It's taken only 3 days

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

So those of you who saw my earlier post know that today was full of eye opening revelations. Where I discovered I didn't even know my exBPDgf.

Earlier this evening my phone alerted me that it blocked a text from a blocked number, given that she is the only one blocked on my phone it could only have been from her. As it's blocked, I just know one was sent but not what was in it.

A couple of hours later, I received an email from exBPDgf that simply stated:

"I'm really upset right now. I have never cheated on you. I just don't know my own thoughts and emotions sometimes"

The problem with that statement is I saw the photographs, so even if intercourse wasn't involved, she still felt it acceptable to take photographs of her naked in bed with another man. I also found out from people I spoke to today that she was definitely cheating in September as it was with one of those people.

Given that my final message to her was to ask her to leave me and my family alone and that I cannot have any kind of relationship, friendship or otherwise with someone who cheated on me, I can only presume her statement is as a way of re-engagement or recycling. I guess Christmas fling isn't what she expected it to be or he saw the signs after I broke the triangle and she scared him off.

Since then, I've had 7 blocked calls in the last hour. Thankfully I've found a way to turn off the audio alert but not a way yet to stop my phone from telling me I have blocked calls or text messages.

Even if I did answer, I really wouldn't know what to say to her right now anyway. I'm in the process of healing and working through my own emotions, I don't have the strength or energy to soothe hers too. I may in the next few days engage her, simply to ask her to post back my key and as for her things, I shall post them to her.

I have no interest in an emotional engagement or a discussion around what she did and didn't do. As far as I'm concerned, I said it was over, she said it was over so until the day she emails to say she has started therapy and would really like some support (if ever) I'm going to concentrate on myself.

[Ripped Heart]

So those of you who saw my earlier post know that today was full of eye opening revelations. Where I discovered I didn't even know my exBPDgf.

Earlier this evening my phone alerted me that it blocked a text from a blocked number, given that she is the only one blocked on my phone it could only have been from her. As it's blocked, I just know one was sent but not what was in it.

A couple of hours later, I received an email from exBPDgf that simply stated:

"I'm really upset right now. I have never cheated on you. I just don't know my own thoughts and emotions sometimes"

The problem with that statement is I saw the photographs, so even if intercourse wasn't involved, she still felt it acceptable to take photographs of her naked in bed with another man. I also found out from people I spoke to today that she was definitely cheating in September as it was with one of those people.

Given that my final message to her was to ask her to leave me and my family alone and that I cannot have any kind of relationship, friendship or otherwise with someone who cheated on me, I can only presume her statement is as a way of re-engagement or recycling. I guess Christmas fling isn't what she expected it to be or he saw the signs after I broke the triangle and she scared him off.

Since then, I've had 7 blocked calls in the last hour. Thankfully I've found a way to turn off the audio alert but not a way yet to stop my phone from telling me I have blocked calls or text messages.

Even if I did answer, I really wouldn't know what to say to her right now anyway. I'm in the process of healing and working through my own emotions, I don't have the strength or energy to soothe hers too. I may in the next few days engage her, simply to ask her to post back my key and as for her things, I shall post them to her.

I have no interest in an emotional engagement or a discussion around what she did and didn't do. As far as I'm concerned, I said it was over, she said it was over so until the day she emails to say she has started therapy and would really like some support (if ever) I'm going to concentrate on myself.

[Samuel S.]

Ripped Heart, I am so very sorry that you are experiencing all of that with your ex. She obviously is a liar. You have photos of her. You have confirmation from others. She is being very deceptive, untrustworthy, and unkind. You deserve a person who is open, trustworthy, and kind. I applaud you for standing up for what is right! Hopefully, she will return things to you, and I would suggest that you two meet in a public place where there is a simple exchange, thank you, and goodbye. In this way, you will not be lured into her manipulation. Hang in there, my friend!

[HappyNihilist]

Oh, Ripped Heart, I'm so sorry.   I've been following your story, and my heart breaks for you.

I'm glad you're taking care of yourself and focusing on your needs.

You are a wonderful, caring, thoughtful, intelligent person. You deserve kind, honest, respectful treatment. You will not get that from her -- but you can give that to yourself. 

I have no interest in an emotional engagement or a discussion around what she did and didn't do.

I don't blame you one bit. She just wants to try to lie and justify herself, anyway. I highly doubt any discussion about this with her would be productive or satisfying for you.

As far as I'm concerned, I said it was over, she said it was over so until the day she emails to say she has started therapy and would really like some support (if ever) I'm going to concentrate on myself.

There, I fixed it for you. 

