MC not going fast enough

[Zon]

My wife was complaining during an hour and a half browbeating about many (approximately 20) things.  She complained about me having difficulty or being unable to open up emotionally within the MC session.  I had said during the session that I did not because I was protecting myself.  She said that she doubted I would ever open to her or anyone.  I used to be open with her, but that was not discussed.  I consider myself more open in the session than she.

Furthermore, she said that she had looked within herself and did not see how she could have done anything to me beside possibly being her loud self.  This goes along with her accusations that I am too sensitive.

It all started with an argument over something minor where she handed me her rings to hold onto when I did not relent to agree that what she believed happened was what I had originally thought happened.  This is in contrast to me thinking something different happened and agreeing with her that I was wrong.  I told her that she was right, but I had originally thought something else had happened.

Question:  has anyone else experienced their pwBPD (and NPD in my case) complaining that they were not going fast enough in MC?  How did you handle it and were the results good?

P.S.  I am too sensitive and not open enough.  

[formflier]

My wife was complaining during an hour and a half browbeating about many (approximately 20) things.  She complained about me having difficulty or being unable to open up emotionally within the MC session.  I had said during the session that I did not because I was protecting myself.  She said that she doubted I would ever open to her or anyone.  I used to be open with her, but that was not discussed.  I consider myself more open in the session than she.

Initial reaction... .that is way too many things.  Most successful MC session I have been in... .each side gets 1 or 2. 

I also think that each party should talk about their own emotions... rather than complaining about the other party.  Behavior is a different story. 

Her emotions are hers... .yours are yours... .you can each have your own valid emotions... and should be fine with that.

If you act irrationally... .that is different story.

Furthermore, she said that she had looked within herself and did not see how she could have done anything to me beside possibly being her loud self.  This goes along with her accusations that I am too sensitive.

It all started with an argument over something minor where she handed me her rings to hold onto when I did not relent to agree that what she believed happened was what I had originally thought happened.  This is in contrast to me thinking something different happened and agreeing with her that I was wrong.  I told her that she was right, but I had originally thought something else had happened.

Question:  has anyone else experienced their pwBPD (and NPD in my case) complaining that they were not going fast enough in MC?  How did you handle it and were the results good?

P.S.  I am too sensitive and not open enough. 

Any chance you can take some time and write out the details of the disagreement?

I'm out of time... .but this sounds like something I used to get caught up in.  I think I may be able to help you out better with some detail.

Hang in there!   

[Zon]

My wife was complaining during an hour and a half browbeating about many (approximately 20) things.  She complained about me having difficulty or being unable to open up emotionally within the MC session.  I had said during the session that I did not because I was protecting myself.  She said that she doubted I would ever open to her or anyone.  I used to be open with her, but that was not discussed.  I consider myself more open in the session than she.

Initial reaction... .that is way too many things.  Most successful MC session I have been in... .each side gets 1 or 2.  

I also think that each party should talk about their own emotions... rather than complaining about the other party.  Behavior is a different story.  

Her emotions are hers... .yours are yours... .you can each have your own valid emotions... and should be fine with that.

If you act irrationally... .that is different story.

I should clarify that this all occured after the counseling session.  We are limited during the session.  EFT definitely focuses on emotions which she seems to have difficulty handling.  I am not saying it easy for me, but I do not embrace anger like she does nor do I leave the session to contain myself.

In the most recent counseling session, she left just before the end because she could not handle her emotions again.

According to my therapist, her biggest issue is that she cannot handle her emotions at all.  Her losing it and leaving the session (now sessions) is not a favorable sign.  My wife has said that she will take up the MC's offer to see him individually, so that will be interesting.  My T had spoken (before our last MC session) with the MC at least from my view of things.

Furthermore, she said that she had looked within herself and did not see how she could have done anything to me beside possibly being her loud self.  This goes along with her accusations that I am too sensitive.

It all started with an argument over something minor where she handed me her rings to hold onto when I did not relent to agree that what she believed happened was what I had originally thought happened.  This is in contrast to me thinking something different happened and agreeing with her that I was wrong.  I told her that she was right, but I had originally thought something else had happened.

Question:  has anyone else experienced their pwBPD (and NPD in my case) complaining that they were not going fast enough in MC?  How did you handle it and were the results good?

P.S.  I am too sensitive and not open enough.  

Any chance you can take some time and write out the details of the disagreement?

I'm out of time... .but this sounds like something I used to get caught up in.  I think I may be able to help you out better with some detail.

