Techniques for Communiqués

[Mutt]

I'm struggling with communication with ex in the last few weeks. Seasons have an effect on her and she becomes incredibly difficult. Rinse / repeat for every year I have known her which is coming up to 10. To make a long story short. She's been invalidating me in ways like "it's been two years Mutt, get over it." I find that she's trying to create these situations more often in the last two months where she wants me in her vicinity.

I think she's triggered with intimacy. Do I wait 'til this blows over and she finds a new attachment?

If I use T she's triggered and obviously so, I'm usually to the point with T. If I use SET she thinks I'm overtly friendly and gets the wrong idea and asks me to go out on family things with the kids on her time and she thinks we're friends. Court was a nightmare and shortly ended awhile ago, I haven't forgotten. I refuse each time ( parallel parenting )  That said I think it's going to have to come down to BIFF. Lately she's Queen / Waif. I'm feeling frustration with communication. My question to members with kids. Do you gage what his / her emotions and respond in an appropriate communication technique (SET, JADE, BIFF) or stick to one formula like BIFF.

I don't feel like I have an obligation with being friendly with SET at least not in the near future. Affair, High-Conflict Custody, Bankruptcy Protection, these are all things in a span of 24 months and she's dissociated it. I haven't and I don't want her anywhere within my vicinity.

[Nope]

We always BIFF. As hard as it is to believe, my DH's BPDex does still want him back despite the fact that she can't bring herself to treat him like a human being with feelings for even five minutes. Even the kids are fully aware that she treats him badly and hates me because she has regrets and wishes she was with him again. What we've figured out is that nothing DH does is going to effect her feelings or her actions. So we simply give her the information that must be exchanged and let the chips fall where they may.

We just had a mini blow up right before Thanksgiving because she couldn't get ahold of the kids right at the very minute she decided she wanted to. There was a whole lot of blaming and overreacting from her side. It all probably had more to do with not having any of her kids with her and her entire family wanting nothing to do with her. That would be hard on anybody on Thanksgiving. During holidays what she really needs is someone to belittle and rage at to release the pressure. No reason that needs to be any of us.

I guess what I'm getting at is: BIFF, but don't forget the "friendly". And be prepared to ignore follow up emails that are just looking for further engagement.

[Mutt]

She's not being forthright. She's trying to emotionally blackmail me and the common denominator is meetings in the kids extra-curricular activities,  school functions and meetings. She had zero interest with co-parenting and responses to communiques. Now, she has a sudden interest and it raises alarm bells.

I'd be lying if I said I don't feel a little anxiety. I let her have this one with the school as she was invisibly insistent that she HAS to be there at my appointment. It gives her opportune chances with triangulating me with teachers and projecting herself. What's important is the kids work without her distortions at these meetings.

I have the kids this Christmas and I expect to be blasted. She had them last year and I had them on the 26th and she had a mini meltdown. It's not for me to worry about or for me to sooth her.

I like that Nope. Let the chips fall where they may. I guess I did do that in this instance and didn't feel guilt, knowing that this is her behavior and there'll be other opportunities where I'll be prepped and anticipating these no-win situations. I agree with BIFF and thanks for the advice. I still have another 14 years to deal with her and realistically we haven't been seperated for terribly long. I'm banking on her finding someone new she will return to her emotional baseline.

[PinkieV]

My DH's uBPDew has been very good this week, as SS14 has been with her. We expect a ramp up of negative FB posts today and over the weekend as he leaves tomorrow (we live two states away and have custody).  She tried negative engagement last Saturday when SS was on his way, and DH shut down the conversation after one sarcastic reply. Yes, we know he shouldn't, but sometimes it just feels too good!

Interestingly, SS texted last night asking for the dates of his Christmas visitation - we had him all holidays last year as she was in jail. He knows the dates, she knows the dates, so not sure what that was about. DH is going to book a later than normal flight out so that SS14 can see SS18 for an hour or so as SS18 will be arriving for holiday leave from bootcamp that same day. SS18 has no interest in a relationship with BM right now, and that may have something to do with it. We'll wait and see!

For the most part uBPDew is quiet until she sees SS14, so we brace ourselves and then move on. Even SS14 has learned he's not responsible for her happiness - score a big one for counseling!

[david]

My ex left in 2007. We have two kids so NC is not possible. I still get emails telling me that I need to move on as she did ?  I used to try to figure it out but I simply don't care anymore why she sends emails like that.

I have come to realize that emails like that or something else accusatory usually means ex is stressed in some way and I am a safe outlet for her to "rage". I ignore it.

I communicate through email only and ex has been on a mission for half a year now to try to break that boundary. I believe she doesn't like the documentation as it takes away her "power" and also exposes her behavior.

I sometimes, not as often as before, get emails going all over the place with allegations, passive/aggressive bs, outright lies. I ignore it all. If there is something about the boys in it I respond to that only. I use the three to five sentence minimum rule. I rarely exceed five sentences.