[Mutt]

"I'm really upset right now. I have never cheated on you. I just don't know my own thoughts and emotions sometimes"

An observation. I think there's partial truth, a lack of impulse control?

Even if I did answer, I really wouldn't know what to say to her right now anyway. I'm in the process of healing and working through my own emotions, I don't have the strength or energy to soothe hers too. I may in the next few days engage her, simply to ask her to post back my key and as for her things, I shall post them to her.

It's a good idea to reproach at a later time. I give 24 hours with my ex when she's dysregulated to find her in a different emotional state later. I don't sooth her. Communication is easier, impossible when she's dysregulated.

Ignore her calls. Taking care of you is priority #1.

I'm sorry you're going through this.

[Ripped Heart]

Many thanks for the responses guys, it really helped a lot.

Today I did engage, she sent an email asking for an address to send my keys back to so I responded quite simply with an address. A few minutes later, another email came through pleading with me to talk to her, so I emailed back and this is what I had to say:

"I think everything that has needed to be said has been said. I need time and space right now because I'm hurting badly, it hurts because I still love you and I still care so I need the time and space away from that now to heal and grieve.

I really hoped with all my heart and soul it could have worked for us. Sadly, I don't think it was ever going to be possible right from the very beginning and as much as I tried to give you that safety, security, attention and love I don't think it was ever going to be enough.

You said yourself right at the very beginning about hitting the self destruct button in relationships. I was foolish enough to think I could have ever made a difference and stopped that from happening. It was never within my control, it was always in yours. So I made the mistake in believing I could be something to you that I couldn't possibly be and spent a good part of the relationship trying to rescue you instead of just being myself. That's not your fault, that's all on me and to that I need to change who I am.

I learned a valuable lesson in all of this and that is, you can't save everybody, especially those who don't want to be rescued and that is a very painful lesson to learn.

I really do hope that one day you find what you are looking for and find your happiness and the love you desire because you are deserving of it.

I need to focus on who I am now and work on myself. So again, I don't think there is anything more left to discuss that hasn't already been said by either of us"

[Ripped Heart]

And here was the response to my message and the reason why people should listen to those much wiser, stronger and healthier when it comes to engagement:

I wish i could close my eyes and slip away

Darkness pulling me

Its calm

Its quiet

Peaceful

Wrapped around me

Comfort

[Mutt]

Don't be hard on yourself Ripped Heart. Infidelity hurts like hell.

I have many emails back and forth after my ex left with the other man. I wasn't proud, I was also wounded. I was angry at the pain they both caused and broke a home.

I'd like to share something I learned here on the boards.

Silence is a source of great strength

I say nothing when she's emotionally immature, dysregulated, projects etc. I don't voice feelings with her or my actions as I understand she has many defense mechanisms and blames me. I cannot get through. I'm less resistant whereas I resisted. I radically accept her for whom she is.

She eventually learned my response and tries to get a reaction much much less. This took practice and time on my behalf, not something she can do. It helps with peace in my life.

I think many members felt invalidated and wanted their voice to be heard. You are in T and have a support system here. Use them.

[patientandclear]

There's nothing wrong with what you said.  Quite the opposite: it was respectful and honors your hopes and intentions and experience, and it didn't go on forever, and it wasn't loaded with drama or self blame or self pity or lashing out.

I think it's good you sent it. I am not a fan of disappearing.  It hurts when it's done to us and there's no need to do it to them.  If someone is begging you to talk, explaining why you can't engage in that makes sense.  Once.

However, you've said it once now.  Fully and warmly and without anything you need to regret.  You don't need to say it again, and now you need to show her, and you, that you mean what you say.

Her response is fine.  It is appropriate that she should feel loss and feel badly.  This is Exhibit A of the Things You Cannot And Should Not Save Her From.

All of this is as it should be and must be, given where you and she were.  You're handling this really well.  I know it feels like crap a lot of the time.  But really, you've been a model of self- and other-respect.  Good for you.

[myself]

Your message is, I've done everything I could and am still going to do more, but will be placing those efforts where real growth can occur. Hers is, I feel like giving up. Victim mode. Another sign you're not on the same page together. Another chance for her to step up too when it sounds like she's not going to. So, sad as the case may be, yes it's better for you to have the focus on yourself and where and how you'll go from here.

[Mutt]

I wish i could close my eyes and slip away

Darkness pulling me

Its calm

Its quiet

Peaceful

Wrapped around me

Comfort

If we listen - borderline waif.

She wants rescue.

Hers is, I feel like giving up. Victim mode.

At the center of the disorder the core wound of abandonment.

Can we fix this?

It's important to understand where one person ends and the other begins as to not get enmeshed in her stuff?