Hang in there!  

Here it is in a nutshell:

• We were in kitchen and our D9 was outside.  S3 was loud and energetic.



• D9 had knocked and wanted inside.  Her head was against the glass due to the glare.



• I looked towards the sliding glass door and pointed/indicated for her to go around to the front of the house.



• Wife said, "She did not see you."  She later told me about the glare.  Even later, I remembered D9 pressed against the glass to see better.



• I looked back and saw that D9 was not there.  I heard something that could have been a knock or someone walking on the wood deck.



• I said she did see me since she was not there.



• Wife got upset and said, "She is right there!" while pointing.



• I realized that my wife could see through a small gap where I could not.



• I admitted that she was right, and I did not understand at first because I thought there was only one view outdoors which showed D9 was not there.  I had thought my wife was talking was older information.



• Wife tried to get me to admit that I was not listening/ignoring her.



• I denied ignoring her and said it was just a minor misunderstanding on my part.



• Wife tried harder to get me to believe that I was intentionally ignoring her.



• I would not budge.  I told her that I did not understand and admitted that I was mistaken but would not admit to ignoring her.



• Wife handed me her rings for safekeeping for the night.



• Wife then complained about 20 different items/issues for the next hour and a half.

I was really not in a good position with that argument.  First, she was trying to get me to remember the event in a different way.  I cannot let my memory be tampered with by her anymore.  Second, agreeing to ignoring her would have validated that thought of hers, yet invalidated her at a deeper level (ignoring her).  That would have made it even worse.  Obviously, my accepting my mistake and saying she was right was not good enough for her.

In a normal relationship, she would just call me a doofus and roll her eyes then both of us would move on.  I really, really, really want it that way.

I am happy that I am keeping a journal, but it is so hard to remember all the items she throws out all the time.  :)o you suppose I could ask her if I could type it all as she complains?  

[formflier]

Here it is in a nutshell:

• We were in kitchen and our D9 was outside.  S3 was loud and energetic.



• D9 had knocked and wanted inside.  Her head was against the glass due to the glare.



• I looked towards the sliding glass door and pointed/indicated for her to go around to the front of the house.



• Wife said, "She did not see you."  She later told me about the glare.  Even later, I remembered D9 pressed against the glass to see better.



• I looked back and saw that D9 was not there.  I heard something that could have been a knock or someone walking on the wood deck.



• I said she did see me since she was not there.



• Wife got upset and said, "She is right there!" while pointing.



• I realized that my wife could see through a small gap where I could not.



• I admitted that she was right, and I did not understand at first because I thought there was only one view outdoors which showed D9 was not there.  I had thought my wife was talking was older information.



• Wife tried to get me to admit that I was not listening/ignoring her.



• I denied ignoring her and said it was just a minor misunderstanding on my part.



• Wife tried harder to get me to believe that I was intentionally ignoring her.



• I would not budge.  I told her that I did not understand and admitted that I was mistaken but would not admit to ignoring her.



• Wife handed me her rings for safekeeping for the night.



• Wife then complained about 20 different items/issues for the next hour and a half.

I was really not in a good position with that argument.  First, she was trying to get me to remember the event in a different way.  I cannot let my memory be tampered with by her anymore.  Second, agreeing to ignoring her would have validated that thought of hers, yet invalidated her at a deeper level (ignoring her).  That would have made it even worse.  Obviously, my accepting my mistake and saying she was right was not good enough for her.

In a normal relationship, she would just call me a doofus and roll her eyes then both of us would move on.  I really, really, really want it that way.

I am happy that I am keeping a journal, but it is so hard to remember all the items she throws out all the time.  :)o you suppose I could ask her if I could type it all as she complains?  

Hmmm... .Ok... this is going to be a quick reaction.  I'm going to need to think on this for a bit... .and hopefully some other more senior members can chime in.

My gut tells me that the perceived mishandling of the "door incident"... .got things rolling for the 1.5 hr browbeating.

The door incident may have bee time for a "perhaps your are right" response... ."I'm sorry honey... .(give her a big hug)... .and admit "I should pay more attention".  "Thanks for helping me out on this... "

Then try to move along.

Because you are correct... .you don't want to admit... .for sure... .that you are ignoring her... you also don't want to invalidate her argument.  So... "perhaps" done pleasantly... .and then focusing on validating other things... ."that she can catch detail you didn't see"... .that she is so helpful... .etc etc.