[Mutt]

I communicate through email only and ex has been on a mission for half a year now to try to break that boundary. I believe she doesn't like the documentation as it takes away her "power" and also exposes her behavior.

I notice she doesn't like this either this week. She was adding urgency in her email that I needed to give her a response before midnight a couple of hours after she had sent it because she's "not going to have internet access". I thought is she trying to say her home internet service is getting cut off due to non-payment   I sent her an email inquiring about an approximate time when she was done with the kids. She sent an email on her Samsung phone as the footer says Sent from Samsung mobile saying "sorry no internet access can't give response" Very sad. I think she doesn't like emails and is trying to bust boundaries.

[Nope]

I notice she doesn't like this either this week. She was adding urgency in her email that I needed to give her a response before midnight a couple of hours after she had sent it because she's "not going to have internet access". I thought is she trying to say her home internet service is getting cut off due to non-payment   I sent her an email inquiring about an approximate time when she was done with the kids. She sent an email on her Samsung phone as the footer says Sent from Samsung mobile saying "sorry no internet access can't give response" Very sad. I think she doesn't like emails and is trying to bust boundaries.

*blink blink*

... .You'll have to excuse me. I'm having a hard time with this. You are saying she sent you an email saying she couldn't respond to you because she has no internet access? That's something special right there.

Reminds me of the time my DH's ex spent several minutes on the phone arguing with DH that she didn't have time to call the kid's school and let them know to release the kids to DH for his parenting time. While we were waiting outside the school office to get them no less.

[Mutt]

That's exactly what I'm saying. She said it in e-mail twice that she has no internet access. If I said this to people in real life. This board is a godsend. I look like the crazy one   She's dissociating. I'm of sound mind and level headed.  

I'm not too worried about not using BIFF this time as she is clearly not of sound mind in this particular series of communiques. I'm sure a judge or L would pick up   's IF it were to make it's way in court.

[david]

I sent an email last week and she replied in an email that her email wasn't working too. I realized she didn't want to answer the email and I know the reason why. Soo, I sent a text through my email account to her phone. I told her she could reply through her phone and I would receive it in my email account. She still did not reply. We have a court date set next month for me seeking extra custody time and this is just more for my lawyer to use.

[Mutt]

david there are similarities between our exes. I'm of mind that mine is quite ill. I'm not a professional and can't diagnose. I'm curious is your ex diagnosed?

I know you can send a text by email using the sms extension for a cell number, if you know the carrier's sms extension. For example in the US and ATT it would be @txt.att.net.

Are you saying your sending your email to your cell sms extension then forwarding this to your exe's sms and carrier then if she replies to your sms message, you get it returned to your email inbox so it's captured? If so, how do you do that?

It's not legal to be able to get records of the contents of an sms message from the carrier (at least in Canada) The carrier will provide how many text messages and what numbers they were sent to.

[david]

Yes, I sent it using phone number@txt.att.net. That goes to her cell. It does limit the number of characters but my messages are brief anyway so that is not a problem. If she replies it goes to my email account because that is where I sent it from.

My ex, as far as I know, was never diagnosed with BPD. However, she was diagnosed in 2007 with PTSD, sleep deprivation, and major depression with psychosis. She went to a mental health facility for a weekend. They wanted her there longer but legally could not keep her. Recently I learned she has been diagnosed with adjustment disorder because of our divorce. The divorce was 4 years ago and adjustment disorders usually last around six months. When she left she emptied our house. She removed all the electrical outlet covers (a total of 47), the three toilet paper holders, etc. I mean emptied. She left very little and that was smashed or broken in some way. Lots of anger. She did leave in our attic a plastic bag on top of an empty box. The bag contained a journal she kept from back in the late 80's early 90's right before we met. It goes on to about 6 months after we met. It has 8 out of the 9 criteria in it for BPD. She is a nurse too. She gave her textbooks to one of her sons from her first marriage. He went to nursing school too. He didn't use the books but he kept them. When ex left the house he moved back in. Her textbook on psychology was in the bunch. It was around 870 pages long. It had a chapter on personality disorders. It had DSM III criteria in it so it gives you an idea of the age of the book. There were three pages in the entire book that had highlights. Yep, it was on BPD.

I don't know if she was ever officially diagnosed. Either she was and never told me or she thinks she is but has never been officially diagnosed.

A few months after she left I emailed her about dbt. The reply I got was extremely angry and threatening. I never said BPD and I thought I was trying to help her back then. I never said anything to her about it since. I do reply, in my emails, as if she does have BPD. When I started doing that things got (for lack of a better word) better. I still got nasty emails and sometimes still do. The frequency of the emails has declined and the anger is lessened. I stay focused on our two boys and never discuss anything else even when she tries.

We are currently going to a co parent counselor. It's court ordered. I am thinking about bringing some things up that will probably trigger her. I think it would help the counselor get what he is dealing with. I can do it in such a way that I would not be perceived as provoking her but it would expose her. It concerns our boys and is important to discuss if co parenting.