[Ripped Heart]

If we listen - borderline waif.

She wants rescue.

I long suspected this might be the case. I'm a very placid person so it never got to the stage where I even had to raise my voice to her. The only time I was ever stern was a day out with my daughter where she used silent treatment and acted like a child. Even then, I calmly told her that this was a day with my daughter and if she wanted to behave like a spoilt child, I was more than happy to take her home because I didn't want to ruin the day with d14.

I have seen her rage and be abusive to me and to others but she would always apologise.

Something I read recently and I know it definitely strikes a chord with me because it's something I've discussed in Therapy on a couple of occasions:

Any male who grew up having to love an unhappy, discontent or depressed mother will likely be attracted to a BPD Waif. The central reason for this, is that he tried tenaciously as a child to balance/improve his mother's mood, with the subconscious hope that he could win her affection, and help her become responsive to his intrinsic needs for tenderness, joyful interaction and play. This means, he came to believe that if he could just repair Her, he might feel happier and better. As a kid, this was an automatic and reflexive defense he acquired, to get what he needed and save himself from more pain. The trouble is, he learned to give, what he very much needed to receive, and that has set the tone for all his attachments in adulthood.

I realised that I wasn't just a caretaker to my young sister at a young age but also to my mother. After her divorce from my NPD father, my mother was depressed and after she had to go out and work several jobs to provide. I took the role of caring for my sister and was subject to several of my mothers rages if I got something wrong or it wasn't to her standard. I talked to T I don't think there was any occasion my mother said she was proud of me or even a "well done" it was always, "if you put more effort in you could have done better" So I have always worked to seek approval and for the larger part, it was to minimise the rages.

I see now why I put so much into this relationship and why I thought I could continue to save her, regardless of how many times she threw herself back in the water.

Despite not reacting to her message earlier, more did follow. I got another 4 missed calls, followed by

Rings one ring

Then rejects

Life as usual

I caved on that and responded by saying my phone was back on, only to get:

I don't know what i wanted to say

Before a final:

Everything got paid out my bank

I see it for what it was today, NC for 3 days and she wanted to test my boundaries to see if she still had the control. There has been silence since the last message from her, I've gone back to blocking everything and it feels like starting over again but with a bit more insight this time. I noticed I still post in the undecided, because given everything, I don't think I'm completely ready to detach just yet, I need a lot more work on me before I reach that stage and until then I will continue to live in the impossible hope that her next message to say she is in therapy and wants support.

[Mutt]

The only time I was ever stern was a day out with my daughter where she used silent treatment and acted like a child. Even then, I calmly told her that this was a day with my daughter and if she wanted to behave like a spoilt child, I was more than happy to take her home because I didn't want to ruin the day with d14.

Silent treatment not fun. A day with family difficult.

BPD is emotional arrested development. Emotional immaturity.

She has difficulties with boundaries on the self and understanding others boundaries. Much like a young child that flails against the parent's boundary.

You put your foot down. Another way of looking at it is boundaries. She may not be used to your boundaries and acted out.

I realised that I wasn't just a caretaker to my young sister at a young age but also to my mother. After her divorce from my NPD father, my mother was depressed and after she had to go out and work several jobs to provide. I took the role of caring for my sister and was subject to several of my mothers rages if I got something wrong or it wasn't to her standard.

For some members and not all, involvement with a person with a PD is because of our FOO (Family of Origin) I can relate.

You can work on "core stuff" in T, as she can work on her "core wound" too. She can't fix you and vice versa.

[patientandclear]

... .I will continue to live in the impossible hope that her next message to say she is in therapy and wants support.

I suppose by now you know what I'm going to say ... .

Let's say she does say this.  (Unlikely that this will be her response if it was not her response to losing other relationships, but ... .let's say for the sake of argument she has now come to the point of seeking therapy.)

If you read stories of long-term participants on these boards, "therapy" is not a quick fix.  Those whose partners wBPD are in therapy sometimes have been engaged in therapy for many years and still see little change.  :)BT, one of the two state of the art therapy approaches discussed on BPDF, doesn't change the feelings that surface.  It provides tools to recognize and respond differently to the feelings.  But it's not like they feel good.  They respond less destructively to feeling bad.  That's a rough road to hoe, when you (person wBPD) remember that it feels better to push someone away or to start flirting with another potential partner -- it provides at least momentary relief.

