paying it. 

[Waddams]

Re: What is financial abuse?

I guess in a bigger sense, to me financial abuse is taking unfair advantage of someone else financially in a planned/purposeful fashion.

The example of a person uses access/restriction to family money is one way.

In my case, my uPDxw knew what our budget was, but overspent it and ran up debts anyway.  She didn't care what impact it had on me trying to keep up.  I never used money to control her, but I did eventually have to start taking action to cut off her overspending. 

I have even paid for his kids bills, because they were in his name and he refused, and I didn't want it to go on our joint credit.

Is there such a thing as joint credit?  If he has bills that are his, and has the money to pay them, then let him worry about it.  If he has to deal with consequences such as the daycare saying he can't drop the kids off, then so be it.  If you want him to pay his fair share, then at least stop paying his personal expenses.  He won't pay his fair share of family expenses if you're paying it all AND other personal expenses of his.

And when he gets upset about it, let him.

[mace17]

Actually yes, there is such a thing as joint credit, at least where I live.  If he doesn't pay a bill and it goes to a collection agency, even though it is in his name it will show up on my credit report.  This is why I can't let that happen.  I have already been denied credit because of things he hasn't paid, and that's why I monitor his bills too. I hate having to bail him out sometimes, especially since its not like he doesn't have the money he's just lazy and stingy, but if I don't if will affect my credit too.

[DreamFlyer99]

Mace17,

do you have thoughts on what you want to do with the information about financial abuse? It sounds like you're facing a really difficult situation where you feel badly taken advantage of.

Abuse tends to be about control, so if your husband is being less responsible than you by not paying his own personal bills or helping with his own child's daycare you can take a look at what he might be getting out of his actions. For instance, being irresponsible is paying off for him because you will take care of things he's not interested in taking care of since you don't want your own credit messed up. So he gets to do less work while you take on more.

Are you thinking that you need to find a way to separate your finances more thoroughly?

If you're wondering what you could do legally, have you checked out the Leaving Board: Family law, divorce and custody? i know you aren't leaving, but they may have some wisdom about dealing with this financial issue.

How is the rest of the marriage?