[Mutt]

I'm sorry to hear about the co-parenting co-coordinator david. I was pressured by ex and my L and her L saying that conflict is a part of divorce and it eventually fades. I wouldn't hear it. I retorted "when there's conflict in marriage and the marriage is over. I'm sorry, it doesn't mean conflict ends when the marriage ends". Honestly, from what I experienced in court it's "cookie cutter" in the sense that they treat everyone the same and I'm not a fan of co-parenting with a person that shows trusts of mental illness. Very early on I researched and decided to co-parent. She still doesn't like it and I told her she can co-parent. My boundary on myself is that I parallel parent regardless.

That's pretty far out there with the electrical covers and toilet paper covers. My mom works in a psychiatric hospital. She's dealt with a coworker that was BPD. I think your ex telegraphed the answer with disproportionate displays of anger when BPD was suggested. I was angry after the split and made suggestions about BPD and I got less than choice words. I keep mum about it now and have laser focused attention with her only about the kids needs. It hit me today, she doesn't want to be tracked by email so she may start calling again.

I'll subscribe to voicemail to text again. I'm single and don't want to pay for a landline and a cell is more versatile with screenshots so I cut the landline and it gives me better control. I only have one number she can reach me at and it makes it easier for me to track   Anyways voicemail to text  transcribes the voice recording into an email that you provide and converts the recording into a .wav file and attaches it to your chosen email address. I upload the attachments to the cloud for documentation in case of. Either way, whatever she chooses to communicate, text, phone ( I never pick up when it's her, straight to voicemail ) my boundary is it's going to get tracked. Once in court for false DV charges, second for custody as she wasn't giving me just visitation. The kids have a right to both parents and I'm protecting myself 'cause the kids need dad in their corner irregardless.

david from the sounds of it you parallel parent. I wish you the best of luck with this parenting co-ordinator and hope you keep parallel parenting for you and your boys. Some people simply get off on conflict and chaos, mentally ill or not.

[david]

I have been parallel parenting for several years now. I think around 2010. It works.

A few years ago I got rid of texting, landline, etc. The only way to communicate with me is email or my cell. I never picked up when my ex was calling me and let it go to voicemail. Ex then started calling me from various phones so I could not identify who was calling since the numbers were not in my phone book. I stopped answering my phone when I didn't recognize the number. During that time my phone would ring and I would let it go to voicemail and get no message. A few minutes later the phone would ring again and she would leave a voicemail. I never had to reply to any of them because they did not pertain to the kids. I would put the number in my phone book to identify it. I had 5 or 6 numbers in my phone book that way. She eventually stopped.

Since that time ex has tried a few other variations to try to talk to me.

Email has worked well since 2010 so I have no intention of changing something that works unless given a very good reason.

"That's pretty far out there with the electrical covers... ." When I got access to the house it was a mess' Things she did not take she broke and smashed them. I took photos. She did leave a disposable camera in our basement. I was cleaning the house when I found it. It had 6 photos taken. I decided to get them developed. One of the photos was a Uhaul truck in our driveway. It clearly showed the license plate. I went to Uhaul and explained I needed a receipt for our taxes. The receipt also showed the storage unit she rented. About two months after that I received a rejection letter from our homeowners. Ex made a claim saying I stole everything and made it look like her. The letter basically said since we were both on the homeowners that neither one of us could rob the house and then make a claim. I had to read it three times until it sank in and then I laughed so hard I had tears coming out of my eyes. During equitable distribution, three years later, she made similar claims. By then I had 40 to 60 photos from facebook with the things she took in her new place. She had four pages listed with individual items I had stolen. I had pictures showing at least three of the pages of things in her possession. When her atty seen a few of the pictures we settled in less than 15 minutes.

During those first three years she also filed a protection order every year against me. She also filed an assault charge. I was found guilty of disorderly conduct and lost my job as a result. I went to jail for two weeks. When I got out I purchased an audio recorder and a video recorder. The first time I went to pick the boys up after that she came walking out and headed right for me. Our court order states that we are to stay in our residence until the other party drives away. I turned the video camera on , stood out of my vehicle, and pointed it directly at her. When she realized what I was doing she made a uturn and went back into her place. She tried it again the next time and hasn't since that time. She has complained through her atty, in a custody eval, and to the co parent counselor that I am breaking the law by recording. My explanation has been that since that time I haven't had a single incident. A judge yelled at me about it. I asked him for an alternative that followed the law. He said nothing after that. I am so used to it now that it is just second nature for me.

Because of her anger she has pushed away her kids from her first marriage and is pretty close to completely alienating our kids. Our boys are 16 and 11 now. I see the same patterns in them that I see in my ss's. I tried to point out how she was pushing all the boys away from her and that just led to anger directed at me. She has so many defense mechanisms and if you break through one she retaliates in anger. I didn't cause it and I can't fix it. It is what it is.