Schema therapy may work differently -- I don't understand it as well, but my reading suggests that it aspires to integrate the different "modes" pwBPD live in.  But that too is a long slog.  I've been doing lifespan integration therapy specifically designed for trauma survivors for 18 months now.  I really really really really want to get better and be happier.  I recognize patterns.  I am not personality-disordered and have a generally positive self-concept.  I can see that integration as a goal is very important and does help me make better decisions.  But it has been incredibly slow progress, and I still feel like crap a lot of the time.

So "being in treatment" is not a quick turn around that is likely to change the behaviors you have been hurt by.

Also ... .even setting aside people wBPD who are highly sensitive to feelings of being controlled and overtaken by the will of others, most people don't react well to being told by another person that they are sick and need help.  (There is a book by F. Amador that is worth reading on the subject.)  So "I'll be there for you if you get therapy" is rarely a stance that is well received.

Also worth considering: you are probably not helping her by helping her.  pwBPD use other humans as a crutch to avoid pain.  Using other techniques is what is learned in therapy.  So being there is quite possibly going to defeat the very approach that might be of use to her.

Rough stuff.

When I parted from my BPDex, I told him what I needed to be able to stay close to him.  I also said I realized that might not be easy for him.  I didn't say it was because he was sick and I didn't suggest what he might do to fix that flaw in himself.  Just explained that, to keep giving my heart and soul to someone, I need that someone to be able to sustain an engagement with me and not substitute other people into my place.  I think it is always fair and respectful to state your needs.  But the path for her to get to a place where she could meet those needs ... .she has to decide whether she wants to find that path, and if so, she has to actually claim the path herself.  Your support isn't very relevant to that process, if that makes any sense.  She knows you care and she knows you can't deal with her as she is.  That's a LOT of information you've provided her, and in its own way, it is a lot of support.

[myself]

I don't think I'm completely ready to detach just yet, I need a lot more work on me before I reach that stage and until then I will continue to live in the impossible hope that her next message to say she is in therapy and wants support.

This is very honest. I'd also say that as understandable as the feelings are to hope she improves, as you know those are her steps to take (or not). Hanging onto that hope too much will impede your own progress.

[Ripped Heart]

PatientandClear, I knew you were going to say that  

The truth is that there is nothing I can do that will help and that I can only help myself. However, I also have to be true to my feelings of what stage I'm at right now and it's a case of knowing the truth, knowing my own feelings and working towards getting the 2 aligned.

Being honest, given what has been learned about her the past couple of days, given what I've learned about myself through here and through therapy and also given the reality of the situation, if I were to simply turn around now and say "I'm done, nothing she can say will ever change that and I'm moving forward" I would be denying my feelings and therefore masking over them.

She went to therapy once before, it's where she was diagnosed and stayed there long enough to draw a detailed cycle chart of how her moods trigger. But didn't stay long enough to do anything about it. So about having the attention span of staying the course, I know that to be an impossibility for her but it was a huge step and something I would want to encourage if she were to try follow that path again, even if it wasn't for me.

I know the direction and I know the ending. I have to continue to work with my feelings to find that acceptance before I can find the closure.

She just called me, did it from her daughters phone after trying my number again several times. 10 minutes of it were her crying like I've never heard her cry before before she finally said she was thinking back to last year and when I surprised her with a weekend away to a log cabin in the woods with hot tub and champagne and wished we could go back to that time.

Told her it was ok to cry and it was ok to have happy memories and that it's ok to miss those times. That I miss them too but I can't help her anymore, she has to do that herself. I told her again that if I could take that pain away from her I would do in a heartbeat but it's not mine to take away.

She then said that the reason she wanted to end things was only because it wasn't being fair to me. And that's when I almost caved. Instead, I said that perhaps it was time to go and take some time to think things over. Told her she has the power of choice, as do I, and that when you make a choice, you have to be aware of the consequences that follow, understand them and be accepting of them.

I think today has helped a lot for me in terms of some aspects of closure but I know my feelings don't match my thoughts. I was able to remain emotionally detached on the phone but if I'm honest, that was an act rather than how I really felt. It has helped me too in figuring out where my weaknesses are in who I am and what I need to work on.

[Samuel S.]

There's a lyric that goes "sometimes when we touch, the honesty is too much". In many respects, your up and down relationship with your BPD and how you now have ambiguous feelings is very heartfelt and clear. I honor your honesty. I honor the fact that you love her, but realize that her issues have become so unsurmountable, that you definitely are on the right path of not having her in your life. It definitely is extremely hard to do so when you have so many fond memories, but the harsh reality of her behavior is something that you clearly realize as her problem that she herself needs to resolve, but she obviously is just now only getting a glimpse of her own responsibility for.

Whatever you do today and days to come, please be kind to yourself, and please restore yourself with things and sincere people that give you peace and happiness.