Lots of these double bind things are tough to navigate.  Sometimes there is no solution... .just limit damage and move on.

Now... for the 1.5 hr browbeating.  Best to avoid it... .but if you get in the browbeating stage... .we'll need to figure out when to use a limit.  And stick to it. Don't try this until we have chatted it out some   

We want limits (boundaries) to stick.

Hopefully a senior member can give a better word track for the browbeating.

"What can I solve for you right now?"  help me understand how xyz affects you? 

Who knows... .but I would guess that once the browbeating starts... you need to exit... .somehow.

Hang in there and thanks for the detail.  I think we'll be able to help.

[Zon]

Here it is in a nutshell:

• We were in kitchen and our D9 was outside.  S3 was loud and energetic.



• D9 had knocked and wanted inside.  Her head was against the glass due to the glare.



• I looked towards the sliding glass door and pointed/indicated for her to go around to the front of the house.



• Wife said, "She did not see you."  She later told me about the glare.  Even later, I remembered D9 pressed against the glass to see better.



• I looked back and saw that D9 was not there.  I heard something that could have been a knock or someone walking on the wood deck.



• I said she did see me since she was not there.



• Wife got upset and said, "She is right there!" while pointing.



• I realized that my wife could see through a small gap where I could not.



• I admitted that she was right, and I did not understand at first because I thought there was only one view outdoors which showed D9 was not there.  I had thought my wife was talking was older information.



• Wife tried to get me to admit that I was not listening/ignoring her.



• I denied ignoring her and said it was just a minor misunderstanding on my part.



• Wife tried harder to get me to believe that I was intentionally ignoring her.



• I would not budge.  I told her that I did not understand and admitted that I was mistaken but would not admit to ignoring her.



• Wife handed me her rings for safekeeping for the night.



• Wife then complained about 20 different items/issues for the next hour and a half.

I was really not in a good position with that argument.  First, she was trying to get me to remember the event in a different way.  I cannot let my memory be tampered with by her anymore.  Second, agreeing to ignoring her would have validated that thought of hers, yet invalidated her at a deeper level (ignoring her).  That would have made it even worse.  Obviously, my accepting my mistake and saying she was right was not good enough for her.

In a normal relationship, she would just call me a doofus and roll her eyes then both of us would move on.  I really, really, really want it that way.

I am happy that I am keeping a journal, but it is so hard to remember all the items she throws out all the time.  :)o you suppose I could ask her if I could type it all as she complains?  

Hmmm... .Ok... this is going to be a quick reaction.  I'm going to need to think on this for a bit... .and hopefully some other more senior members can chime in.

My gut tells me that the perceived mishandling of the "door incident"... .got things rolling for the 1.5 hr browbeating.

The door incident may have bee time for a "perhaps your are right" response... ."I'm sorry honey... .(give her a big hug)... .and admit "I should pay more attention".  "Thanks for helping me out on this... "

Then try to move along.

I concur completely.  At first, I was trying to understand what was going on.  I did not understand why she said someone was there when I could not see that person.  After I finally understood, which did not take too long, I told her that she was right and I was mistaken.  I told her what my faulty reasoning/confusion was.  I then tried to move along as I could see her getting agitated even more.  She was intent on sticking to it.

Because you are correct... .you don't want to admit... .for sure... .that you are ignoring her... you also don't want to invalidate her argument.  So... "perhaps" done pleasantly... .and then focusing on validating other things... ."that she can catch detail you didn't see"... .that she is so helpful... .etc etc.

Lots of these double bind things are tough to navigate.  Sometimes there is no solution... .just limit damage and move on.

Now... for the 1.5 hr browbeating.  Best to avoid it... .but if you get in the browbeating stage... .we'll need to figure out when to use a limit.  And stick to it. Don't try this until we have chatted it out some   

I have typically let her continue for a few reasons:  I am deer and I see headlights, she may give more clue about what is bothering her and she may calm down from venting.  However, I am finally realizing that it does not help her nor me.

However, she has let somethings slip that I bring as topics within the counseling sessions to ask.  I like having the mediator there. 

We want limits (boundaries) to stick.

Hopefully a senior member can give a better word track for the browbeating.

"What can I solve for you right now?"  help me understand how xyz affects you? 

Who knows... .but I would guess that once the browbeating starts... you need to exit... .somehow.

Hang in there and thanks for the detail.  I think we'll be able to help.

Cool and thank you.